now onto blue/black zombies......

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thanks people for all the help on my demons now if you could help on my zombie deck that would be great,

4 x hunted ghoul
4 x zombie outlander
4 x diregraf captain
4 x Phylactery lich
2 x Death baron
1 x Lich lord of unx
1 x Mikaeus, the unhallowed

4 x vile rebirth
4 x killing wave
4 x grimoire of the dead
2 x Endless ranks of the dead
2 x levitation
1 x Necromancer's covenant
1 x army of the damned 

4 x Sejiri refuge
4 x Arcane Sanctum
8 x Swamp
6 x Island

what do people think the idea is the combo between killing wave and grimoire of the dead but my mana curve is all off, levitation is so i have defence against flying creatures but not sure if it is neccessary.
i think maybe the best way to sort this mess out would be to get rid of the grimoire of the dead and levitation and add in some artifacts for the phylactery lych and just use this as a beat down deck upping the endless ranks of dead to 4.
I would competely cut the lich out and make this more of a beat down style deck with zombie tokens. Keep grimore of the dead with several copies of endless ranks of dead. You have enough lords to make your tokens and other smaller zombies pretty powerful. I dont like Lich lord of unx since you dont have enough mill spells to make it useful. In addition, you should just cut out white in this deck since splashing in just a tiny little bit will only make the deck worse. Oh, and a Damnation is just beast with grimore of the dead. Oh and Mikaeus is osm but dosent really work with grimore. Since you running grimore, you could turn this into a zombie reanimation deck pretty easily.  

souless one and undead warchief are cool.

Edit: Add Rooftop storm for lolz. And I really like that idea of a zombie reanimation deck.
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To Autocard individual cards type [c*]Into the Maw of Hell[/c*] and remove the asterisks to get Into the Maw of Hell or Stuffy Doll. Ta-Da! Autocarded! When Autocarding a deck type: Yay! Now people are actually look at your decklist properly and help you improve it! Excellent! You can tell that I love exclamation marks!
Basics to Building a Solid Deck
1. Try to run playsets of cards (meaning 4 of a card). This way your deck will win more consistently and you will draw your better cards more often. 2. Make sure to focus your deck on one single idea that can win you the game and make sure all the cards in your deck contribute to that idea. You have a limited number of cards so make sure all of them count. For example, your deck could be a Elf Tribal deck, an Aggro aggressive deck or maybe a Control deck. 3. Card advantage is very important. You need to understand that cards the draw you more cards are extremely helpful. The more cards you have in your hand the more options you have. With more options you have a greater chance at winning the game. 4. Removal is also quite important. Most decks more or less should run at least some removal. 5. Last but not least, make sure your deck is exactly 60 cards! Even 61 is not acceptable. Good luck in deck building!
k heres changes,

4 x hunted ghoul
4 x zombie outlander
4 x diregraf captain
2 x Death baron
4 x cemetery reaper
1 x Soulless one

4 x vile rebirth
4 x killing wave
4 x grimoire of the dead
4 x Endless ranks of the dead
1 x Life's finale
1 x army of the damned 
1 x Rooftop storm

11 x Swamp
11 x Island

dont know the name of any dual blue black lands so thats why there not in there but better?
i would have damnation instead of lifes finale but it is to expensive a card for me to buy atm. Smile
That makes sense. Seriously, do a zombie reanimation deck or i will. 
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To Autocard individual cards type [c*]Into the Maw of Hell[/c*] and remove the asterisks to get Into the Maw of Hell or Stuffy Doll. Ta-Da! Autocarded! When Autocarding a deck type: Yay! Now people are actually look at your decklist properly and help you improve it! Excellent! You can tell that I love exclamation marks!
Basics to Building a Solid Deck
1. Try to run playsets of cards (meaning 4 of a card). This way your deck will win more consistently and you will draw your better cards more often. 2. Make sure to focus your deck on one single idea that can win you the game and make sure all the cards in your deck contribute to that idea. You have a limited number of cards so make sure all of them count. For example, your deck could be a Elf Tribal deck, an Aggro aggressive deck or maybe a Control deck. 3. Card advantage is very important. You need to understand that cards the draw you more cards are extremely helpful. The more cards you have in your hand the more options you have. With more options you have a greater chance at winning the game. 4. Removal is also quite important. Most decks more or less should run at least some removal. 5. Last but not least, make sure your deck is exactly 60 cards! Even 61 is not acceptable. Good luck in deck building!
Grimoire of the Dead can be good with Cellar Door.  Doors are also good with things like Oversold Cemetery, Unholy Grotto, Unbreathing Horde and Soulless one.

