I'm at a loss here

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This is a question for dMs who like me refused to update to 4e and stuck with 3.5, I have pretty much run out of ideas to campain with and when i think i have one i get the typical player responce that its too hard or "your just out to kill us". I want to get my party more involved with the role play aspect of the game but all they seem to want to do is kill everything they run into. I told them that we are taking a break for a bit I've been looking through the DMG about creating my own world to spice things up, more oftin than not we play forgotten realms, but im struggleing with a diety structue. I guess i'm here to reach out if a few of us could come up with new world to play maybe our players and us could have a more enjoyable game experince. 



So far i've trashed about four diety structures i really like the idea of having a council in stead of one all powerful creator, and i really like the number eight not sure why.
I've also drawn up a few cities but thanks to children i have to redraw them agian. otherwise i don't really have much, need ideas.

thanks for reading guys hope to hear from anyone willing to help.... 
I've got one you can pilfer for ideas that I use in my own homebrew. They were designed with 4e in mind, but I'm sure that fixing it up for 3.5 isn't too big an issue.

Hope this helps. Happy Gaming

What are your major campaign focuses? Assign diety portfolios based off of that.


You generally need a diety of healing, nature, harvest, oceans, money, magic, death, war, protection, trickery, and honor. Add some sub domains, or combine them as you want. 


As an example for you here is one I made off the top of my head. 



  • God of healing and protection. She is a sheltering mother type, but also the patron of many soldiers.

  • A trickster god of the forest. He can be a satyr who is known for protecting small animals, but also children. 

  • A death god with a heavy water theme. Marniers follow him and pray for their boats not to sink, but he also travels the rivers collecting dead souls from anywhere and escorting them down the river styx.

  • A warrior priestes known for her love of money. She is the patron of all bandits and the orc hordes. 

  • An arch-mage who ascended to godhood and is renoun for establishing the rules of the wizarding order. Specifically that most wizards have a code similarly to chivalry and can challenge one another to duels.

  • The elder god who was lost in time. His seat on the gods council sits empty, and thus there is never a tie when they vote. His domain is time, and otherworldly beings pay him respects.

  • The lord of the harvest, known for his ability to seed the [nile] and allows the desert races to grow food. Farmers and desert nomads pay him respect.

  • The Justicar. A being that was not a god, but present while the other 7 created the world. It is his sacred duty to ensure laws are followed. Totally emotionless, and devoted to the word of the law. 


Back in the day, the 6 )no wizard or justicar) gods went to create the world with their powers combined. The justicar went to stop them, but they pleaded and he allowed it on the condition that Law is created and followed. This established the council of gods who make all godly decisions, and keep them from interfearing too much in the mortal world. About the time the wizard found a way to ascend, the elder god disappeared...


You've got paladins who crusade for Healing and Protection. A fairly muted forest theme in the setting, so you know this setting is probably more urban than normal. A strong maratime presence, and the campaign probably involves a few continents. Wizards who follow a strict code of action. And a desert that some raiders and nomads live in.


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Really you need to either have a setting built that needs some gods applied, or you need to break down some dieties to make your setting off that idea. You've got some cities built, can you talk about them?

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"Can't say enough how much I agree with Krusk"        "Wow, thank you very much"

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In my experience, this upfront work isn't really worth the effort unless you really enjoy it. Deities and the like don't need to be fleshed out except as needed and that's usually only when a player wants to have a character with a divine connection. So what I'd do in that case is just ask the player to tell me about their deity and what it's all about. Not only does it save you the work, but the player is more likely to be invested in the choice.

No amount of tips, tricks, or gimmicks will ever be better than simply talking directly to your fellow players to resolve your issues.
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well for the deity structure if you like having a council you could try running something like the Greek pantheon.  There's also already made structures for councils of deities if I remember right in both 3.5 and 4E.  I know you mentionned you didn't change to 4E but you could poach some stuff from that edition.  Anyway back to the pantheon idea.  Zeus, Athena, Aries, Poseidon, Hades, etc..  I'm sure you could get 8 to fit your needs.

But honestly if your players just answer with "you're just trying to kill us" at anything you throw at them maybe it's time to swap players or change who is the DM.  It sounds like they might have had enough or something.  Taking a break was a good idea, maybe they will have a more positive outlook when you get back together.
"Non nobis Domine Sed nomini tuo da gloriam" "I wish for death not because I want to die, but because I seek the war eternal"

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/19.jpg)


Really you need to either have a setting built that needs some gods applied, or you need to break down some dieties to make your setting off that idea. You've got some cities built, can you talk about them?




I just had them drawn, not much detail given to them yet, my kids got to them. I gotta redraw them yet. 

 
 Really you need to either have a setting built that needs some gods applied, or you need to break down some dieties to make your setting off that idea. You've got some cities built, can you talk about them?




