RTR - Guild Promo Card Questions

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Hello all I just wanted to make sure if I was wrong about which guild promo cards are which.  The link on the RTR page doesn't actually show you which card it is and it's hard to tell sometimes.

I believe the promo cards will be the following but please let me know if you don't agree as my eyes aren't great and having to make them out with alternate art is sometimes dificult.

Izzet - Hypersonic Dragon
Golgarri - Corpsejack Menace
Rakdos - Carnival Hellsteed
Azorius - Archon of the Triumvirate
Selesnya - Grove of the Guardian  - This ones the easiest since it's obviously a land (no mana cost or p/t)

I think this is kind of bad as I think I would rate them in the order listed and of the pics below (Izzet, Golgari, Rakdos, Azorius then Selesnya), although the last 2 are open to debate.

It just seems kind of sad as without knowing what is in your packs your prob going to choose one of the first 3 leaving the last two under played. I really would have preferred Collective Blessing for Selesnya.  As it stands I believe I will be choosing Izzet for my promo and then playing Izzet/Rakdos or Izzet/Azorius if feasible.

Hypersonic DragonCorpsejack MenaceCarnival Hellsteed
Archon of the TriumvirateGrove of the GuardianCollective Blessing

So what do you all think?  Am I right?
www.wizards.com/magic/tcg/products.aspx?...

I really believe they should take out the ability to play with the Promo.  Also ditch the Guild Booster pack as it's just going to make things lack a bit of challenge.  Only way you don't play the promo card or with the guild chosen is if you either open unblievable bombs in other guild or absolutely nothing to make your guild choice remotely playable.
I think they did a pretty decent job of balancing the promos. The Izzet one is only a Volcanic Dragon for 1 less mana, which is very good but hardly game-breaking. Its other ability will give you the opportunity to make some techy plays, but it doesn't give you card advantage or anything.

Corpsejack Menace is awesome because it works so well with the Golgari mechanic, but aside from that it's underwhelming. If you choose Golgari, you are taking a small risk because you might not open very many cards with Scavenge at all. Alternatively, you could open tons of Scavenge cards and a Lotleth Troll and just run over everyone.

Carnival Hellsteed's only saving grace is first strike. Unleash on it is only relevant if your opponent is at 6 life. In my opinion, this is the worst of the bunch because it has no evasion and no way of giving you an additional advantage.

If you get to 7 mana and play Archon of the Triumvirate and you get to attack with it, you are probably going to win. 7 mana is a lot, but as far as raw power goes, this one is better than all the rest.

Grove of the Guardian is like Corpsejack Menace. If you pull a lot of cards with Populate, you are going to end up with so many 8/8s your opponent won't have a chance of coming back unless they're playing Azorius and have Supreme Verdict. Plus this one is a land, so it doesn't take up a slot in your 23. Very strong.

I haven't chosen what guild I'm playing yet. I'm leaning toward Golgari based on the spoilers so far, the fact that BG is my favorite limited color combination, and its promo has the lowest CMC meaning I'll always be able to play it when I draw it (nothing worse than being stuck on mana with a 6 or 7-drop in your hand). I don't think it would be too hard for another guild to change my mind though. There's still a lot of cards to be spoiled.
Why is collective blessing listed? Is that the promo for playing? All of the cards are nice, but the Rakdos one feels the most underwhelming to me. I think I am going to go Selesnya after all since I am going to be making that deck and the land is at least a 2 of.
I don't think you're giving R&D nearly enough credit.

Yes, some of these are better in a vacuum than others as far as limited goes, but you have to consider that each of them plays into the strengths of their particular guild and that R&D likely considered that as well. They wouldn't have made any of these promos if they weren't certified nuts in their respective archetypes.
I think they did a pretty decent job of balancing the promos. The Izzet one is only a Volcanic Dragon for 1 less mana, which is very good but hardly game-breaking. Its other ability will give you the opportunity to make some techy plays, but it doesn't give you card advantage or anything.

Corpsejack Menace is awesome because it works so well with the Golgari mechanic, but aside from that it's underwhelming. If you choose Golgari, you are taking a small risk because you might not open very many cards with Scavenge at all. Alternatively, you could open tons of Scavenge cards and a Lotleth Troll and just run over everyone.