You can use Mutilate instead of Damnation.  It should have pretty much the same effect most of the time 
Can I ask what the deciding factor, or original idea it was to do this as B/U zombies? I only see 3 U cards there, and none of them are great cards.
Splashing Blue for the Captains is probably worth it, especially if it's all on dual lands.

Rooftop Storm = Win.

Other than that, doesn't really need blue, and the mana base can be shifted slightly to allow for a stronger Mutilate, but zombies will always do well, I feel, when played right.
my original plan was to splash blue to use lich lord of unx combined with loads of zombies for some nice milling, but that doesnt seem a great idea, i would have more blue in there but wouldnt know where to start, how am i making this a reanimate deck i do love the idea where do i start???
Rooftop Storm = Win.


Sorry, but IMO, a good zombie deck should have won long before this spell is relevant.
Yeah, I posted rooftop storm just to show a prime example of a win-more card and for lols. If your opponent doesnt know what that card does and see you play his face would be priceless after he reads it (if your playing a zombie deck). :D
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To Autocard individual cards type [c*]Into the Maw of Hell[/c*] and remove the asterisks to get Into the Maw of Hell or Stuffy Doll. Ta-Da! Autocarded! When Autocarding a deck type: Yay! Now people are actually look at your decklist properly and help you improve it! Excellent! You can tell that I love exclamation marks!
Basics to Building a Solid Deck
1. Try to run playsets of cards (meaning 4 of a card). This way your deck will win more consistently and you will draw your better cards more often. 2. Make sure to focus your deck on one single idea that can win you the game and make sure all the cards in your deck contribute to that idea. You have a limited number of cards so make sure all of them count. For example, your deck could be a Elf Tribal deck, an Aggro aggressive deck or maybe a Control deck. 3. Card advantage is very important. You need to understand that cards the draw you more cards are extremely helpful. The more cards you have in your hand the more options you have. With more options you have a greater chance at winning the game. 4. Removal is also quite important. Most decks more or less should run at least some removal. 5. Last but not least, make sure your deck is exactly 60 cards! Even 61 is not acceptable. Good luck in deck building!
what if i was to add in a bit off mill or discard that way, there will be plenty of creature cards in the graveyard for me to bring back with grimoire of the dead. cards like mind sculpt or dream twist and merfolk mesmerist i could put some entomb in their along with some heavy hitters ready to be ressurected when the grimoire goes off, can anyone suggest cards for this reanimate style deck.
yh rooftop storm is for lol'z i will only have one, only play casual at the moment, grave titan would be mint with entomb, what other big zombies would be good for this combo. 
Remember Nighthawk, You dont want cards that are just win-more. If your only running one than you should just run none. 
Dude! Please Learn How to Autocard!
To Autocard individual cards type [c*]Into the Maw of Hell[/c*] and remove the asterisks to get Into the Maw of Hell or Stuffy Doll. Ta-Da! Autocarded! When Autocarding a deck type: Yay! Now people are actually look at your decklist properly and help you improve it! Excellent! You can tell that I love exclamation marks!
Basics to Building a Solid Deck
1. Try to run playsets of cards (meaning 4 of a card). This way your deck will win more consistently and you will draw your better cards more often. 2. Make sure to focus your deck on one single idea that can win you the game and make sure all the cards in your deck contribute to that idea. You have a limited number of cards so make sure all of them count. For example, your deck could be a Elf Tribal deck, an Aggro aggressive deck or maybe a Control deck. 3. Card advantage is very important. You need to understand that cards the draw you more cards are extremely helpful. The more cards you have in your hand the more options you have. With more options you have a greater chance at winning the game. 4. Removal is also quite important. Most decks more or less should run at least some removal. 5. Last but not least, make sure your deck is exactly 60 cards! Even 61 is not acceptable. Good luck in deck building!
I run a lot of 1 of cards just for the lulz, it makes casual games more interesting.

