Gatecrash is a "EDH expansion" ?

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Howdie

As a standard player I cannot think otherwise than the title says. Up until now the spoiled rares/mythic rares(and we got all of them spoiled) are
mostly very underwhelming for a standard player.

Shocklands and Aurelia's fury and Simic/Boros Charm are  110% sure to get into standard decks, maybe the red goblin as well, but other few standard playable/nearly-playable cards are either 50/50(Dimir charm, Domri Rade), or sideboard stuff(Dimir double-edged Bob, white medic dude).

Compared to Innistrad or RtR this expansion is bad and boring in standard. I guess I'm glad we got sealed/draft, and that EDH players can be happy, but that are the only reasons why I'm ok with GTC.

 
Howdie

As a standard player I cannot think otherwise than the title says. Up until now the spoiled rares/mythic rares(and we got all of them spoiled) are
mostly very underwhelming for a standard player.

Shocklands and Aurelia's fury and Simic/Boros Charm are  110% sure to get into standard decks, maybe the red goblin as well, but other few standard playable/nearly-playable cards are either 50/50(Dimir charm, Domri Rade), or sideboard stuff(Dimir double-edged Bob, white medic dude).

Compared to Innistrad or RtR this expansion is bad and boring in standard. I guess I'm glad we got sealed/draft, and that EDH players can be happy, but that are the only reasons why I'm ok with GTC.

 



So can we expect you not to show up to any events?
Yep. This set basically sucks.

Oh, and am I the only one who thinks Aurelia's Fury is bad? 

みんな、見ていてくれ!

Yep. This set basically sucks.

Oh, and am I the only one who thinks Aurelia's Fury is bad? 


You're silly.
Yeah, except most of it isn't good in edh either.

3DH4LIF3

This set seemed more focused on Limited playability and casual fodder than EDH, frankly. Very few money cards in the set, especially knowing how far the shocks will drop. I expect that after the dust has cleared, Innistrad and M13 will be the best sets to open still. Hoping Dragon's Maze is more impressive from a standard point of few, and once GTC drops we can probably expect some Sorin vs Tibalt spoilers.
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Yep. This set basically sucks.

Oh, and am I the only one who thinks Aurelia's Fury is bad? 


It's GILBIC.

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139359831 wrote:
I hope all this helps you to see things in a greater light—and understand that Magic: the Gathering was really created by extraterrestials using Richard Garfield as a medium. The game itself reflects the socio-psycho realtivity between living beings, and the science that takes precedence over them—to define reality for them all (like telekinesis, weather, scientific reaction, phenomenon, ingenuity, how the brain works, etc.). I'd also bet there is an entity floating thousands of miles above us, looking down on the current state of game, shaking its fist like... "Wtf are you doing?! You're getting it all screwed up!". Awkward—to be evolved, and yet still subject to the ladder that is the concepts of the game. In this case, misconception, corruption, and deception. With the realities of each color becoming distorted (through oblivious designers), leading the game to reflect a false state of reality that warps the understanding that other people have about those things. For example, people thinking that white could be anything except pure good. This shouldn't be too far off though, I mean...Magic is designed based on reality after all, so that entity (those entities) should be subject to those things. Anyways, I guess when you're busy doing space stuff you can't always be around to ensure quality control. It's no wonder they choose Garfield, they're so much alike; that's exactly what happened to him and Magic.
166199665 wrote:
omg snortng so much febbdelicious /intocixated in rl
Yep. This set basically sucks.

Oh, and am I the only one who thinks Aurelia's Fury is bad? 


No. I too, have card evaluation skills.
I'm gonna say Aurelia's Fury is incredibly useful, and you'll see it played in Standard until it rotates (as long as R/W decks are played that is), since it basically reads: your creatures are unblockable next turn.  To the O.P., the constant "GILBIC" and "EDH fodder" comments are a constant in any spoiler season, and most of the EDH comments come from people who don't even play the format.  Many cards are hard to judge just by looking at them, example: Sphinx's Revelation, which was deemed "GILBIC" when it was spoiled.  I sold a couple of them for $5 before they caught on and the prices skyrocketed.  Without playtesting, the comments you see are simply (as the forum states) speculation.  Also, when Rorix says a card is bad, that's every single card, so don't listen to that noise.  Some of the cards you see might not look that good, but some may spawn an entirely new archetype, like that ooze enchantment that is either going to be a $0.50 rare, or an entire new deck type across multiple formats (unlikely, but it may happen).  That's why we don't get to know FFL stuffs, because then we'd know what's really up.  But to give you the broadest possible answer, sets can't be built around one format only (Modern Masters and Un-sets excluded), because there are so many players out there playing so many different formats that need new experiences as well as answers to problem cards.  Pauper gets new stuff with every set, and that's a format that is usually only played online, even Vintage gets new stuff every now again.  So no, this is definitely NOT an EDH set, it's just another expansion set.     
Yep. This set basically sucks.

