Do you play against yourself?

35 posts / 0 new
Last post
I know that a lot of people "Goldfish" when testing a deck. I don't do this. I pull out another deck that I suspect is around the same power level and play them against each other. It's kinda' hard to do, because you have to think how you would think, if you didn't know what you know about both hands... anyway, I feel like it gives me great results.

Does anybody else do this?
Show
My Decks http://community.wizards.com/vennsvaults/go/forum/viewcategory/138835/Venns_Vaults My Bronation Station http://community.wizards.com/pony My 1000th post! On Thursday 03/13/2011! Yay St. Patric's day. How to play many other Casual Magic Formats http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/29198663/?sdb=1&pg=last#521400213 Many of these were on the Magic Resources Site years ago. It was removed around the time 2HG became a sanctioned format. Purple Work Station http://community.wizards.com/purpleworkstation/go/forum/viewboard IMAGE(http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/images/2/23/Phyrexian_Loyalty.png)
ITT: people make jokes about thread title.

But seriously, I don't anymore, I found that though it's something to do, all of the fun leaves when you know what's in the other person's hand. 
Nice thread title.

I tend to do the same you do. I only goldfish right after buildind a deck if I feel like the curve is messed up or something related. Otherwise, I pick up a deck I believe has the same power level and pit them against each other. In case the deck I picked is too strong or too weak, I try again with another that that fits the power level I noticed. And so. I believe this not only gives you a better understanding of the behavior of the deck during normal play, but it also gives you a better understanding of yourself as a player, so it's a positive experience in both ways. Only problem is that when I like the new deck that I built for some reason and try to make it win no matter what. I try to avoid those situations as much as possible but hey, we are all humans (or programmed to act like them).
OMG click HERE! OMG! How to autocard and use decklist format
--->
For autocarding, write [c][/c] with the name of the card inside it. [c]Island[/c] = Island For linking a card to Gatherer without writting the name of said card for readers, use the autocard brackets together with and equal sign and right the name of the real card. Then put the message you want inside the tags, like you would do with autocarding. Like this: [c=Curse of the Cabal]Captain Never-resolves[/c] = Captain Never-resolves For using the decklist format, follow this: [deck] 4* Terramorphic Expanse 4* Evolving Wilds ... [/deck] It equals:
Real signature, Sblocked for space:
57817638 wrote:
I like storm crow because I really like crows in real life, as an animal, and the card isn't terribly stupid, but packs a good deal of nostalgia and also a chunck of the game's history. So it's perhaps one of the cards I have most affection to, but not because "lol storm crow is bad hurr hurr durr".
Listen to my SoundCloud while you read my signature. The Island, Come And See, The Landlord's Daughter, You'll Not Feel The Drowning - The Decemberists by vimschy IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/rkvR.gif)IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/L3es.gif) IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/m71H.gif)
Quotes
56747598 wrote:
57295478 wrote:
Although I do assume you deliberately refer to them (DCI) as The Grand Imperial Convocation of Evil just for the purposes of making them sound like an ancient and terrible conspiracy.
Now, now. 1994 doesn't quite qualify as "ancient".
56734518 wrote:
Oh, it's a brilliant plan. You see, Bolas was travelling through shadowmoor, causing trouble, when he saw a Wickerbough Elder with its stylin' dead scarecrow hat. Now, Bolas being Bolas took the awesome hat and he put it on his head, but even with all his titanic powers of magic he couldn't make it fit. He grabbed some more scarecrows, but then a little kithkin girl asked if he was trying to build a toupee. "BY ALL THE POWERS IN THE MULTIVERSE!" he roared, "I WILL HAVE A HAT WORTHY OF MY GLORY." and so he went through his Dark Lore of Doom (tm) looking for something he could make into a hat that would look as stylish on him as a scarecrow does on a treefolk. He thought about the Phyrexians, but they were covered in goopy oil that would make his nonexistant hair greasy. He Tried out angels for a while but they didn't sit quite right. Then, he looked under "e" (because in the Elder Draconic alphabet, "e" for Eldrazi is right next to "h" for Hat) in his Dark Lore of Doom and saw depictions of the Eldrazi, and all their forms. "THIS SHALL BE MY HAT!" he declared, poking a picture of Emrakul, "AND WITH IT I WILL USHER IN A NEW AGE OF DARKNESS -- ER, I MEAN A NEW AGE OF FASHION!" And so Nicol Bolas masterminded the release of the Eldrazi.
57864098 wrote:
Rhox War Monk just flips pancakes, and if games have told us anything, it's that food = life.
