Help in building a Skirmisher Human Sorcerer

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Hello there guys. We're playing a Human-Only campaign (since it's an anime-like campaign; highschoolers with powers against otherworldy threats), and I was wondering: How can I make a Skirmisher Styled Human Sorcerer? I'm building while reading the Hanbook (and I mean the forums one, this http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/28976317), and I don't see any real guidelines on how to do it.

My character will start off at Level 8.

It's actually like this

--LVL 8 HUMAN SORCERER, UNALIGNED--

16 STR, 1 2 CON, 14 DEX, 11 INT, 8 WIS, 20 CHA (Used  22/22 buypoints, used the 4 +1 Bonuses attained at 4 and 8)

AC 22, FORT 18, REF 17, WILL 22

HP 59

CLASS FEATURES: COSMIC POWER
FEATS: Dual Implement Spellcaster, Unarmored Agility, Staff Expertize (3 more feats to go, wondering which I should take, interested in the Spellblade ones)

AT-WILL:
Blazing Starfall
Ensorcelled Blade
Burning Spray

EQUIPMENTS:
Staff of Provocation +2
Magic Dagger +2
Cloth Armor of Sudden Recovery +3

DAMAGE WORKSPACE
+10 to Spell Attacks with Staff (4 1/2 lvl + 5 Ability + 1 Feat + 2 Enh)
+12 to Spell Damage with Dual Implement (5 Ability +3 Class +2 Enhancement +2 Feat)

Any tips? I'm still building; everything is valid, except for stuff found on Elemental Chaos Essentials, and non-human races.
I'm not sure what you mean by skirmisher. In 4e, that just applies to a monster that is more mobile than other types.
I'm not sure what you mean by skirmisher. In 4e, that just applies to a monster that is more mobile than other types.



It's a term used quite a lot on the builds guide, I don't know either why
- I would change my stats to 18/11/13/8/10/20 (if you want DIS in heroic that is) and gain +1 Fort, Damage, and AC.

- Get Superior Implement Proficiency (Accurate Staff likely). 

- Auspicious Birth / Born Under a Bad Sign background for HPs

- Something in your neck slot to help NADs

- List your power selection  
- I would change my stats to 18/11/13/8/10/20 (if you want DIS in heroic that is) and gain +1 Fort, Damage, and AC.

- Get Superior Implement Proficiency (Accurate Staff likely). 

- Auspicious Birth / Born Under a Bad Sign background for HPs

- Something in your neck slot to help NADs

- List your power selection  



Hmmmmmm.... well, I'll check out about the stats.

I haven't made my pick on Encounters/Dailies yet, I listed my at-wills tough. 
Also, ditch the Staff of Provocation and get a Staff of Ruin (same item level).
Also, ditch the Staff of Provocation and get a Staff of Ruin (same item level).



By the way, in which handbook dcan I find he Superior Implement Training Feats?
Skirmisher usually means a mobile, melee fighter.  Rogues are pretty stereotypical here, or scouts.  Rangers can tend to stay in one place, as can Avengers and slayers, but Rogues frequently need to move for the flank.  Barbarians requently move via a charge.

Sorcerers are not typically skirmishers.  Their attacks are ranged or close (Flame Spiral).  They may be in melee range for a couple of rounds, but they don't live there.  After the first few rounds, they'll typically want to get out of melee range, and won't be constantly moving.  So it's a rare sorcerer that's a skirmisher.

Are you looking for an effective Skirmisher?  Or an effective Sorcerer?  Or are you really looking for an effective skirmishing sorcerer (that's gonna be trickier). 

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

Skirmisher usually means a mobile, melee fighter.  Rogues are pretty stereotypical here, or scouts.  Rangers can tend to stay in one place, as can Avengers and slayers, but Rogues frequently need to move for the flank.  Barbarians requently move via a charge.

Sorcerers are not typically skirmishers.  Their attacks are ranged or close (Flame Spiral).  They may be in melee range for a couple of rounds, but they don't live there.  After the first few rounds, they'll typically want to get out of melee range, and won't be constantly moving.  So it's a rare sorcerer that's a skirmisher.

Are you looking for an effective Skirmisher?  Or an effective Sorcerer?  Or are you really looking for an effective skirmishing sorcerer (that's gonna be trickier). 



