B/R ZOMBIES/humans

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I appreciate B/R Zombies but i want to put a twist on it focusing a little more on Falkenroth Aristocrat I added a few more humans to fed/protect her. Its pretty typical just looking for a little more advantage with my humans. 

Diregraf Ghoul x3
Gravecrawler x3
Rakdos Cackler x3
Blood Artist x4
Knight of Infamy x4
Geralf's Messenger x4
Falkenrath Aristocrat x4
Disciple of Bolas x2
Zealous Conscripts x2

Tragic Slip x3
Brimstone Volley x3
Pillar of Flame x3 

Dragonskull Summit x4
Blood Crypt x4
Rakdos Guildgate x4
Cavern of Souls x3
Swamp x5
Mountain x2

I usually play casual but i want to dabble in standard, i deconstructed my B/r vamp and B/G pod for this . I left out the hellkite because of budget any alternatives? Could I sub Flames of the Firebrand or Thunderbolt for flakking? Also is 22 solid for lands? I know 8 4+ drops isnt very aggro but i like how my humans fed Aristocrat and provide sustain in long games. I think my sideboard will consist of what pieces are usually in the typical build.

I dont understand standard metagame any help making this succesful will be appreciated
Bloodthrone Vampire works well with mixed Zombie-Vampire builds. Lots of combat trick potential there.

I just posted a deck with a similar theme but witout Zombies. I plan to try Thatcher Revolt for my Vampire-feeding needs. The Zombies-Vampire build is good, I just don't want to buy the Messengers and Gravecrawlers.

I doubt you need the Guildgates and I suspect your decks's performance will suffer because of them.
i like the zombies tempo and for 3cmc id rather run more Brimstone Volley i feel 8 humans can sustain my aristocrat, if not i already own 3 gravecrawler/messangers who are happy to get sac'd. i didnt want to run the gates but from a recent standard article i saw them running it
I actually wanted to make a jund adaptation for Golgari Charm to break Orings and Rest in Peace and also its invaluable against board wipes and weenies. Also Dreg Mangler and Rancor for more aggro. I don't know if there enough hate for this deck to worry about the splash yet
Meh I don't like zealous conscripts or disciple
Diregraf ghouls and grave crawlers are better than rakdos cacklers. Consider hellrider and bump in the night for fast aggro.
If you want to run jund zombies you need lotleth troll, deathrite, rancor, dreg mangler, abrupt decay
Also it might be just me but I stopped using tragic slips in favor of victim of night and dreadbore
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
i ran cacklers to help from mono-red going under but it doesnt help any. i already have a solid golgari pod sporting all those i figure with enough shock and duals i can combine w/ my b/r vamp for a solid jund, the current skeleton is way too expensive. I found the current zombies burns out too fast against any midrange. conscripts and disciple really improved that matchup for me but im gonna drop them to run jund now. Ill work on my numbers and post a list soon.
Alright here's what i got so far

Main Board

3 Deathrite Shaman 
3 Gravecrawler
3 Diregraf Ghoul
3 Lotleth Troll
3 Blood Artist
3 Knight of Infamy
3 Geralf's Messenger
3 Dreg Mangler
3 Falkenrath Aristocrat

3 Rancor
2 Pillar of Flame
3 Dreadbore
3 Searing Spear 

Land

3 Blood Crypt
3 Dragonskull Summit
3 Cavern of Souls
3 Overgrown Tomb
3 Woodland Cemetery
3 Swamp
2 Forest
2 Mountain

Side Board

3 Duress
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Golgari Charm
3 Brimstone Volley
2 Hellrider
2 Slaughter Games

I think using black as the medium this deck wont be too color hungry i.e. Geralf's Messenger. Everything is 3-of to pack in the best tools from both Red and Green i hope the straightforward power and synergy can support the lack of consistency.

Also in my side board, i subbed golgari charms for Bonfire of the Damned for their utilty as well as volley and hellrider for more burn if neccessary, and slaughter games/duress for help against control.

Am i sacrificing too much consistency for green? You think this would be any bit viable in FNM?
I've been running jund zombies for about a month, deck has changed quite a bit and heres what i have
btw i've gone 2-2 every time

4 x Blood Crypt
4 x Overgrown Tomb
4 x
4 x
1 x
5 x
4 x
4 x
2 x
2 x Knight of infamy
4 x
4 x
3 x
4 x
2 x
3 x
2 x
2 x
2 x

sideboard



I think you do give up a lot of consistancy by going from B/R to jund.One of the things i don't like about jund is the lack of burn. in B/R i had pillars. bumps, spears, brimstones etc that were very versitile.
It might be just me but i've had some pretty bad luck playing with this deck. I often find myself either color screwed or too creature or removal heavy. I do think its worth giving a try though as it can work very well
I would suggest changing your numbers around a bit. i personally still haven't figured out what burn/removal is best, debating abrupt decay and such

as for sideboard i don't have any bonfires so can't tell you much
appetite for brains is great for killing sublimes/thrags/etc
blood artists are very good against other zombie decks
i personally like golgari charm, it is goods
liliana is good against control and can kill geist
mizzium mortars is decent removal, can overload and kill loxodon
olivia is good against aggro, and i use vraska against control to get my assasin dudes out and kill tampon moon sages/jaces