56747598 wrote:
76973988 wrote:
This thread has gotten creepy. XP
Really? Really? The last couple days have been roughly every perverse fetish imaginable, but it only got "creepy" when speculation on Mother of Runes's mob affiliation came up?
76672808 wrote:
57864098 wrote:
57531048 wrote:
Nice mana base. Not really.
Yeah, really. If my deck was going to cost $1000+, I'd at least make it good.
99812049 wrote:
I like to think up what I consider clever names for my decks, only later to be laughed at by my wife. It kills me a little on the inside, but thats what marriage is about.
56816728 wrote:
56854588 wrote:
Of course, the best use [of tolaria west] is transmuting for the real Tolaria. ;)
Absolutely. I used to loose to my buddy's Banding deck for ages, it was then that I found out about Tolaria, and I was finally able win my first game.
70246459 wrote:
WOAH wait wait wait
56957928 wrote:
You know, being shallow and jusdgmental aside, "I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
"I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates
56957928 wrote:
OH MY GOD
109874309 wrote:
The only way I'd cast this card is into a bonfire.
82032421 wrote:
The short answer is that there's no rule barring annoying people from posting, but there a rule barring us from harassing them about it.
56747598 wrote:
Browbeat is a card that is an appropriate deck choice when there's no better idea available. "No better idea available" was pretty much the running theme of Odyssey era.
56874518 wrote:
Or perhaps it was a more straightforward comment indicating a wish for you to be bitten (Perhaps repeatedly) by a small yet highly venomous arachnid.
70246459 wrote:
58280208 wrote:
You're an idiot, and I'm in no mood for silliness.
57817638 wrote:
57145078 wrote:
You just... Vektor it.
That's the answer to everything.
70246459 wrote:
58347268 wrote:
I think the problem is that you don't exist.
This would sound great out of context!
56965458 wrote:
Modern is like playing a new tournament every time : you build a deck, you win with it, don't bother keeping it. Just build another, its key pieces will get banned.
57864098 wrote:
57309598 wrote:
I specifically remember posting a thread when I was just a witty bitty noob.
You make it sound like that's still not the case.
58325628 wrote:
Rap is what happens when the c from crap is taken away.
Doug Beyer:
But sometimes it's also challenging. Because sometimes OH MY GOD, WHAT THE HELL IS THIS THING?
141434757 wrote:
Flashforward five thousand years (Click for atmosphere) :
57927608 wrote:
to paraphrase Jeff Goldblum, Vektor finds a way.
58347268 wrote:
when in rome **** AND PILLAGE
143229641 wrote:
I always find it helpful when im angry to dress up in an owl costume and rub pennies all over my body in front of a full body mirror next to the window.
Dymecoar:
Playing Magic without Blue is like sleeping without any sheets or blankets. You can do it...but why?
Omega137:
Me: "I love the moment when a control deck stabilizes. It feels so... right." Omega137: "I like the life drop part until you get there, it's the MtG variant of bungee jumping"
Zigeif777:
Just do it like Yu-Gi-Oh or monkeys: throw all the crap you got at them and hope it works or else the by-standers (or opponents) just get dirty and pissed.
57471038 wrote:
58258708 wrote:
It's true that Alpha and Beta didn't contain any cards like Tarmogoyf, Darksteel Colossus, or Platinum Angel. It just contained weak, insignificant cards like Black Lotus, Mox Sapphire, and Time Walk.
Normally it's difficult to pick up on your jokes/sarcasm. But this one's pretty much out there. Good progress. You have moved up to Humanoid. You'll be Human in no time.
91893448 wrote:
94618431 wrote:
I didn't know Samurai were known to be able to cut down whole armies...
They can when they're using lightsabers!
57129358 wrote:
97980259 wrote:
My wife brought home a baby black squirrel they found on a horse track and cared for it for a few days. We named it Grixis, but it died.
Unearth it!
70246459 wrote:
[/spoiler] And I'm on Magic Arcana. How about you? Oh, by the way, I'm also on From the Lab now. Twice, actually. And now with my own submited decklist!
Goldfishing is generally useless because I tend to play decks that have cards who's sole purpose is to interact with my opponent.
When good partners to play with are scarce, of course!
My forum good deeds. Fortunately, left unpunished:
Show
"Incidentally, everytime you post in of these (mine or anyone else's) you have really great advice." -Tigerguy786 "Thanks Stop-Whining, your suggestions have been gold." -RedRollinS "You are probably the best person who has explained a certain concept to me so far, thank you VERY much for the information, it helps me out a ton. I can't wait to play this deck and use some cards for a deck of my own. Cheers!" -SpaceLincoln "In short, you good sir, are made of win advice. And I am actually going to be taking pretty much all of it." -jeremyc13
Me building/play testing a deck:

