Islands RDW Redux (Version 1.0 - 2.0 to drop after Spoilers finish[Warning:Spoilers])

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Land
19 Mountain

Creatures
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Stromkirk Noble
4 Vexing Devil
4 Ash Zealot

Planeswalkers
4 Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded

Burn
3 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear
4 Skullcrack
2 Brimstone Volley
4 Thunderous Wrath

SB
4 Reckless Waif
3 Furnace Devils
3 Thunderbolt
2 Flames of the Firebrand
2 Boros Reckoner
1 Pillar of Flame
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
Yeah, good playtesting today. My RDW matchup is usually very good but this was just a pain to deal with. Anybody who don't have Vexing Devils yet, make sure you get them because they're a workhorse in this deck. 
Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded?!? Really?

a 4-of?  REALLY??!!??

Too random for me.  Also don't want to get stuck with a handful of them. 
Shadowchu, for the record, was playing a deck with Centaur Healer, Thragtusk, Rhox Faithmender, Deathrite Shaman, and Sphinx's Revalation//Tree of Redemption depending on the build.

I think I would have gotten you that last game you needed to go.  I ripped a Wrath to answer the second Rhox and I think I'd win the race, even with your tree.

Zooligan:  Yes.  Tibalt.  You control his +1 extremely well.  Your curve is very low.  He's won me lots of games.  I've won with gridning and riding the +1.  I've won with -4.  I've won with -6.  His +1 handles duplicates quite well naturally.
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
Funny enough, I think brimstone volley is the weakest card in the deck. I think if the deck could run on 2 lands it would be perfect to be honest. 

Forge Devil seems terrible but I don't know what other creatures would be good here.  
Forge Devil is good on the draw.  I actually board it in a decent bit.  I didn't against you though.

Tell them about Tibalt.  Tell them! 
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
How has Legion Loyalist been? I need to order my playset and was wondering how good they are. The first strike seems nice, but trample and unblockable by tokens don't seem that good. Trample doesn't seem that good when all the creatures are 2 power or less (except vexing devil if it sticks around or a noble that got two attacks in). Unblockable by tokens seems potentially great, but there doesn't seem to be too many tokens seeing play in standard. 

Looks like I'll have to trade for some tibalts. It looks pretty good here. I'll try to playtest this a little when I get the chance.   

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How about Burning Tree Emmissary instead of Forge?

I found Carmen Sandiego before you were born unless you're Zlehtnoba.

Tibalt was really good here. Basically anything you're discarding or drawing is the same as what you have before so +1ing him isn't a problem here. -4 will be relevant against control decks and -6 will be relevant against midrange decks. It actually works really well here.

Legion Loyalist is decent from what I've played against. It's going to be great against thragtusk tokens and lingering souls tokens which can be problems for RDW.

Also, buy Tibalts. They are at like $2.50-3.

edit: Also, the deck I was playing against this was very much still in the design phase but I have had some actually experience playing it against real opponents who were playing tier 1 aggro decks and my deck raped them. This matchup makes me want to go smaller to be honest because I'm too midrange for this deck and some of these bigger midrange decks are going to get ground out by Tibalt which sounds ridiculous but is a real thing.  
Hmmm.  I'll have to proxy it up and give it a go.  I guess with all the 1 and 2 drops, it might work.  That "at random" thing bothers me, but maybe if I see it played...
Hmmm.  I'll have to proxy it up and give it a go.  I guess with all the 1 and 2 drops, it might work.  That "at random" thing bothers me, but maybe if I see it played...



You don't need many lands.  Tibalt turns lands and other extraneous cards into value.
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
I gotta buy more Bayous. Not sure I wanna drop $60 on playsets of crap I don't have yet for this (loyalist, noble, tibalt). Plus skullcracks will prolly be a dollar at drop and I gotta dig up Thunderous Wraths.

Is this seriously good? 

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I don't like the MD Loyalists or the playset of  Thunderous Wraths. If you're trying to maximize Tibalt, wouldn't a combo deck be more appropriate than RDW anyways?
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I gotta buy more Bayous. Not sure I wanna drop $60 on playsets of crap I don't have yet for this (loyalist, noble, tibalt). Plus skullcracks will prolly be a dollar at drop and I gotta dig up Thunderous Wraths.

Is this seriously good? 


It beat my life gain deck which is specifically meant to destroy aggro decks. I'm an idiot so I have a whole bunch of different versions of the deck and it did well against all of them. I even had a tree of redeption rhox faithmender going and it wasn't that great. 

