Help with Level 21 Hybrid Warforged

22 posts / 0 new
Last post
Starting an epic level campaign and need a striker/leader for the group. Need to fill both roles, but more striker than leader. Please let me know what you think of my build so far.


====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Relic, level 21
Warforged, Barbarian/Runepriest, Hammer of Vengeance (PH3), Demigod
Runic Artistry Option: Wrathful Hammer
Hybrid Talent Option: Barbarian Armored Agility
Divine Spark Option: Divine Spark Strength
Divine Spark Option: Divine Spark Constitution

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 26, CON 26, DEX 14, INT 10, WIS 14, CHA 12

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 16, CON 16, DEX 12, INT 8, WIS 12, CHA 10


AC: 37 Fort: 37 Ref: 33 Will: 31
HP: 154 Surges: 15 Surge Value: 41

TRAINED SKILLS
Athletics +23, Endurance +25, Intimidate +18

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +12, Arcana +10, Bluff +11, Diplomacy +11, Dungeoneering +12, Heal +12, History +10, Insight +12, Nature +12, Perception +12, Religion +10, Stealth +12, Streetwise +11, Thievery +12

POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Warforged Racial Power: Warforged Resolve
Runepriest Feature: Rune of Mending
Runepriest Attack 1: Word of Diminishment
Barbarian Attack 1: Howling Strike
Barbarian Utility 2: Shrug It Off
Runepriest Attack 3: Words of Bravery
Runepriest Utility 6: Rune of Meritorious Alacrity
Runepriest Attack 9: Rune of Shielding (Runepriest)
Runepriest Utility 10: Rune of the Astral Winds
Hammer of Vengeance (PH3) Attack 11: Avenging Hammer
Hammer of Vengeance (PH3) Utility 12: Shield of Vengeance
Barbarian Attack 13: Iron Breaker's Shout
Barbarian Attack 15: Ancestral War Band Rage
Runepriest Utility 16: Rune of Reinvigoration
Runepriest Attack 17: Word of Healing Assault
Barbarian Attack 19: Desert Wind Rage
Hammer of Vengeance (PH3) Attack 20: Vengeance's End

FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Warforged Tactics
Level 4: Heavenly Halberdier
Level 6: Hafted Defense
Level 8: Toughness
Level 10: Two-Handed Weapon Expertise
Level 11: Improved Defenses
Level 12: Gritty Determination
Level 14: Fleet-Footed
Level 16: Brutal Reach
Level 18: Hide Armor Expertise
Level 21: Axe Mastery
Level 21: Second Skin

ITEMS
Marauder's Stalkerhide Armor +5 x1
Bloodclaw Halberd +5 x1
Amulet of Vigor +4 x1
Iron Armbands of Power (paragon tier) x1
Goggles of Night x1
Shadowdancer's Boots x1
War Ring x1
Ring of Giants x1
Stalwart Belt (paragon tier) x1
====== End ======


 
Ranger|Cleric FTW.  Or Barb|Cleric.  |Cleric adds a lot more to a str melee striker than |Runepriest.  Also, if you want it to be more striker than leader, take more striker than leader powers.  Needs moar curtain of steel.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
Ranger|Cleric FTW.  Or Barb|Cleric.  |Cleric adds a lot more to a str melee striker than |Runepriest.  Also, if you want it to be more striker than leader, take more striker than leader powers.  Needs moar curtain of steel.

Hammer of Vengeance is one of the top striker PP's.  Though it does come with a heavy catch (mainly, must use runepriest powers).

Still, you'll likely end up with more damage that way.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Ranger|Cleric FTW.  Or Barb|Cleric.  |Cleric adds a lot more to a str melee striker than |Runepriest.  Also, if you want it to be more striker than leader, take more striker than leader powers.  Needs moar curtain of steel.



Party already has a ranger so don't want to go that route. Barb/Cleric might work though, so I will research that.
The main benefits are some really nice, very striker/defendery powers (Weapon of Astral Flame, Mighty Hew), Battle Cleric's Lore, meaning you can spend your HT on something other than armour, and the +2 to hit for a round your heals give out.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
The nice advantage of Barb|Cleric is that you can use your Hybrid Talent on Thaneborn. That adds a solid boost to both Striker & Leader. And it means boosting your Str/Cha instead of Str/Con, so you qualify for Superior Will and have a much better Will Defense, too.

Anyway, some notes:
You need a damage boost. WP Gouge is a good first step, but I'd pick up Oath of Enmity via MC: Avenger or MC Swordmage to power swap for Borrowed Confidence. Lasting Frost, Frost Weapon, Icy Heart, Gloves of Ice or a Rending Weapon for a free extra MBA. If you worship Sehanine, you can get Power of Skill to turn Righteous Brand into an MBA. Not having to spend feats on Second Skin, Hide Armor Expertise, Heavenly Expertise or Brutal Reach gets you feats for that.

