Planeswalker Gaining Health??

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Okay, so, i was playing some of my friends in a match today, and one of them tried to play a Heroes Reunion on a planeswalker.. how is this possible.. is it even.. i was thinking not, i challenge him for this move, he said he had found in the official rules that it says its possible because the Heroes Reunion cast 7 health on target player. and than stated Planeswalkers are players. As i said my friend thought this weas possible. i thought not so we tried to find his so called rule and couldn't find it.. can I please get some help into as why, If it is possible or if it is not. my friends and i Seek inlightenment.
that's not possible

while damage can be redirected to a planeswalker (by an opponent, not by the controller of the planeswalker themselves) lifegain (or lifeloss for that matter) cannot be redirected to a planeswalker
proud member of the 2011 community team
No, that doesn't work.

Plansewalkers are not players.  They can't gain loyalty counters from spells that grant players life.
MTG Rules Advisor
thank you all so much. play well my friends (:
if players are planeswalkers simply cast Dreadbore targetting him ;)
proud member of the 2011 community team
What are the Only ways you can destroy a Planeswalker
There are cards Beast within that can destroy any permanent. Dreadbore was mentioned as well. Or attacking it reduces the # of counters by the damage dealt. Non-combat damage can be redirected to a planeswalker.
Poison counters?
No, only players can have poison counters.
MTG Rules Advisor
if players are planeswalkers simply cast Dreadbore targetting him ;)

The sentence "planeswalkers are players" does not imply "players are planeswalkers" so you can't destroy your opponent with Dreadbore ;).
The idea that planeswalkers are like players, and the corollary marketing tagline, "You are a planeswalker" are probably pretty effective for getting people excited about playing Magic and getting the rarer cards. (It works on me, anyway.)

In general, though, they've been a nightmare for us on the Q&A forum. There is no rules connection between a player and a planeswalker.
What are the Only ways you can "destroy" a Planeswalker

Planeswalker uniqueness rule
0 Loyalty counters (damage, Vampire Hexmage)
destroy effects (Dreadbore, Vindicate)
marked damage greater than its toughness (assuming it's a creature)
toughness less than 1 (assuming it's a creature)
the world rule (Enchanted Evening+Opalescence+Mirrorweave cast at Concordant Crossroads)


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There is no rules connection between a player and a planeswalker.

Except a rule that allows redirecting damage from player to planeswalker.

What are the Only ways you can "destroy" a Planeswalker

Planeswalker uniqueness rule
0 Loyalty counters (damage, Vampire Hexmage)
destroy effects (Dreadbore)
marked damage greater than its toughness (assuming it's a creature)
toughness less than 1 (assuming it's a creature)
the world rule (Enchanted Evening+Opalescence+Mirrorweave cast at Concordant Crossroads)



And sacrifice.

marked damage greater than its toughness (assuming it's a creature)


Gideon always makes sure to either prevent all damage, become indestructible, or both when he turns into a creature, so you'll have to do a bit of maneuvering to get this to work.

Rules Advisor
proud member of the 2011 community team
Gideon always makes sure to either prevent all damage, become indestructible, or both when he turns into a creature, so you'll have to do a bit of maneuvering to get this to work.

Gideon is not only planeswalker that can be a creature. Every planeswalker can be a creature.

Offtopic: Assume you are a planeswalker. You turn into a creature. How do you feel?

Gideon always makes sure to either prevent all damage, become indestructible, or both when he turns into a creature, so you'll have to do a bit of maneuvering to get this to work.

Gideon is not only planeswalker that can be a creature. Every planeswalker can be a creature.


Gideon is the only planeswalker that can become a creature without needing another card to do so. That would be the "maneuvering" I was talking about.
Rules Advisor
Gideon is the only planeswalker that can become a creature without needing another card to do so. That would be the "maneuvering" I was talking about.

I thought "maneuvering" was about getting around Gideon's damage prevention or indestructibility.

What are the Only ways you can "destroy" a Planeswalker

Planeswalker uniqueness rule
0 Loyalty counters (damage, Vampire Hexmage)
destroy effects (Dreadbore, Vindicate)
marked damage greater than its toughness (assuming it's a creature)
toughness less than 1 (assuming it's a creature)
the world rule (Enchanted Evening+Opalescence+Mirrorweave cast at Concordant Crossroads)





Don't forget forcing your opponent to Death Wish the planeswalker from the main game, after you've begun resolving Shahrazad, get a Hive Mind on the battlefield, then cast Death Wish on your opponent's turn (off of a Quicken) after you've Mindslaver'd them. Then the planeswalker (after you finish the subgame & Shahrazad) will simpy cease to exist.
No, only players can have poison counters.