Carnival Hellsteed's only saving grace is first strike. Unleash on it is only relevant if your opponent is at 6 life. In my opinion, this is the worst of the bunch because it has no evasion and no way of giving you an additional advantage.

If you get to 7 mana and play Archon of the Triumvirate and you get to attack with it, you are probably going to win. 7 mana is a lot, but as far as raw power goes, this one is better than all the rest.

Grove of the Guardian is like Corpsejack Menace. If you pull a lot of cards with Populate, you are going to end up with so many 8/8s your opponent won't have a chance of coming back unless they're playing Azorius and have Supreme Verdict. Plus this one is a land, so it doesn't take up a slot in your 23. Very strong.

I haven't chosen what guild I'm playing yet. I'm leaning toward Golgari based on the spoilers so far, the fact that BG is my favorite limited color combination, and its promo has the lowest CMC meaning I'll always be able to play it when I draw it (nothing worse than being stuck on mana with a 6 or 7-drop in your hand). I don't think it would be too hard for another guild to change my mind though. There's still a lot of cards to be spoiled.




Wow. You just made me realize that carnival hellsteed didn't have flying.

I guess I was too focused on the artwork. 
Agree with Dark Avatar about assessments. Pretty much the only guild I'm not thinking of playing is Rakdos, for it's boring, complex mechanic nd less than stellar promo (plus, no 'wow' cards in it just yet). Was leaning toward Izzet and Azorious at the start, but Golgari looks pretty darn strong atm. Vraska doesn't count as a Golgari right, so she won't be available in the guild booster pack?
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75932913 wrote:
Symo: you are a snake and i don't trust you as far as i can kick you to be honest. this is primarily because of how bad you can roflstomp as mafia and keep getting away with it.
Mafia Games to Date: Scars of Mirrodin: Mafia Roleblocker/Don - Win KoS Mafia II: Town Vanilla - Win Orchard Mafia: Town Vanilla - Lost YMTC Summit of Null Moon II: Mafia - Win *I have never been lynched or NK'd in any of these games. That will probably change shortly.*
Agree with Dark Avatar about assessments. Pretty much the only guild I'm not thinking of playing is Rakdos, for it's boring, complex mechanic nd less than stellar promo (plus, no 'wow' cards in it just yet). Was leaning toward Izzet and Azorious at the start, but Golgari looks pretty darn strong atm. Vraska doesn't count as a Golgari right, so she won't be available in the guild booster pack?



No. Never. Then EVERYONE would be playing only Golgari. I assume the only rare will be the promo or a shockland with the rest being commons and uncommons that help out the guild colors.
Agree with Dark Avatar about assessments. Pretty much the only guild I'm not thinking of playing is Rakdos, for it's boring, complex mechanic nd less than stellar promo (plus, no 'wow' cards in it just yet). Was leaning toward Izzet and Azorious at the start, but Golgari looks pretty darn strong atm. Vraska doesn't count as a Golgari right, so she won't be available in the guild booster pack?



No. Never. Then EVERYONE would be playing only Golgari. I assume the only rare will be the promo or a shockland with the rest being commons and uncommons that help out the guild colors.



yeah, that makes sense. 
The Subversively Evil Yet Extraordinarily Helpful One.
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75932913 wrote:
Symo: you are a snake and i don't trust you as far as i can kick you to be honest. this is primarily because of how bad you can roflstomp as mafia and keep getting away with it.
Mafia Games to Date: Scars of Mirrodin: Mafia Roleblocker/Don - Win KoS Mafia II: Town Vanilla - Win Orchard Mafia: Town Vanilla - Lost YMTC Summit of Null Moon II: Mafia - Win *I have never been lynched or NK'd in any of these games. That will probably change shortly.*
For me, it's Izzet first choice, Golgari second, Azorius third, and probubly Rakdos fourth. I love the Izzet one (and Izzet is my favored guild in general), but alot of people might pick that. The Golgari one is pretty beast, and I already have alot of Golgari cards so it'd make a nice addition (trying to make a Commander deck with them anyway). The Azorius one is great, but a bit bland, so I made it third. The Rakdos one is horrible, but I like red/black so I put it fourth for the other cards that might come in that pack. The Selesnya one is good within its guild, but there's a risk in selecting it that I may not get enough Populate to make it matter (I also don't plan on playing them after the Prerelease), so I put it last.
Thank you Blitzschnell for the awesome banner!
I think Golgari and Izzet will be drafted totally out first. Golgari because it's easily got the best cards by a long shot, and Izzet because the casual crowd love it.