I'm looking at making the leser dieties or even some of the demi gods rulers of the major cities and creating rivalries between cities.
well for the deity structure if you like having a council you could try running something like the Greek pantheon.  There's also already made structures for councils of deities if I remember right in both 3.5 and 4E.  I know you mentionned you didn't change to 4E but you could poach some stuff from that edition.  Anyway back to the pantheon idea.  Zeus, Athena, Aries, Poseidon, Hades, etc..  I'm sure you could get 8 to fit your needs.

But honestly if your players just answer with "you're just trying to kill us" at anything you throw at them maybe it's time to swap players or change who is the DM.  It sounds like they might have had enough or something.  Taking a break was a good idea, maybe they will have a more positive outlook when you get back together.




Yep, my thoughts exactly but when we get back to it i'd like to have something totaly different that they're not used too. 

I'll have to get my dieties and demi gods out again to look over the greek pantheon i more or less just skiped that portion i didn't really have any interest in playing them in a dnd setting.  
Yep, my thoughts exactly but when we get back to it i'd like to have something totaly different that they're not used too. 



Just talking out loud here - what happens if you do all that work and get the same result from your players? Or find they're not interested in any of your content?

No amount of tips, tricks, or gimmicks will ever be better than simply talking directly to your fellow players to resolve your issues.
DMs: Don't Prep the Plot | Structure First, Story Last | Prep Tips | Spoilers Don't Spoil Anything | No Myth Roleplaying
Players: 11 Ways to Be a Better Roleplayer | You Are Not Your Character     Hilarious D&D Actual Play Podcast: Crit Juice!

Here, Have Some Free Material From Me: Encounters With Alternate Goals  |  Dark Sun Full-Contact Futbol   |   Pre-Generated D&D 5e PCs

Follow me on Twitter: @is3rith

Then i destroy them...
Then i destroy them...



+1. Awesome.

No amount of tips, tricks, or gimmicks will ever be better than simply talking directly to your fellow players to resolve your issues.
DMs: Don't Prep the Plot | Structure First, Story Last | Prep Tips | Spoilers Don't Spoil Anything | No Myth Roleplaying
Players: 11 Ways to Be a Better Roleplayer | You Are Not Your Character     Hilarious D&D Actual Play Podcast: Crit Juice!

Here, Have Some Free Material From Me: Encounters With Alternate Goals  |  Dark Sun Full-Contact Futbol   |   Pre-Generated D&D 5e PCs

Follow me on Twitter: @is3rith

LOL ! +2
"Non nobis Domine Sed nomini tuo da gloriam" "I wish for death not because I want to die, but because I seek the war eternal"

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/19.jpg)

lol yeah, i'll lose it if i go to all this work and they still wine about it.
This is a question for dMs who like me refused to update to 4e and stuck with 3.5, I have pretty much run out of ideas to campain with and when i think i have one i get the typical player responce that its too hard or "your just out to kill us". I want to get my party more involved with the role play aspect of the game but all they seem to want to do is kill everything they run into. I told them that we are taking a break for a bit I've been looking through the DMG about creating my own world to spice things up, more oftin than not we play forgotten realms, but im struggleing with a diety structue. I guess i'm here to reach out if a few of us could come up with new world to play maybe our players and us could have a more enjoyable game experince. 



So far i've trashed about four diety structures i really like the idea of having a council in stead of one all powerful creator, and i really like the number eight not sure why.
I've also drawn up a few cities but thanks to children i have to redraw them agian. otherwise i don't really have much, need ideas.

thanks for reading guys hope to hear from anyone willing to help.... 




I kind of fit that description, as I've never had a chance to get around to trying 4E.

But, why write the 4th Edition folks out of the equation?  I get cool ideas from them every time I visit this forum.  I don't think great campaign ideas, or great DMs, can ever really be limited to any particular edition or game system.

If you're up for something published for 3.5, you might be interested in checking out Paizo's various Pathfinder Adventure Paths - I've never tried any of them, but I can't recall that I've ever heard anything particularly bad about them, and the folks who have tried them seem to be quite enthusiastic about them.

