Here Comes the Sun

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"Here comes the sun. and I say: it's alright."


This entirely theoretical build is designed to teleport the sun offensively. In theory, it steadily destroys the universe, or instantly destroys the planet. For less violent options, you can merely teleport your enemies into space, onto visible stars or the moon, or to remote mountains. 

Requirements:
  Cosmic Connection (Cosmic Soul's L30 feature) changes all ranged powers to ranged sight.
  Space Vortex (L23 Psion attack) teleports your target to within 5 squares of you. It also incidentally makes a basic attack at +8 to attack and damage. In case the Sun has a pretty good basic attack.

Optional (make everything more awesome):
  Mirror Darkly (L6 Warlock) allows you to originate attacks and other effects from it, instead of yourself.
  Paladin’s Truth (Paladin feat) allows you to ignore immunities on targets marked by you.
  Horns of Balinor (Holy Symbol) makes space vortex mark your target, so that paladin’s truth lets you ignore immunities (in case your DM claims stars are immune to being teleported).

Note that these are all easily combined, via multiclassing, hybriding, or being a tiefling for secrets of belial. For example, be a tiefling psion/paladin.

Process:
1.  Pick two stars in the sky that you can see. Create a mirror darkly near one. Use Space Vortex on the other one, teleporting the second star close to the first star. This should steadily destroy the rest of the universe. Supernovas may accelerate the process.
Repeat Step 1 every 5 minutes.
2. Attack the sun overhead and teleport it to within 5 squares of you. Use “Merge with the Cosmos” (L26 Cosmic Soul) to avoid death, achieving immortality now that _everything_ is inside a star.

Special: If anyone attempts to interfere with your plan, teleport them onto the sun (save or die) or, more reliably, somewhere they won’t get a save, like a distant mountain or the moon if it has an atmosphere and isn’t hindering terrain.

You may need to adjust if the stars and suns in your campaign are entirely different from ones in reality. For example, perhaps the sun deals no damage and is just light. In which case, bringing it within 5 squares may simply be an effective way to fight vampires. Your DM may alternatively claim that your power just simply fails on the sun, but then he's clearly just a horrible badwrongfun DM.

P.S. Sun, sun, sun. Here it comes. Thanks to the Beatles for solving a difficult naming problem. Also to Erachima for his assistance in creating this very serious build.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
I would have thought being this close to the sun would have left me blind but instead I'm speechless...
But... how do you deal with things like speed of light?
But... how do you deal with things like speed of light?

I think we can safely assume that teleportation sidesteps that particular wrinkle.

If you mean in terms of where you see things - it's really okay if you're slightly off in the positioning of things. Horseshoes, hand grenades, and solar bodies. Close enough is fine.

Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
This smells of 3.5e flavor text-as-rules, but it's all in oddly worded features never intended to to interact.  Well done.

Bargle wrote:
This is CharOp. We not only assume block-of-tofu monsters, but also block-of-tofu DMs.
 

Zelink wrote:
You're already refluffing, why not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
But... how do you deal with things like speed of light?

I think we can safely assume that teleportation sidesteps that particular wrinkle.

If you mean in terms of where you see things - it's really okay if you're slightly off in the positioning of things. Horseshoes, hand grenades, and solar bodies. Close enough is fine.


You have to place your mirror within 25 feet of a star if you're using it, though.  4+ years (Alpha Centauri is 4.37 light years from Sol, if you're wondering where I got that number) of travel time makes leading your target interesting. Tongue Out

You're teleporting the stars to the mirror darkly. It doesn't really need to be next to one, itself. Just near to one.

Or even assume that the first star is less useful, but that second time you use it, now you've got two stars right by each other. Or just always create it in the same location, and teleport every star to within 5 squares of that point. Normally, I'd say that all of the stars appearing there would eventually block line of sight or effect in some fashion, but teleportation doesn't care about line of effect, and you've just said it takes multiple years (assuming that's the speed of light in dnd-verse) so you're safe to just toss every star there.