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
I feel you, i run around 10-15 removal in my g/b pod and 8-12 burn in my b/r vamp. I think playtesting and knowing the decks im playing will tell how many i need. i dont prefer victim of the night for mirror matches, monoR, and huntsman but i think ill switch dreadbore and golgari charm just so i have enchantment breakers and to smite mana-dorks. I think between lotleth and falkenroth being my major attackers i might drop rancor for more burn, say searing spear or Flames of the Firebrand for flakking since i dont have Thundermaw Hellkite Also i dont have any standard planeswalkers except Liliana of the Dark Realms she could fix my mana by fetching shocklands as well as buffing lotlrth or aristocrat.
what are thoughts on sb'ing 1x or 2x Blasphemous Act or Killing Wave for a board wipe
Don't really see when you would want to board wipe your own dudes when playing zombies, but try Mutilate 
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
what are thoughts on sb'ing 1x or 2x Blasphemous Act or Killing Wave for a board wipe


2 or 3x Bonfire of the Damned
"Dare to fight, defy difficulties and advance wave upon wave... Monsters of all kinds shall be destroyed." - Mao Zedong
@Watercat
i actually like mutilate alot even if i can afford to squeeze in liliana but thats only if im playing a little more casually. I think board wipe really benefits this deck, Falkenrath Aristocrat Gravecrawler Lotleth Troll and Geralf's Messenger are hard to kill. But also mutilate will almost always kill my aristocrat.

@CD
I dont think i can afford Bonfire, i barely can afford the falkenraths, also i dont think i could effectively cast this except if drawn 5/6th turn. Blasphemous Act can be come really cheap especially against populate,tokens, and other aggros that over-commit to the board.
Make sure to get some skullcracks when gatecrash comes put
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
o theyll easily replace searing spear in every deck. im hoping the zombies in black can replace geralf's messanger, with RDWs running Ash Zealot as well as alot of haste i would like more T3 blockers. The fact theyre bringing back thrulls kinda ruins that
Well I would side it since spear targets creatures.
Zombies is an aggro deck and you usually don't want to be blocking. Unless against RDW you want win late game and you just want to outrace them. The best response to ash zealot is just pillar or burn it. You probably don't want to leave too many guys to block, exception knight of infamy.
Also I doubt there's gonna be any zombies in gtc, maybe a few B/U. Might be some black or red spells.
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
good call didnt realize skullcrack doesnt burn craetures, also im just worried rdw is gonna adopt hellraiser goblin over Lightning Mauler and then we have a problem. I was hoping to playtest jund but my cards are in my dorm so i cant really comment on the tempo but it looks solid and green gives it a little more stanima becasue i kept getting beat out by g/w with T2 Call of the Conclave and T3 Rootborn Defenses which really bugs me
Hmm hellraiser is a 3 drop and lightning is 2. If there's another good 2 drop to replace lightning it might be run, however pyreheart is usually the 3 drop.
I find G/W the hardest matchup also. I don't play against populate that much but sometimes thy get t2 loxodon, t3 silverblade and rancor having a 6/4 double strike. Knight of infamy can block and take no damage but otherwise your screwed. Also sublime is annoying as hell. Some people go healing G/W with trostani and armada, but those are slower and it's atleast possible to win.
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
yeah even simple g/w like i said can break my tempo and leaving 2/3 mana open to deal with silverblade or loxodon breaks tempo too, but again hopefully including Golgari Charm to break Rancor, Rest in Peace, Collective Blessing or even Detention Sphere, as well as regen if they go for broke in combat, will help. looking at this i think i am rethinking Ultimate Price as a MB over dreadbore.

