Help a noob alter the Golgari Growth starter deck?

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Hello!

  I just started playing Magic about a week ago. My roommate and his buddy were playing when I got home from work, and I decided to watch for a round or two, then I played a few games using their decks. I really enjoyed myself, so I made several trips to the gamestore to pick up some cards to dive in head first. I bought the 200+ deck builder box, the "Mob Rule" deck, the "Fiery Dawn" deck, and the "Golgari Growth" deck. My roommate also gave me some cards from his collection to help me start out.

  I've been playing a lot of games with the Golgari Growth, but I keep getting stomped by his green/white populate deck. I have made a few changes to the deck which seemed to help a little, but I cant seem to find the right cards and direction for it. I REALLY like corpsejack menace, and the scavenge mechanic is so thematic and awesome, but I never seem to have enough mana in time to really make use of it before he is swarming me with 5 8/8 guardians and thragtusks everywhere.

  I was hoping I could get some advice on how to better my deck. Ill willing to spend some money if a card is essential to the build, but im not dropping $80 bucks on 4 "overgrown tomb" cards. So without furthur ado, I will post what my deck currently is.



I think I want to push the scavenging mechanic to keep the theme of the deck. there are some cards that I really like Sluiceway Scorpion, but it didnt seem that effecient when I could thrown down Deadbridge Goliath. A lot of the cards that came with the deck have really high scavenge costs, and I never seem to have enough mana to get them out there. cards like Korozda Monitor look like they could be pretty strong with a scavenge investment, but I feel like there are better options. I know I definitly want more Slitherhead and Corpsejack Menace.I am completely open to all suggestions and ideas. Thanks!
You probably want 4x Dreg Mangler, Deadbridge, and Vampire Nighthawk. 4 Grisly Salvage seems good too. You might need to add some cheap spells so you have stuff to do early game; Ultimate Price and Dead Weight might be worth playing, assuming you can't get Abrupt Decay. Actually, Arbor Elf can speed you up a lot.

what do you think about my land count? I took some out of forest and put some into swamps. Also im thinking of dropping some of the slimes for more creatures with scavenge. maybe the drudge beetles?

--24 x land--
11 x Forest
10 x Swamp
3 x Golgari Guildgate


--5 x spells--
1 x Ultimate Price
1 x Murder
1 x Grisly Salvage
2 x Jarad's Orders



--31 creatures--
4 x Slitherhead
4 x Deadbridge Goliath
4 x Vampire Nighthawk
2 x Corpsejack Menace
1 x Korozda Guildmage
2 x Gatecreeper Vine
2 x Korozda Monitor
2 x Drudge Beetle
3 x Arbor Elf
4 x Dreg Mangler
1 x Predator Ooze
1 x Acidic Slime
1 x Lotleth Troll 


edit: Took out the keyrunes and replaced them with Gatecreeper Vine to help with my land accumulation, and added a Lotleth Troll. maybe a Trestle Troll to defend against fliers? thanks for the tips, so far
the second version is much better took out almost all the bad cards

the single card that will help you the most in this matchup would be sever the bloodline its $$

demonlord of ashmouth is godly and cheap.

upgrade your commons and you should be able to beat him. the keyrune should go as well tbh
Don't want to just parrot here, but if populate is giving you problems, Sever the Bloodline is going to be really, really useful. 

what do you think about my land count? I took some out of forest and put some into swamps. Also im thinking of dropping some of the slimes for more creatures with scavenge. maybe the drudge beetles?

--24 x land--
11 x Forest
10 x Swamp
3 x Golgari Guildgate


--5 x spells--
1 x Ultimate Price
1 x Murder
1 x Grisly Salvage
2 x Jarad's Orders



--31 creatures--
4 x Slitherhead
4 x Deadbridge Goliath
4 x Vampire Nighthawk
2 x Corpsejack Menace
1 x Korozda Guildmage
2 x Gatecreeper Vine
2 x Korozda Monitor
2 x Drudge Beetle
3 x Arbor Elf
4 x Dreg Mangler
1 x Predator Ooze
1 x Acidic Slime
1 x Lotleth Troll 


edit: Took out the keyrunes and replaced them with Gatecreeper Vine to help with my land accumulation, and added a Lotleth Troll. maybe a Trestle Troll to defend against fliers? thanks for the tips, so far



I would remove the gatecreeper vines, korozda monitors, and predator ooze for a couple more murder, ultimate price, or victim of night. I would play all 4 arbor elf also (especially since your deck is light on two drops).