...Where in the rules does it say that?
No, only players can have poison counters.


...Where in the rules does it say that?


It probably doesn't, but there is no means of giving poison counters to anything other than a player, so it's still true. As a general thing, we deal in the rules and cards that actually exist.
Jeff Heikkinen DCI Rules Advisor since Dec 25, 2011
No, only players can have poison counters.


...Where in the rules does it say that?


Any permanent could get a poison counter, even an exiled card or one in the graveyard. Players could have time or -1/-1 counters on them.

But all this doesn't mean anything for them.

Rules Advisor

The Basic rulebook, read it! A lot of basic questions are answered there!

How to autocard :
Type [c]Black Lotus[/c] to get Black Lotus.
Type [c=Black Lotus]The Overpowered One[/c] to get The Overpowered One.

...and no existing card (nor combination of cards) can accomplish this.
As Jeff already said, it's not forbidden, it just is impossible.


Yet.

Planeswalker cards should come with large, wet fish. That way, whenever someone utters the phrase "Planeswalkers are players", you would have something suitable to hand to slap them across the face with.

~ Tim 
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
Sig
56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)
Don't blame the player: blame Wizards of the Coast(R). Here is the first line of the Basic Rulebook:

«In the Magic game, you are counted among the elite spellcasters of the Multiverse - ­the Planeswalkers.»

No surprise so many people get confused!

Don't blame the player: blame Wizards of the Coast(R). Here is the first line of the Basic Rulebook:

«In the Magic game, you are counted among the elite spellcasters of the Multiverse - ­the Planeswalkers.»

No surprise so many people get confused!


Dont get me wrong, Im not blaming new players for misunderstanding things... what annoys me are the established players (who really should know better) that mislead people by overgeneralising or being plain lazy with how they explain things. 

Players are planeswalkers, storywise. Planeswalkers arent players though, since storywise "players" dont exist (this isnt like YGO where the player of the game in the real world represents a player of a game in the fantasy world). Storywise there are no cards, decks, dice, coins, counters, rulebooks etc - there are no players - in the story it's all real.

The actual planeswalker rules are so simple that all these "planeswalkers are players"/"planeswalkers are like players..." talks actually overcomplicate things. People just need to explain the rules using plain facts. (the same things happen when people say "when you can cast a sorcery" - it causes more confusion than if they just explained the actual rules)
Seriously, you can sum up everything people need to know about Planeswalkers in about a minute or two, without any crazy analogies or misleading half-truths. /rant over



~ Tim
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
Sig
56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)
Don't blame the player: blame Wizards of the Coast(R). Here is the first line of the Basic Rulebook:

«In the Magic game, you are counted among the elite spellcasters of the Multiverse - ­the Planeswalkers.»

No surprise so many people get confused!


Yeah, but the better more powerful kind of planeswalkers!

New players should be forced to read the Time Spiral novels... :P

Rules Advisor

The Basic rulebook, read it! A lot of basic questions are answered there!

How to autocard :
Type [c]Black Lotus[/c] to get Black Lotus.
Type [c=Black Lotus]The Overpowered One[/c] to get The Overpowered One.

New players should be forced to read the Time Spiral novels... :P

I guess you are joking. Still, I feel the need to remind everyone that the Number One problem, on this planet, is people forcing others to do so and so.
Live and let live, please!

New players should be forced to read the Time Spiral novels... :P

I guess you are joking. Still, I feel the need to remind everyone that the Number One problem, on this planet, is people forcing others to do so and so.
Live and let live, please!



Of course I was joking. Still, I think your way of thinking that matter is simplistic. We need rules and enforcments of them otherwise if I was allowed to do anything I could do "dishonest" thing and if you were to frown upon me if I took something from you for instance, I'd give you "live and let live". This is totally off topic though. :P

On the subject of Planeswalkers, did you know that wotc changed the non english names of those to the english one (I don't remember if the Lorwyn ones had the french word on them) ? They could have better ideas to simplify things. :D

Rules Advisor

The Basic rulebook, read it! A lot of basic questions are answered there!

How to autocard :
Type [c]Black Lotus[/c] to get Black Lotus.
Type [c=Black Lotus]The Overpowered One[/c] to get The Overpowered One.

Being off topic started when YOU talked about forcing people to read stuff.
Some jokes are not funny: ask any friend from a visible minority.

As for «simplistic way of thinking», you might consider looking in a mirror...
I think your way of thinking that matter is simplistic. We need rules and enforcments of them otherwise if I was allowed to do anything I could do "dishonest" thing and if you were to frown upon me if I took something from you for instance, I'd give you "live and let live".