Azorius and Selesnya will be second.


Noone will draft Rakdos because it got totally shafted on card quality (every card they have is basically strictly worse than a Golgari equivalent, they only have two good cards (rare and Mythic Rare), and their mechanic is basically worse than every other Guild's because it's a drawback on already underpowered creatures, whereas Golgari, Selesnya, Azorius, and Izzet's are all upside. 
Agree with Dark Avatar about assessments. Pretty much the only guild I'm not thinking of playing is Rakdos, for it's boring, complex mechanic nd less than stellar promo (plus, no 'wow' cards in it just yet). Was leaning toward Izzet and Azorious at the start, but Golgari looks pretty darn strong atm. Vraska doesn't count as a Golgari right, so she won't be available in the guild booster pack?



No. Never. Then EVERYONE would be playing only Golgari. I assume the only rare will be the promo or a shockland with the rest being commons and uncommons that help out the guild colors.



There's no way they will be putting shocklands in every guild pack.  The guild's respective gate, absolutely.     
Agree with Dark Avatar about assessments. Pretty much the only guild I'm not thinking of playing is Rakdos, for it's boring, complex mechanic nd less than stellar promo (plus, no 'wow' cards in it just yet). Was leaning toward Izzet and Azorious at the start, but Golgari looks pretty darn strong atm. Vraska doesn't count as a Golgari right, so she won't be available in the guild booster pack?



No. Never. Then EVERYONE would be playing only Golgari. I assume the only rare will be the promo or a shockland with the rest being commons and uncommons that help out the guild colors.



There's no way they will be putting shocklands in every guild pack.  The guild's respective gate, absolutely.     



I was thinking it could have been a possible rare if they were random. I do agree that the gates are far more likely though.
Well if it's random, then of course it could be... but it would be silly to just throw em out like that.  Gates need to be in limited games tho.  They should give those out at every draft!   
Why is collective blessing listed? Is that the promo for playing? All of the cards are nice, but the Rakdos one feels the most underwhelming to me. I think I am going to go Selesnya after all since I am going to be making that deck and the land is at least a 2 of.




I put CB there as it's a card that I would prefer as the guild promo over the land.

And why do you say the lands at least a 2 of???

Also I usually do not like to put non colored lands in my deck unless my double mana curve is low or I am only playing 2 colors.  Ravnica is a set where you almost always at least splash a third color at thee least.

I remember doing a ravnica /gp/dis draft for FNM and I got one of the Nephilims out on turn 3 hehe.  (Nephilims are the 4 colored guys) I think it was Dune-Brood Nephilim .

I wonder if they will bring back Might of the Nephilim or Blessing of the Nephilim.  I remember these 2 cards being so sweet with my Boros Swiftblade

Aanyway I ranked the Hypersonic Dragon first because the ability to play Sorcery at instant speed is just to good.  Also it's a 4/4 hasted flyer for 5 mana. Also with Izzet it's easy to splash Black or White and both those get some decent Sorcery spells.  I am thinking white would be nuts with the populate which I expect to see more on sorcery over instant spells.
Why is collective blessing listed? Is that the promo for playing? All of the cards are nice, but the Rakdos one feels the most underwhelming to me. I think I am going to go Selesnya after all since I am going to be making that deck and the land is at least a 2 of.




I put CB there as it's a card that I would prefer as the guild promo over the land.

And why do you say the lands at least a 2 of???

Also I usually do not like to put non colored lands in my deck unless my double mana curve is low or I am only playing 2 colors.  Ravnica is a set where you almost always at least splash a third color at thee least.

I remember doing a ravnica /gp/dis draft for FNM and I got one of the Nephilims out on turn 3 hehe.  (Nephilims are the 4 colored guys) I think it was Dune-Brood Nephilim .

