Self Mill Curse

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I have a curse deck, but it's inctedibly slow. I came up with the idea to mill myself and use Open the Vaults to dump them on my opponents (this deck is for multiplayer).

So here it is:



It's sitting at 70 cards, so I definitely need to kill 5 cards. Thoughts? 
my friend made a really good blue/green self mill deck that nearly always wins. he has mirror-mad phantasm, a clone and a body double (in case you mill mirror-mad phantasm). sac the copy and mill your entire library

you should add laboratory maniac if this is a legit self-mill deck (thats your win con) and lots of dredge/flashback so you still technically get the cards you want. my friend also runs lots of skaabs, because theyre great defenders for a pretty low CMC

unfortunately i dont know his deck list...but it has everything pertaining to what i stated above

~Your either my puppet or my matchstick~

color preferences (1st is fav and so on):

198732583 wrote:
Oh Ajani seems to like Elpheth's milk, meow.
You miscalculated. 70 - 5 = 65. Minimal deck size is 60, so you need to cut 10 cards. (No discussions on that! Either you want this to be as good as it can possibly be, then you make it 60. Or you don't, but then 65 is just as abitrary as 70.)

Brainspoil hints at the fact, that you don't mind older cards.

Mind Sculpt can only target opponents. Why is that in the deck?

You probably want a way to discard all those expensive and unplayable curses in exchange for fresh cards.

A card like Faithless Looting seems mandatory. It less you ditch your cards in the GY where you want them for Open the Vaults and it digs you a nice 4 cards deeper into your library. Flashback makes it useful when it's milled into your graveyard, too. It's like a match made in heaven.



Your manabase is terrible. For Example: There's ten cards in the deck that require ... yet you only have seven black sources. This spells disaster. You don't have any worthwhile turn1 plays so why not include 2-3 Terramorphic Expanse//Evolving Wilds. Also Darksteel Ingot doesn't accellerate you from 4 to 6 mana for a turn 5 Empty the Catacombs (unlike chalice) but with 7 white sources, chance are you'll often have 6 mana but still only 1 white source or even none. So Darksteel Ingot it is!

Ditch the Elixir of Immortality. I have no Idea what that's supposed to be doing in your deck. If you're almost decked out, that means you have a crapload of cards in your graveyard. So instead of making the game go longer with an Elixir, how about just winning the game with Recoup targeting that Open the Vaults in your GY?
I forgot: If you combo out, it might be nice to have Dovescape coming back with all those curses, especially Curse of Death's Hold.
my friend made a really good blue/green self mill deck that nearly always wins. he has mirror-mad phantasm, a clone and a body double (in case you mill mirror-mad phantasm). sac the copy and mill your entire library

you should add laboratory maniac if this is a legit self-mill deck (thats your win con) and lots of dredge/flashback so you still technically get the cards you want. my friend also runs lots of skaabs, because theyre great defenders for a pretty low CMC

unfortunately i dont know his deck list...but it has everything pertaining to what i stated above



Frankly, no. That's an entirely different deck than what I want to do.

You miscalculated. 70 - 5 = 65. Minimal deck size is 60, so you need to cut 10 cards. (No discussions on that! Either you want this to be as good as it can possibly be, then you make it 60. Or you don't, but then 65 is just as abitrary as 70.)

Brainspoil hints at the fact, that you don't mind older cards.

Mind Sculpt can only target opponents. Why is that in the deck?

You probably want a way to discard all those expensive and unplayable curses in exchange for fresh cards.

A card like Faithless Looting seems mandatory. It less you ditch your cards in the GY where you want them for Open the Vaults and it digs you a nice 4 cards deeper into your library. Flashback makes it useful when it's milled into your graveyard, too. It's like a match made in heaven.



Your manabase is terrible. For Example: There's ten cards in the deck that require ... yet you only have seven black sources. This spells disaster. You don't have any worthwhile turn1 plays so why not include 2-3 Terramorphic Expanse//Evolving Wilds. Also Darksteel Ingot doesn't accellerate you from 4 to 6 mana for a turn 5 Empty the Catacombs (unlike chalice) but with 7 white sources, chance are you'll often have 6 mana but still only 1 white source or even none. So Darksteel Ingot it is!

Ditch the Elixir of Immortality. I have no Idea what that's supposed to be doing in your deck. If you're almost decked out, that means you have a crapload of cards in your graveyard. So instead of making the game go longer with an Elixir, how about just winning the game with Recoup targeting that Open the Vaults in your GY?



I forgot: If you combo out, it might be nice to have Dovescape coming back with all those curses, especially Curse of Death's Hold.