Step 1.
Frantically go through my boxes and binders of cards, grabbing every conceivable card I might possible maybe use or need for the deck.

Step 2.
Flay all the cards onto a large table and count how many I have, writing the number on a slip of paper.  That number is usually 60/70.

Step 3.
Remove cards until I'm down to 40-43, leaving them nearby in case I change my mind.

Step 4.
Sleeve em up.

Step 5.
Goldfish for about an hour, removing and adding land/spells until I have the land/spell ratio perfected.

Step 6.
Play test against one of my own, randomly selected decks.

Most would probably skip step 6, but I know my own decks so very well that I know exactly what I would do in every situation as though I do not know what cards are in the other decks hand.  Even if I look at my hand and say, "Well, I know he has a Mana Leak in his hand, but this is what I would play if I didn't know that".

Some are unable to do that, though.  That's probably why lots of people don't.  I also like playing against my own decks because I have a variety of them. By doing this I know how my deck will react to control, aggro, burn, combo, etc.
You are Red/Blue! Copies of Tobias Andrion so far: Twenty Three!! I'm Johnny/Spike. I want to win, but I want to win with fun and awesome deck ideas and/or great card combos.
Goldfishing is generally useless because I tend to play decks that have cards who's sole purpose is to interact with my opponent.

I'm the same way.  It's hard to goldfish when you run Oblivion Rings and Doom Blades.
You are Red/Blue! Copies of Tobias Andrion so far: Twenty Three!! I'm Johnny/Spike. I want to win, but I want to win with fun and awesome deck ideas and/or great card combos.
Goldfishing is generally useless because I tend to play decks that have cards who's sole purpose is to interact with my opponent.

I'm the same way.  It's hard to goldfish when you run Oblivion Rings and Doom Blades.