Don't be too smart to have fun
If u get more dual lands, I would keep predator ooze. He can chump thragtusk, and if you give him a little bump, you can get him to 3/3 to kill the tusk/token, then swing back even bigger. Tusk is hard to mitigate against, really the best way to fight it is to play your own ($$$) or just go bigger than him (cheap).

okay so this is what I currently have, makiung a run to the local gamestore to pick up some cards today. I was able to get my hands on a Deathrite Shaman, and it worked pretty well, so I think I will try to pick up another. anyone have some suggestions on what to replace the korozda monitor? I agree that its a little weak, especially if I can get a few lotleth troll. Also, I really like Predator Ooze. It turns into a threat really quickly with Corpsejack Menace in play, and if nothing else its a great blocker. It has served me really well in play, so unless when the deck is finished it doesnt work ill take it out. Also also, I was thinking of adding Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord. As of right now, this is what the deck is. 

--24 x land--
11 x Forest 
10 x Swamp 
3 x Golgari Guildgate 



--5 x spells--
1 x Victim of Night 
1 x Murder 
2 x Grisly Salvage 
2 x Jarad's Orders 
1 x Treasured Find 



--31 creatures--
3 x Slitherhead ----need 1
2 x Deadbridge Goliath----need 2
3 x Vampire Nighthawk----need 1
2 x Corpsejack Menace 
1 x Korozda Guildmage 
2 x Korozda Monitor-----need to replace
2 x Drudge Beetle----need to replace
4 x Arbor Elf 
2 x Dreg Mangler----might put in 2 more, not sure 
1 x Predator Ooze 
1 x Acidic Slime 
1 x Lotleth Troll----need more 
4 x Trestle Troll
1 x Deathrite Shaman -----might put in more



what do you guys think? 


trestle troll gots to go

demonlord of ashmouth is almost free and very good when you have so many weenies. 

if you have them a few golgari charm are well worth the slot. 
So I made a run to the gamestore and got some singles. splurged a bit on abrupt decay. took out some guys, put in some guys. let me know what you think. I played 3 games with the new cards and it feels pretty good. I feel like I have important people at the 4 mana slot to cast rather than the demonlord of ashmouth, but if i feel like I dont have enough muscle Ill buy one and try it out.

 



--24 x land--


10 x Forest
10 x Swamp
4 x Golgari Guildgate



--8 x spells--

4 x Abrupt Decay
2 x Jarad's Orders
2 x Golgari Charm
 



--28 creatures--
4 x Slitherhead
4 x Deadbridge Goliath
4 x Vampire Nighthawk
2 x Corpsejack Menace
2 x Arbor Elf
3 x Dreg Mangler
1 x Predator Ooze
2 x Lotleth Troll
2 x Trestle Troll
1 x Deathrite Shaman
2 x Strangleroot Geist
1 x Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord

I would probably remove trestle troll for another dreg mangler and a 2 mana creature (maybe thrill-kill assassin but looking for efficiency mostly). You really need overgrown tomb or woodland cemetery if you're going to play strangleroot geist and predator ooze.

It looks like you've made quite an improvement and it should be a very fun deck to play.
Don't be too smart to have fun
The biggest flaw I see here is too many creatures, and not enough supporting spells. You'd do well to back off on dudes and up your removal.

-2 Trestle Troll -> Just doesn't do anything for you.
-2 Strangleroot Geist -> Double Green is going to be too hard for you to cast on turn 2-3 when this guy shines.
-2 Arbor Elf -> Yes, he's good, but you don't have the proper lands (Overgrown Tomb) to really take advantage of him. He only works with half of your lands ATM.


Also, I would get rid of the golgari charms. I've played them in a number of games and always wished they were something else.

That gives us 8 slots to work with.

