UB Delver Nighthawk

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Lands X 21

Darkslick Shores x4 
Drowned Catacomb x4
Cavern of Souls x1
Island x7
Swamp x5 

Creatures x16

Delver of Secrets x4
Invisible Stalker x3
Snapcaster Mage x4
Vampire Nighthawk x4
Skinrender x1 

Artifacts x3
Runechanter's Pike x2
Sword of War and Peace x1

Spells x20

Ponder x4
Mana Leak x4
Vapor Snag x4
Thought Scour x3
Gitaxian Probe x1
Tragic Slip x2
Sign in Blood x2

Its pretty much the standard delver deck with evasive creatures and the whole Snap, Snag, Leak, Ponder core. Since pretty much all of my creatures have evasion slapping a pike on them can be pretty deady, and on a Nighthawk; well, gaining life is fun. =)

In testing i really like Sign in blood and paying 2 life to draw two cards doesnt really matter unless im losing. I also am probably going to remove the singleton Probe for a 4th Thought Scour.

Thoughts on: Duress, Dismember and more slips? 

Also SoWap has been a little lackluster. I may just replace it with SoFaF or another Pike.

EDIT: Also, thoughts on Talrand, Sky Summoner and Gut Shot? A free kill spell and a drake seems fun.




100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I'd say drop the sword for a pike, and drop the scours for doomblade/go for the throat. Ponder should take care of keeping a hand.

Maybe also consider Talrand. Sky Summoner. He goes with the evasion by throwing out mass amounts of drakes.

Maybe even drop the slips and skinrender for Dismember.

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The biggest reason Thought Scours are here is to fule the pikes and if i add a 3rd Pike i definitely want 4 Thought Scours.

Although, i like Skinrender in the list i may drop him for a Talrand. Making drakes with this deck shouldnt be a problem unless Talrand is killed immediatly.

EDIT: Even if i mill a spell i can still Snapcaster it back if i need to. I will also test with some Dismember in the main. 
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I guess it can fuel your pikes pretty well, but I'm saying my reccomendation as a whole. If you run Talrand, then you don't want to mill your spells, you want to cast them. If you want turbo pike, then milling is totally viable.

Edit: Thought scour < Forbidden Alchemy 

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/5.jpg)

Because i have 4 Snapcasters milling spells isnt the end of the world, however, it would be bad if i milled my Talrand(s).

Forbidden Alchemy is actyually pretty interesting, ill look into it as well, plus the FNM Promo of it is really nice.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
Alright ive put together a Sideboard for my current list.

Total 15

Negate x3
Surgical Extraction x2
Nihil Spellbomb x2
Phantasmal Image x2
Tragic Slip x1
Dismember x2
Despise x2
Duress x1 
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
Im kinda leaning towards SoFaF over War and Peace at this point. Does anyone else have thoughts about the swords or my 75 in general?
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
This deck in a lot of ways feels similar to the UW version.  Nighthawk with a Pike on it seems really good.  While you'd be losing a cantrip if you take out the Thought Scours, could Nephalia Drownyard work in its place? Maybe up the Probes to offset?
This deck in a lot of ways feels similar to the UW version.  Nighthawk with a Pike on it seems really good.  While you'd be losing a cantrip if you take out the Thought Scours, could Nephalia Drownyard work in its place? Maybe up the Probes to offset?



Yes, the deck is basically the core of UW Delver, but i am running black Nighthawk instead of GoST and some kill spells and Sign in Blood.

Nephalia drownyard does esentially the same thing as Thought Scour but the biggest difference is that Thought Scour is 1cmc. With Thought Scour i am essentially milling 3 cards, Scour + 2 off the top and i can pump my Pike boost by 3 if i mill 2 spells.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
why do you run the one skinrender? i feel like taking that out you could put your land count down to 20 and have 2 extra spaces open for things? just curious

also what do you think about knight of infamy??? it seems like it could be great tech agaisnt all those white human decks and even the u/w delver being able to block GoSt all day long  
Im actually running the Skinrender just for fun, but hes actually not that bad. He comes in, kills a guy, and then i have a 3/3 beater. Although, i have been considering replacing him with Talrand.

As far as blocking GoST, anything equiped with a pike can deal with it and Vampire Nighthawk can block unequipped geist all day. Knight of infamy is good tech against white, but my creatures slots are better filled as is i feel.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
TL;DR

run dismember, its pretty really good right now 

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Why run vapor snag over a 2 cost removal spell like doom blade or go for the throat (or dismember?).
Im probably going to replace some the the Snags for Dismember or Go for the Throat.