Well, if that's tricky then let's just say I want to make a high-damage dealing, USEFUL Human Sorcerer
Skirmisher usually means a mobile, melee fighter.  Rogues are pretty stereotypical here, or scouts.  Rangers can tend to stay in one place, as can Avengers and slayers, but Rogues frequently need to move for the flank.  Barbarians requently move via a charge.

Sorcerers are not typically skirmishers.  Their attacks are ranged or close (Flame Spiral).  They may be in melee range for a couple of rounds, but they don't live there.  After the first few rounds, they'll typically want to get out of melee range, and won't be constantly moving.  So it's a rare sorcerer that's a skirmisher.

Are you looking for an effective Skirmisher?  Or an effective Sorcerer?  Or are you really looking for an effective skirmishing sorcerer (that's gonna be trickier). 


Spark Form, Flame Spiral, Thunder Leap, Slaad's Gambit, and the all-important Ensorcelled Blade on a Yakuza? The only time a Sorcerer isn't in melee, it's becaues the targets are dead.

@Aldath: Human is a fairly bad choice for sorcerer, you gain little from an extra at-will or feat (and it's not going to be a racial feat), and you're highly dependant on your secondary stat for Damage, AC/NAD, and Riders. There's only 2 races that don't match Cha+Dex/Str that are worth taking, Human ain't one.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
@Aldath: Human is a fairly bad choice for sorcerer, you gain little from an extra at-will or feat (and it's not going to be a racial feat), and you're highly dependant on your secondary stat for Damage, AC/NAD, and Riders. There's only 2 races that don't match Cha+Dex/Str that are worth taking, Human ain't one.


I can think of two good reasons to be a human sorcerer.  Heroic Effort, and Adroit Explorer.  Also, the feat can be handy, and the +1 to all NADs compensates somewhat for losing the secondary stat bump.
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...

Storm-based Dagger sorcerers are pretty cool.

And I like Barbarian|Sorcerer hybrid but some may not consider it optimal.


@Aldath: Human is a fairly bad choice for sorcerer, you gain little from an extra at-will or feat (and it's not going to be a racial feat), and you're highly dependant on your secondary stat for Damage, AC/NAD, and Riders. There's only 2 races that don't match Cha+Dex/Str that are worth taking, Human ain't one.


I can think of two good reasons to be a human sorcerer.  Heroic Effort, and Adroit Explorer.  Also, the feat can be handy, and the +1 to all NADs compensates somewhat for losing the secondary stat bump.


Extra Feat is barely worth +1 Damage/Riders past the basic heroic feat train, it's really sad but Skill Power is a top feat slot for Sorcs even if you aren't Insight trained, the feat selection is that bad. +1 NADs is almost exactly worth +1 AC/NAD, as has been mentioned elsewhere Sorc Will is hilariously high and your bad NAD is basically irreparable Human or not. Adroit Explorer is equal to Lightning Fury or Demonskin Adept.
So it's Heroic Effort vs the Racial Powers and Feat support of other Races.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Have you considered Fighter|Sorcerer? At 8th level, you get the signature move of Flame Spiral+Come And Get It. Hybrid Talent for Fighter Armor(Hide+Heavy Shield+Str 16 or Scale+Heavy Shield) fixes AC. And Adroit Explorer for Flame Spiral again+Kirre's Roar gives you a followup for round 2.

I wouldn't call the following build optimized(at least not for effectiveness), but it might get you to what you want in terms of a Fighter|Sorcerer with anime style.

Oddball Fighter|Sorcerer who claims to be a Monk 
I can think of two good reasons to be a human sorcerer.  Heroic Effort, and Adroit Explorer.  Also, the feat can be handy, and the +1 to all NADs compensates somewhat for losing the secondary stat bump.


Extra Feat is barely worth +1 Damage/Riders past the basic heroic feat train, it's really sad but Skill Power is a top feat slot for Sorcs even if you aren't Insight trained, the feat selection is that bad. +1 NADs is almost exactly worth +1 AC/NAD, as has been mentioned elsewhere Sorc Will is hilariously high and your bad NAD is basically irreparable Human or not. Adroit Explorer is equal to Lightning Fury or Demonskin Adept.
So it's Heroic Effort vs the Racial Powers and Feat support of other Races.