+2 Murder -> completely unconditional, just nukes something. Very good.
+1-2 Sever the Bloodline -> I'm so glad I got mine when they were 10 cent rares. However, it is an absolute BEATING against Selesnya. Worth the $3 easy.
+1-2 Ultimate Price -> this depends on how many mono-colored creatures your friends are running. The more they have, the better this becomes.

For your last two to four slots, Here's a couple of good cards you could include:

Rancor -> I swear you can put this in dang near any deck with green in it and it's good. "Combos" with Jarad and Vampire Nighthawk pretty well, but overall makes any of your threats Threaty-er. Threaty-er? Sure, why not. Even better for you since you don't mind your guys dying, and you may end up trading a slitherhead for a centaur if your friend doesn't want to get beaten over the head for 3 starting on turn 2.

Gnaw to the Bone -> I don't know how many creatures you end up with in your graveyard at any given time, but if its between 4-6, this card is just bananas. You can gain so much life from one copy of this (casting and then Flashing Back) that it will give you time to go over the top of your selesnya opponent.

Spider Spawning -> in the same vein as gnaw to the bone, only a different approach. Gives you a lot of chump blockers to buy you time.

Mutilate -> this one is iffy. It can be a massive board wipe on both sides, but you are more equiped to spring back by using scavenge and/or corpsejack menace. Only really good if your friend is playing with 3/3's or smaller.

Tribute to Hunger -> if your friend keeps only 1-2 large creatures on the board at a time, this is a good one to have a few copies of. Once again,situational.
you guys make some good points. I was playing a game the other day where If i had rancor or intimidate i would have won so easily. I also just pulled a gnaw to the bone and i wanted to try it out. I pulled some putefy So I will try that out as well. if putrefy doesnt work, ill switch to murder and other kill spells.

what do you guys think about Golgari Rot Farm? I just got 2 and they seem crazy but I havent played a game with one yet. 
you guys make some good points. I was playing a game the other day where If i had rancor or intimidate i would have won so easily. I also just pulled a gnaw to the bone and i wanted to try it out. I pulled some putefy So I will try that out as well. if putrefy doesnt work, ill switch to murder and other kill spells.

what do you guys think about Golgari Rot Farm? I just got 2 and they seem crazy but I havent played a game with one yet. 



golgari rot farm is bonkers in some formats but terrible in others. Imagine you're on the draw and you play a turn 2 golgari rot farm bouncing your forest. Opponent's turn he untaps and plays.... stone rain.... yeah, in this case golgari rot farm is a terrible selection. Or even if they're not playing land destruction they might play a turn 3 acidic slime on the back of a couple arbor elf.

It slows your deck down significantly (you miss your turn 2 play usually or you might cas a 1 CMC creature). However, even with these drawbacks it's an amazing card for casual play. In games where you might otherwise ditch a 2 land hand if one of those lands is a bounce land you've got a keeper. In the right environment (slower/midrange multiplayer environments without a lot of Land Death) it's basically an extra card in hand.

putrefy is one of the best removal spells in G/B. It's right up there with maelstrom pulse and abrupt decay. There are a handful of black removal spells that might suit a specific situation better (for example victim of night is only 2 CMC however it loses in the versatility department). Even maelstrom pulse is a sorcery and doesn't have the no regen clause although it seems more powerful in the abstract. If you've got putrefy then your removal selection problems are essentially gone as you can just choose that one and then move on to the next part of your deck that you want to improve.
Don't be too smart to have fun
Can someone explain how Golgari Rot Farm is beneficial to use? no matter what you still end up with 3 mana on turn 3 if you use this or just drop regular lands. I dont get it.



this is my deck ATM

10 x forest
10 x swamp
4   x Golgari GuildGate


4   x abrupt decay
2   x Putrefy
2   x Rancor
2   x Jarad's Orders
1   x Gnaw to the Bone

4   x Slitherhead
4   x Deadbridge Goliath
4   x Vampire Nighthawk
3   x Dreg Mangler
2   x Korozda Guildmage
2   x Corpsejack Menace
2   x Lotleth Troll
1   x Predator Ooze
1   x Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
2   x Deathrite Shaman


I pulled another deathrite shaman last night so im gonna try to find a place for him. Probably take out the Golgari Charm. comments?
Well, for one thing it is better then the guildgate. You certainly do not have to play it the second turn either, it plays just as well on the fourth turn.