I suspect things would get exciting fairly rapidly that way.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Was thinking action economy, mostly.  You might get away with putting the mirror inside 9 AU of the first star if you wanted to start the fireworks with the first teleport.  Probably get faster results if you managed to drop it closer, though.

Actually, this might be a great way to finally kill off Forgotten Realms once and for all.... Cool
I'll admit: there are crazy epic things you can do at level 30 that show that you're just being silly and ending the campaign by winning.

I think this shows that you're ending the campaign by ending the campaign and every possibility that the world will ever be inflicted on you again ;)
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
How are you getting the sun to count as a creature for Space Vortex?
How are you getting the sun to count as a creature for Space Vortex?



The Sun is a star.  Stars are Far Realm creatures.  It ain't rocket surgery. Tongue Out
My Dwarf Star is totally wearing Planar Stasis Boots.
No worries, we can bring the party to it. Allabar likes dwarves. Nom nom nom.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Congratulations. Your party just got sucked into the black hole I was parked next to.  I don't get pulled in because you know... there's a reason I'm a dwarf star.
This is the most awesome thing I ever see in charopt board.

How high do you estimate the reflex of the sun to be?
Yes, what if it dodges?
How high do you estimate the reflex of the sun to be?

You'll see some variance by campaign there, I suspect. Object defenses start at reflex 10 and go to reflex 2 for gargantuan, so... automatically hit. Allabar's reflex is 41, which you'd need about a 5 to hit. So you might want to pick up Insightful Riposte so you still hit on a 2.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Cool idea, but actually, straightforward and easy to resolve using the reality of stars. When you see the light of the stars, you're not seeing them in the present, you're seeing where they were 8+ minutes ago.

i.e. you can target where they were 8+ minutes ago, but not where they actually are now.
As already noted... that's not a real problem. Just a very mild delay.


Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Actually, no, that's a huge problem. Even the sun is going to be thousands of miles away from where you're looking at over the course of 8 minutes.
Unless the star is pulling some serious move-stealth-move shenanigans, we can probably assume the caster can (eventually) correctly estimate a square the star will be in. And this is a trick you only need to pull off successfully once.
Normally, I'd say that all of the stars appearing there would eventually block line of sight or effect in some fashion, but teleportation doesn't care about line of effect, and you've just said it takes multiple years (assuming that's the speed of light in dnd-verse) so you're safe to just toss every star there.

BTW, love the use of the word "safe" in this sentence.
Very well then.

1) Ranged Sight requires only that you see the target. There are no rules for the speed of light or movement of the target. Only that you can see it.

2) Our sun has a 865k mile diameter. Even if forced to guess a square for some reason, you're still fine even if off by thousands of miles.

3) You can always target adjust. It only costs you five minutes to setup a new attempt, and you can actually make multiple attacks per mirror.

4) You're a level 30 specialist in astronomy with a 26+ intelligence and access to rituals. You can probably much more directly observe the stars than with the naked eye. Even if so restricted, stars have very predictive movements - at least initially. I'll grant that things might get messy once you start tossing them all about.

5) It's very possible for you to move your own position of attack, since you can teleport anywhere you see at any time, and there are many ways to survive such endeavors.  


It is certainly the case that you won' t necessarily destroy one or two solar systems every five minutes. Some short rests you'll get none. Some you'll set off a chain reaction. That doesn't really change the premise, however. 
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
As long as we're critiquing, crashing two stars together will hardly destroy the universe. It will, however make that little corner of the universe very uncomfortable for a while. Fun build.
Unless the star is pulling some serious move-stealth-move shenanigans, we can probably assume the caster can (eventually) correctly estimate a square the star will be in. And this is a trick you only need to pull off successfully once.



No. Stars are moving at hundreds of miles per second relative to us. And we're actually aware, due to computer power and astrophysics, of exactly how far away they are. Which the caster will not be unless the DM adjucates that they are.

If a star is a mere 4 light years away, that's 31536000 *4*100, or 12,614,400,000 or 12.6 Billion miles away from its apparent position. You're off by a mere .1 ly, that's still 30 million miles off. So yes, they're pulling off quite serious stealth shenanigans.