Totally, I just kinda get tired of having them in hand and kinda say " I'm sure they've played a threat by now." 
Do or do not. There is no lie.
OMG click HERE! OMG! How to autocard and use decklist format
--->
For autocarding, write [c][/c] with the name of the card inside it. [c]Island[/c] = Island For linking a card to Gatherer without writting the name of said card for readers, use the autocard brackets together with and equal sign and right the name of the real card. Then put the message you want inside the tags, like you would do with autocarding. Like this: [c=Curse of the Cabal]Captain Never-resolves[/c] = Captain Never-resolves For using the decklist format, follow this: [deck] 4* Terramorphic Expanse 4* Evolving Wilds ... [/deck] It equals:
Real signature, Sblocked for space:
57817638 wrote:
I like storm crow because I really like crows in real life, as an animal, and the card isn't terribly stupid, but packs a good deal of nostalgia and also a chunck of the game's history. So it's perhaps one of the cards I have most affection to, but not because "lol storm crow is bad hurr hurr durr".
Listen to my SoundCloud while you read my signature. The Island, Come And See, The Landlord's Daughter, You'll Not Feel The Drowning - The Decemberists by vimschy IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/rkvR.gif)IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/L3es.gif) IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/m71H.gif)
Quotes
56747598 wrote:
57295478 wrote:
Although I do assume you deliberately refer to them (DCI) as The Grand Imperial Convocation of Evil just for the purposes of making them sound like an ancient and terrible conspiracy.
Now, now. 1994 doesn't quite qualify as "ancient".
56734518 wrote:
Oh, it's a brilliant plan. You see, Bolas was travelling through shadowmoor, causing trouble, when he saw a Wickerbough Elder with its stylin' dead scarecrow hat. Now, Bolas being Bolas took the awesome hat and he put it on his head, but even with all his titanic powers of magic he couldn't make it fit. He grabbed some more scarecrows, but then a little kithkin girl asked if he was trying to build a toupee. "BY ALL THE POWERS IN THE MULTIVERSE!" he roared, "I WILL HAVE A HAT WORTHY OF MY GLORY." and so he went through his Dark Lore of Doom (tm) looking for something he could make into a hat that would look as stylish on him as a scarecrow does on a treefolk. He thought about the Phyrexians, but they were covered in goopy oil that would make his nonexistant hair greasy. He Tried out angels for a while but they didn't sit quite right. Then, he looked under "e" (because in the Elder Draconic alphabet, "e" for Eldrazi is right next to "h" for Hat) in his Dark Lore of Doom and saw depictions of the Eldrazi, and all their forms. "THIS SHALL BE MY HAT!" he declared, poking a picture of Emrakul, "AND WITH IT I WILL USHER IN A NEW AGE OF DARKNESS -- ER, I MEAN A NEW AGE OF FASHION!" And so Nicol Bolas masterminded the release of the Eldrazi.
57864098 wrote:
Rhox War Monk just flips pancakes, and if games have told us anything, it's that food = life.
56747598 wrote:
76973988 wrote:
This thread has gotten creepy. XP
Really? Really? The last couple days have been roughly every perverse fetish imaginable, but it only got "creepy" when speculation on Mother of Runes's mob affiliation came up?
76672808 wrote:
57864098 wrote:
57531048 wrote:
Nice mana base. Not really.
Yeah, really. If my deck was going to cost $1000+, I'd at least make it good.
99812049 wrote:
I like to think up what I consider clever names for my decks, only later to be laughed at by my wife. It kills me a little on the inside, but thats what marriage is about.
56816728 wrote:
56854588 wrote:
Of course, the best use [of tolaria west] is transmuting for the real Tolaria. ;)
Absolutely. I used to loose to my buddy's Banding deck for ages, it was then that I found out about Tolaria, and I was finally able win my first game.
70246459 wrote:
WOAH wait wait wait
56957928 wrote:
You know, being shallow and jusdgmental aside, "I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
"I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates
56957928 wrote:
OH MY GOD
109874309 wrote:
The only way I'd cast this card is into a bonfire.
82032421 wrote:
The short answer is that there's no rule barring annoying people from posting, but there a rule barring us from harassing them about it.
56747598 wrote:
Browbeat is a card that is an appropriate deck choice when there's no better idea available. "No better idea available" was pretty much the running theme of Odyssey era.
56874518 wrote:
Or perhaps it was a more straightforward comment indicating a wish for you to be bitten (Perhaps repeatedly) by a small yet highly venomous arachnid.
70246459 wrote:
58280208 wrote:
You're an idiot, and I'm in no mood for silliness.
57817638 wrote:
57145078 wrote:
You just... Vektor it.
That's the answer to everything.
70246459 wrote:
58347268 wrote:
I think the problem is that you don't exist.
This would sound great out of context!
56965458 wrote:
Modern is like playing a new tournament every time : you build a deck, you win with it, don't bother keeping it. Just build another, its key pieces will get banned.
57864098 wrote:
57309598 wrote:
I specifically remember posting a thread when I was just a witty bitty noob.
You make it sound like that's still not the case.
58325628 wrote:
Rap is what happens when the c from crap is taken away.
Doug Beyer:
But sometimes it's also challenging. Because sometimes OH MY GOD, WHAT THE HELL IS THIS THING?
141434757 wrote:
Flashforward five thousand years (Click for atmosphere) :
57927608 wrote:
to paraphrase Jeff Goldblum, Vektor finds a way.
58347268 wrote:
when in rome **** AND PILLAGE
143229641 wrote:
I always find it helpful when im angry to dress up in an owl costume and rub pennies all over my body in front of a full body mirror next to the window.
Dymecoar:
Playing Magic without Blue is like sleeping without any sheets or blankets. You can do it...but why?
Omega137:
Me: "I love the moment when a control deck stabilizes. It feels so... right." Omega137: "I like the life drop part until you get there, it's the MtG variant of bungee jumping"
Zigeif777:
Just do it like Yu-Gi-Oh or monkeys: throw all the crap you got at them and hope it works or else the by-standers (or opponents) just get dirty and pissed.
57471038 wrote:
58258708 wrote:
It's true that Alpha and Beta didn't contain any cards like Tarmogoyf, Darksteel Colossus, or Platinum Angel. It just contained weak, insignificant cards like Black Lotus, Mox Sapphire, and Time Walk.
Normally it's difficult to pick up on your jokes/sarcasm. But this one's pretty much out there. Good progress. You have moved up to Humanoid. You'll be Human in no time.
91893448 wrote:
94618431 wrote:
I didn't know Samurai were known to be able to cut down whole armies...
They can when they're using lightsabers!
57129358 wrote:
97980259 wrote:
My wife brought home a baby black squirrel they found on a horse track and cared for it for a few days. We named it Grixis, but it died.
Unearth it!
70246459 wrote:
[/spoiler] And I'm on Magic Arcana. How about you? Oh, by the way, I'm also on From the Lab now. Twice, actually. And now with my own submited decklist!
Why yes I do. I also test decks I make against other ones I have.