Destined Scion is almost a strict upgrade on Demigod.
Paragon of Victory could be a decent choice of PP for a Barb|Cleric. Nice mix of Leader|Striker
Anyone have a link to any good barb/cleric builds they could provide? 
Anyone have a link to any good barb/cleric builds they could provide? 


community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
Hammer of Vengeance is not a strong striker pp at all, mellored. It's just interrupts, on any good striker you should already have more than you can use.
Hammer of Vengeance is not a strong striker pp at all, mellored. It's just interrupts, on any good striker you should already have more than you can use.



This. The powers all totally suck too.
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
Anyone have a link to any good barb/cleric builds they could provide? 


community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...



I'd modify it slightly for starting at Epic game with a focus on being a Striker:
Go with Epic Destiny Reincarnate Champion and pick Tiefling at 21st
Pick Secrets of Belial feat to swap your Utility 16 for Borrowed Confidence
Start with a 16/14/14/13 array so as to get either Dexterity/Constitution up to 17 by 21st for either Heavy Blade or Axe Mastery for either Fullblade or Gouge.
Take Acolyte Power for Draw Their Eyes from Warlord
Get the standard Frost package of Frost Weapon, Lasting Frost, Gloves of Ice, Shard for Cold, whatever else I'm forgetting.

This then lets you do the following at 21st:
Minor: Borrowed Confidence
Move: Draw Their Eyes(+Str to damage)
Standard: Storm of Blades(as part of this, Savage Growl as a free action upon hitting)
AP: Storm of Blades(Adroit Explorer)

This ought to give even Solos a really hard time of it.
Ok, here is the latest rendition of the build. Let me know your thoughts. 

P.S. It also looks like a bug is in the builder as when I take the secrets of belial feat, I can not swap out cure critical wounds (lvl 16 utility). All I am given the choice to seap is my paragon utility "Destined for greatness". I house ruled the change to include Borrowed Confidence.


====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Leona, level 21
Human, Barbarian/Cleric, Adroit Explorer, Reincarnate Champion
Hybrid Cleric Option: Battle Cleric's Lore
Hybrid Talent Option: Feral Might
Feral Might Option: Thaneborn Triumph
Ambitious Effort Option: Ambitious Effort New Power
Human Power Selection Option: Heroic Effort
Past Spirit Option: Past Spirit (Tiefling)
Society - Noble (+2 to Insight)
Theme: Mercenary

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 24, CON 14, DEX 12, INT 10, WIS 14, CHA 22

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 16, CON 12, DEX 10, INT 8, WIS 12, CHA 16


AC: 36 Fort: 39 Ref: 29 Will: 36
HP: 127 Surges: 9 Surge Value: 34

TRAINED SKILLS
Athletics +22, Diplomacy +23, Endurance +17, Insight +21, Intimidate +25, Perception +19

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +11, Arcana +12, Bluff +18, Dungeoneering +14, Heal +14, History +12, Nature +14, Religion +12, Stealth +11, Streetwise +20, Thievery +11

POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Mercenary Attack: Takedown Strike
Human Racial Power: Heroic Effort
Cleric Utility: Healing Word
Barbarian Feature: Roar of Triumph
Tiefling Racial Power: Infernal Wrath
Cleric Attack 1: Righteous Brand
Barbarian Attack 1: Howling Strike
Barbarian Utility 2: Shrug It Off
Cleric Utility 6: Bastion of Health
Barbarian Attack 7: Fearsome Smash
Cleric Attack 9: Divine Power
Warlord Utility 10: Draw Their Eyes
Adroit Explorer Utility 12: Destined for Greatness
Barbarian Attack 13: Crack the Skull
Barbarian Attack 13: Storm of Blades
Barbarian Attack 15: Frost Hide Rage
Cleric Utility 16: Added Borrowed Confidence as a house rule (replaced Cure Critical Wounds)
Cleric Attack 17: Strength of the Sun
Barbarian Attack 19: Rock Tree Rage
Adroit Explorer Attack 20: Bloodied Greatness

FEATS
Level 1: Two-Handed Weapon Expertise
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Weapon Proficiency (Fullblade)
Level 4: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade)
Level 6: Superior Fortitude
Level 8: Resourceful Leader
Level 10: Cunning Stalker
Level 11: Superior Will
Level 12: Bravura Leader
Level 14: Gambler's Word
Level 16: Lasting Frost
Level 18: Acolyte Power
Level 20: Improved Defenses
Level 21: Secrets of Belial

ITEMS
Frost Brand Fullblade +5 x1
Hero's Stormscale Armor +5 x1
Amulet of Vigor +4 x1
Iron Armbands of Power (paragon tier) x1
Goggles of Night x1
Silt Striders x1
War Ring x1
Ring of Giants x1
Silver Sky Tabard x1
====== End ======

Ok, here is the latest rendition of the build. Let me know your thoughts. 