To put it simply, you don't have a chance unless you're aiming specifically at the Sun, which is likely a Pelor/Sun God construct and subject to its own rules. If it is a guargantuan object, you're still going to be thousands of miles of potential squares to pick from. 
Very well then.

1) Ranged Sight requires only that you see the target. There are no rules for the speed of light or movement of the target. Only that you can see it.



Right. Which you don't. You see the light it gave off a few years back. It is somewhere else.
I don't "perfectly" see the  car moving a hundred feet from me, but I certainly see it well enough for D&D's purposes. Nor does your objection change the other four points, and you sorta need to overcome all 5.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
You're forgetting relativistic teleportation theory which teaches us reverse propogation of photonic displacement can be compensated for, using an array of arcantric nodes so the precise location of a star is trivially pinpointed through a transitional analysis.
Very well then.

1) Ranged Sight requires only that you see the target. There are no rules for the speed of light or movement of the target. Only that you can see it.



Right. Which you don't. You see the light it gave off a few years back. It is somewhere else.



Man, raining on parades appears to be a very popular past time around these parts. 

Are you seriously bringing astrophysics into a discussion about someone using magic to pull a star out of the sky? And the rest of you, why are you playing into his game?

It works because of magic. That's why.  

Incidentally, I love this concept (star moving teleport shennigans).

edited for lack of a verb 
You're forgetting relativistic teleportation theory which teaches us reverse propogation of photonic displacement can be compensated for, using an array of arcantric nodes so the precise location of a star is trivially pinpointed through a transitional analysis.

I'll admit, I actually like the idea of tossing out a variety of arcane eyes and such out into the cosmos as part of the project. There are actually several ways in which you yourself can teleport out, look about, and come back, too. 
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Remember, this is a universe where instead of a^2 + b^2 = c^2, you have c^2 = max(a,b)^2.  Real World geometry doesn't even bother to make a token appearance in the diagonal movement rules, I see no reason to think realtivistic delay effects will show up here.

(Humor note: there's also no reason to think that the sun is actually a huge ball of burning plasma.  It could be a epic sunrod.  Tiny object, bright light for N-hundred million miles.)  Or it could be a spotlight cut into the top of the roof of the world.  Or the glint in the eye of the deity who loves the planets.  Or a fiery chariot pulled by flaming horses across the sky.

"It doesn't work because of [real world consequences of thing not defined in d&d rules]" seems like a silly argument here, when you can simply state "It might not work because of [thing not defined in d&d rules] is not defined in D&D rules")

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

And now I'm having flashbacks to Pyramids by Terry Pratchett.


"Here comes the sun. and I say: it's alright."


This entirely theoretical build is designed to teleport the sun offensively. In theory, it steadily destroys the universe, or instantly destroys the planet. For less violent options, you can merely teleport your enemies into space, onto visible stars or the moon, or to remote mountains. 

Requirements:
  Cosmic Connection (Cosmic Soul's L30 feature) changes all ranged powers to ranged sight.
  Space Vortex (L23 Psion attack) teleports your target to within 5 squares of you. It also incidentally makes a basic attack at +8 to attack and damage. In case the Sun has a pretty good basic attack.

Optional (make everything more awesome):
  Mirror Darkly (L6 Warlock) allows you to originate attacks and other effects from it, instead of yourself.
  Paladin’s Truth (Paladin feat) allows you to ignore immunities on targets marked by you.
  Horns of Balinor (Holy Symbol) makes space vortex mark your target, so that paladin’s truth lets you ignore immunities (in case your DM claims stars are immune to being teleported).

Note that these are all easily combined, via multiclassing, hybriding, or being a tiefling for secrets of belial. For example, be a tiefling psion/paladin.

Process:
1.  Pick two stars in the sky that you can see. Create a mirror darkly near one. Use Space Vortex on the other one, teleporting the second star close to the first star. This should steadily destroy the rest of the universe. Supernovas may accelerate the process.
Repeat Step 1 every 5 minutes.
2. Attack the sun overhead and teleport it to within 5 squares of you. Use “Merge with the Cosmos” (L26 Cosmic Soul) to avoid death, achieving immortality now that _everything_ is inside a star.