On a more serious note, when I am makin a new deck I will play myself, so I can get a feel for how it runs, and to see how it deals with whatever I have. I might also borrow my brother's deck, to play against.
No, I have other people to do that for me.

Be my opponent, that is.  
Always right, 102% of the time.
I usually play a few dozen games agaisnt different decks I own to fine tune the decks that I've just built/am building. This allow me to arrive with more competitive decks for my casual group, because my casual group is hardly casual, there's some very strong decks in there, we dont play vintange turn 1 decks, but there's some available.

As for being impartial vs partial. Just play the hand you have when you have it in front of you and tell yourself what you'd do with that hand, never think about the other hand. I know I'd play a turn 3 master transmuter if I had one, even if I know that in the other deck there's a path to exile. I always ask myself if the turn 4 would be improved by the turn 3 move and simply do it if the answer is yes
I love trolls Dont hate me because I'm blunt and you cannot handle it
I feel your pain, have been gotten (more than once o_0) for talking about doing me vs me matches using those exact words o_0.

But yes, I do play my decks against each other, usually to test new ones but sometimes if I'm bored. It's not an entirely accurate assesment of my decks values, as I tend to favor aggor more heavily than the rest of my playgroup, but it helps me iron out mana curve and find weaknesses.
Thank you Blitzschnell for the awesome banner!
Yes.
Level 2 Magic Judge Lite a man a fire, warm him for a day. Light a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Forgive my ignorance, what is "goldfishing"?

EDIT: Nevermind, I found it.
First, Yes, I gave the thread its name for the lols.

Second, Wow, a lot of you play with yourselves a lot more than I do. Normally I play with it about twice... once with a faster, more aggressive deck. Then with a slower more controling deck. I don't play against combo, modrange or aggro-conrol for testing.

@Vector: That is really hard! I want to win every time, but that's unfair to my other deck. I tell myself things like, "I don't know that I have that." Or "The deck is supposed to do ___. So I should save this for A, B, or C." It's a little frustrating, but gives me the best results.

@Sanctuarykitten: You play with people ALL THE TIME!? Don't they ever get tired of it? Or do you? Okay, bad jokes, semi-sarcastic hyperbole and all aside, I dig your post.

@MagicPablo666: That was fantastic! I laughed at it more than any other joke here.
Show
My Decks http://community.wizards.com/vennsvaults/go/forum/viewcategory/138835/Venns_Vaults My Bronation Station http://community.wizards.com/pony My 1000th post! On Thursday 03/13/2011! Yay St. Patric's day. How to play many other Casual Magic Formats http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/29198663/?sdb=1&pg=last#521400213 Many of these were on the Magic Resources Site years ago. It was removed around the time 2HG became a sanctioned format. Purple Work Station http://community.wizards.com/purpleworkstation/go/forum/viewboard IMAGE(http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/images/2/23/Phyrexian_Loyalty.png)
Yeah, but it becomes so predictable that I have a hard time lasting the best of three. Usually when I beat my own deck any repetition would just yield the same results. Then I tend to switch to a new and fresh experience, or until I've beaten all my decks, that is.
Show
Obligatory and Preliminary Smiley Reservoir: IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/Wee.png)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/Dancing%20AIM.gif)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/rawr.gif)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/ghgh.png)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/%5D%5D.gif)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/luv.gif)IMAGE(http://rsescape.net/forum/Smileys/RSE%20emotes/circle.png)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/sly.png)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/turtle.gif)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/jade.png)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/proud.gif)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/wilson.gif)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/pcXQL.gif)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/blushing.png)IMAGE(http://www.the-gladiatorz.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/proud.png)
Read thread title, came in to read Magic General at its finest, was not disappointed.
A++, would read again.
(RPJesus's now-overdue witty response will push this to A+++)