When you steal my stuff, you are trampling over the «and let live» part of the phrase, so this pseudo-reasoning is obviously flawed (and dishonest). My stuff is mine. I may choose to give it to you, or I may choose to keep it. If you steal my stuff, you actually are forcing me to «give» it to you, against my will. That is why theft is a crime.

A crime is something that is forbidden: something that one is not supposed to do, and that shall be punished if commited. But, as long as they commit no crime, grown-ups should be free to do as they wish, even if they make unwise choices.
Forbidding bad behavior is very different from forcing people to do stuff.
The former is respectful of individual freedom; the latter tramples over it.

Civilized human beings recognize some rights to each other and regroup to unite against those who trample those rights. Of course we need laws! and of course we need goons to enforce those laws! But any legitimate law can only forbid innappropriate behavior (and procure consequences for commiting such).

However, laws should never force action, if such laws is to be deemed legitimate. Sadly, many countries enforce non-legitimate laws by trampling over this fundamental principle. But then, very few country leaders actually care about fundamental principles. Power is the only principle they seek.

Games rules are different from social rules on that very aspect: games rules tell us what we can do, and we can't do anything that's not specifically authorized, while social rules tell us what we can't do, and anything not forbiden is allowed (in civilized parts of the world, that is).

I probably am off topic. Sue me.

In conclusion, planeswalkers can't gain health.

^_^;
Nor can anything in Magic, players included. Tongue Out

But more saliently, Planeswalkers, unlike players, cannot gain life. For one thing, what they have is not life, much less "health", but loyalty.
Jeff Heikkinen DCI Rules Advisor since Dec 25, 2011
Really? So why unloyal planeswalkers go to the graveyard ;)?
Flavour-wise, they're not dying, they're just saying "I've had just about enough of this $&|+, you can't fire me, I quit!".

Rules-wise, they only go to a place called the "graveyard" because that's what the discard pile happens to be called. It doesn't make any less sense than it does for, say, Fireball.
Jeff Heikkinen DCI Rules Advisor since Dec 25, 2011
A planeswalker can die. He or she might be destroyed ;).
A planeswalker can die. He or she might be destroyed ;).


They would only die if they were a creature at the time. ;)

~ Tim  
I am Blue/White Reached DCI Rating 1800 on 28/10/11. :D
Sig
56287226 wrote:
190106923 wrote:
Not bad. But what happens flavor wise when one kamahl kills the other one?
Zis iz a sign uf deep psychological troma, buried in zer subconscious mind. By keelink himzelf, Kamahl iz physically expressink hiz feelinks uf self-disgust ova hiz desire for hiz muzzer. [/GermanPsychologistVoice]
56957928 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
That makes no sense to me. If they spelled the ability out on the card in full then it would not be allowed in a mono-black Commander deck, but because they used a keyword to save space it is allowed? ~ Tim
Yup, just like you can have Birds of paradise in a mono green deck but not Noble Hierarch. YAY COLOR IDENTITY
56287226 wrote:
56888618 wrote:
Is algebra really that difficult?
Survey says yes.
56883218 wrote:
57799958 wrote:
You want to make a milky drink. You squeeze a cow.
I love this description. Like the cows are sponges filled with milk. I can see it all Nick Parks claymation-style with the cow's eyes bugging out momentarily as a giant farmer squeezes it like a squeaky dog toy, and milk shoots out of it.
56287226 wrote:
56735468 wrote:
And no judge will ever give you a game loss for playing snow covered lands.
I now have a new goal in life. ;)
I asked this before but nobody answered :P.
Assume you are a planeswalker. You turn into a creature. How do you feel ;) ?
While they usually only use the word "die" in templating for creatures, the word "die" still just means "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield", not "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield while being a creature". A non-creature planeswalker going to the graveyard from the battlefield would count as it dying, for anything that cares about that.
While they usually only use the word "die" in templating for creatures, the word "die" still just means "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield", not "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield while being a creature". A non-creature planeswalker going to the graveyard from the battlefield would count as it dying, for anything that cares about that.

The rules define "dies" as a term used only for creatures.

700.6. The term dies means “is put into a graveyard from the battlefield.” It is used only when referring to creatures.

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While they usually only use the word "die" in templating for creatures, the word "die" still just means "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield", not "is put into a graveyard from the battlefield while being a creature". A non-creature planeswalker going to the graveyard from the battlefield would count as it dying, for anything that cares about that.

The rules define "dies" as a term used only for creatures.

700.6. The term dies means “is put into a graveyard from the battlefield.” It is used only when referring to creatures.


not anymore, they changed that in the latest update (that isn't live yet)

www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.a...
proud member of the 2011 community team