I wonder if they will bring back Might of the Nephilim or Blessing of the Nephilim.  I remember these 2 cards being so sweet with my Boros Swiftblade

Aanyway I ranked the Hypersonic Dragon first because the ability to play Sorcery at instant speed is just to good.  Also it's a 4/4 hasted flyer for 5 mana. Also with Izzet it's easy to splash Black or White and both those get some decent Sorcery spells.  I am thinking white would be nuts with the populate which I expect to see more on sorcery over instant spells.



The land is essentially giving you an 8/8 target to populate or just a defender if you need it and have enough land to continue on with the game. It is pretty versatile to me and I plan to use it every chance I get.

I agree with having a third color, but a splash of it at best. I am thinking black so I can get the guild mage, Abrupt Decay and Vraska (populating tokens that can instantly win you the game? :D).
The guild packs will be random. You can quote me on that. The last thing they want is for every Golgari player to have access to the exact same cards at the prerelease. It would basically be like giving everyone a preconstructed deck to play with. That would make for a very boring tournament.

I also think (or at least hope) that there will be another rare in the guild pack besides the promo. Otherwise we're actually getting less product for our money than we would for any other prerelease. I, for one, don't want to pay $25 for 5 packs.
I wonder if they will bring back 
Might of the Nephilim or Blessing of the Nephilim.  I remember these 2 cards being so sweet with my Boros Swiftblade


They most likely won't. They said that the nephilim were a bad idea (which I agree with) so reprinting a card that reference cards you will never reprint wouldn't make sense.
They most likely won't. They said that the nephilim were a bad idea (which I agree with) so reprinting a card that reference cards you will never reprint wouldn't make sense.



The problem was that they were too much cool. They were supposed to be four-color creatures with cool abilities. They have that, but the abilities don't justify all four colors, and the mana costs should give you more than a 3/3 at best.

Dune-Brood Nephilim might be combining the Gruul's "reward for attacking" motif with the Selesnya's love of tokens, with a cute retro reference, but what about 1/1 tokens is Rakdos, Golgari, or Orzhov? Or what is black? (Black gets 1/1 tokens, obviously but this isn't worth adding another color.)

Glint-Eye Nephilim, in the Guild Model, looks Izzet or maybe Gruul. In the standard color pie, it's all the way, though discarding a card for +1/+1 until EOT might be , especially since it feels like looting. Still no black.

Ink-Treader Nephilim is very, very with maybe a bit of . The only other card I can think of like this is Precursor Golem, which is printed much later (two card types and a new rarity later), and it's colorless. It doesn't feel very . (I would've preferred Phyrexian Unlife as a proc on this guy. I've come to think of the Nephilim as Evangelion-style angels, anyway. Their name even refers to angels.)

Witch-Maw Nephilim: Phallic nephilim should be , just for the art (and yet the rules text makes this possibly overthrow Ekundu Cyclops), yet it's . Green is the obvious one, but what's blue about it? Yeah, you could say it combos with graft, but it also fits in withChorus of the Conclave, Golgari Guildmage, and Borborygmos. I know it's supposed to go with the Izzet's card-drawing brilliant madness, but that just raises the question of why it's not ?

Yore-Tiller Nephilim: This should be . should all be present. The fact that it corresponds to the Golgari alone should make it . Maybe since "tapped and attacking". But what's about it?
139359831 wrote:
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They most likely won't. They said that the nephilim were a bad idea (which I agree with) so reprinting a card that reference cards you will never reprint wouldn't make sense.



The problem was that they were too much cool. They were supposed to be four-color creatures with cool abilities. They have that, but the abilities don't justify all four colors, and the mana costs should give you more than a 3/3 at best.

Dune-Brood Nephilim might be combining the Gruul's "reward for attacking" motif with the Selesnya's love of tokens, with a cute retro reference, but what about 1/1 tokens is Rakdos, Golgari, or Orzhov? Or what is black? (Black gets 1/1 tokens, obviously but this isn't worth adding another color.)

Glint-Eye Nephilim, in the Guild Model, looks Izzet or maybe Gruul. In the standard color pie, it's all the way, though discarding a card for +1/+1 until EOT might be , especially since it feels like looting. Still no black.