P.S. It also looks like a bug is in the builder as when I take the secrets of belial feat, I can not swap out cure critical wounds (lvl 16 utility). All I am given the choice to seap is my paragon utility "Destined for greatness". I house ruled the change to include Borrowed Confidence.




You may need to select the "show other options" feature when swapping powers, but it could just be a bug.
Ok, here is the latest rendition of the build. Let me know your thoughts. 

P.S. It also looks like a bug is in the builder as when I take the secrets of belial feat, I can not swap out cure critical wounds (lvl 16 utility). All I am given the choice to seap is my paragon utility "Destined for greatness". I house ruled the change to include Borrowed Confidence.




You may need to select the "show other options" feature when swapping powers, but it could just be a bug.

Yeah, tried that with no luck.
Funny, in a way, since the only power you can't swap out, is the one power it lets you swap out.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Hammer of Vengeance is not a strong striker pp at all, mellored. It's just interrupts, on any good striker you should already have more than you can use.

At-will standard + encounter interupt is good.
Encounter standard + at-will interupt is better.  (minor heal/damage boost + hurricane of blades + interupt).
At-will standard + at-will interupt + encounter minor/free is best.  Though definatly the trickiest to build and utilize.  (possibly no action attacks from the iron wolf theme).


Not that cleric|barb isn't competitive.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Hammer of Vengeance is not a strong striker pp at all, mellored. It's just interrupts, on any good striker you should already have more than you can use.

At-will standard + encounter interupt is good.
Encounter standard + at-will interupt is better.  (minor heal/damage boost + hurricane of blades + interupt).
At-will standard + at-will interupt + encounter minor/free is best.  Though definatly the trickiest to build and utilize.  (possibly no action attacks from the iron wolf theme).


Not that cleric|barb isn't competitive.



You have absolutely no idea how Nova strikers work. Which is how strikers work. Besides, they're IRs, not IIs, making it even worse. You're really completely wrong.
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
I'd do the following:
Switch out WF to Icy Heart in paragon. Pick up a Shard of Merciless Cold(Paragon) and Gloves of Ice(Paragon) - that'll boost your damage by +6 per swing.

One thing to consider is starting from a 16/15/14 base where your starting Str is 18, Dex 15, Cha 14. Then you raise Str to 24 and Dex to 17, Cha to 20. That lets you qualify for Heavy Blade Mastery, which makes feats such as Gambler's Word potentially worthwhile. But otherwise, I'd get rid of Gambler's Word as you're not sufficiently crit-optimized to average a crit per combat(around .8 or so instead) - and the time when Gambler's Word is useful is when things are really not going you way - i.e. when you haven't gotten a crit in the first place.

Improved Defenses could then be Superior Reflexes. At the very minimum, it ought to be Lightning Reflexes without the Dex-boost. I'd also get Superior Initiative in there at 21st if you don't get the Dex up, 22nd if you do - that'll help you go first, which would really boost your odds of taking down an opponent before it gets to go.

Ring of Tenacious Will would really solve the surge issue, too.
You have absolutely no idea how Nova strikers work. Which is how strikers work. Besides, they're IRs, not IIs, making it even worse. You're really completely wrong.



As a Rune|Barb, your powers are basically Thundering Howl/Storm of Blades/Hail of Steel Clone. The immediates you're packing are likely only Strikebacks and Backlash Tattoo. Both are fairly low-grade and low-priority immediates with sufficient and good item slot alternatives.

Your nova sequence is Move > Rune of Mending > Thundering Howl > AP Storm of Blades. Rune of Mending initiates the runestate which builds another MBA into the mix. Having it key off of an ally's attack makes it pretty inconsequential whether its an II or IR. I'm not really seeing the problem here.

Yes, the powers and other features on HoV are all trash, but we said that about KAM too, and CharOp loved the **** out of KAM. This is a worse version of it, but well...its pretty close.
Rune of Mending is +6 damage to the entire group for a round, too - so in addition to 36+ damage for you, it adds up for everyone else too.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Sure, Hybrid Runepriest has some perks, but Hammer of Vengeance is NOT one of them.
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!