Also earlier this week i saw someone was using a pair of Hellhole Flailer and only 3 pillars/spears. i like constantly having an outlet capable of 4 to the dome. he could be a replacement for geralf's messenger if you dont unleash him. either way if he survives the attack you have 4/5 burn for 4 mana if he was exalted
Geralf does 4 damage also If he dies. Geralf is the only card that trades with both forms of thrag.
I'm running 0 pillars and recently took out 2 spears for 2 abrupt decay mainboard. Abrupt can kill thrag token, flipped garruk, silverblade, loxodon, d sphere etc. I kind of do want more burn but I'm afraid I'm going to screw myself over
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
they also ran geralf's but took out a spear/pillar for the flailers, im still looking at r/b zombies since it is the shell for this and the jund shell right now doesnt have much to benefit this deck. i love abrupt decay but sometimes when i get stalled by a gummed up field i need burn spells to finish. again i dont have the cars neccesary to test this but i will early next week, at this point im stuck between burn or control but ill also have to see what is being played around me too 

the current jund just trys to pack as much power in with the great consistency maybe dropping Dreg Mangler and Pillar of Flame for Farseek and Thragtusk or Olivia Voldaren or Huntmaster of the Fells could be possible
I find G/W the hardest matchup also. I don't play against populate that much but sometimes thy get t2 loxodon, t3 silverblade and rancor having a 6/4 double strike. Knight of infamy can block and take no damage but otherwise your screwed. Also sublime is annoying as hell. Some people go healing G/W with trostani and armada, but those are slower and it's atleast possible to win.

The only game I lost with my G/W aggro deck at Friday's FNM was against a B/R aggro deck with lots of removal. When my last Strangleroot Geist succumbed to Pillar of Flame it was game over. I need to introduce more anti removal tech (4x Faith's Shield is not enough).

It seems blind obedience can find its way into g/w side boards even mains. i think golgari charm will become increasing relevent in any deck that can fit it.

Extort also seems it will destroy burn which will knock out b/r zombies as a competitive deck. Im thinking jund has enough creature/enchantment removal to change this. also anybody else worried about gideon? i think a couple Tragic Slip would ease my mind though, if only rapid hybridization worked like Beast Within
I don't think extort will have that huge of an impact, seems more of a limited thing.
Just FYI i decided to scrap jund zombies and go back to B/R.
consider the new Glaring Spotlight card. Can help kill geist and for 3 mana can be used to make everything unblockable. seems good sideboard, along with skullcrack 
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
consider the new Glaring Spotlight card. Can help kill geist and for 3 mana can be used to make everything unblockable. seems good sideboard, along with skullcrack 

Geist will be carrying Stony Silence in his back pocket.

@Hreth- Yeah wow i forgot about stony silence...bummer white has way to much control for such little mana. I'm seeing Bant Auras is now the deck to beat, apparently B/R Zombies is a good match up for it.


@Watercat- i saw you decided to scrap your jund, i still wanna work on it even if there is little the GC will provide for it, hopefully g/w and the typical jund begins to fall out of favor. Either way i think this could be a fun deck, even if it will be lack luster at fmn, im building it this weekend for some casual multiplayer. I think if it does well there it could be fnm worthy. 

Decks to beat
U/G infect (the 3rd Turn Win)
Eldrazi/Quicksilver
White Knights Weenies
B/U Zombies
G/W Lifegain
Goblin/Artifact sac (3rd Turn Win)
Jund Dragons (Alara)

Ill tryn post results to get a feel for its strength and weaknesses


@Hreth- Yeah wow i forgot about stony silence...bummer white has way to much control for such little mana. I'm seeing Bant Auras is now the deck to beat, apparently B/R Zombies is a good match up for it.


@Watercat- i saw you decided to scrap your jund, i still wanna work on it even if there is little the GC will provide for it, hopefully g/w and the typical jund begins to fall out of favor. Either way i think this could be a fun deck, even if it will be lack luster at fmn, im building it this weekend for some casual multiplayer. I think if it does well there it could be fnm worthy. 

Decks to beat
U/G infect (the 3rd Turn Win)
Eldrazi/Quicksilver
White Knights Weenies
B/U Zombies
G/W Lifegain
Goblin/Artifact sac (3rd Turn Win)
Jund Dragons (Alara)

Ill tryn post results to get a feel for its strength and weaknesses



Well most of those decks aren't standard so idk how good of a test that is
Anways its not that its not a good deck, just nowhere near consistent enough. i think you'll get outraced by b/r zombies or rdw and lose midgame to jund. you could win against control as long as you don't get completely screwed (which happens rather often) 
IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/rCB4r.jpg)
What problem are you having with consistency? It runs 12 duals and caverns for fixing since theres only vamps/zombies. I like how it has answers for most anything. Burn can shut down early Silverblade Paladin and Thragtusk. Golgari Charm can clear a B/R and RDW field, clear enchants or prevent a boardwipe. And some creature control is nice. Youve tested it but i still want to see what it can do for myself. Also if i can hold my own against some really quick and some really broken decks i dont think alot of standard decks will be that bad. Thats just my logic though.
With preview coming to a close it doesnt look like R/B is getting any tools, i think regardless of how this playtests i think im gonna go back to a G/R aggro i have the majority of the pieces in my golgari pod deck and here. It seems more powerful especially since R/B is runing out of problems that the opponent can't solve. I really appreciate the help guys, mostly Watercat.
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