If you like the milling + reanimate angle, don't forget you can use your lich lords to mill yourself.   If you're worried about the life loss, then add some lifelink in there, like Basilisk Collar or Loxodon Warhammer

for grimoire decks, however, I like using non-zombie creatures.  For example I have a deck that uses Zombie Infestation to discard Eidolon cards (Enigma Eidolon for example.  They're terrible, but their second ability makes the deck tick) and has Diregraf Captain to make my tokens bigger.  However, I also run Grimoire of the Dead which allows me to reanimate my eidolons (which, I might add, can all sacrifice themselves to trigger Diregraf Captain's second ability) in addition to whatever other creatures have died during the course of the game for a massive army of "zombies" (grimoire brings them back as black zombies)

I also like that grimoire is instant speed, which IMO makes it better than Liliana Vess' ultimate
I see Rooftop Storm as a straight forward bad card (or at least one of very limited use), rather than a win-more card. Not that win-more cards aren't bad, they're just a specific sort of bad. Personally, I view Endless Ranks of the Living Dead as more of a win-more card. It's only really of any use if you already have loads of zombies in play anyway. It doesn't help you build your army until it's already built. Then it just makes it far larger than it really needs to be. At best it's a sideboard card for use against decks that can somehow build an army that outnumbers your zombie one.

Bobbert, I think you've misjudged the purpose of Lich Lord of Unx. I wouldn't use him in a milling deck - he does X damage, as well as milling X cards. Taking X out of twenty life is obviously more significant than milling X out of fifty three cards.  I'd use him in a deck that can take advantage of cards in an opponent's graveyard, such as Coffin Queen and Dimir Doppelganger. That's one route you could take for a reanimation deck. Could be fun!
i think trousers has got a point the fact lich lord of unx does X life aswell makes him work well in this zombie re-animation style deck, heres what i have come up with ive added some discard so i can get the creatures i want into the graveyards ready for re-animation,

4 x Hunted ghoul
4 x Augur of skulls
4 x Dimir doppelganger
3 x Diregraf captain
2 x Death baron 
2 x Lich lord of unx
1 x Griselbrand

4 x Distress
4 x Killing wave
4 x Grimoire of the dead
3 x Cellar door
3 x wistful thinking

dual lands and such.

its a bit ropey at the moment can anyone suggest any cards?
Aye, this still needs some work. You need to find stronger defences to keep opponents at bay until you've got your strategy into place. You're looking for low-cost defensive cards that either put cards into opponent graveyards, or make use of cards in opponent graveyards. An obvious place to begin might be with removal. Look for zombies that'll put opponents' cards into their graveyards, such as Fleshbag Marauder. Your aim is to fill up opponents' graveyards and then use them against them, so the more cards you have that can directly support that strategy, the better. Hunted Ghoul can continually hold off a 1/X creature, but it can't force creatures into the graveyards unless opponents attack or block with X/1 creatures. Festering Goblin, however can take down X/2 creatures, 2 X/1 creatures, and can even force a creature into the graveyard with Fleshbag Marauder.

Those are just basic ideas to demonstrate how to think about it. A straight forward black kill spell is more useful here than Hunted Ghoul, as it stands a better chance of getting rid of a threat and putting it into the graveyard. This is also a slow deck, and a vanilla 1/2 isn't going to be a lot of use during mid- to late-game. Giving your creatures deathtouch with Death Baron is a far more useful effect here than the point of life loss when a zombie dies that Diregraf Captain brings. Creatures with deathtouch kill opponent threats and put them into the graveyard - this directly supports your strategy. If you have a strategy that involves a lot of zombies dying, then the Captain would be of more use, but the only time that's built into your strategy here is if and when you play a Killing Wave. in this case I think I'd drop him to 1 or 2 (if any) and run 3 or 4 Barons. Speaking of Killing Wave, this has a certain amount of anti-synergy with a deck that uses creature tokens, as they can't be resurrected. Skirk Ridge Exhumer produces Festering Goblin tokens that don't mind dying, however, and could make sure that any creature your opponent tries to save from Killing Wave bites the dust anyway.

