Is the standard array (16,14,13,12,11,10) that bad?

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Hello, me and some some friends started playing dnd last year.   Our DM choosed the standard array to determine our abilities, stating that adventurers should not have a negative score since they experiment a lot of thing, and so, kinda touch all domains.  However, the more i read in this forum, the more i think that these scores are overall bad, especially for hybrid characters who need a co-primary.  The same goes for some characters who multiclass.  By example, a fighter with dex as secondairy wielding hide who a 14 instead of a 16 get less ac, less reflex, less initiation and less effects or dmg on some of his powers.  It also affects his acrobatics, stealth and thievery skills if he's trained in these.

Yet, our DM think that having a -1 in an ability score  doesn't hurt much.  He's he right?  Am I simply overestimating the weight of a weaker stat?

Sorry if i did some mistakes.  I do not main english. 
Not terrible base, but it is sub-optimal.  You could make a nearly-as-powerful character with those stats but it won't be anything that would work well in these forums.
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The best way I can think of to answer that involves two ESPN sports anchors and one of their team catchphrases.

"Is that bad?"
"It's not good."

It's not terrible, but it's not great, either.  It's just kind of ... there.
Point your DM to the 22 point buy option, it can produce the same array your DM listed, and many others.  This gives players many more options for creating characters.

Bargle wrote:
This is CharOp. We not only assume block-of-tofu monsters, but also block-of-tofu DMs.
 

Zelink wrote:
You're already refluffing, why not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
Our DM choosed the standard array to determine our abilities, stating that adventurers should not have a negative score since they experiment a lot of thing

Yet, our DM think that having a -1 in an ability score  doesn't hurt much.

If the DM thinks -1 is not important, why won't he let you start with an 8?

D&D is a team game. It's okay to have a weakness in certain areas as long as someone else in your party can cover it. A barbarian doesn't need to be smart when he's got a wizard right beside him.

But yes, that array is ok. Just not the best.
In a home game i usually utilize the 16/14/14/13/10/8 stat line. Good primary and decent secondary and you get to round out your NADs. This is good when you get stat bumps to your primary and secondary but a lot harder for Humans unless going for a DEX or Int primary class.
All standard array will do, is remove a bunch of builds off the table. If your DM is so concerned about the well roundedness of an adventurer, he can just let everyone bump their 8 into 10 for free, problem solved. Not having a pair of 16's takes a lot of builds out of the equation, particularly those that rely on their secondary stat for AC.  Also some people like playing a low stat. I think your DM is doing a disservice to the player's bredth of 4e options by dictating the standard array.
All standard array will do, is remove a bunch of builds off the table. If your DM is so concerned about the well roundedness of an adventurer, he can just let everyone bump their 8 into 10 for free, problem solved. Not having a pair of 16's takes a lot of builds out of the equation, particularly those that rely on their secondary stat for AC.  Also some people like playing a low stat. I think your DM is doing a disservice to the player's bredth of 4e options by dictating the standard array.



This


All classes that wear light armor and do not use Dex or Int as a primary stat are getting screwed out of some AC. (Rangers, barbarians, Avengers, to name a few).

Classes that are highly specialised, only use a single stat, and perhaps would prefer to start with an 18 will also lose some of their appeal.

Also, classes that depend on imposing an effect based on their seconday stat will have trouble.

In all, please use the 22 point buy, it allows for various combinations of arrays.


Please point out to the DM that once one starts messing with the basic math of it all, you should adjust everything, and that includes skill challenges and monsters.           
Having a 10 instead of an 8 just means you suck slightly less. You still suck. That +0 isn't gonna make a ton of difference (It won't matter for NADs, since only one score can be 8 anyways, it won't matter for attacks). At most for skills, but even then it's only a 1 difference in skills you weren't gonna bother with anyways. Dump scores are dump scores for a reason. There's not a single mathematical justification for giving up a +1 in your secondary/second primary stat in favor of a +1 in your most useless stat.

Aside of all the mechanical reasons, it doesn't even make sense in a fluff kind of way. Not all adventurers experiment with everything. An 8 simply indicates a character is below average in something. Not horrible, not crapsack, just below average. Why would every single adventurer be above average in every single stat? Furthermore, characters become more interesting with flaws, even if it's small statistical ones like this. They touch all domains? Why would a Rageblood Barbarian bother touching upon domains as silly as Wisdom (Philosophy, insight, etc.)? There's a ton more arguments you could use to justify having an 8 in a score.

tl;dr: By forcing your characters to touch on all domains, he's making you suck.
 Why would a Rageblood Barbarian bother touching upon domains as silly as Wisdom (Philosophy, insight, etc.)? 




To MC into Fighter or Avenger and be a boss.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out here
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
Barbarians aren't Berserkers. Barbarians are tribesmen in harsh climates and are highly in touch with their ancestry and Religion, as well as being in tune with Nature, and within that, Human Nature. Insight and Perception are key survival skills, and you do. not. want to lie to a Barbarian.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Why limit a character variable that is already limited?  If the idea of balance is so important that every +1/-1 must be accounted for by your DM, does he/she also intend to make sure you all play the same race?

If he's not willing to let you all build your own stats from the 22 point method, ask if s/he will at least allow you to choose an array from the 'example' chart provided that lists about 15 different arrays from which to choose. 

This is still a compromise as this allows more options than just 1, but not as much freedom as the 22 point method.
What mengu said is pretty accurate.  But it depends on the class and build. 

One of the main ones it hurts is if its a class that needs dex/int for AC something like a shaman, barbarian, or avenger usually wants its secondary stat high for those reasons.  Many classes need it for riders as well.

But I don't think anyone has mentioned that it also takes the possibility of a starting 18 preracials off the table.  Several classes are usually best off with a starting 18 preracial boosts in their attack stat nomatter the race of the PC: cleric, rogue, wizard, and monk for instance should all normally go for a starting 18.

And that is true for off stat/race combinations as well.  So if you want an elf barbarian for instance you will be stuck with a 16 strength, even though a barbarian should normally be shooting for a 18 strength post racials.
 Why would a Rageblood Barbarian bother touching upon domains as silly as Wisdom (Philosophy, insight, etc.)? 




To MC into Fighter or Avenger and be a boss.

Okay good point. I didn't think my example through particularly well. I was actually avoiding trying to point out Intelligence as a Barb dump stat because Barbarians are warrior tribesmen with a certain aptitude in tactics and understanding (Int isn't just book smarts!). Hence I went for Wisdom.

Man that backfired quickly.
and Int in 4e IS booksmarts !

Wisdom seems the describe skills picked up outside of a library. 
Also, a point to make is that stats to a certain extent represent the ability to use a particular stat effectively in an encounter rather than the actual real ability.

You can be of average strength, but simply not apply it very effectively when called upon. Or average(or even genius-level IQ) and not remember little details in the midst of heated combat.