Monastic Vows (organic & unbalanced) w poll

 


To take a vow you must choose a deity. Certain spells are off limits for certain deities.
A deity is important here. This is divine magic based on domain beliefs. Vows can blend with Ki monk.
3e multicasting works for any dual class scenario. I would hate to give out high lvl stuff to someone who just took the vow.  


My methodology was simple. I looked up real monastic vows, I then assigned spells from Next and AD&D. These spells are then transformed into divine rewards. They don’t follow the same casting rules as pure spells. They aren’t totally unbalanced.  I did try to extract a good amount for each and flavor the casting levels for future adjustments. I made a point to avoid equality after realizing how boring it is. I was pleased that my ADD yielded unintended satisfaction with Poverty as the clear runt dropping a miracle ota(on that aghhghghghsss!!!).  


 It hasn’t been played. I could use some face feedback and really curious to see if the ‘balance brigade’ slaps a clear consensus in the poll.  

If you dont know the spells just assume based on name and lvls below.  Assume lvls are equal so its versatility and numbers. I dont know of a better way to poll rank.


Obedience
1. Bless, 2.Command, 2. Augury, 2. Summon Insects, 3. Stick to Snakes 5. Atonement, 6. Insect Plague, 6. Succor


Stability 1.Cause Fear, 1. Protection from Evil, 2.Sanctuary, 3. Water Breathing, 3. Endure Elements 7.Death Ward, 7.Regenerate


Chastity  1. Purify Food and Drink, 2.Zone of Truth, 5.Atonement, 6.Tremmor, 8.Holy Aura,

Poverty  1. Create Water, 2. Create Food and Water, 4.fire Seeds, 5. Quest, 9.Miracle


Silence 3.Silence, 3.Speak with Dead, 5.Tongues, 7.Commune 7.Holy Word, 9.Symbol


Peace 1.Cure, 2.Aid, 3.Cure Blindness, 3.Cure Disease, 5.Atonement, 7.Speak with monsters , 8.Rainbow, 9.True Resurrection


Note: Thinking about balancing broken vows differently so one is temp like silence for a few levels, or chastity just stops advancement, obedience has to involve quest restoral.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kex7tp7536Y

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What's required to keep each vow? That plays something of a role in how relatively appealing each option is. Also, I'm assuming that the casting progression is based on monk level, that each spell is a daily resource, and that spells that traditionally have other costs associated with them (miracle) retain those. Are those assumptions correct?
Dwarves invented beer so they could toast to their axes. Dwarves invented axes to kill people and take their beer. Swanmay Syndrome: Despite the percentages given in the Monster Manual, in reality 100% of groups of swans contain a Swanmay, because otherwise the DM would not have put any swans in the game.
Your spell choices confuse me. What use does someone who takesa Vow of Silence have for tongues or speak with dead, spells that require you to speak?  I always though the idea of a Vow of Silence is it forces you to listen better, and gives you inner strength.

I'm not sure what Vows of Chasitity have to do with tremors or vows of poverty have to do with fire seeds.

So overall, I'm pretty confused by this system
Maybe I'm missing the point here but these options seem kinda lame. Thematically I can kinda see it but if someone put this in front of me I'd not bother with any of them.
the Vow of Silence should include Greater Irony.
What's required to keep each vow? That plays something of a role in how relatively appealing each option is. Also, I'm assuming that the casting progression is based on monk level, that each spell is a daily resource, and that spells that traditionally have other costs associated with them (miracle) retain those. Are those assumptions correct?





Taking a vow means that you cant perform certain skills, ie feats, checks and challenges or they are at a disadvantage. For example a vow of peace restricts intimidate unless its based on reputation instead of an intimidating action or threat. Assume its balanced evenly. The rest of it is a social contract with the DM. They vary by deity. Chastity for an evil deity might not include ****, silence for war might not include a war cry. I don’t include chaotic deities so that flushes out some of the nonsense with the anti-chaotic vows. Much is DM fiat similar to the AD&D Paladin.

Poverty might be the toughest to keep. Generally you can earn money as long as its invested or part of a plan. The limit is on what you spend and what you give to your party members. I would lock the Monk at 5 silver a day for their own spending while giving away/paying 5 gold a day to party members or people that work for them.  