I'd look for more spells that will take advantage of your opponents' graveyards. Maybe you can make use of more than just the creatures in there. I'd go with more Lich Lords, and look for more targeted removal, including discard. Spells that let you choose which cards your opponents discard, rather than them are far superior here. These are, after all, the cards you're going to be taking advantage of - you want them to be the strongest in your opponent's hand, not the weakest.

I'd lose Hunted Ghoul, Augur of Skulls, possibly Diregraf Captain, Griselbrand, possibly Killing Wave and Wistful Thinking, and search for some better fits. 
i also nedd some ways of protecting my artifact the grimoire being the main mechanic of the deck i want it to be a bit hader to remove so it at least has the chance to go off.
Cool. Well, counter spells, then. You're in blue, so that would seem like the ideal way to protect your crucial cards and get the main opponent threats into their graveyards. This is a very slow deck, so you need to give serious thought to some strong early-game defenses, too, especially for facing the super-fast turn 4 win decks.
heres what i have for a decklist, with discard for creatures and counter for my grimoire to not get wiped,

4 x walking corpse
3 x Zombie outlander
4 x lich lord of unx
2 x Death baron
2 x Diregraf captain

2 x Liliana of the veil 

1 x Life's finale 
4 x Grimoire of the dead
2 x Endless ranks of the dead
3 x Mana leak
3 x Voltaic key
4 x Despise
4 x Killing wave

4 x Drowned catacomb
10 x swamp 
8 x Island

what do people think the idea of the deck is focusing on grimoire of the dead.
And you aren't running voltaic key because...?

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/12.jpg)

good point will add that in for the grimoire to get its counters quicker.
updated, do people think i should down the killing wave to 3 and up the mana leak to 4, or should i up the voltaic key to 4
If you're putting the key in, then you might want to look for other artifacts with tapping abilities, so you can take proper advantage of it.

I don't think that Walking Corpse and Zombie Outlander are really right for this deck. As I've said, this is a slow deck, so you want defensive/controlling early drops, ideally ones that can get opponent creatures into graveyards.

As I've mentioned, I find Endless Ranks of the Dead hugely overrated, and I don't really understand its place in this deck. You only have sixteen creatures in the deck - that's about a quarter of the deck, so one in four of the cards you draw will be zombies and that means you're not going to have many in play (you can expect maybe two creatures in your opening hand, and then one in every four cards that you draw), at least until you've managed to wipe your opponent's creatures out and resurrected them with the grimoire. Once you've done that, you presumably have loads of creatures and your opponent has none anyway, so Endless Ranks is fairly surplus to requirements.

I still don't see Diregraf Captain's purpose here, either. It's good if you're expecting lots of zombies to die, but that's not what your deck does. As I said, you don't have very many creatures, and most that you do have you're going to want to try to keep them alive, so, hopefully, not many are going to die and activate the captain's ping. The deathtouch provided by the Baron is far more useful here, so I'd just run four of them if you can. Otherwise I'd look at other zombie lords such as Cemetery Reaper.

You could do with quite a lot more creatures in this deck. Lich Lord is only as effective as the number of zombies you have in play. As I say, Endless Ranks isn't going to achieve this without lots of zombies in play to begin with. Lich Lord can put one token into play each round, but that won't improve matters much. There are plenty of zombies with control abilities (Festering GoblinSkinrenderCabal Interrogator), and ones that take advantage of graveyards (Bone DancerCoffin QueenGeth, Lord of the Vault), so try to support your strategy with creatures as much as possible.
agreed:  Voltaic Key is only good with a lot of artifacts that tap.  If it's just in there for Grimoire of the Dead it's kinda useless.  Cellar Door maybe?  hell with so many artifacts you could run Phylactery Lich, but now it's starting to sound like a different deck. 
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