So the changes im thinking about so far are:

-2 Vapor Snag
-1 Gitaxian Probe

+2 Dismemeber
+1 Go for the Throat/Doom blade

EDIT: Also, thoughts on splashing green for Rancor??
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12


EDIT: Also, thoughts on splashing green for Rancor??


uh.... what's there to think about?  splashing green for rancor is a bad idea

Blue is the best color ever. How do you deal?  ------------------------------  Team GFG - "gulf, foxtrot, gulf" 

 

 

I produce Dubstep and House beats:

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Best Pauper Deck in the format, not close:

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EDIT: Also, thoughts on splashing green for Rancor??


uh.... what's there to think about?  splashing green for rancor is a bad idea



Yeah thats what i thought. I just needed to hear it from someone else to convince myself out of the idea.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
So do y'all think taking out the snags for more black removal would be the better plan?
So do y'all think taking out the snags for more black removal would be the better plan?



Im testing it out and i like the 2 Dismember over 2 Snags. Why bounce it when you can kill it? Im still keeping 2 Vapor snags in the main though because they are still too good to cut completely.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
So do y'all think taking out the snags for more black removal would be the better plan?


real removal > fake removal

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I like this deck a lot.

Regarding the 2 slot on the curve, do we like Stalker, Knight of Infamy (which isnt bad), or perhaps Vault Skirge if we're handing out Pikes?

Hear me out, Skirge gets to play pretend to be Delver if you don't get one in the opening 7... plays ok 2 and carries equipment really well. He'll eat removal for sure so your opponent can race. Then you can stick a nighthawk and really run hard.

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I like this deck a lot.

Regarding the 2 slot on the curve, do we like Stalker, Knight of Infamy (which isnt bad), or perhaps Vault Skirge if we're handing out Pikes?

Hear me out, Skirge gets to play pretend to be Delver if you don't get one in the opening 7... plays ok 2 and carries equipment really well. He'll eat removal for sure so your opponent can race. Then you can stick a nighthawk and really run hard.



Thank you.

I like Stalker and i Dont like Stalker. He is really only good if i stick a pike on him, and if i cant he is just a pinger for as long as hes out in play.

I have considered Knight of Infamy, but Vault Skirge is definitely interesting. How many would you run in the main? over the stalkers?

Also, i like Skinrender better than Talrand at this point. The biggest problem with talrand is that he is killed before i even get much or any value out of him. At least Skinrender is removal on a beatstick. 
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I was consider this creature base:

4 Delver
4 Vault Skirge
4 Snapcaster
4 Nighthawk

It feels a little weird. Like Maybe 3 Snaps and a miser 4 drop would be better.

20 lands

3 Pikes

12 cantrips
5 spot removals
4 Leaks

That's the deck. 

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Alright, ive updated my list.

4 Delver of Secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
2 Invisible Stalker
2 Vault Skirge
4 Vampire Night hawk

4 Ponder
4 Thought Scour
4 Mana Leak
2 Vapor Snag
2 Sign in Blood
2 Dismember
2 Tragic Slip
1 Go for the Throat

3 Runechanter's Pike

4 Darkslick Shores
4 Drowned Catacomb
7 Island
6 Swamp

i found that 4 Vault Skirge was a little too much, same as 4 Stalkers. So, a 2-2 split of each actually works very well.

 
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
i think i'd rather just play more value creatures like ravenous rats and augur of bolas.  both carry pikes or whatever as well.

also, this deck probably wants a couple batter skulls (can't remember if the original list had them) 

Blue is the best color ever. How do you deal?  ------------------------------  Team GFG - "gulf, foxtrot, gulf" 

 

 

I produce Dubstep and House beats:

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Best Pauper Deck in the format, not close:

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/2974646#comment-49713276

 

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i think i'd rather just play more value creatures like ravenous rats and augur of bolas.  both carry pikes or whatever as well.

also, this deck probably wants a couple batter skulls (can't remember if the original list had them) 



I actually did consider batterskull for the deck. Would you run it maindecked or sb? My main concern is its cost. It is really good, but since im only running 20 lands casting it could be iffy.

100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I am really really loving Vampire Nighthawk in here. He can block most creatures if need be and even without any spells in my graveyard the first strike from the Pike just makes him better. Im happy he was reprinted.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
what do y'all think about using ravenous rats like burning forest brought up? it seems really good in this type of deck 
what do y'all think about using ravenous rats like burning forest brought up? it seems really good in this type of deck 



The discard from the rats is good and yes they can carry equipment. However, what holds me bakc from using them is that they have no evasion and my creature slots are already packed for this type of deck. Vault Skirge & Stalker have the same P/T as the rats but their evasion makes them deadly real quick when equipped. An equipped Rat can just be chump blocked all day.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
Oh okay that makes sense.

