Can we say of an Intelligent person that he is very influent ?

if so, then here is what I would list as for the six attributes:



STR Body       vs CHA Spirit
DEX Tools      vs CON Nature
INT Influence vs WIS Empathy


 

For us to understand what you are proposing, I believe you'll need to give us a lot more information. First, what are you listing for the attributes? What does tools, body, etc, mean in game mechanics terms? Also, by influent do you mean influential?

I just looked up influent in Merriam Webster and got this:

   

1

: something that flows in: as

a: a tributary stream

b: fluid input into a reservoir or process 


2

: a factor modifying the balance and stability of an ecological community


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If you're looking for the variant on "influence," then you want "influential." But to influence someone, you're more likely to want something persuasive (CHA), where using INT would be presenting logical arguments. That's less "influencing" than "convincing."

In memory of wrecan and his Unearthed Wrecana.

Charisma is influence (which includes convincing by way of manipulation).
Intelligence is ability to articulate and make evident using facts (which includes convincing by way of presenting proof).

Danny

For easy evidence of this principle, witness the number of folks in history who, while very intelligent, had difficulty communicating their visions to others, and thus failed to exercise as much influence as they might have.  Da Vinci.  Nikola Tesla.  On the other hand, we have people who are downright idiots, but who have such magnetic personalities that they can move millions of people.  I will refrain from mentioning particular political examples, but if you simply consider Infomercials, you can probably get the idea.

The OP seems also seems to confuse Constitution - a measure of physical resilience - with Druidic nature lore or something.  And while dexterity is often used with tools, it is not necessarily so.  Acrobatics, for instance, are also dexterity maneuvers.

 
I agree with the common sentiment here. Influence is indeed Charisma based. If using skills, one would use skills such as diplomacy, bluff, perform or handle animal to name a few from 3.5e. All of these skills are charisma based.

I could see an argument for Intelligence helping one resist being influenced, but I think Wisdom is more appropriate for this and has been the go to stat for resisting influence in D&D for some time. Even the smartest person can be duped easily if not wise.
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I could see an argument for Intelligence helping one resist being influenced, but I think Wisdom is more appropriate for this and has been the go to stat for resisting influence in D&D for some time. Even the smartest person can be duped easily if not wise.

I agree.

Danny

I agree with the common sentiment here. Influence is indeed Charisma based. If using skills, one would use skills such as diplomacy, bluff, perform or handle animal to name a few from 3.5e. All of these skills are charisma based.

I could see an argument for Intelligence helping one resist being influenced, but I think Wisdom is more appropriate for this and has been the go to stat for resisting influence in D&D for some time. Even the smartest person can be duped easily if not wise.



Charisma is used to persuade via personality and charm.  However, there are times when I've failed from that avenue and had to use my intelligence to lay out logically why someone should agree with me and had that work where the charisma method did not.  Both charisma and intelligance can be used to influence people.
thanx for your comments;


the CON=Nature means natural beasts have high CON (to convince you, try to eat fresh *uncooked* meat )


at first I had pulled CHA as Influential, but then I said it would deal a better job as Spirit;


so I put Influence to INT; but I fully realize the foolishness of my thoughts (expecially when I transcribe from french to english )


thank you again... 

at first I had pulled CHA as Influential, but then I said it would deal a better job as Spirit;



Why?  I don't get this. 

I agree with the common sentiment here. Influence is indeed Charisma based. If using skills, one would use skills such as diplomacy, bluff, perform or handle animal to name a few from 3.5e. All of these skills are charisma based.

I could see an argument for Intelligence helping one resist being influenced, but I think Wisdom is more appropriate for this and has been the go to stat for resisting influence in D&D for some time. Even the smartest person can be duped easily if not wise.



Charisma is used to persuade via personality and charm.  However, there are times when I've failed from that avenue and had to use my intelligence to lay out logically why someone should agree with me and had that work where the charisma method did not.  Both charisma and intelligance can be used to influence people.