Tibalts are at $2.50, I got Legion Loyalists for $2.75 on ebay, I found Nobles for $3 but they're in Chinese. so you're under $60 right now. Make it happen. 
I have found electrickery to be complete garbage in playtesting (mana dorks, sometimes, that's it)

also, this might be completely stupid but, 1 or 2 nightbird's clutches?

also, in sideboard any room for traitorous blood etc?  can really house heavy duty critters like reanimated griselbrand or that stupid tree
How is Tibalt better than Faithless Looting? 

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How is Tibalt better than Faithless Looting? 



It isn't card disadvantage.  I don't pay mana to dig after I cast him.  He wins the game.
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
What's the average cost you think? Also, what about putting in a couple of Chandra, the fire brands?
What's the average cost you think? Also, what about putting in a couple of Chandra, the fire brands?


That card doesn't really do anything and costs 4. Too many hungry for the deck, i would think. 
I like that each subsequent printing of Chandra is worse than the last. ;_;

This deck looks NAUGHTY.
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 
Id be interested, as I'm going to play Grull come GtC
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 



We went 1 and 1 in matches =]

Match 2 he went T2 Burning-Tree, Burning-Tree, Searing Spear my dude all THREE games.  I still won that match ;)

******
Chandra costs a bajillion mana and doesn't do anything.

Nightbird's Clutches seem less good here because I'll almost never be able to flash it back.  I'll try it though.  I'll have some combination of Flames of the Firebrand/Threaten Effect in the SB.

I love Thunderous Wrath and I find Tibalt better in a deck like this than any sort of combo. 

This deck is super cheap.  No Hellrider.  No Hellkite.  I have sets of each and I'm trying this instead.  Vexing Devil is the money card in this build, hilariously enough.

I think this build will be VERY good before the metagame settles.   
Slave of Tibalt. Currently trading for foils of my bro. PM me. Tarmogoyf on Twitter. Follow me. Team GFG Guns, Fame, Glory Those that require a sig for the ego simply haven't had enough kind words thrown his or her way. Currently looking for prerelease Plains! People who have mailed me rares:
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Malpheas: THANK YOU FOR THE FOIL TIBALT, YOU BEAUTIFUL GUY, YOU! Suudsu2200: Armageddon! Sèance, Dominating Licid, Words of War, Gaea's Anthem, Momentous Fall, Nyxathid PM me to make it happen. Your username will end up here, as the cards you sent me. I reserve the right to order your usernames by the cards I liked the best. Oh, and if you send me some Islands in the package, I'll sign them and mail them back.
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 



I'm interested--that's why I mentioned Burning Tree earlier on. Are you running Flinthoof or Strangleroot? I'm thinking of running dorks to see if I can mimic the best of GW aggro:

T1 Dork
T2 Lox
T3 Burning Tree, other stuff, possibly hellrider
T4 Loyalist and uncounterable gruul pump stuff or my suite of burn

But it's hella inconsistent.

I found Carmen Sandiego before you were born unless you're Zlehtnoba.

Seems like a crazy list you got here, Islands.  You've always got unique takes on traditional lists, and this is no exception.
 
I really like the going smaller package. Hopefully we get another good one drop in GTC.  I've been playing RDW on mtgo lately, and have found that I often get stuck with the expensive dudes and can't get enough pressure down before I'm outclassed by smiters and thragtusks.  I've been really liking stonewright, but that's in a 23 land build, where as he wouldn't be nearly as effective here.

How do you deal with the bigger creatures? First strike + burn with the loyalist? If that's the case, hopefully we get 1-cmc burn as I think it'd probably be better than Pillar. G/W and Naya are the hugest pains in my side as RDW, I'm wondering if this has a better match up than the traditional RDW lists that have been making the rounds in standard currently.

As much as I want to just jam Boros, my favorite color combo, I have to give this a try.  Seems awesome.  Gonna pick up some Tibalts today in preparation.
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Ok, I'm willing to give this a shot, since I happen to already have 3 Tibalt and he's not doing much outside a casual deck.

No way you can convince me to run 4 Wraths though.  What do you reccomend for a build running 3 Tobalt and 2 Wrath?  I'm thinking of filling out the MD Pillars and tossing in a pair of....I don't know...Nivmagus Elemental?  Or maybe DynachargeFuror of the Bitten wouldn't be too bad either.
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Fun list.

