Weird Married Couples

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Some friends and I have a campagin going where I am swapping out our groups rogue for a Dragonborn Paladin of the Raven Queen who has the backstory that he got involved with the Raven Queen to stamp out the forces of Orcus that are spreading around the world because his family was killed by cultists of Orcus. To make a long story short, he was enslaved by these cultists and met a young half-elf woman, by the time they were rescued and taken to a Raven Queen Temple they had grown very close and were married.

The question I have is: Is the idea of a Dragonborn married to a Half-Elf woman too jarring? Would that kind of thing even happen? I can't find much background on Dragonborn culture in 4e for ideas, really.
People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange. Sounds like a cool plot point. Wouldn't expect any children though.
Raaargh! While dragonman may marry elf girl, magic heritage interferes with magic heritage meaning no fey dragon spawn. Tiefling x half-Elf = Tiefling but default fluff has dragonborn not interbreeding with other races!

*Chews on the Original Poster*

Braaains....
Spiteful Wizard and Voice of Reason of the House of Trolls The Silent God of the House of Trolls Unfrozen OTTer Arbiter of the House of Trolls Yes, I have many titles. Deal with it.
People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange. Sounds like a cool plot point. Wouldn't expect any children though.


*stumbles in*

braaaiiiinnnnnsssss

*bites zeratulcraft*

(zeratulcraft has been bitten, and now has the Zeta Virus coursing through their veins. Please see my sig for details.)
Boraxe wrote: "Knowledge of the rules and creativity are great attributes for a DM, but knowing when to cut loose and when to hold back, when to follow the rules and when to discard them, in order to enhance the enjoyment of the game is the most important DM skill of all." Keeper of the Sacred Kitty Bowl of the House of Trolls. Resident Kitteh-napper.
People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange. Sounds like a cool plot point. Wouldn't expect any children though.



I tried to think of a reasonable way that these two could have kids, but aren't Dragonborn made in eggs? That would be extremly awkward since humans can't lay them. I really don't like the idea of having kids be around, they seem to be more of a distraction than anything.

Raaargh! While dragonman may marry elf girl, magic heritage interferes with magic heritage meaning no fey dragon spawn. Tiefling x half-Elf = Tiefling but default fluff has dragonborn not interbreeding with other races!

*Chews on the Original Poster*

Braaains....



So there's no cases of them interbreeding? That seems a bit odd, I mean I guess when I think back there have always been very few of the mixed races. Like there's no offical half-Dwarf or anything. What I really need to do is get my hands on a PHB and read more about Dragonborn as a referesher course.

People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange. Sounds like a cool plot point. Wouldn't expect any children though.


*stumbles in*

braaaiiiinnnnnsssss

*bites zeratulcraft*

(zeratulcraft has been bitten, and now has the Zeta Virus coursing through their veins. Please see my sig for details.)



Not sure what's going on here.

People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange. Sounds like a cool plot point. Wouldn't expect any children though.



This, about a hundred times over (on all counts).
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
There's always adoption.

I really don't see why there would be any problem. Half-elves themselves are hybrids, to start with, and the dragonborn is your character so you get to dictate his views on inter-racial marriages.

As for children, the D&D world is already full of hybrids as is, half-dwarves or muls, half elves, even tieflings can be considered a sort of hybrid. Further, the dragon sorcerer got his/her powers through a blood line linking directly to an actual dragon. As both half-elves and dragonborn can be dragon sorcerers, I can see no reason why they couldn’t produce viable offspring together. 

I tried to think of a reasonable way that these two could have kids, but aren't Dragonborn made in eggs? That would be extremly awkward since humans can't lay them.



They could always adopt.

Also, strictly speaking, the fact that dragonborn lay eggs would be largely* irrelevant.  Assuming that dragonborn and humans could interbreed, it would be the female's anatomy that would decide how the birth would take place.  A human female could not lay an egg because she would not have the necessary hardware.  Likewise, a dragonborn female could not give live birth because her biology setup to function like that.

Also, fantasy settings often do not use real-life genetics and biology, and function off of magic and lego genetics instead.  And even if a fantasy setting does subscribes to a more consistent set of genetic rules, there's no reason why they have to be the exact same rules we would expect in the real world.


*Though not entirely.  Even assuming compatible genetics, the conditions instead a womb and instead an egg can be very different, which could affect the surviabilityof the offspring.  Though if this too can be just as easily handwaved.

I really don't like the idea of having kids be around, they seem to be more of a distraction than anything.


Then there's your answer.  Besides, protagonist in fiction usually rarely need to worry about "minor" nuisances like the possibility pregnancy unless drama is the goal of the work.

People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange.



Also this.  Human and dragonborn psychology is basically the same, so there's no reason why members of the two races could not fall in love.