You could influence people with your strength. Intimidate is a good example of a skill that does this. Game mechanics wise it is a charisma skill, but I could see an argument for you to be able to apply Strength OR Charisma, or maybe even other stats.

You really can influence people with any stat. Your wisdom influences others. Your intelligence influences others. Your charisma influences others. Your strength influences others. I could even see your dexterity and constitution influencing others.

I feel it makes more sense for it to be charisma based, but I could see a great case for allowing other stats to be used if appropriate. In my games I would allow Intelligence (or any stat) to work IF it made sense at that point, even if the skill was Charisma only.    
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so I put Influence to INT; but I fully realize the foolishness of my thoughts (expecially when I transcribe from french to english )


thank you again... 



That makes a lot of sense to me now. Influent is the french word for influential. I am French, I just don't speak much of it!
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even if the skill was Charisma only.


In Next, skills aren't tied to specific ability scores. They simple modify your ability check (whichever one you happen to be making) when they apply. So Persuade can be used with INT to make a compelling case using cold logic, while it modifies CHA if you're appealing to less pragmatic notions. Persuade can apply to a STR check if you're strong-arming someone into cooperating. 

Standard Answer to all 5E rules questions: "Ask your DM."

if so, then here is what I would list as for the six attributes:

STR Body       vs CHA Spirit
DEX Tools      vs CON Nature
INT Influence vs WIS Empathy


I don't understand what the purpose or goal of this thread is. What are you trying to actually do?

Why, yes, as a matter of fact I am the Unfailing Arbiter of All That Is Good Design (Even More So Than The Actual Developers) TM Speaking of things that were badly designed, please check out this thread for my Minotaur fix. What have the critics said, you ask? "If any of my players ask to play a Minotaur, I'm definitely offering this as an alternative to the official version." - EmpactWB "If I ever feel like playing a Minotaur I'll know where to look!" - Undrave "WoTC if you are reading this - please take this guy's advice." - Ferol_Debtor_of_Torm "Really full of win. A minotaur that is actually attractive for more than just melee classes." - Cpt_Micha Also, check out my recent GENASI variant! If you've ever wished that your Fire Genasi could actually set stuff on fire, your Water Genasi could actually swim, or your Wind Genasi could at least glide, then look no further. Finally, check out my OPTIONS FOR EVERYONE article, an effort to give unique support to the races that WotC keeps forgetting about. Includes new racial feature options for the Changeling, Deva, Githzerai, Gnoll, Gnome, Goliath, Half-Orc, Kalashtar, Minotaur, Shadar-Kai, Thri-Kreen, Warforged and more!
well, easy to answer:


opposing Tools vs nature (because using tools is for humanoid vs nature is for natural beasts )

oppoing  Influence vs empathy  ( originally empathy was named Relationship )

opposing Body vs the mind ( spirit )


For people unfamiliar with uglyvan, it may be helpful to see his prior threads.

BADCHIP
WISE
WIME
And... I don't know what to call this or this.
I agree with the common sentiment here. Influence is indeed Charisma based. If using skills, one would use skills such as diplomacy, bluff, perform or handle animal to name a few from 3.5e. All of these skills are charisma based.

I could see an argument for Intelligence helping one resist being influenced, but I think Wisdom is more appropriate for this and has been the go to stat for resisting influence in D&D for some time. Even the smartest person can be duped easily if not wise.

Ifellers like CHA might be better for resisting influence than WIS.   The politician who can connive people isn't going to fall for conniving because he's seen it before.  Where the wise person might be wise in the ways of the world, but notnecessarily people.  (ie people who are wise but fall for infomercials)
His system looks like a bastardized version of New Marvel.

To the OP -


Wow. I want to visit your universe dude 'cause it must be one hell of a ride.

For people unfamiliar with uglyvan, it may be helpful to see his prior threads.

