Class to mitigate a mage (New to 4E)

15 posts / 0 new
Last post
Our party has had a lot of trouble with mages lately. What is the best strategy to immobilize or mitigate them, and what type of class/build would you recommend to fulfill this role.

I appreactiate the help, as we are new to 4E and are trying to become more proficient in team strategy. This is a great learning experience for us. 

Thanks in advance!

-Tim 
Our party has had a lot of trouble with mages lately. What is the best strategy to immobilize or mitigate them, and what type of class/build would you recommend to fulfill this role.

I appreactiate the help, as we are new to 4E and are trying to become more proficient in team strategy. This is a great learning experience for us. 

Thanks in advance!

-Tim 



Mages traditionally have poor ac and low hp. Anything that hits hard is a plus. There are several classes that could just outright kill the mage on their first turn. Rangers come to mind.

Alternatively, a grappling Fighter would allow you to lock down the mage. The fighter would mark it, grab it, and force it to only attack him or it would take more damage.


Your leader could also come in handy by buffing defenses. And controllers can debuff enemy attacks. It's hard to hit things if you're at -4 or more.
Get Striker to mage. Usually via a granted shift from a Leader. Striker one-rounds mage with is nova (that is a sequence of power usage that expends resources to do a lot of damage in one turn). Mage is dead. No more mage.

Usually really is that simple. The basic tactics you are going for in 4e are as follows: Defenders lock down low threat targets and/or targets that are bags of HP that do very little damage (brutes) and, if possible, still contributes damage to your focus fire target. High priority targets are nova-ed by the striker(s), who is (are) being buffed by the leader. Controllers are responsible for splitting, disabling, and attrition of enemy forces.
Um ... 
4e is not, typically, Player vs. Player.  The math doesn't work out for that.  So, assuming your DMs doing it that way, you're not so much fighting a "mage" as your fighting a "mage-looking monster"

Those will normally be "controller" monsters.  They tend to have AC a few points shy of par (but normal non-AC defences), and also tend to be a bit shy of hit points.  But being a 4e monster, that means they still have quite a few hit points, well more than most PCs.

So basically it works out the same as any other monster: Hit them with damage, and park the fighter next to them.  They'll die quick.  The only real difference is: Target AC preferably, and be careful about bunching up where they can easily hit many of you. 

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

Battlemind.

Lightning Rush -> Forces the mage to attack you and change the target of his area spells. Plus a free OA.

Brutal Barrage -> The mage dies

Topaz Crusader -> Expeditious Retreat + Run + AP (Run)

They have other tricks also.
Sapphire - Swormage Dragon Guardian - Dont touch my allies build. Swordmage / Sigil Carver / Draconic incarnation The Holy Slayer - A Striker - Defender Fighter | Cleric / Barbarian - Paragon of Victory WEREBEAR BATTLEMIND: You wont go where you want. - A Battlemind (Druid) / Unbound Nomad / Topaz Crusader
Archer ranger.  Shoot it until it dies.  You'll have longer range and better initiative.  It will not live.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
Possibly just take a leader and grant saving throws.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Char-op what is best in life?

"Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!" 
The sea looks at the stabillity of the mountian and sighs. The mountian watches the freedom of the sea and cries.
Possibly just take a leader and grant saving throws.



Doesn't help dominated leader. 
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
Char-op what is best in life?

"Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!" 

After flashing back to that scene, I now understand why CharOP doesn't like Beastmasters (hint: think about the lines before that quote). Tongue Out

Um ... 
4e is not, typically, Player vs. Player.  The math doesn't work out for that.  So, assuming your DMs doing it that way, you're not so much fighting a "mage" as your fighting a "mage-looking monster"

Those will normally be "controller" monsters.  They tend to have AC a few points shy of par (but normal non-AC defences), and also tend to be a bit shy of hit points.  But being a 4e monster, that means they still have quite a few hit points, well more than most PCs.

So basically it works out the same as any other monster: Hit them with damage, and park the fighter next to them.  They'll die quick.  The only real difference is: Target AC preferably, and be careful about bunching up where they can easily hit many of you. 



Quoted this one since it seemed the most comprehensive.

Assuming it is indeed your DM throwing mage-monsters at you, perhaps also give the partys defenses a look-over. Why is he throwing low AC/HP controllers at you?

Do you all suffer from high AC, low rest of defenses? Particularly Will is a juicy target for any DM.     

Lamentations. Definitely. Its why I find deafened to be the ultimate status condition.
Char-op what is best in life?

"Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!" 



In Char Op we don't misquote movies.

Char-op what is best in life?

"Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!" 



In Char Op we don't misquote movies.


In Soviet CharOp, movies misquote you?