Ink-Treader Nephilim is very, very with maybe a bit of . The only other card I can think of like this is Precursor Golem, which is printed much later (two card types and a new rarity later), and it's colorless. It doesn't feel very . (I would've preferred Phyrexian Unlife as a proc on this guy. I've come to think of the Nephilim as Evangelion-style angels, anyway. Their name even refers to angels.)

Witch-Maw Nephilim: Phallic nephilim should be , just for the art (and yet the rules text makes this possibly overthrow Ekundu Cyclops), yet it's . Green is the obvious one, but what's blue about it? Yeah, you could say it combos with graft, but it also fits in withChorus of the Conclave, Golgari Guildmage, and Borborygmos. I know it's supposed to go with the Izzet's card-drawing brilliant madness, but that just raises the question of why it's not ?

Yore-Tiller Nephilim: This should be . should all be present. The fact that it corresponds to the Golgari alone should make it . Maybe since "tapped and attacking". But what's about it?




The more I think about it. The more nephilim seem like Eldrazi.
The more I think about it. The more nephilim seem like Eldrazi.



Lovecraftian either way.
139359831 wrote:
Clever deduction Watson! Maybe you can explain why Supergirl is trying to kill me.
---- Autocard is your friend. Lightning Bolt = Lightning Bolt
I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.
I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.



The nepilim were just designed as cool cards. They didn't tie in to Ravnica at all. And because of the guild system, they kind of felt odd within it. I don't think they were ever supposed to have anything to do with their casting costs.
I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.



The nepilim were just designed as cool cards. They didn't tie in to Ravnica at all. And because of the guild system, they kind of felt odd within it. I don't think they were ever supposed to have anything to do with their casting costs.


That's what I always thought too, which is why it frustrates me a little when people talk about how they don't fit into the guilds' themes.
I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.



The nepilim were just designed as cool cards. They didn't tie in to Ravnica at all. And because of the guild system, they kind of felt odd within it. I don't think they were ever supposed to have anything to do with their casting costs.


That's what I always thought too, which is why it frustrates me a little when people talk about how they don't fit into the guilds' themes.


The nephilim tie into Ravnica just fine.  They're guildless monsters roaming and eating the countryside.  Niv-Mizzet fights and kills two of them, but flies away when he starts to lose the battle.

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I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.



The nepilim were just designed as cool cards. They didn't tie in to Ravnica at all. And because of the guild system, they kind of felt odd within it. I don't think they were ever supposed to have anything to do with their casting costs.


That's what I always thought too, which is why it frustrates me a little when people talk about how they don't fit into the guilds' themes.


The nephilim tie into Ravnica just fine.  They're guildless monsters roaming and eating the countryside.  Niv-Mizzet fights and kills two of them, but flies away when he starts to lose the battle.



I don't see how that shows that they tie in to Ravnica at all. They were mentionned in the novels because they were in the set. But their presence had no impact at all on the story.......or the set.

Monsters wandering aimlessly have no more to do with Ravnica than any other plane. 
I always liked the Nephilim. They didn't do a great job of making them fit all 4 of their colors, but then again what is blue about Child of Alara? I just like the Lovecraftian monsters that overtake the cities.

In fact, if Sinker is Nephilim vs. Eldrazi (aka Godzilla vs. Mothra), I would be beyond ecstatic.



The nepilim were just designed as cool cards. They didn't tie in to Ravnica at all. And because of the guild system, they kind of felt odd within it. I don't think they were ever supposed to have anything to do with their casting costs.


That's what I always thought too, which is why it frustrates me a little when people talk about how they don't fit into the guilds' themes.


The nephilim tie into Ravnica just fine.  They're guildless monsters roaming and eating the countryside.  Niv-Mizzet fights and kills two of them, but flies away when he starts to lose the battle.



I don't see how that shows that they tie in to Ravnica at all. They were mentionned in the novels because they were in the set. But their presence had no impact at all on the story.......or the set.

Monsters wandering aimlessly have no more to do with Ravnica than any other plane. 


True, true.  I just misunderstood what you were getting at.

Rules Advisor