BADCHIP
WISE
WIME
And... I don't know what to call this or this.



Wrecan:



your version of the 12 subabilities  :


The Subabilities.  Following are the twelve Subabilities you may choose, if your character selects the Subabilities Option:
 Muscle (Strength): This Subability represents the muscle force that you can bring to bear on an obstacle.  It is commonly implicated by checks related to carrying, bending and breaking things.
 Motion (Strength): This Subability represents the ability to use your strength to move yourself or others and is commonly implicated in checks related to jumping, swimming, and climbing.
 Hardiness (Constitution): This Subability represents the ability to endure extreme environments, such as heat, starvation, cold, torture, and drowning. 
 Health (Constitution): This Subability represents the ability to withstand attacks against your person, such as poison and disease.
 Adroitness (Dexterity): This Subability represents your Ability to perform fine motor skills, and it most often implicated in picking locks, picking pockets, performing sleight of hand, or forging documents.
 Coordination (Dexterity): This Subability represents your ability to manipulate your body into specific positions.  It is typically implicated by checks for tumbling and hiding.
 Imagination (Intelligence): This Subability represents your ability to deduce solutions from clues and things you know or observe.  It is commonly implicated by checks related to puzzles, strategies, gambling, riddles, mysteries, and anticipating the actions of other characters.
 Memory (Intelligence): This Subability represents your ability to recall important information, whether details of a conversation from a week before, or lore that one learned in studies.
 Acuity (Wisdom): This Subability represents your perceptive abilities.  It allows you not only to see small details, to notice danger, to hear faint noises, to smell subtle odors, and to feel small changes in altitude, pressure, and temperature.
 Resolve (Wisdom): This Subability represents your ability to withstand mental assaults and temptations, and to see through trickery, subterfuge, and deception.
 Communication (Charisma): This Subability represents your ability to express yourself in a clear and understandable manner, whether through verbal communication, facial expressions, or gestures.
 Presence (Charisma): This Subability represents your force of personality.  Some times simple force of will allows people to accomplish remarkable things.
Wrecan:



your version of the 12 subabilities  :


Right.  That comes from this article which is part of my Secondary series.  I'm not sure how it pertains to your proposal.
I can't tell if this guy is trolling or not...
the CON=Nature means natural beasts have high CON (to convince you, try to eat fresh *uncooked* meat )

Ok, I will.  NOM  NOM NOM!  I love sushi!

But to answer your question: yes, you can say that an Intelligent person is very influential.  In D&D terms, that would be someone with a high Intelligence and a high Charisma.  They are smart enough to have good ideas, and charismatic enough to convince others to listen to them.

Just being smart isn't enough.  For example, if you are condescending and boring, it doesn't matter how smart you are; you will have a very hard time getting people to listen to you.

Just being smart isn't enough.  For example, if you are condescending and boring, it doesn't matter how smart you are; you will have a very hard time getting people to listen to you.



Hmm... what?  Were you saying something?
;) 
Just being smart isn't enough.  For example, if you are condescending and boring, it doesn't matter how smart you are; you will have a very hard time getting people to listen to you.



Hmm... what?  Were you saying something?
;) 

Quiet you!  And now I want some sushi...

even if the skill was Charisma only.


In Next, skills aren't tied to specific ability scores. They simple modify your ability check (whichever one you happen to be making) when they apply. So Persuade can be used with INT to make a compelling case using cold logic, while it modifies CHA if you're appealing to less pragmatic notions. Persuade can apply to a STR check if you're strong-arming someone into cooperating. 



This is a quote from the Persuade skill in the packet:

Your Persuade skill usually modifies a Charisma check.




It's not 100% tied to a skill and implies almost any other stat could apply. But it definitely mentions Charisma as the go to stat for these rolls. As written, it definitely implies that intelligence, or strength, or whatever could apply. I could see any stat applying in the right situation.   

 
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