Special: If anyone attempts to interfere with your plan, teleport them onto the sun (save or die) or, more reliably, somewhere they won’t get a save, like a distant mountain or the moon if it has an atmosphere and isn’t hindering terrain.

You may need to adjust if the stars and suns in your campaign are entirely different from ones in reality. For example, perhaps the sun deals no damage and is just light. In which case, bringing it within 5 squares may simply be an effective way to fight vampires. Your DM may alternatively claim that your power just simply fails on the sun, but then he's clearly just a horrible badwrongfun DM.

P.S. Sun, sun, sun. Here it comes. Thanks to the Beatles for solving a difficult naming problem. Also to Erachima for his assistance in creating this very serious build.

You cannot target an object with Space Vortex.  Would need to use this with some sort of living space amoeba like in that episode of star trek or the like.
Very well then.

1) Ranged Sight requires only that you see the target. There are no rules for the speed of light or movement of the target. Only that you can see it.



Right. Which you don't. You see the light it gave off a few years back. It is somewhere else.



Man, raining on parades appears to be a very popular past time around these parts. 

Are you seriously bringing astrophysics into a discussion about someone using magic to pull a star out of the sky? And the rest of you, why are you playing into his game?

It works because of magic. That's why.  

Incidentally, I this concept (star moving teleport shennigans). 

Can't you solve the sight problem with any of the variety of sight enhancing powers ("automatically know the location of...")
 You cannot target an object with Space Vortex.  Would need to use this with some sort of living space amoeba like in that episode of star trek or the like.

Only 5 attack powers target objects. The remainder can still be used to attack objects except when prevented by the DM. Who obviously won't prevent you from doing so, cause that'd be a total injustice

That and in D&D cosmology, at least some of those stars are creatures (Khirad, Allabar, etc).
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Well there you go, living stars work just fine.  
That and in D&D cosmology, at least some of those stars are creatures (Khirad, Allabar, etc).

And some are just painted onto the inside of the crystal sphere that surrounds the solar system....

At least the "creature" ones are reasonable sized.

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

Obeserve Creature ritual resolves accurately seeing the object in question.



Observe Creature


You covertly spy on a creature—whether friend, rival, or enemy—through the power of your scrying magic.

Component Cost: 21,000 gp, plus a focus worth 10,000 gp
Market Price: 105,000 gp
Key Skill: Arcana
Level: 24
Category: Scrying
Time: 1 hour
Duration: Special


When you perform this ritual, choose a specific creature. You create a magical sensor adjacent to that creature, and you can see and hear as if you were standing in the square where your sensor is located. You need not personally know or have ever seen the subject. However, when performing the ritual you must describe your intended subject with sufficient clarity that the ritual unambiguously knows which creature you’re talking about. This ritual can show you a creature anywhere in the world, but it can’t show you a creature on another plane.
    The magic of the ritual interprets your statement of intended subject in the most straightforward way possible. If your description is insufficient to determine a specific creature, the ritual fails and no components are expended. If your statement describes a subject other than the one you intended, the ritual still functions and the components are expended.
    You have no inherent way to discern where the sensor is in relation to you, but careful observation might give you some clues. The sensor moves with the subject for the duration of the effect.
    Your Arcana check determines how long the sensor lasts.


























Arcana Check ResultDuration
19 or lower1 round
20–242 rounds
25–293 rounds
30–394 rounds
40 or higher5 rounds




" You must be my Lucky Star ... (belly button) ... 'cause you shine on me wherever you are."


Good thing 4e doesn't have 3e's can't Spot the sun problem.


I suppose you wouldn't be able to judge star Mass all that well.
So on occasion, you'd have to start the sequence again.
And you would not want to be in the smaller star.

Here comes your 19th forums breakdown ... ohh who's to blame, it ain't 5E driving you insane.

 

PS: I kind of LOVE this combo for actual game breaking shaninigans, rather just teleporting suns.  Once you know the creature you want to yank, and you create an effective prison scenario, you can literally snag any creature you want in put it in a box.  Makes the modules go much faster.
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