How does this deck run against most other decks? are you having any problems with anything? 
Before i updated to my current list, my biggest problems were drawing too many Invisible Stalkers and Huntmaster shenanigans. However, tweaking the creature base and adding spot removal has really helped me deal with problem creatures.

Niche had a good point about Vault Skirge. It eats removal, as does Snapcaster, but usually theyve used what removal they had currently and they had none for my Nighthawks. Then i Just go to town and stick other creatures and equip, attack, gain life, repeat.

One of the biggest probelms i forsee though, is Terminus and DoJ effects, but i run counters and Snaps, so its not the end of the world.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
very good to hear. Do you think this beats out the U/W delver version? and do you run pretty well agaisnt the reanimator decks? frites and grites?
Yes, i feel this deck would do pretty well against the UW version, and personally i like it a lot more. Allthough this is not to say that UW isnt good.

As far as the various reanimator decks go, i actually have not played against any yet. Maybe ill see one tomorrow night at FNM though. If i do see one my plan is to outrace it and use my counters. Also SB Nihil spellbombs would help a lot, plus i have dig to get to them.

EDIT: Some more info. I feel that the decks roughest matchups would probably be Zombies or RG aggro mainly because theyre very fast and usually run caverns making Mana Leak less useful in the match.

EDIT 2: Forgot to mention that SB should help a bit in those matchups. 
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I like Niche's list with Augurs over the Skirges, unless you can find a slot for Forbidden Alchemy. You really need those Pikes if you're going to go with Skirge.

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i think i'd rather just play more value creatures like ravenous rats and augur of bolas.  both carry pikes or whatever as well.

also, this deck probably wants a couple batter skulls (can't remember if the original list had them) 



I actually did consider batterskull for the deck. Would you run it maindecked or sb? My main concern is its cost. It is really good, but since im only running 20 lands casting it could be iffy.



i would bump up to like 22 lands anyways, since you should be running with a higher converted mana cost than UW delver.  batterskull, depending on the meta, probably makes sense maindeck, if only 1.  you can also run another in the board.  it just works well as a big end threat that isn't at an unreachable mana cost, but also works well when you have a bunch of random creatures you can equip to.

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I produce Dubstep and House beats:

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Best Pauper Deck in the format, not close:

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/2974646#comment-49713276

 

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In my current list 20 landsd have been sufficient, but if i do include batterskull i would want 22 lands. The only problem is that my creature and spells slots are tight as is, which would mean dropping a pike for the batterskull and 2 other cards to bring the land count up to 22.

Ive tested Augur of Bolas and hes good at slowing down aggro decks turn 2 and i get to dig through my deck.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
Lands X 21

Darkslick Shores x4 
Drowned Catacomb x4
Cavern of Souls x1
Island x7
Swamp x5 

Creatures x16

Delver of Secrets x4
Invisible Stalker x3
Snapcaster Mage x4
Vampire Nighthawk x4
Skinrender x1 

Artifacts x3
Runechanter's Pike x2
Sword of War and Peace x1

Spells x20

Ponder x4
Mana Leak x4
Vapor Snag x4
Thought Scour x3
Gitaxian Probe x1
Tragic Slip x2
Sign in Blood x2

Its pretty much the standard delver deck with evasive creatures and the whole Snap, Snag, Leak, Ponder core. Since pretty much all of my creatures have evasion slapping a pike on them can be pretty deady, and on a Nighthawk; well, gaining life is fun. =)

In testing i really like Sign in blood and paying 2 life to draw two cards doesnt really matter unless im losing. I also am probably going to remove the singleton Probe for a 4th Thought Scour.

Thoughts on: Duress, Dismember and more slips? 

Also SoWap has been a little lackluster. I may just replace it with SoFaF or another Pike.

EDIT: Also, thoughts on Talrand, Sky Summoner and Gut Shot? A free kill spell and a drake seems fun.







skinrender can be moved to the board, as it isn't universally useful enough to warrant maindeck inclusion.  you can get away with only 3 nighthawks, i'd think.  sword of war and peace isn't as a good as it once was, you can lose it or board it.  personally, i think invisible stalker is better as anything else right now, since we're in an aggro meta.  it made a lot more sense 6 months ago or whatever, but its pretty crappy now.  augur repalces it.  i like despise maindeck, duress is for the board.  dismember is good for the deck, very good.  tragic slip, to me, is lackluster.  creatures are big right now, so having a better class of removal is where its at.  i don't like vapor snag when you have black for removal.  i could maybe.... MAYBE see like 2 for the tempo they provide plus its interaction with your ETB effects. 

i would like to see nephalia drownyard as well, if only 1 of them. you can mill yourself for better snapcasters, plus it can insta-growth your pike.

i'm weary of sign in blood because of the life loss for this type of deck.  if you're running 22 lands, you can cut down on the cantrips as well.

this is a pretty full weekend for me, but if i get some free time, i'll try brewing a list, since this is a deck that is seriously on my radar for sleeper hits.

and like i said before, batterskull really helps to make all the mediocre creatures you run a lot better later in the game too.

oh, and you definitely want phantasmal images somewhere.  mimic vat as a 1-of in the board might not be terrible either.