Thinking about creating a race for 4e? Make things a lil' easier on yourself by reading my Race Mechanic Creation Guide first.
in the first game of dnd i played in i had my lizardfolk barbarian fall in love with a teifling fighter (the fighter was a female) and the dm gave me a random percentile chance to see if cross breeding actually worked (by my luck it did) so i would say no matter the race it would be up to the dm and you if your pairing produced offspring.
If dragonborn lay eggs, why to female dragonborn have busts and (presumably) mammories?
This is a fantasy world. With magic spells.
Sure, child could be a dragon-sorcerer.
Or a barbarian with blood rage or a berserker.
Doesn't really matter.

And that doesn't even bring up the idea of concubines, surrogates, or other "extra-marital" options. Besides, who is to say what is marital norm anyway. Just because 'western culture' has hang-ups does not mean the fantasy realm has the same hang-ups. Maybe monogamy would disgust and horrify them?
I tried to think of a reasonable way that these two could have kids, but aren't Dragonborn made in eggs? That would be extremly awkward since humans can't lay them.



They could always adopt.

Also, strictly speaking, the fact that dragonborn lay eggs would be largely* irrelevant.  Assuming that dragonborn and humans could interbreed, it would be the female's anatomy that would decide how the birth would take place.  A human female could not lay an egg because she would not have the necessary hardware.  Likewise, a dragonborn female could not give live birth because her biology setup to function like that.

Also, fantasy settings often do not use real-life genetics and biology, and function off of magic and lego genetics instead.  And even if a fantasy setting does subscribes to a more consistent set of genetic rules, there's no reason why they have to be the exact same rules we would expect in the real world.


*Though not entirely.  Even assuming compatible genetics, the conditions instead a womb and instead an egg can be very different, which could affect the surviabilityof the offspring.  Though if this too can be just as easily handwaved.

I really don't like the idea of having kids be around, they seem to be more of a distraction than anything.


Then there's your answer.  Besides, protagonist in fiction usually rarely need to worry about "minor" nuisances like the possibility pregnancy unless drama is the goal of the work.

People love who they love, and PCs are almost always strange.



Also this.  Human and dragonborn psychology is basically the same, so there's no reason why members of the two races could not fall in love.




I think if forced to do the whole kid topic things would get too weird in this game, especially considering we have a pretty young girl at the table with us and we're already somewhat censored. But the topic is interesting, I think there would be a percentile die involved in the survivabilty of the child.

I don't even plan for his wife to make an appearence in game for a loooooong time.

But one of the worrying things about them being a couple is the fact that he's nearing seven feet tall, I guess that's not that ridiculous though. 

in the first game of dnd i played in i had my lizardfolk barbarian fall in love with a teifling fighter (the fighter was a female) and the dm gave me a random percentile chance to see if cross breeding actually worked (by my luck it did) so i would say no matter the race it would be up to the dm and you if your pairing produced offspring.



Yeah that is what I was just thinking, we'd have to break out the D100 to see if that ever did pop off, but at the same time I think that with the way this game is going that moment will be a long time off.

If dragonborn lay eggs, why to female dragonborn have busts and (presumably) mammaries?

Secondary sexual characteristics on females have two primary purposes. If I may use a bit of vernacular, those purposes are

a) chick repellants
b) boy magnets

Chick repellants are things that make other females unable to compete for mates, or at least make them think they cannot compete for mates.

Boy magnets are things that make males want to mate with this female more than they want to mate with other females.

Secondary sexual characteristics on males have the same two functions, but of course with the genders swapped - boy repellants and chick magnets.

Secondary sexual characteristics are used to say three things:


  • I'm healthy (I have genes that protect me from disease, so my kids will have those genes); 

  • I'm strong (my kids get those genes too, oh and hey you don't want to fight with me over who gets to mate); 

  • I'm prosperous (I/my family can help my mate and my kids be prosperous). 


This has been the standard of beauty in every human culture, although it sometimes got perverted in strange ways (poor people work in the fields, therefore having pale skin is a sign of prosperity, so let's smear white poison on our skin to make ourselves more pale). And quite a few non-human cultures as well (example: bowerbirds).

Now realistically, the dragonborn females' boobs* are NOT used to sell D&D books to dragonborn males. They are used to sell books to humans. PCs are generally expected to be healthy, strong, and soon prosperous - so we generally want our PCs to show the secondary sexual characteristics that we recognize as saying this. Which includes boobs on females. So dragonborn get 'em. Kobolds, which also are emphatically non-hominid but are allowed to look small and weak, don't.
"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
If dragonborn lay eggs, why to female dragonborn have busts and (presumably) mammories?



They definitely have mammaries.  This was confirmed in a dragon article way, way back.  And the reason they have mammaries is because they are most likely mammals, assuming that real-world taxonomy groupings still apply in the fantasy setting in question.  Mammaries are one the primary defining characteristics of the mammalia class.  And to be even more technical, since they lay eggs, they are likely monotremes.

I think if forced to do the whole kid topic things would get too weird in this game, especially considering we have a pretty young girl at the table with us and we're already somewhat censored.


It shouldn't get weird as long as your group is mature about the conversation (and vague about the nitty-gritty details).  I learned the basics of animal biology and other branches of natural sciences from PBS, the Discovery channel, and books while still in early elementary school.  So, at least, it's not an entirely unapproachable topic.