Question though:  Have you had any trouble with the Thunderous Wrath? Seems problematic with a playset of 4 in the deck, combined with all that draw from Tibalt.
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 



I'm interested--that's why I mentioned Burning Tree earlier on. Are you running Flinthoof or Strangleroot? I'm thinking of running dorks to see if I can mimic the best of GW aggro:

T1 Dork
T2 Lox
T3 Burning Tree, other stuff, possibly hellrider
T4 Loyalist and uncounterable gruul pump stuff or my suite of burn

But it's hella inconsistent.


I'm going to make a new thread as not to derail this one. 
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 



We went 1 and 1 in matches =]

Match 2 he went T2 Burning-Tree, Burning-Tree, Searing Spear my dude all THREE games.  I still won that match ;)


I also didn't really have a sideboard. And didn't draw a flinthoof boar the entire time and only 1 predator ooze. 

I think if the cockatrice shuffler wasn't such a joke we both would have known what the decks were doing better in general. 
So the RG aggro list I've been playing around with stacked up pretty well to this. Will post a list if anybody cares. 



We went 1 and 1 in matches =]

Match 2 he went T2 Burning-Tree, Burning-Tree, Searing Spear my dude all THREE games.  I still won that match ;)

******
Chandra costs a bajillion mana and doesn't do anything.

Nightbird's Clutches seem less good here because I'll almost never be able to flash it back.  I'll try it though.  I'll have some combination of Flames of the Firebrand/Threaten Effect in the SB.

I love Thunderous Wrath and I find Tibalt better in a deck like this than any sort of combo. 

This deck is super cheap.  No Hellrider.  No Hellkite.  I have sets of each and I'm trying this instead.  Vexing Devil is the money card in this build, hilariously enough.

I think this build will be VERY good before the metagame settles.   



I think this morning Tibalt was a buck fifty and I just bought a play set at two-twenty-five per. That's a HUGE increase wtf. Get em now folks!

I found Carmen Sandiego before you were born unless you're Zlehtnoba.

I took out a land and two spells from my RDW to throw in 3 Tibalt's tonight for a tournie and he was pretty kickass! Gave me lots of draw and he really throws people for a loop. Other than only 1 thundermaw in my deck, everything else is at least a three of. So the redundancy is great. I was impressed with Tibalt's performance, and was totally shocked by how good his +1 really was. I will proxy up this deck to give it a go jjst based off what I saw tonight from actually playing Tibalt.
So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?
So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?


Probably ignore it and attack them. 
So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?


Probably ignore it and attack them. 





Pretty much this. If someone spends turn 4 playing this against aggro instead of Verdict or Thragtusk, they're letting you win. 
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So how much damage should this deck be dealing at turn 4, on average, for the turn and cumulative?
So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?


Probably ignore it and attack them. 


this is a non-issue since gideon is absolutely terrible and will not see serious play

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So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?


Probably ignore it and attack them. 


this is a non-issue since gideon is absolutely terrible and will not see serious play



agreed.
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So, just wondering, what is the plan for mono red to get rid of the new Gideon PW with his indestructible/prevent damage 0 ability?


Probably ignore it and attack them. 


this is a non-issue since gideon is absolutely terrible and will not see serious play


Also true. 
I'm curious to hear how you folks are using Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded to get the mileage out of him that I seem to be hearing. Are you dropping him on two in preference to a hastie in order to get him primed for the -4 before it's too late to get anything out of it? Holding him would seem to reduce the value quickly, but my impulse would be to cast the hastie on turn two.

Land
19 Mountain

Creatures
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Stromkirk Noble
4 Vexing Devil
4 Ash Zealot

Planeswalkers
4 Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded

Burn
3 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear
4 Skullcrack
2 Brimstone Volley
4 Thunderous Wrath

Current SB (Will be heavily modified)
4 Reckless Waif
4 Forge Devil
1 Pillar of Flame
3 Electrickery
3 Thunderbolt




Where is HellriderHellrider makes RDW well RDW.  I would take Hellrider over Thunderous Wrath anyday and twice on Sunday.  Also all that burn is nice but it seems quite conter-intuitive to have all that burn and not run Guttersnipe.  Another often over-looked card in these decks that belongs is Hellion Crucible for end of opponent's turn mana-dump to get something tangible.  If you don't like that manadump I recommend Dragon Hatchling or Stonewright.


-NW
-NW "Behold blessed perfection!" --Sheoldred, Whispering One
NW, you're relatively new to the forums so you don't know yet; Islands knows what he's doing. This deck is designed to run off 2-3 land and Hellrider costs 4. Dragon Hatchling is bad and Stonewright's too mana intensive, though really good.