Oh, and am I the only one who thinks Aurelia's Fury is bad? 


Yeah, I don't think the card actually does anything.

Directed at OP: In most constructed sets only a certain amount of the cards are constructed playable. Most of the cards in the set are just bad from a Standard viewpoint. And then fewer are good in modern, then even fewer in legacy. That's just how it goes. And quite frankly since most of the cards in each set are unplayble outside of limited, who cares if they made them with EDH in mind? I don't even like EDH but I don't see how this is a problem. 
This set seemed more focused on Limited playability and casual fodder than EDH, frankly. Very few money cards in the set, especially knowing how far the shocks will drop. I expect that after the dust has cleared, Innistrad and M13 will be the best sets to open still. Hoping Dragon's Maze is more impressive from a standard point of few, and once GTC drops we can probably expect some Sorin vs Tibalt spoilers.



sorin and tibalt are fighting each other? is that even fair?

thats like pitting a trained MMA fighter vs that kid in middle school that the jocks beat up on....
I'm gonna say Aurelia's Fury is incredibly useful, and you'll see it played in Standard until it rotates (as long as R/W decks are played that is), since it basically reads: your creatures are unblockable next turn.  To the O.P., the constant "GILBIC" and "EDH fodder" comments are a constant in any spoiler season, and most of the EDH comments come from people who don't even play the format.  Many cards are hard to judge just by looking at them, example: Sphinx's Revelation, which was deemed "GILBIC" when it was spoiled.  I sold a couple of them for $5 before they caught on and the prices skyrocketed.  Without playtesting, the comments you see are simply (as the forum states) speculation.  Also, when Rorix says a card is bad, that's every single card, so don't listen to that noise.  Some of the cards you see might not look that good, but some may spawn an entirely new archetype, like that ooze enchantment that is either going to be a $0.50 rare, or an entire new deck type across multiple formats (unlikely, but it may happen).  That's why we don't get to know FFL stuffs, because then we'd know what's really up.  But to give you the broadest possible answer, sets can't be built around one format only (Modern Masters and Un-sets excluded), because there are so many players out there playing so many different formats that need new experiences as well as answers to problem cards.  Pauper gets new stuff with every set, and that's a format that is usually only played online, even Vintage gets new stuff every now again.  So no, this is definitely NOT an EDH set, it's just another expansion set.     


Everything this person said is true.
I consider this a fun set
I play for fun
Howdie

As a standard player I cannot think otherwise than the title says. Up until now the spoiled rares/mythic rares(and we got all of them spoiled) are
mostly very underwhelming for a standard player.

Shocklands and Aurelia's fury and Simic/Boros Charm are  110% sure to get into standard decks, maybe the red goblin as well, but other few standard playable/nearly-playable cards are either 50/50(Dimir charm, Domri Rade), or sideboard stuff(Dimir double-edged Bob, white medic dude).

Compared to Innistrad or RtR this expansion is bad and boring in standard. I guess I'm glad we got sealed/draft, and that EDH players can be happy, but that are the only reasons why I'm ok with GTC.

 



EDH is also a playing format. Surprisingly as this may be, it does bring WotC money, and probably quite a lot of it (certainly not as much as Draft, Standard, Modern in that order, but a chunk of money still).

One may look how flexible these cards are for Standard, and how much the format will change when 1) Innistrad rotates, 2) Gatecrash forces deck redesign, 3) all that lovely info you don't have about Dragon's Maze, or even the REST of Gatecrash, 4) what M14 has in store, 5) anything else I've failed to mention.

"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count." "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969) "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
I get to play my watery graves.  nothing else matters.
Next thing you will tell me Browbeat is bad.
Pretty much taken from MTGS: forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t...
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Out of the 15 mythics from Return to Ravnica, I count 4 that see consistent Standard play: Revelation, Angel of Serenity, Jace, and Rakdos' Return. A few other have shown up from time to time. I really don't see how Gatecrash is any different. Its normal. But still, every set, we get people complaining about the mythics.