But the topic is interesting, I think there would be a percentile die involved in the survivabilty of the child.



Which is a valid idea.  Personally, I'm not a big fan miscarriage drama, so I'd either have the breeding either work or not work.  But that's me.

But one of the worrying things about them being a couple is the fact that he's nearing seven feet tall, I guess that's not that ridiculous though. 



It's common enough to be the subject of several tropes.
Thinking about creating a race for 4e? Make things a lil' easier on yourself by reading my Race Mechanic Creation Guide first.
If dragonborn lay eggs, why to female dragonborn have busts and (presumably) mammories?




If I'm the DM, and its my world.  female dragonborn do not have breasts.  The do have wider, or more flexible hips than other races.  The hips would be the defining feature that attracts many dragonborn males, rather than frontal or posterior assets.  Of course if I was to have a dragonborn male describe what attracted him to a dragonborn female. It would include frills, tendrils, smile/teeth, the proportion of shoulder to hip, the graceful sway of her walk...


Breast on a dragonborn... completely ridiculous.  Just shows how unimaginative people can be and how they have to "humanize" all races.  For further discussion on this we could look at beards on dwarves and utters on minotaurs.  


TjD

This thread is going to turn into another Dragonborn-Seinfeld sketch, isn't it?

I've always found it a bit humorous that every other human-but-different race gets a free pass, but not dragonborn.  Elf boobs?  Okay.  Dwarf boobs?  Why not.  Shifter boobs?  Sure.  Gnome boobs?  Sounds legit.  Half-dragon boobs?  Why wouldn't they?  Dragonborn boobs?  WOAH!  Woah!  That is not okay.  That's just unimaginative, and weird, and they have scales and cooties and donotwant!

I mean, yeah it's kinda unimaginative that all these races look and function just like humans.  Perhap we do need more races whose biology, instincts, and mating habits are less like a human's.  But you never see this conversation started with halflings.


And what's the deal with half-orcs...?
Thinking about creating a race for 4e? Make things a lil' easier on yourself by reading my Race Mechanic Creation Guide first.
I say let them have the baby if they want. regardless of whether or not they can naturally have a child, this is a setting with magic. To say that the only forms of magic are combat oriented is silly. There is surely some ritual that would enable them to have a child, even if they normally can't. Make it interesting, and say there is a chance the child will either be mostly dragonborn, or mostly half-elf, depending on whose blood is more dominate. Then there are 4 possible outcomes for them to expect, and you don't have to worry about what a half dragonborn-quarterhuman-quarterelf looks like.

Races are humanized because as humans we are unable to conceptually relate to a sentiant being if it is too different form us. Making a race similar in most ways, means that by deffinition they experience the world in a manner similar to our own, and therefor we are able to empathise with them. Does it makes sense for a dragonborn, who is obviously reptilian, to have breasts? Probably not. However, it is still neccissary, because as a human, a breast is something that we relate to. It means that they raise and nuture thier infants in a way not completly disimilar from ourselves. It also signifies that they have sexual tastes not completly different than our own. These humanizing factors make them relatable to us, because in practice, it is usually too difficult to imagine how a completly alien creature thinks. I might encounter a sentient alien jellyfish, who sees in the ultraviolet spectrum, communicates through chemical receptors on it's tentacles, procreates by tossing it's genetic material haphazardly into pools of PH neutral water, and believes the meaning of life is "xxxmrrrrghbllt 37treacle" This is a race that stricly speaking "makes sense" but chances our we are not going to have a long standing relationship.
It's dnd for pete's sake.  If you want to say they manage to make a kid, they get to make a kid.  Fluff is important (VERY important when I play) but it's important to know that it can be changed.  

The only problem arrives when they try to start adding stats to the kid, which I doubt will happen and if they do then they weren't really in it for the rp I think.
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 



I'm hoping the gnome is male. Otherwise I can not possibly imagine how that would work.
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 



I'm hoping the gnome is male. Otherwise I can not possibly imagine how that would work.




Death by snoo snoo?
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 



I'm hoping the gnome is male. Otherwise I can not possibly imagine how that would work.




Death by snoo snoo?



Doth thou not mean Death By Moo Moo?
Spiteful Wizard and Voice of Reason of the House of Trolls The Silent God of the House of Trolls Unfrozen OTTer Arbiter of the House of Trolls Yes, I have many titles. Deal with it.
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 



I'm hoping the gnome is male. Otherwise I can not possibly imagine how that would work.




Death by snoo snoo?



Doth thou not mean Death By Moo Moo?



Gnome was female haha. They did not have children...yet.

XD death by moo moo. Made me smile sir. 
My friends gnome is married to a minotaur. Cannot get much more strange. 



This is fantasy we're talking about.  The only limit for how strange it can get, however you choose to define "strange", is ultimately one's imagination.  I can imagine stranger still...and that's as much as I'm going to elaborate.
Thinking about creating a race for 4e? Make things a lil' easier on yourself by reading my Race Mechanic Creation Guide first.