Sorcerer builds are tight for featspace well into paragon.  In fact, you could build a pretty well optimized Sorcerer into epic without taking a single racial feat.  So then it comes down to Heroic Effort vs. other racial powers.  In that comparison, Heroic Effort stacks up very well.
I can think of two good reasons to be a human sorcerer.  Heroic Effort, and Adroit Explorer.  Also, the feat can be handy, and the +1 to all NADs compensates somewhat for losing the secondary stat bump.


Extra Feat is barely worth +1 Damage/Riders past the basic heroic feat train, it's really sad but Skill Power is a top feat slot for Sorcs even if you aren't Insight trained, the feat selection is that bad. +1 NADs is almost exactly worth +1 AC/NAD, as has been mentioned elsewhere Sorc Will is hilariously high and your bad NAD is basically irreparable Human or not. Adroit Explorer is equal to Lightning Fury or Demonskin Adept.
So it's Heroic Effort vs the Racial Powers and Feat support of other Races.


Sorcerer builds are tight for featspace well into paragon.  In fact, you could build a pretty well optimized Sorcerer into epic without taking a single racial feat.  So then it comes down to Heroic Effort vs. other racial powers.  In that comparison, Heroic Effort stacks up very well.



If you aren't doing something specific, like a rebreather, there aren't too many sorc feats that are worth taking.  See if you can do a revenant human, that should be interesting, and you could make a passable storm sorc out of it.  My top 3 choices for sorc magic are dragon, dragon, or dragon, but YMMV.

If you aren't doing something specific, like a rebreather, there aren't too many sorc feats that are worth taking.  See if you can do a revenant human, that should be interesting, and you could make a passable storm sorc out of it.  My top 3 choices for sorc magic are dragon, dragon, or dragon, but YMMV.


I'm not even talking about sorc-specific feats.

Once you've got your basic striker functionality (Expertise, Superior Implement, DIS, Icy Heart, Lasting Frost, Wintertouched), it's totally worthwhile to spend a few feats shoring up your defenses (Unarmored Agility/Leather Amor, Improved Defenses, Superior Will).  That's all your heroic and low paragon feats right there.  Not to mention White Lotus feats and/or multiclassing to have some other tricks going.

A Human Sorcerer isn't necessarily a more damaging striker than other races (although Heroic Effort makes it more effective where it counts), but it can be a sturdier and more versatile build.  Solid blue.
Every optimized sorcerer is a skirmisher. Flat out. 

Skirmisher

     Specializes in mobility and clever positioning during battle
     Prefers to attack on the move or with combat advantage
     Benefits from brutes or soldiers that draw the adventurers’ attention

Yeah, that sounds like every good sorc to me. 


 
10/10 Would Flame Again: An Elite Paladin|Warlock The Elemental Man (or Woman): A Genasi Handbook The Warlord, Or How to Wield a Barbarian One-Handed The Bookish Barbarian Fardiz: RAI is fairly clear, but RAZ is different That's right. Rules According to Zelink!
If you aren't doing something specific, like a rebreather, there aren't too many sorc feats that are worth taking.  See if you can do a revenant human, that should be interesting, and you could make a passable storm sorc out of it.  My top 3 choices for sorc magic are dragon, dragon, or dragon, but YMMV.


I'm not even talking about sorc-specific feats.

Once you've got your basic striker functionality (Expertise, Superior Implement, DIS, Icy Heart, Lasting Frost, Wintertouched), it's totally worthwhile to spend a few feats shoring up your defenses (Unarmored Agility/Leather Amor, Improved Defenses, Superior Will).  That's all your heroic and low paragon feats right there.  Not to mention White Lotus feats and/or multiclassing to have some other tricks going.

A Human Sorcerer isn't necessarily a more damaging striker than other races (although Heroic Effort makes it more effective where it counts), but it can be a sturdier and more versatile build.  Solid blue.



I wouldn't bother with blowing a feat for +1AC.  Just accept that your AC is garbage, and use your powers to stay up.  Dead monsters don't do any damage. 

I do like white lotus in conjuction with sorcerous blade channeling though.
Lets be honest though, that's every real striker. Oh wait, that IS every real striker.

@Jugg: UA is +2, and without really trying (Armor of level, Chain Shirt) you should regularly be a L+15, so I wouldn't call UA wasted, I just don't consider it necessary for the same reasons you listed.

I will admit that my Sorc is feat starved, but I play a gimmick that's costing me 4 feats
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Lets be honest though, that's every real striker. Oh wait, that IS every real striker.