I didn't miscalculate. Most of my decks are 65 and they work well. 70 is too much and 60 makes me drop too many nice cards. 65 is a solid number for my purposes.

Yes, older cards are fine, but my group only plays modern. Faithless Looting is a good idea, so I'll definitely switch Sign in Blood for those. I didn't catch that about Mind Sculpt, so I'll need another option to mill myself. Usually I really hate fetch lands, but since lands aren't dreadfully inmportant for this deck I'll use them.

Darksteel ingot is okay, but I really prefer that extra mana. Plus, using some fetchers gives me plenty of the color I need. Elixir goes with the Mirror-Mad if I deck myself and have my Open the Vaults in my hand. Use Vaults, get all my enchantments and the one Elixir, then toss the Elixir and get my deck back. Using Recoup doesn't give my curses a chance to work.

Dovescape is okay, but the curses should be more than enough to win. I'd have to playtest it and see how it works. 
65 IS NOT OKAY. I FORBID YOU FROM HAVING A 65 CARD DECK. JUST LOOK AT THE NUMBERS. Would you prefer having a 4/60 chance to draw your wincon/super important card(s) or a 4/65 chance? I think most of us want the higher chance. I know throwing in any even slightly relevant card into your deck Is fun, however, you never want to sacrifice consistency.  
Dude! Please Learn How to Autocard!
To Autocard individual cards type [c*]Into the Maw of Hell[/c*] and remove the asterisks to get Into the Maw of Hell or Stuffy Doll. Ta-Da! Autocarded! When Autocarding a deck type: Yay! Now people are actually look at your decklist properly and help you improve it! Excellent! You can tell that I love exclamation marks!
Basics to Building a Solid Deck
1. Try to run playsets of cards (meaning 4 of a card). This way your deck will win more consistently and you will draw your better cards more often. 2. Make sure to focus your deck on one single idea that can win you the game and make sure all the cards in your deck contribute to that idea. You have a limited number of cards so make sure all of them count. For example, your deck could be a Elf Tribal deck, an Aggro aggressive deck or maybe a Control deck. 3. Card advantage is very important. You need to understand that cards the draw you more cards are extremely helpful. The more cards you have in your hand the more options you have. With more options you have a greater chance at winning the game. 4. Removal is also quite important. Most decks more or less should run at least some removal. 5. Last but not least, make sure your deck is exactly 60 cards! Even 61 is not acceptable. Good luck in deck building!
Seconded. 60 cards. 65 is Arbitrary. I can also build 80 card decks, that are good. It doesn't matter. The 60 card version will always be leaner and more consistent. If 65 was in any way a "good number", then you'd see tournament decks with that. But in 99,99% of the cases they're 60. The remaining 0,01% have either a very specific reason (Battle of Wits) or they're just good old scrubs. Don't be a scrub. ;)


Also, unless you have some VERY lenient mulligan rules (read: you're cheating) your manabase will not allow you to play this deck.  22 lands without any fixing whatsover in this 65 card monstrosity is not going to work, unless all your friends decks are as terrible and slow as your deck, so you can somehow live until round 15 when you finally draw that second Island or Swamp. And you're playing 4 colors!

Seriously, do you have unlimited free mulligans as a house rule? Do you prearrange your deck to have the right lands in your starting hand? If you do, then you're not playing the same game as us.


Overflowing Chalice is just bad here because it doesn't address the obvious colorfixing issues in your 4-color monstrosity. How about Coalition Relic? That one, like Chalice can give you 2 extra mana on the next turn but it also fixes it.

Right now the deck has almost nothing meaningful to cast before turn 3. (besides possibly 4x Faithless Looting) Since you early game is non-existent, you might as well play a couple (two or three) of the Ravnica bounce lands -> Orzhov Basilica, Dimir Aqueduct etc. they fix mana and act as 2 lands.



Mesmeric Orb is a good self miller. Other than that, Traumatize just gets the job done. Or Both. That's probably better and more consistant than paying 3+5+2x mana for the mirrormad phantasm thingy (extra 3 Mana, if you had to transmute for it, which is likely)

Traumatize and Mesmeric Orb could also serve as a secondary wincondition in case your opponent is just waiting to cast Back to Nature or whatever. In those cases You could switch to milling mode. (Open the Vault will also bring back Mesmeric Orbs!) Stuff like Back to Nature is also the reason, why I suggested a singleton Dovescape. Unless your opponent has Magus of the Disk or any other enchantment destroying Creature he will be in a lock.


About the Elixir. What does "Getting my deck back." accomplish? If you dumped your entire Deck in the graveyard and played Open the Vaults. Didn't you just win? If not, how does shuffling whatever is still in your GY back to your library and gaining 5 life points help you win? I don't see it.