EDIT: it might sound blasphemous, but maybe the solution is to simply remove delver.... 

Blue is the best color ever. How do you deal?  ------------------------------  Team GFG - "gulf, foxtrot, gulf" 

 

 

I produce Dubstep and House beats:

https://soundcloud.com/burning_forest

 

Best Pauper Deck in the format, not close:

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/2974646#comment-49713276

 

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Alright, so i used this deck at FNM last night and went 2-2. Heres my matchups.

Round 1 vs GR aggro win 2-1
Round 2 vs Mono black control win 2-0
Round 3 vs GR aggro loss 1-2
Round 4 vs Mono Red Goblin Burn loss 0-2

Aggro is very prevalent right now (obviously), but i feel this deck has a good matchup against it. Vampire Nighthawk is just scary even unequipped and is really good in aggro matchups. Mana Leak is still good, but with kill spells simply killing the uncounterable creatures works almost as well, depending on what it is. I actually learned that Mono red is a rougher matchup for the deck than RG aggro, mainly because they have more threats than i have answers and more answers to my threats.

Aside from some Pilot errors last night and just bad luck in G3 R3, i really like how the deck functions and i feel it has a good chance in the current meta.
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
@ Burning_Forest

Ive found that nighawk is too good to not include 4, however you do have some good points.

Dismember was just all around good. in testing and at FNM. Tragic Slip is good against decks with lots of x/1 creatures, but other than that you are right in it being lackluster. I often wished that it was just a GftT or Dismember. 

Nephalia Dronwyard seems interesting right now. I will have to test it out and see how i like it. How many would you include?

On to Sign in Blood. You are right about the life loss from it being not so good. I often found myself siding them out. They worked good in testing but not in FNM. Plus i already have plenty of card draw.

The problem with removing delver is that when he flips he really helps me get damage through early on. The biggest deterent about running him is the "is he gonna flip this time... its been 3 turns?" 
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Bumpity bump bump
100th post on 5/29/12 500th post on 8/20/12
I actually made a version of this myself and ran it last FNM and went 3-2. Here is my decklist:

Creatures: (16)
4x Snapcaster Mage
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Vault Skirge
4x Vampire Nighthawk 

Spells: (19)
4x Ponder
2x Forbidden Alchemy
4x Thought Scour
2x Go For the Throat
1x Doom Blade
2x Tragic Slip
4x Mana Leak

Artifacts: (3)
3x Runechanter's Pike

Land: (22)
4x Darkslick Shores
4x Drowned Catacomb
5x Island
6x Swamp
1x Cavern of Souls
1x Ghost Quarter
2x Evolving Wilds

Sideboard:
2x Black Sun's Zenith
1x Go For the Throat
2x Doom Blade
3x Duress
2x Dissipate
1x Rewind
2x Talrand, Sky Summoner
2x Gut Shot

I ended up losing 2-1 to B/U Zombies... super fast with killing waves to sack their own guys with a captain and messenger out, it sucked.

Lost 2-1 to G/W aggro with swords... didn't have enough removal to keep their creatures off the board, even after side. 

Won 2-0 against mono blue illusion aggro
Won 2-0 against R/G rogue(gladecover/green sun/rancor/green miracles) 
Won 2-0 against Heartless

Basically anytime I stuck a pike on a Nighthawk, it was game over.

I seem to struggle against aggro, but I literally threw this deck together a couple hours before FNM started, and the sideboard was even more last minute, obviously. I will be doing some teching today and post an updated list and comments to what changes I make.
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I like your deck. How has Forbidden Alchemy been working for you? Ive considered it but never actually tried it, yet. Youre right about sticking a pike on a Nighthawk. Its pretty much GG when that happens.

For my matchups against Zombies i like to bring in my Surgical Extractions and a Nihi Spellbomb to help deal with their recurrung creatures.

Im currently working on testing out Nepahlia Drownyard, so i will probably test out forbidden alchemy as well. 
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