@Jugg: UA is +2, and without really trying (Armor of level, Chain Shirt) you should regularly be a L+15, so I wouldn't call UA wasted, I just don't consider it necessary for the same reasons you listed.

I will admit that my Sorc is feat starved, but I play a gimmick that's costing me 4 feats



Right, and if you weren't you'd use those 4 feats for all the awesome class feats the sorc has!  Er... wait.

Well, Wild does have some feats that bring it almost in line with the rebreather, provided an enabling leader.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
I have a lot of fun with this now 12th level Sorcerer/Ranger combo
damage is mainly from his Chaos bolt but thats just for saving the big things for "when really needed)

at Will : Chaos Bolt is currently 1d10 + 18 which is a nice base damage. 
Encounter : Tempest Surge 3d8 + 16 (burst d4)
Daily : Dazzling Ray 6d6 + 18 

Fun part begins if I Crit then I add +3d8 (staff) +1d6 (Bracers)
on top of that comes the Hunter's Quarry for an extra +2d8 if used and another +1d6 fire damage if REALLY lucky.

maximum damage is currently crit'ing with Dazzling ray, activated bracer and hunter's Quarry. Which is 54 + 40(5d8) + 12fire(2d6) = 102. 

but thats not all: This dude have great saves Ac 27, fort 24 ref 28 will 28 making him hard to hit. Oh there is more he can morph into a rat giving +4 stealth to his already insane +24 - so he can double at a thief too.

Anyway below is the shade sorcerer:





























































































































































































SHADESORC level 12
Shade, Sorcerer, Wild Mage
Build: Chaos Sorcerer
Spell Source Option: Wild Magic
Occupation - Criminal (+2 Stealth)
Theme: Dead Rat Deserter
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 9, CON 14, DEX 20, INT 11, WIS 10, CHA 17
AC: 27 Fort: 24 Ref: 28 Will: 28
HP: 81, Surges: 7 Surge Value: 20
TRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +18, Arcana +13, Bluff +20, Endurance +16, Insight +11, Stealth +24
UNTRAINED SKILLS
Athelics +7, Diplomacy +13, Dungeoneering +6, Heal +6, History +6, Intimadate +12, Nature +6, Perception +6, Religion +6, Streetwise +12, Thievery +12
POWERS
Basic Attack : Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack : Ranged Basic Attack
Dead Rat Deserter Utility: Body of the Rat
Dead Rat Deserter Utility: Hybrid bite
Shade Utility: One with Shadow
Hunter's Quarry Power: Hunter's Quarry
Sorcerer Attack 1: Chaos Bolt
Sorcerer Attack 1: Storm Walk
Sorcerer Attack 1: Frostbind
Sorcerer Attack 1: Chaos Dazzling ray
Sorcerer Utility 2: Stretch Spell
Bluff Utility 2: False bravado
Sorcerer Attack 3: Ice Dragon's Teeth
Sorcerer Attack 5: Serpentine Blast
Sorcerer Attack 7: Crushing Sphere
Sorcerer Attack 9: Staggering Blast
Sorcerer Utility 10: Narrow Escape
Wild Mage Attack 11: Tempest Surge
Wild Mage Utility 12: Torrent of Power
FEATS
Hafted Defense
Level 2: Great Fortitute
Level 4: Lightning Reflex
Level 6: Warrior of the Wild
Level 8: Unarmored Agility
Level 10: Implement Expertise (Staff)
Level 11: Wild Spellfury
Level 12: Lethal Hunter
ITEMS:
Summoned Githweave Armor +3
Amulet of Aranea +2 
Defensive Staff +3
Gem of Colloquy
Resplendent Gloves
Bag of Holding
Sandals of Precise Stepping
Belt of Nourishment
Elixir of Invisibility
Potion of Vigor

 
I have a lot of fun with this now 12th level Sorcerer/Ranger combo
damage is mainly from his Chaos bolt but thats just for saving the big things for "when really needed)


I'm glad you have fun with it, but practically speaking from the position of an expert on sorcerer optimization, nearly all of your choices are bad, especially that you only have a 17 Cha at your level, you shouldn't even have a 17 at 1st level. The only thing I see that's good is you took Expertise, UA (which is barely still useful), and Wild Spellfury.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.

IMAGE(http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/2958/33524904.jpg)


On a more serious note, you are gimping yourself by giving yourself -3 to hit for not having an attack-standard charisma.

Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein

I'm glad you have fun with it, but practically speaking from the position of an expert on sorcerer optimization, nearly all of your choices are bad, especially that you only have a 17 Cha at your level, you shouldn't even have a 17 at 1st level. The only thing I see that's good is you took Expertise, UA (which is barely still useful), and Wild Spellfury.



Actually its a typo which you experts probably already noticed since i have +18 to hit .... the character have 22 in charisma. And while not optimized it keeps pretty much to the three standard books (phb1+2+3) only the rat flavour and shade thing comes else where. 

Optimized probably not effective have been so far. Defensive with fire power no doubt. 
But sorry about the typo. 




6[cha]+3[enh]+7[2+dex]+3[feat]+3[shard] = +22 static at the very least.

You also want staff expertise (not impliment expertise: staff) and then a superior impliment (probably superior impliment proficiency: accurate staff).
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
6[cha]+3[enh]+7[2+dex]+3[feat]+3[shard] = +22 static at the very least.

You also want staff expertise (not impliment expertise: staff) and then a superior impliment (probably superior impliment proficiency: accurate staff).



Here's my quick attempt at it
Show

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Balasar, level 11
Dragonborn, Sorcerer/Ranger, Demonskin Adept
Sorcerous Power Option: Sorcerous Power Strength
Hybrid Ranger Option: Hybrid Ranger Fortitude
Hybrid Talent Option: Soul of the Sorcerer
Soul of the Sorcerer Option: Dragon Soul
Dragon Soul Option: Dragon Soul Cold
Versatile Expertise Option: Versatile Expertise (Light blade)
Versatile Expertise Option: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade)
Dragonborn Racial Power Option: Dragon Breath
Dragon Breath Key Ability: Dragon Breath Strength
Dragon Breath Damage Type: Dragon Breath Cold
Born Under a Bad Sign (Born Under a Bad Sign Benefit)
Theme: Ooze Master
 
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 21, CON 11, DEX 13, INT 9, WIS 13, CHA 21
 
STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 16, CON 10, DEX 12, INT 8, WIS 12, CHA 16
 
 
AC: 24 Fort: 24 Ref: 19 Will: 24
HP: 83 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 20
 
TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +9, Athletics +15, Diplomacy +15, Endurance +10
 
UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +6, Bluff +10, Dungeoneering +6, Heal +6, History +6, Insight +6, Intimidate +12, Nature +6, Perception +6, Religion +4, Stealth +6, Streetwise +10, Thievery +6
 
POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Ooze Master Attack: Sudden Slime
Dragonborn Racial Power: Dragon Breath
Hunter's Quarry  Power: Hunter's Quarry
Ranger Attack 1: Twin Strike
Sorcerer Attack 1: Dragonfrost
Ranger Attack 1: Off-Hand Strike
Ranger Attack 1: Jaws of the Wolf
Ranger Utility 2: Invigorating Stride
Sorcerer Attack 3: Flame Spiral
Sorcerer Attack 5: Thunder Leap
Sorcerer Utility 6: Sudden Scales
Sorcerer Attack 7: Spark Form
Sorcerer Attack 9: Adamantine Echo
Endurance Utility 10: Enter the Crucible
Demonskin Adept Attack 11: Demon-Soul Bolts
 
FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Wintertouched
Level 4: Superior Implement Training (Accurate dagger)
Level 6: Versatile Expertise
Level 8: Armor Proficiency: Leather
Level 11: Lasting Frost
Level 11: Icy Heart
 
ITEMS
Frost Accurate dagger +2 x1
Amulet of Protection +3 x1
Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier)
Eagle Eye Goggles (heroic tier) x1
Power Jewel
Magic Leather Armor +2 x1
Frost Short sword +2 x1
====== End ======


I don't think sorc by itself is a "skirmisher", thats why I added ranger.  And also because... twin strike.
So basically you added ... invigorating stride and lost a feat and one of the best MBAs in the game.
So basically you added ... invigorating stride and lost a feat and one of the best MBAs in the game.




  1. It's STR based, you have an MBA, no need to double up on them.

  2. You have Twin Strike, one of the best at wills in the game.

  3. You have a passable AC for a character who prefers melee and blast powers.

  4. You have a move action heal, for a character who prefers melee and blast powers.



I'd use it over a plain sorc that wasn't either a rebreather or a firegoat, but also the amusement factor entertains me.  You're playing a ranger|sorc, wth is wrong with you...wait, why is everything dead?