One of the forums on this site is a "Homebrew Campaign" workshop, where DMs would come up with campaign ideas, tinker around with them for a while, and then apparently abandon them.  Some were dreadful, but from time to time something really exciting and original would be suggested, and, whether the idea was awesome or forgettable, there would typically be a lot of great responses from some very creative DMs that expanded on the idea in unique and interesting ways.  You might try looking around in there to see if you can find one of the gems, and finish developing it... I figure that if you can't find some inspiration for a new campaign there, I have no idea where you'd find it.
[spoiler New DM Tips]
  • Trying to solve out-of-game problems (like cheating, bad attitudes, or poor sportsmanship) with in-game solutions will almost always result in failure, and will probably make matters worse.
  • Gun Safety Rule #5: Never point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy. (Never introduce a character, PC, NPC, Villain, or fate of the world into even the possibility of a deadly combat or other dangerous situation, unless you are prepared to destroy it instantly and completely forever.)
  • Know your group's character sheets, and check them over carefully. You don't want surprises, but, more importantly, they are a gold mine of ideas!
  • "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." It's a problem if the players aren't having fun and it interferes with a DM's ability to run the game effectively; if it's not a problem, 'fixing' at best does little to help, and at worst causes problems that didn't exist before.
  • "Hulk Smash" characters are a bad match for open-ended exploration in crowds of civilians; get them out of civilization where they can break things and kill monsters in peace.
  • Success is not necessarily the same thing as killing an opponent. Failure is not necessarily the same thing as dying.
  • Failure is always an option. And it's a fine option, too, as long as failure is interesting, entertaining, and fun!
[/spoiler] The New DM's Group Horror in RPGs "This is exactly what the Leprechauns want you to believe!" - Merb101 "Broken or not, unbalanced or not, if something seems to be preventing the game from being enjoyable, something has to give: either that thing, or other aspects of the game, or your idea of what's enjoyable." - Centauri
that's right, us 4E playing fools have good ideas !!!  ...  Sometimes :p
"Non nobis Domine Sed nomini tuo da gloriam" "I wish for death not because I want to die, but because I seek the war eternal"

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/19.jpg)

When I was playing a Thri-kreen, I found a pdf online with an excellent 2nd edition book about that race. Not all of what was in there translated well to 4th edition, but most did. I talked to the DM and we even kept the bit about Elves tasting delicious to them.
Pick a pantheon.  Any pantheon.  Rename them all.  Re-do the fluff associated with them.  E.g. you pick Norse gods.  Odin is now named Lek-Chi, the Great.  He rides a dragon named Moonrider.  He has two pet lions named Tooth and Nail.  His weapon is a ray of incinerating light that springs from his eyes.  Thor is now named... Rubidoux, the Stormbringer.  He uses... a great scythe which slices open the sky when he fights with it and lets lightning leak out.  It is said that one day he will use it to cut down the great Tree of Entropy which is slowly eating the world.  Etc.

You don't have to make a pantheon up entirely from scratch.  You get to excercise your creativity.  Your players might not even recognize what you're doing unless you keep looking at the Norse section of DDG when the PC's interact with the deities directly.  Make deep enough fluff changes and there may not be anything left really tying the two pantheons together.

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"Who says I can't?" "The man in the funny hat..."

  How about a drow adventure. Not a forage into the Underdark, but within it. They worship Lloth and have been tasked with clearing temples of Her lesser deities, The Web of 8.

  Each demigoddess possesses an aspect of the Spider Queen ( you could use ability traits-Str, Dex,etc. and throw in two more to make your number) and there is an item in each that is needed. Combined, it will help to crush an Illithid invasion or Dwarven assault.

  They get to kill everything they can,and you have a theme for new deities.

  Eight is also a good number for chaos based pantheon.The DMG lists several planes that have major or minor chaotic influences.You could create deities or demigods that rule those planes.

  Just spitballing, hope this helps.

Really you need to either have a setting built that needs some gods applied, or you need to break down some dieties to make your setting off that idea. You've got some cities built, can you talk about them?




I just had them drawn, not much detail given to them yet, my kids got to them. I gotta redraw them yet. 



I don't mean a physical map, but can you explain the cultures of those cities. What makes them different from one another, who lives there, and what do they enjoy doing? How about what they do for work?.

"In a way, you are worse than Krusk"                               " As usual, Krusk comments with assuredness, but lacks the clarity and awareness of what he's talking about"

"Can't say enough how much I agree with Krusk"        "Wow, thank you very much"

"Your advice is the worst"

This is a question for dMs who like me refused to update to 4e and stuck with 3.5, I have pretty much run out of ideas to campain with and when i think i have one i get the typical player responce that its too hard or "your just out to kill us".

Is it too hard? Are you just out to kill them? If so, shift your focus. If not, make them think you've shifted your focus.

The default assumption of the game is that the monsters are trying to kill the PCs, and most people believe that if this is not the set up then there's no challenge. Take whatever pantheon you make and try giving them some challenges that not only don't involve killing the characters, but also set them up for failures that are supremely interesting. Take Ulysses or Aneas: each was on the bad side of a deity, but the action those deities took was to make their victims' lives worth a couple of long and involved stories. If you stumble upon the right failure, the players might even come up with reasons to have it come about, just to see what happens. That, if you can reach it, is pure roleplaying.

[N]o difference is less easily overcome than the difference of opinion about semi-abstract questions. - L. Tolstoy