What if (almost) every spell created a lasting effect?

This idea occurred to me after reading one of Garthanos' suggestions regarding wizards, which I believe was the one about giving the wizard things to eat up his actions such that he didn't need a spell to cast every round. I believe specifically he mentioned needing to refresh defensive spells, but what if we extended this to all kinds of different spells?

For example, single target spells like magic missile and acid arrow wouldn't end with a single shot, but instead give you a supply of them to use throughout the battle. The amount wouldn't be infinite, but enough to last a single combat.

Like Garthanos said, defensive would last X number of rounds regardless of whether their effects had been depleted or not. So mirror images could be refreshed using an action and such.

Spells like fireball and cone of cold are somewhat harder, but perhaps they behind a zone of effect. So fireball could leave a ring of burning ground that would last for X number of rounds. To add to this, the wizard could also spend an action to move the zone some number of feet/squares.

Basically, the purpose of this idea is to let daily spells have a big impact upon any given encounter while allowing the wizard to have something magical to do every round with necessarily needing to resort to at-will/encounter level spells. Although, at-will cantrip attack spells could be used to cover things until the wizard has enough spell slots to make it through the day.

EDIT: I should also mention that a big reason for this idea is that I think it can satisfy both parties. The ones who don't like the idea of at-will magic and such, and those who don't care for how limiting vancian magic can be. This way, the spells can be big and powerful and the wizard can have something magical to do every round by managing the magical effects he's brought into play. 
This is something I could get behind if it were handled right. I think a zone of effect is a little too boring to be a Wizard's thing to do every round, but the general premise of "Use this resource to gain the ability to cast this type of spell for the rest of the encounter" to me seems like a good one. 
I like the spirit of the idea.  But I can foresee objections being raised of tracking issues.  I think at-will spells accomplish much the same thing with less paperwork.
I fear this would do nothing more than boost the spells by adding the lasting effects and not lead to a spellcaster to use options other than spells. For example, a ring of fire produced by a fireball can't really be manipulated at all, so the wizard will likely just cast another spell the next turn.
Glad to see some people like it. You could always make the ongoing effects more interesting. Rather than just leaving a burning zone, fireball could also allow you to spout off a burst of flames from zone to hit an individual target some distance away farther than you could move the flames.

While I agree that for some, if not many, people moving zones around would be boring, but I personally think its cooler to command a mass of flames to envelope my enemies than it would be to cast burning hands one more time.

If the wizard stays the way it is, roughly, I don't really see much chance for tracking issues since the wizard is most likely going to cast only a couple of spells in any given combat, especially if the spells work this way. If you're concerned about nova-ing and peppering the battle-field with zones and stuff, you could always limit it to one spell active of each kind; zone, 'quiver', and defensive.

I personally have no problem with at-will and encounter spells. In fact, I'd love it if every spell had an at-will, encounter and daily version. You could use the at-will and encounter versions all you wanted as long as you had the spell prepared, even if you used the daily version. I really only am proposing this idea because I feel could satisfy a larger group of people than some of the other solutions I've seen.

@LadyBlackwell, that's why I mentioned the zone of flames could be moved. It would give the wizard something magical to do on their turn without them needing an at-will spell or casting one of their precious daily spells. 
It would extend the power of the spell caster in the at-will territory and futher erode the base for martial characters. However, I would not mind carrying over the idea of effects over time for all classes, similar to the save concept in 4E, where each round you determine if the effect lasts by rolling a dice. This could be used by all classes for different abilities or spells.
Your thread title reminded me of another idea I had.

The idea was that various effects for a fighter. Hamstringing (slowed) or Blinding (real not blood in the eyes) or incapacitation of a Limb (weakness?)

When used against npcs especially.. just ought to be well permanent. If your fight is only 5 or so rounds... a fighting man giving a hamstring that slows till the wound heals is equivalent of a wizard having an ice spell that makes most of the enemies on the battle field slow...for one round.

Well why not?

Upping the anty for martial empowerment really is what needs done when you know you are wanting wizards to do extreme effects. Start looking at more extreme impacts could be simpler in this case no counting durations.

A blind dragon is probable still damn nasty but why does it need to be blood in your eyes temporary.
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

 
EDIT: I should also mention that a big reason for this idea is that I think it can satisfy both parties. The ones who don't like the idea of at-will magic and such, and those who don't care for how limiting vancian magic can be. This way, the spells can be big and powerful and the wizard can have something magical to do every round by managing the magical effects he's brought into play. 



Sure take up some action economy and keep the wizard engaged with his magic... I think 4e had spells with heavier maintains (than just minor action) clauses  that were like some of what you mention.
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

Thinking on this thread I had an idea, so I'm just wondering if anyone is interested.

By default, wizards get no damage dealing at will spells.

When a wizard casts a daily spell, they get at will spells depending on the spells used. So a wizard casting fireball would then get a few at will spells for controlling the flames left behind, expanding the zone of fire, lashing out at enemies with gouts of flame who are close to the area and manipulating smoke to create cover / difficult terrain.

Magic missile I loved the idea before of maintaining it to fire a missile every turn if its sustained.

Similar things can be done with other spells with careful planning. Also this would give bigger meaning to concentration as if you lose concentration you would lose the at wills from that spell potentially.
Thinking on this thread I had an idea, so I'm just wondering if anyone is interested.