I... think I actually goldfish every single deck I build nowadays... even if it's just online before I have the actual physical pieces for it (TappedOut.net's goldfisher is freaking awesome).
~ Guides I Have Been Silly Enough To Write ~
Budget Duals and Fetches in Multiplayer
CadaverousBl00m's Guide To Multiplayer Artifice
Multiplayer Tribal Format

~ Latest Multiplayer Ramblings: Appearing on my blog when I feel like it ~
Kitchen Table Pricewatch: Rise of the Eldrazi Post-Rotation
Kitchen Table Pricewatch: Worldwake Post-Rotation
Kitchen Table Pricewatch: Zendikar Post-Rotation
Previous Multiplayer Concoctions
Elemental, My Dear Watson (Rainbow Elementals)
Watch The Little Birdies! (Bird Tribal with Proliferate)
Kavu Kavu Kavu Banana (Kavu Predator aggro)
Faerie Bleeder (The "Death By A Thousand Cuts" Faerie deck)
Braaiiins! (Mono-black Zombie control)
Verhexterring (Jinxed Ring / Grave Pact)
Flourishing Blowflies ( -1/-1 Counters)
Goldfishing is generally useless because I tend to play decks that have cards who's sole purpose is to interact with my opponent.

I'm the same way.  It's hard to goldfish when you run Oblivion Rings and Doom Blades.


Totally, I just kinda get tired of having them in hand and kinda say " I'm sure they've played a threat by now." 

Right.  I usually play them as soon as I get them, unless I feel it's been too early for there to be a target.  Although, sometimes I have 3 dice to keep track of their life, how many spells I have casted, and what turn it is.
You are Red/Blue! Copies of Tobias Andrion so far: Twenty Three!! I'm Johnny/Spike. I want to win, but I want to win with fun and awesome deck ideas and/or great card combos.
AVHer: That's a really good idea.  I think I'll do that the next time that I run through a deck, and don't want to spend the time playing against myself.

That's another issue I have... It takes too long! By the end I'm hardly even enjoying it anymore, and I just want to get it done and over with. Does anybody else have that problem?
Show
My Decks http://community.wizards.com/vennsvaults/go/forum/viewcategory/138835/Venns_Vaults My Bronation Station http://community.wizards.com/pony My 1000th post! On Thursday 03/13/2011! Yay St. Patric's day. How to play many other Casual Magic Formats http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/29198663/?sdb=1&pg=last#521400213 Many of these were on the Magic Resources Site years ago. It was removed around the time 2HG became a sanctioned format. Purple Work Station http://community.wizards.com/purpleworkstation/go/forum/viewboard IMAGE(http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/images/2/23/Phyrexian_Loyalty.png)
That used to happen to me, but I learned not to shy away from trying a new, more dynamic hand if your starter is feeling a little lacking, and starting off on the right leg keeps everything curving out nicely and is much more interesting. 
My forum good deeds. Fortunately, left unpunished:
Show
"Incidentally, everytime you post in of these (mine or anyone else's) you have really great advice." -Tigerguy786 "Thanks Stop-Whining, your suggestions have been gold." -RedRollinS "You are probably the best person who has explained a certain concept to me so far, thank you VERY much for the information, it helps me out a ton. I can't wait to play this deck and use some cards for a deck of my own. Cheers!" -SpaceLincoln "In short, you good sir, are made of win advice. And I am actually going to be taking pretty much all of it." -jeremyc13
Another thing I like to do is put myself on a turn counter and see how many turns it takes to deal 20 damage, and take note of how many answers and to what those are answers to in that time.
Hey folks,

I helpfully changed the thread title so now you can stay on topic


Monica

ETA: I also removed some inappropriate content. Code of Conduct in case anyone needs a refresher.

Monica

Wizards of the Coast Online Community Coordinator

A friendly dragon.