A normal 4 land hand plays out 1 2 3 4 in power curve. If you have the bounce land it plays out in many different ways depending on your other cards. You could go

1 1 4 5
1 2 2 5
1 2 3 3 6 ;)

The guild gate can only play out as,
0 2 3 4
1 1 3 4
1 2 2 4
1 2 3 3 etc,

The bounce lands let you play to the rest of your hand better. They give you one extra power the turn after use. They make any form of land untapping extra powerful. They make any form of land destruction an extra tempo hit as well, this is the downside. Almost no decks use any land destruction.

If you are also playing casual you have access to cards that directly untap lands in green or even artifacts. You have access to cards that let you really manipulate land plays, many of these come into play tapped anyway.

burgeoning
amulet of vigor
magus of the candelabra and the very expensive candelabra of tawnos
crop rotation play it in his turn so you can untap it in your turn ;)
skyshroud ranger
garruk wildspeaker
primeval titan

It also easily lets you use some lands that would otherwise suck a little such as,
gemstone mine

and it makes already powerful cards REALLY obnoxious such as,
thawing glaciers
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but when you take out a land, the extra mana you gain from the rot farm just evens out. theres something i dont get here 1 land 1 land rot farm for a total of 2 lands in play 1 land total 4 mana 1 land 1 land 1 land 1 land total 4 mana I dont have any land untapping in my deck so maybe its more useful in another deck. im just trying to see if theres a benefit for using it in my deck. the only benefit I could see is if i only had 1 color land in hand, and needed other colors. well I guess that is best case scenario with a good opening hand. but they arent legal in standard so it doesnt matter.


Edit: nvm I think I get it
Drop Predator ooze and that janky life gain spell.

 Drop the Golgari charms.
 You should have four Dreg Manglers in there. You should also be running overgrown tomb like crazy.

I know it's expensive but this deck is SO much better with four Thragtusks.
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Hello!

  I just started playing Magic about a week ago. My roommate and his buddy were playing when I got home from work, and I decided to watch for a round or two, then I played a few games using their decks. I really enjoyed myself, so I made several trips to the gamestore to pick up some cards to dive in head first. I bought the 200+ deck builder box, the "Mob Rule" deck, the "Fiery Dawn" deck, and the "Golgari Growth" deck. My roommate also gave me some cards from his collection to help me start out.

  I've been playing a lot of games with the Golgari Growth, but I keep getting stomped by his green/white populate deck. I have made a few changes to the deck which seemed to help a little, but I cant seem to find the right cards and direction for it. I REALLY like corpsejack menace, and the scavenge mechanic is so thematic and awesome, but I never seem to have enough mana in time to really make use of it before he is swarming me with 5 8/8 guardians and thragtusks everywhere.

  I was hoping I could get some advice on how to better my deck. Ill willing to spend some money if a card is essential to the build, but im not dropping $80 bucks on 4 "overgrown tomb" cards. So without furthur ado, I will post what my deck currently is.



I think I want to push the scavenging mechanic to keep the theme of the deck. there are some cards that I really like Sluiceway Scorpion, but it didnt seem that effecient when I could thrown down Deadbridge Goliath. A lot of the cards that came with the deck have really high scavenge costs, and I never seem to have enough mana to get them out there. cards like Korozda Monitor look like they could be pretty strong with a scavenge investment, but I feel like there are better options. I know I definitly want more Slitherhead and Corpsejack Menace.I am completely open to all suggestions and ideas. Thanks!





I like the Lotleth Troll / Slitherhead combo... it makes for a nasty 2 counters. and if you have a Corpsejack Menace out when u do this your getting 4 x  +1/+1 instead of 2... and u do all this without casting any mana other than to play the original Corpsejack Menace and Lotleth Troll.

Thats what's in my golgari deck anyways...

Another good card to throw in  but its expensive is Deathrite Shaman but its $12 a piece. i only have one.

but when you take out a land, the extra mana you gain from the rot farm just evens out. theres something i dont get here 1 land 1 land rot farm for a total of 2 lands in play 1 land total 4 mana 1 land 1 land 1 land 1 land total 4 mana I dont have any land untapping in my deck so maybe its more useful in another deck. im just trying to see if theres a benefit for using it in my deck. the only benefit I could see is if i only had 1 color land in hand, and needed other colors. well I guess that is best case scenario with a good opening hand. but they arent legal in standard so it doesnt matter.