Second, why rate a set on how good the mythics will be in Standard anyway? Is that what you want to see? A metagame defined by how many mythics you can jam into a 75-card deck? You don't even consider the commons or uncommons? Cards like Pit Fight and Orzhov Charm are the reasons why I'm excited for the new set, not cards like Aurelia's Fury.  
I agree with the title of this thread that is all.

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I like how this set slows down standard, as much or more than RTR did.  I'm looking forward to the ensuing silliness that a slower format sees.
Most cards are printed for casual, there's nothing new about this. Just because you want to give it a new name doesn't change anything. There probably isn't any more dedication to EDH as a format, it's just your inability to evaluate its power level in that format. If we're restricting cards in Stanard by power level, then it's only fair to do so with EDH as well, since the majority of cards aren't playable.

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I actually prefer sets where the mythics don't see any play. It means I can get them cheaper for casual decks AND makes building standard decks cheaper as well. Win win!

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71235715 wrote:
I mainly play EDH but even for me these are not exciting. If i was to open a booster i want to be amazed by what ive got think about it and then possibly sell it for something i want or need. With the Primeval cycle running around i dont have a prayer... 

If your reading Wizards. Make cards which are Coincidentally good for multiplayer, not cards which are nearly playable in multiplayer. 

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Pretty much taken from MTGS: forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t...



Virtually all legendary creatures built these days with EDH in mind. The OP's argument and that of the poster in MTGS don't have much to say that doesn't deal with those cards. As I said above, this attitude of players thinking this stuff is apparently heavily-EDH inclined is done without taking the current format when Gatecrash becomes legal or with the entire block, or the next with a rotating Standard format, into account.

There are also always cards that appeal strongly to EDH players; however, the authors in these cases are either caring only about that shill called "competitive" EDH (1v1), or cards that improve in multiplayer environments, and EDH just happens to encompass the latter, while ignoring that it corresponds well with 2HG, Emperor, which I'm sure are formats that are EXTREMELY familiar to these authors.

Come back when the set, and the Block, are fully revealed, then find a concensus on the cards rating in value in multiplayer, EDH multiplayer, EDH 1v1, versus other 1v1 formats, and THEN if you can also manage to define a baseline above which a set might be "too EDH friendly," and this set falls above that line, THEN we can agree with each other.
"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count." "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969) "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
If you're reading Wizards. Make cards which are Coincidentally good for multiplayer, not cards which are nearly playable in multiplayer. 



Fixed and QFT. 

While it is premature to call Gatecrash "an EDH set," there does seem to be many obvious EDH-inspired cards.  Those Commander precons sold like hotcakes, giving WotC concrete evidence that there is money to be made in the format.  I'd expect more cards in the vein of the Primordial cycle in the future, not less.  However, I doubt that they'll take up so much space in the set that it'll detract from competitive formats.

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Mythics being unplayable in Standard is generally good for the format--keeps the prices down.

I think there's a decent number of GTC cards that look standard playable, but many of them are at lower rarities.  Like...the entire bloodrush mechanic is pushed pretty hard to the point that some bloodrush abilities are similar to or better than pump spells which were format staples in the past.

Cats land on their feet. Toast lands peanut butter side down. A cat with toast strapped to its back will hover above the ground in a state of quantum indecision.

It does feel like theres a large amount of cards clearly designed for EDH in this set.
It does feel like theres a large amount of cards clearly designed for EDH in this set.



Aside from the legendary creatures, Primordials, and charms, care to name a few?

"Possibilities abound, too numerous to count." "Innocent, unbiased observation is a myth." --- P.B. Medawar (1969) "Ever since man first left his cave and met a stranger with a different language and a new way of looking at things, the human race has had a dream: to kill him, so we don't have to learn his language or his new way of looking at things." --- Zapp Brannigan (Beast With a Billion Backs)
Every card could be made for EDH, some less suited than others.  And to say that charms and legendaries were clearly designed for EDH is misleading.  Every set has a large amount of EDH playables.  Why now, in everyone's mind, is "designed for EDH" such a stigma.

But, yeah, sure:

Enter the Infinite
Merciless Eviction
Thespian Stage

I think a couple of people find your vernacular irritating, Q.  You're too often condescending...
Crypt Ghast and arguably Biovisionary are two that come to mind for me. Also, the Orzhov board wipe.
Biovisionary.