Getting to Know Your Magic Online Client

Basic Dungeons & Dragons FREE

I have probably played more hours against myself than I have against other people at this point, mainly because I've lacked opponents and opportunities to play. This is slowly improving.

I learned to play about 3.5 years ago now, by a coworker who'd stopped collecting and actively playing after graduating from school and moving. He'd kept his collection and encouraged me to learn so he could start playing again. He never had any interest in playing competitively, and never looked into what the local MTG scene was like, FNMs, etc. So I didn't know much about it either; I just played him. Eventually I got tired of playing his own decks against him and after trying to build some decent ones with his leftovers I gave up on that and started my own collection.

Having no one to test my decks against but him, naturally I started playing against myself, and it became a regular habit and a part of my deckbuilding process.

Now that I've explored the local MTG scene, and my 12 year old son is learning how to play, I have more opponents and opportunities for playing than I used to, but I still enjoy playing against myself fairly often. EDH has become my favorite way to play, and with 12 personal decks currently in circulation, I'll sometimes set up massive 6-deck EDH games where I run each deck. These usually take about 3 hours to complete, sometimes over the course of more than one day. But given the chance I'd always rather play with other people. 
There's no point in playing against yourself. Knowing the contents of both players hands totally ruins your perception of the game.
Personally, I'm very dubious about the value of such an experiment.

Magic is a game of hidden information. You don't know the exact details of your opponent's deck, you don't know what cards they currently have in their hand, and you don't know the contents of their mind (what they're thinking, what they think you're thinking, what they think you think they're thinking, etc.). If you're playing both sides, you have all of this information, and it's very difficult to properly act as though you didn't. If side A has a combat trick, side B shouldn't play around the trick and shouldn't just blindly rush into it. Instead, you'd have to think about whether side B would likely guess that there would be that combat trick and then play that way.

It's also difficult to stay objective. Half the time, you'd be trying your very hardest to ensure that side A wins. However, as soon as you pass priority, you'd have to completely reverse your values and do your best to make side A lose. It's very easy to just "accidentally" misplay in such a way that one deck is favored. For example, you could just happen to be tapped out or out of removeal just as your new deck's combo gets going. It doesn't have to be anything blatant, and each of your decisions could have been justified at the time, but you could still end up subtly favoring one side over the other. That makes it difficult to actually get objective data about the new deck's performance, since you could just end up finding what you want to be true instead of what actually is.

Also, no matter what you do or how well you play, you'll always lose with at least one side.  And every little action that benefits you in some way also hurts you in some way as the other side.  That could make it very easy to get demotivated and to stop having fun.  And if you lose your focus and start getting sloppy, there's really not much point in it.
I do it all the time! I mainly do it until white stuff comes out......... as I run a green-white deck. ;D
Honestly, I've found the results of self-tested decks to be shoddy at best. When I want to practice, but nobody is around, I spectate because analyzing the gamestate without perfect information is often more condusive to building my understanding of the game than making optimal plays against myself, when I lack the second persona to separate the information.  Playing against yourself unfortunately puts you into a very auto-pilot methodology that is very easy to exploit in a real game, as most games do not consist of "right" and "wrong" choices, but a variance in choice values, which both players have part in.
IMAGE(http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af108/acatan/sigwynzermancopy.png) Signature by IMAGE(http://www.poke-amph.com/heartgoldsoulsilver/sprites/258.png)
I do it, mostly to see how I could play out my actions and to how I could make my plays better.

In a real game if they leave mana open they ether got removal of any type or don't have anything to play.
Playing like the op talks about yes you know what the other hand is so you can analyze how you could play around there removal suit. I actually have done it a lot before AVR came out cause I want to see what and how I could recover against a control deck. Turn's out I was playing the control deck.
Decks I play
Show
Legacy TezzFinityLegacy BurnModern Infect(need to break it) T2-dead
[sblock]
57307308 wrote:
Yes, but DOES HE PEE COLOURLESS MANA?
144543765 wrote:
144018173 wrote:
Serra Angel Serra Sphinx Serra Spider Though Vigilance is a poor fit for red, so I'm not sure if we'll ever see Serra Dragon. I could see Serra Demon, though.
Black Serra creature would have vigilance and fear. It would basically be Batman.
[//sblock]
I goldfish in aggro and combo decks, before actual playtesting with my friends.
139359831 wrote:
Clever deduction Watson! Maybe you can explain why Supergirl is trying to kill me.
---- Autocard is your friend. Lightning Bolt = Lightning Bolt
Funny, here i thought i was the only one who did that. lol!