You've been reading too much of Bajat's thread, or possibly MwaOs'. "But I have Twin Strike and other Ranger Stuff, and Ranger's are good, they're the best!" Yeah, that only applies when you're dealing with a class that doesn't start out with multi-attack capability.

For simplicity, I'll make this level 12 and give you the Shard and upgrade the dagger to +3 so the numbers aren't utterly pathetic.
T1: Quarry, Off-Hand Strike .6*25.5+.05*43.5 = 17.125
Flame Spiral is .75*31.5+.05*46.5 + 2*(.65*26.6+.05*41.5)+24.5+.1.178*19.5 = 96.5111
Combined: 113.6361, .94697 KPR
T2: Spark Form, 108.733 and Sudden Slime 11.9277, combined 120.6608, 1.0055 KPR
T2:Demon Soul Bolts 75.3, .6275 KPR
After that Twin Strike: 38.32, .3193 KPR
KP2R: 1.9525. KP5R: 3.2186. KP10R: 4.8153. Mean KPR: .7

That puts this build equal to ... the DPR King 2 years ago that didn't use a single encounter power.

Both a pure Sorc or a pure Ranger will post better KPR than your mix.
And what is the survivability of this other build?  This has more than either class by itself.  Dead = o DPR.
Dead enemies = 0 DTPR.

Not to mention Level+13 AC isn't more survivable than an average melee ranger, much less one that takes the obvious BCL route or the hilarious High AC+Riposte strategy of your average Str Sorcerer. Please don't be MwaO and refuse to acknowledge that what you set out to gain with a Hybrid could be gained by either base class at exactly the same or lower cost to the primary role of striker. Slapping |Ranger on things doesn't automagically make them better, |Warlord or |Cleric on the other hand ...
Dead enemies = 0 DTPR.

Not to mention Level+13 AC isn't more survivable than an average melee ranger, much less one that takes the obvious BCL route or the hilarious High AC+Riposte strategy of your average Str Sorcerer. Please don't be MwaO and refuse to acknowledge that what you set out to gain with a Hybrid could be gained by either base class at exactly the same or lower cost to the primary role of striker. Slapping |Ranger on things doesn't automagically make them better, |Warlord or |Cleric on the other hand ...



The survival is gained from the sorc side in the form of powers.  1/enc turn a hit into a miss.  1/day you've got defender AC for a fight.  You've still got IS in your back pocket as a heal.  Both classes have excellent powers to pick from.  It's also a lot more fun than a melee ranger.  I've done the ranger|fighter/avenger than can kill bahamut in 2 rounds.  Single target damage is all well and good, but as good as a ranger is, if you're more than moderately optimizing for damage, about 1/4 of your damage in a round vs a single target is overkill, which is useless.  By adding sorc, you at least have the option to AoE.  Did I mention it's not as boring?

I'd swap out the E1 for plant to the hilt for the AP flame spiral carnage as well. Build's not perfect, but it will function, and more than meet baseline DPR requirements.
Two rounds? Slacker.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
Two rounds? Slacker.



I tried to get it to 1, but it won't work without some way to recharge the minor action encounters a few times.  Wonder how close a firewind genasi could come...1300+ HP with soldier defenses is quite a bit, if you're still going to have a playable character that is.

My nova build came in at around 5k damage in a turn 1/day.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
My nova build came in at around 5k damage in a turn 1/day.



Ah but I wanted it to be an encounter thing, Think maybe 1 daily was included in the first round.  Balls out it would have a ton of overkill on round 2.  It's can also do it's job as a defender, which I liked.
It's encounter would be Hurricane of Blades, AP Hurricane of Blades, that will melt elites quite happily and put a serious dent in solos.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
Well, Wild does have some feats that bring it almost in line with the rebreather, provided an enabling leader.



Could you give an example of how that would play out?
Dead enemies = 0 DTPR.

Not to mention Level+13 AC isn't more survivable than an average melee ranger, much less one that takes the obvious BCL route or the hilarious High AC+Riposte strategy of your average Str Sorcerer. Please don't be MwaO and refuse to acknowledge that what you set out to gain with a Hybrid could be gained by either base class at exactly the same or lower cost to the primary role of striker. Slapping |Ranger on things doesn't automagically make them better, |Warlord or |Cleric on the other hand ...

17 posts in and already talking trash.

Kids these days
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