By default, wizards get no damage dealing at will spells.

When a wizard casts a daily spell, they get at will spells depending on the spells used. So a wizard casting fireball would then get a few at will spells for controlling the flames left behind, expanding the zone of fire, lashing out at enemies with gouts of flame who are close to the area and manipulating smoke to create cover / difficult terrain.

Magic missile I loved the idea before of maintaining it to fire a missile every turn if its sustained.

Similar things can be done with other spells with careful planning. Also this would give bigger meaning to concentration as if you lose concentration you would lose the at wills from that spell potentially.



I like the concept behind this, but how many at will spells are you going to be making? How many dailies? Will at wills be shared between dailies or are they each their own set of unique things? 

Like it seems with this, you could narrow the daily spells themselves down to a narrower selection. Maybe as little as 2-4 per school of magic. But then what improves is the at wills you get to use as the followups. For example, maybe a first level wizard can just do a burning hands/fireball and leave a zone of burning flames, and that leftover burning flame is all he gets. At higher levels, he gets more at wills associated with that spell, so he can manipulate the flames to strike, or diminishing it to create more smoke obscuring sight and LoS, or increasing the fire along a set line effectively creating a wall, or even converging the flames into a fire-elemental that fights for you. 

This leads to what I think would be a much more interesting wizard, and much more thematic, as the Wizard will likely have one major spell each fight, but it is likely much stronger than the currently existing martial characters. These archtypes would still need to be brought up to feel more on par with the what the Wizard can do. On the other hand, it leaves an easier method of balancing. You can now compare what at wills the martial characters have at all times with what a Wizard has in any given fight. So the martial characters could be balanced by having more options available in a given fight than the Wizard, but the Wizard would have more options over the day as a whole. So if a 10th level Wizard has say 5 spells per day and each one has 4 at wills associated with it, he has 20 options total available for the day. The Fighter/Rogue might instead have something closer to the 8-12 range (personally I'd lean towards 12, giving one new thing each level, with a little extra at level 1). Comparing Martial at wills to caster at wills becomes and apples to apples comparison, rather than the apples to oranges comparison it is comparing at wills to dailies now, and is thus much easier to balance against each other as well.
I definitely like where you all are going with this. 

You make an interesting point Seerow, which I think I heard someone else mention (apologies if it was you). Why doesn't the wizard get all of their spells slots up front? I mean, everything I hear from the designers seems to suggest that the wizard has some expected number of daily spells cast per X number of rounds, then why do they start with 1 slot and increase from there? The wizard, and all daily ability using classes, should have their daily allotment of power fixed from level one, and only the power of those abilities should increase, not the number of them.
I definitely like where you all are going with this. 

You make an interesting point Seerow, which I think I heard someone else mention (apologies if it was you). Why doesn't the wizard get all of their spells slots up front? I mean, everything I hear from the designers seems to suggest that the wizard has some expected number of daily spells cast per X number of rounds, then why do they start with 1 slot and increase from there? The wizard, and all daily ability using classes, should have their daily allotment of power fixed from level one, and only the power of those abilities should increase, not the number of them.



Check out this casting system ... its slick not just because it inhibits the nova 5mwd but just because.... ought to work along side having a full set of spells too. 

 http://community.wizards.com/dndnext/go/thread/view/75882/29487869/Concentration:_A_Solution_to_the_5MWD?sdb=1&pg=last#525966551

  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

Thinking on this thread I had an idea, so I'm just wondering if anyone is interested.

By default, wizards get no damage dealing at will spells.

When a wizard casts a daily spell, they get at will spells depending on the spells used. So a wizard casting fireball would then get a few at will spells for controlling the flames left behind, expanding the zone of fire, lashing out at enemies with gouts of flame who are close to the area and manipulating smoke to create cover / difficult terrain.

Magic missile I loved the idea before of maintaining it to fire a missile every turn if its sustained.

Similar things can be done with other spells with careful planning. Also this would give bigger meaning to concentration as if you lose concentration you would lose the at wills from that spell potentially.



That's an interesting concept.  Many spells could have an at-will effect that can be sustained/re=produced while you concentrate on that spell?  So a wall of fire could produce bolts of fire that do 1d6 fire damage or something?
Maybe a few more spells like Snilocks Snowball and Geraldine's eight lucky sling rocks at low levels is all you need.
I definitely like where you all are going with this. 

You make an interesting point Seerow, which I think I heard someone else mention (apologies if it was you). Why doesn't the wizard get all of their spells slots up front? I mean, everything I hear from the designers seems to suggest that the wizard has some expected number of daily spells cast per X number of rounds, then why do they start with 1 slot and increase from there? The wizard, and all daily ability using classes, should have their daily allotment of power fixed from level one, and only the power of those abilities should increase, not the number of them.



I'm not sure if that was something I posted around here or not (I definitely remember suggesting something to that effect in the survey, but can't remember if it was something I posted here or if someone else is thinking on the same lines as me), but I agree that is the logical way to handle things. Personally I don't even mind longevity being increased as you get to higher levels. Like a higher level wizard being able to trade out his dailies for weaker encounter powers, or one daily for a couple of lower level dailies, that sort of thing. But as far as number powers available when trying to go nova goes, that should be consistent.