Each spell is based on the monk’s caster level not actual level. Assume the Monks has the same daily caster lvl slots as the cleric. The Monk has a different type of cost for spells. Its more hp driven. They trade their hp one for two when healing others. Miracle may cost a permanent ability score point.

Your spell choices confuse me. What use does someone who takesa Vow of Silence have for tongues or speak with dead, spells that require you to speak?  I always though the idea of a Vow of Silence is it forces you to listen better, and gives you inner strength.

I'm not sure what Vows of Chasitity have to do with tremors or vows of poverty have to do with fire seeds.

So overall, I'm pretty confused by this system



The Monk has power from suppression granted by a deity. Skill bonuses are necessary. There will probably be about four bonuses per vow. Tremors and fire seed are on the fence. It depends on how I sell the fluff to myself in the description.
No vote, because this is pretty lame.  This is a role-playing thing, not a mechanical thing.
The Monk has power from suppression granted by a deity. Skill bonuses are necessary. There will probably be about four bonuses per vow. Tremors and fire seed are on the fence. It depends on how I sell the fluff to myself in the description.


I still don't understand any of the Vow of Silence choices.  What are you trying to replcate here?  Also, how are we to evaluate balance if we don't know what all the benefits are?
Rory, can I make a suggestion?  You need to present this in a more polished version. You have to set forth your design goals and explain how your proposal will acheive those goals. Let me give you an example.

Monastic Vows


This advanced module allows for people to customize their monks.  By taking a vow to a deity, the deity transforms the monk and in return grants the monk new powers.  Such a monk is called a "votary".  The Vow also requires the votary to follow a specific code of behavior.  A votary who violates the Code loses all benefits of the Vow and is a standard monk once again.  (Breaking one's Vow may have other in-game effects, such as the pity, scorn, or even enmity of one's monastic order.)

Monastic Empowerment: Once a day, as an action, the empowerment the monk gets from his Vow manifest in a divine miracle. The level of the most powerful miracle is based on the monk's level. 

Breaking one's vow: Except for the Vow of Fasting, a monk who abandons his Vow cannot take a new Vow (or retake the former Vow) until he has received atonement and demonstrated to the caster that the monk is sincerely repentant of having been unable to satisfy the original Vow.

Vow of Chastity


While many religious-minded people may withhold from enjoying carnal relation to dedicate themselves to their god, the monks who take the Vow of Chastity take this one step further.  They may not touch another living being.  They will foreve deny themselves the touch of flesh.  These monks are known as "chaste votaries"

Restriction: Chaste votaries gain no benefit from an extended rest if, in the past 24 hours, they have willingly touched a living being, even in violence.

Monastic Power: Chaste votaries lose the Way of the Fist power.  Instead, they gain the Way of the Chaste. If they subsequently break their Vow, they lose the Way of the Chaste and regain the Way of the Fist.

Way of the Chaste: You can use a light melee weapon in place of an unarmed attack for any monk maneuver that requires an unarmed attack.

In addition to any roleplaying benefits associated with this Vow, as an action, once a day, chaste votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Mage Armor
3rd: Push
5th: Shield
7th: Wind Wall
9th: Repulsion


Vow of Fasting


Monks who take this vow consume nothing more than bread and water, believing that denial of such essentials make life all the more precious.  Only creatures that require sustenance gain the benefits of this Vow.  This Vow is unique in that it is expected that monks will not maintain the Vow for extended periods.  Thus, unlike other Vows, there is no need to receive an atonement afterbreaking the Vow.  Monks who take a Vow of Fasting are called "ascetic votaries".

Restriction: Ascetic votaries lose all benefits of the Vow as soon as they consume any food or drink, including potions.  Ascetic votaries do not gain any benefits of the Vow until 24 hours after the fasting begins.  Ascetic votaries suffer all the ill effects of thirst and starvation, and cannot benefit from any enchantments or magic that would allow them to better endure hunger or thirst.