Edit: nvm I think I get it




The best thing about the bounce lands is that you get more mana per card in hand. In slower formats and many multiplayer games this will be especially relevant. For example if you have a starting hand that is 3 lands deadbridge goliath, putrefy, slitherhead and stinkweed imp then it's not going to hurt you to play your golgari rot farm turn 2. In addition lets say you draw thragtusk, corpsejack menace, and harmonize during each of your draw steps. If you had 3 lands which were 2 swamps and a forest then you can't cast any of your 4 CMC + spells but if one of those lands was a golgari rot farm then you can cast any of your 4 mana spells on turn 4 even if you get stuck with only the three lands in your opening hand.
Don't be too smart to have fun
yeah I see now why they are good. They arent legal in standard though, right? otherwise I will put some in
yeah I see now why they are good. They arent legal in standard though, right? otherwise I will put some in


 
if your talking about anything from Return to Ravnica then yes thats standard

its from the golgari vs izzet duel deck, and regular ravnica
what is a good balance of creatures and spells? Do I have too many creatures?
That question is not one with a fixed answer. It really depends on what your deck is trying to do.

In this case, you have a lot of interactions that require creatures: Lotleth Troll, Jarad, Corpsejack, Rancor, Korozda Guildmage, and Gnaw to the bone.

So, short answer: No, you do not have too many creatures.

Now, if you were running a deck with delver of secrets and 25 creatures, that'd be a different story. 
just wanted to thank everyone who contributed in the thread, it really helped shape where I wanted this deck to go.

played this at FNM tonight, my first tournament, and did much better than I expected. Just made a few user-errors, but the deck was awesome. 
So I was able to get my hands on an Overgrown Tomb, should I take out a Golgari Guildgate, or switch out a swamp or forest?
Definitely keep the golgari guildgates; I would run 4evolving wilds (because they replace themselves, they thin your deck and make it more likely you'll draw a creature later than draw too many lands), and as many guildgates as you have. I haven't done the math, but it looks like you would replace a forest with the overgrown tomb. When you have lots of cards with and in the cost, you need to have access to the right mana.
well the majority of my cards are equal cost for swamp forests. usualy swamp. forest,colorless, or swamp swamp forest forest, etc... I have more cards that require forests to casts, and more spell effects that require forests.

the only things I currently have that require swamps only is the Vampire Nighthawk, and the regeneration effect on Lotleth Troll. everything else is equal parts swamp/forest, or forest heavy.

I have no idea how to balance the land types, I just put them at equal parts when I was building it.


Going to disagree with all the people who say the Golgari Charm is useless. It just has to fit into your deck. I'll use it to take out a bunch of 1/1's (including my own Slitherhead) then scavenge the Slitherhead. Plus it's multi-function. It just has to make sense with what you're doing with your deck.
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Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.
You are both rational and emotional. You value creation and discovery, and feel strongly about what I create. At best, you're innovative and intuitive. At worst, you're scattered and unpredictable.
Well Putrefy isnt standard legal, so im gonna have to take that out. gonna experiment with a few spells and see how it goes.
what do you guys think about Death's Presence? the mana cost seems high without anything in my deck to increase my mana count, but if you could pull it off it could be ba-nay-nays.
You seem to be wanting to keep it standard, deaths presence has no use in standard(it is a very niche card really only useful with persist)

undying evil or hunger of the howlpack are the real choices for that atm.

When you graduate out of standard though you can use them.
kitchen finks or murderous redcap
greater good or goblin bombardment
and death's presence are amusing together.

Something like this could be fun,
4 birds of paradise
4 golgari guildmage
4 kitchen finks
4 murderous redcap
1 Savra, Queen of the Golgari

4 rancor
4 power conduit
4 coalition relic
2 blasting station
2 crop rotation
2 death's presence
1 greater good
1 burgeoning

5 forest
5 swamp
4 overgrown tomb
4 woodland cemetery
4 golgari rot farm
1 phyrexian tower
You are Red/Blue!
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Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.
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