@Grishny : i'm stuck like your situation, i have a few friends who play but we tend to not have too much time to play. Also we don't have anywhere locally that has FNM or a card shop, so i test out my decks on my own until i can play with my friends.

Playtesting should be done before you break out a deck for friends...as others have said it's pretty easy to do.


 


Here is a good article that gives you options beyond just Goldfishing: 


www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.a...

141434757 wrote:
Thread is so legit it's unbelievable, lol. Though I'm interested in knowing what gain there is to fish here. No, foreign prince, I will not invest in your grand profitable banking corporation.
THEGREATJMAN:

I actually created the same sort of tests.

Originally I started out with choosing a level and rolling a dice:

1: Destroy (level) of the lands you need the most.
2: Destroy (level) of the artifacts you need the most.
3: Destroy (level) of the enchantments you need the most.
4: Destroy (level) of the creatures you need the most.
5: Your opponent drains (level) of your life.
6: Your opponent deals (level) damage to you.

After that point millstone was released and milling became a valid strategy. People I discussed the method with had lots of exceptions to this sort of tests so I moved on to something more refined.

I would create two piles of cards, each with a card that sort of reflected some aspect of the game, and when two cards were put together you had a test. The goal would be to beat as many different combinations of cards.

Both cards would start in play.

Cards could be something like this:

SUPERMAN:

Your opponent starts the game with a 10/10 red and blue flying creature with pro red and pro blue.

Or:

BOLTPLAYER:

During each of your opponents turns roll a dice:
1-2 he plays one lightning bolt.
3-4 he plays two lightning bolts.
5-6 he plays nothing.
Opponent will target your largest creatures first if it will kill them.

Making the cards up is almost as fun as playing against them

It takes some really good decks to take all of the cards you can invent, but it is not necessary to stay overly realistic when creating them, because the harder they are to beat, the better your deck will have to be in itself!


THEGREATJMAN:

I actually created the same sort of tests.

Originally I started out with choosing a level and rolling a dice:

1: Destroy (level) of the lands you need the most.
2: Destroy (level) of the artifacts you need the most.
3: Destroy (level) of the enchantments you need the most.
4: Destroy (level) of the creatures you need the most.
5: Your opponent drains (level) of your life.
6: Your opponent deals (level) damage to you.







Not bad, I think those are pretty similar to the "Dog" test they talk about in the link I provided.  Seems to me Goldfishing is not really a worthy test of anything but an aggro deck.  I prefer combo/stall decks that interact with my opponent, so obviously it might take me a longer time to beatdown a Goldfish. 
141434757 wrote:
Thread is so legit it's unbelievable, lol. Though I'm interested in knowing what gain there is to fish here. No, foreign prince, I will not invest in your grand profitable banking corporation.
THEGREATJMAN:

It's more a mix of all of it

The best way to do it is to make the cards as close to real threats out there, and then exagerate the abilities a bit, and then try out the different combinations between them, and if your deck doesn't win you might get inspired by the way your opponent-cards combined two unexpected concepts and then you try to build a working version of that. Great fun!

For the combo deck there will be two cards that might fit:

GROWING SWARM: 1WGR
(enchantment)
This card starts in play before game begins.

During your opponent's turn put a counter on this card, then put an X/X GW snarf creature with haste onto the battlefield.

Your opponent will only attack if it controls the biggest creature and will then attack with everything.

COUNTERCARD: UU
(blue artifact)
This card starts in play before game begins.

When ever you cast a spell, roll a 6-sided dice. on a 1-4 that spell is countered by a spell with a cc of (Roll a 6-sided dice) 5-6 the spell is not countered.

The 4 cards i've displayed so far have just been created on a whim, and they can become a lot more detailed and more "natural" to the mechanics of the game, for example the card that let's your enemy play lightningbolts may instead let him start with 5 mountains in play and then he draws lightningbolt's instead of casting them, which would be a more realistic choice if you are playing for example, landdestruction or counterspells.

It's an artform to create the cards as best as possible.