In addition to the roleplaying benefits of this Vow, ascetic votaries gain advantage on any Constitution checks (including those related to resisting the effects of hunger and thirst).  Once a day, as an action, ascetic votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Cure Minor Wounds
3rd: Divine Favor
5th: Aid
7th: Haste
9th: Divine Power



Vow of Peace


Monks who take this vow refuse to commit lethal violence against another being, ven if it may cost the lives of themselves or their friends.  Monks who take a Vow of Peace are called "contemplative votaries".

Restriction: Contemplative votaries gain no benefit from an extended rest if, in the past 24 hours, they have willingly inflicted lethal damage on another creature.  Contemplative votaries lose proficiency in all weapons, including unarmed attacks.  

In addition to the roleplaying benefits of this Vow, contemplative votaries gain advantage on any checks related to healing or aiding others.  Once a day, as an action, contemplative votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Cure Minor Wounds
3rd: Cure Light Wounds
5th: Lesser Restoration
7th: Cure Serious Wounds
9th: Death Ward


Vow of Poverty


Monks who take this Vows may not own more than 100 gp of possessions and may not willingly possess any magical items.  Any rewards they receive must be donated to charities dedicated to helping the poor.  By living in the most humble manner possible, they feel a kinship to the less fortunate, and this feeling of charity empowers them to greatness.  These monks are called "humble votaries".

Restriction: Humble votaries gain no benefit from an extended rest as long as they are in physical possession of more than 100 gp of materials, or if they own anything that they cannot carry.

Monastic Power: Humble votaries, in addition to any roleplaying benefit they may receive, receive advantage for ability checks related to beggary, enduring elements, and resisting the effects of hunger and thirst. Once a day, as an action, humble votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Purify Food and Water
3rd: Endure Elements
5th: Magic Weapon
7th: Create Food and Water
9th: Remove Disease


Vow of Silence


Monks who take this vow prefer lives of quiet conemplation, believing that perceiving is more important than speaking.  Such monks are known as "silent votaries".

Restriction: Silent votaries gain no benefit from an extended rest in which they communicated either vocally or telepathically in the previous 24 hours.

Monastic Power: Silent votaries, in addition to any roleplaying benefit such a monk may receive, receive advantage for ability checks related to listening. Once a day, as an action, silent votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Guidance
3rd: Augury
5th: Silence
7th: Locate Object
9th: Commune with Nature



Vow of Stability


The Vow of Stability is the most difficult vow for advanturing monks to take as it ties them to a specific monastic community.  These votaries spend all of their free time in the community, helping to develop it and contribute to it.  Such monks are known as "coenobitic votaries".

Restriction: Coenobitic votaries gain no benefit from an extended rest spent outside their community.

Monastic Power: Once a day, as an action, coenobitic votaries, in addition to any roleplaying benefit they may receive, always knows the quickest path to their community. Once a day, as an action, coenobitic votaries can manifest one of the following effects that does not exceed their level:
1st: Resistance
3rd: Shield of Faith
5th: Consecrate
7th: Glyph of Warding
9th: Passwall


It's not a huge benefit, but players can have a lot of fun roleplaying the manifestation of these effects.
I'm as confused as Wrecan.
The vows intentions/connotations have to be clear.

I would give necromancy spells to a monk chosing a vow of chastity, as the choice is about mortal flesh beeing a weakness, and result being to go against a natural order of things.
But I'm pretty sure a lot of people have a different take on this vow.

Wrecan's presentation is the way to go IMO (his vow of chastity is funny as hell !)

If you think my english is bad, just wait until you see my spanish and my italian. Defiling languages is an art.

As long it's cleaned up a bit and put in a module, sure.
Wrecan kills it again.
I corrected some typos, clarified some things and added a new Vow.
I still don't understand any of the Vow of Silence choices.  What are you trying to replcate here?  Also, how are we to evaluate balance if we don't know what all the benefits are?



Laughing Seems like you figured it out. Most all of your adjustments were spot on. Gratz!!

I do like the notion of peace starting off with lesser spells before Miracle. Would also need some skill adjustments. I like it though. Beats Pathfinder's system.
Thanks.  I added a new version of Vow of Peace.

 


Your creativity Ki was glowing on the restrictions. I love the idea of a hometown monk. It works well with how Im changing their Ki.

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