Huh? I'll be surprised if someone makes this a decent win-con in EDH, certainly, even with cards like Rite of Replication out there. It struck me more as a card for casual/modern with Mirrorweave.
It's kinda sad that casual players aren't more vocal. Reading through this forum makes me feel like the majority of the players only want standard staples cards and f*ck the rest of the other cards...
I take comfort knowing that THAT isn't true, but yeah, it doesn't show here...unfortunately...
As a side question does anyone actually know how the profit for MtG kind of breaks down; which groups of people bring in the most profit? Does most come from the casual players? Or tournament crowds? How does that whole scene break down? Is Standard the biggest money maker? Vintage? What group is MtG's steak, what's it's potatoes? Cornbread? Who does MtG need to cater cards to the most? Who the least? Now that I think about it, it's got to be pretty damn difficult designing cards across a board if you're trying to cater to everyone in the various groups since the dynamics of the game are generally pretty different among the different groups of players.

But I'm curious if there's info available to determine who MtG should be designing cards for the "most"- i.e. that group of people playing their given "variant" of the game.
Crypt Ghast will easily see Standard play.

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It's kinda sad that casual players aren't more vocal. Reading through this forum makes me feel like the majority of the players only want standard staples cards and f*ck the rest of the other cards...
I take comfort knowing that THAT isn't true, but yeah, it doesn't show here...unfortunately...


If you read the standard forums a lot of the more vocal posters really seem to crap on any more casual player.
It's kinda sad that casual players aren't more vocal. Reading through this forum makes me feel like the majority of the players only want standard staples cards and f*ck the rest of the other cards...
I take comfort knowing that THAT isn't true, but yeah, it doesn't show here...unfortunately...


If you read the standard forums a lot of the more vocal posters really seem to crap on any more casual player.


Yeah...I think I noticed that...thanks.
So yeah, basically, there are a lot of players "like me" out there. So wizards cater for us (not only for the tournament players who buy only chase cards).
Come to think of it....I'm not so sure about this assertion any more. I mean, somehow, casual players must be bringing them more money than those people who pay a crapload for ONE deck then?
If so, I kind of understand the frustration of the "lack of power" of the released sets recently, but in the mean time, you "elite" players shouldn't whine as much, since much of the "attention" (media-wise) are focused on standard and "pro" gaming, rather than casual (even though we seemingly get the upper hand in terms of product satisfaction? It seems?).
It does feel like theres a large amount of cards clearly designed for EDH in this set.



Aside from the legendary creatures, Primordials, and charms, care to name a few?




Gruul ragebeast is another.
It's kinda sad that casual players aren't more vocal. Reading through this forum makes me feel like the majority of the players only want standard staples cards and f*ck the rest of the other cards...
I take comfort knowing that THAT isn't true, but yeah, it doesn't show here...unfortunately...


If you read the standard forums a lot of the more vocal posters really seem to crap on any more casual player.


Yeah...I think I noticed that...thanks.
So yeah, basically, there are a lot of players "like me" out there. So wizards cater for us (not only for the tournament players who buy only chase cards).
Come to think of it....I'm not so sure about this assertion any more. I mean, somehow, casual players must be bringing them more money than those people who pay a crapload for ONE deck then?
If so, I kind of understand the frustration of the "lack of power" of the released sets recently, but in the mean time, you "elite" players shouldn't whine as much, since much of the "attention" (media-wise) are focused on standard and "pro" gaming, rather than casual (even though we seemingly get the upper hand in terms of product satisfaction? It seems?).



Limited players generate the most cash for Hasbro/Wizards. Whether those are mainly casual or competitive players, I don't know.
I think part of this sentiment is coming from the fact that there are a handful of potentially great cards, like Merciless Eviction and Treasury Thrull, that simply won't see a lot of play because they cost 1-2 more than they should to be playable in Standard. I can understand that, although it's possible that sentiment is just totally wrong (well, for Eviction at least). Also, I don't think people are used to seeing an entire cycle (the Primordials) devoted to multiplayer/EDH.

I think there is some truth to what these people are saying, probably just tinged with a little overreaction, as per usual. This set isn't as EDH-focused as it is... just... "meh."

I am primarily an EDH player (occasionally Standard, but rarely), and I find a lot of this set to be rather disappointing, although there are definitely some gems.
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I believe they are just slowing down the pace of the game, so that when innistrad rotates out, Return to ravnica will shine. I am really looking forward to this.
I play for fun
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