05/22/2012 Serious Fun: "Pretty Little Liars"

27 posts / 0 new
Last post
This thread is for discussion of this week's Serious Fun, which goes live Tuesday morning on magicthegathering.com.
They may not be returning to Kamigawa any time soon, and all those Eurocentric do gooder's are perhaps jumping up and down in joy bathing in their shenanigans. But I'm glad to see that Kamigawa is sneaking its way into the Plane Chaser sets. I hope a couple of those cards will make it to the M13 Core set.
I need a demon ninja in my life.
Also...I hope for a return to Kamigawa someday. But I'm not holding my breath.
"Gisella always strikes first!"
I am disappointed. Why oh why isn't the new ninja a legend!? I really want a b/u ninja legend to command my ninja commander deck! Preferably one with ninjutsu that works from the command zone. I don't want some random wizard chick at the head of my ninja forces- I could have done that with the cards I already have. The ninja deck had been at the top of my "must buy" list, but now I am not so sure. With over half the cards spoiled, it makes me think the ninja of my dreams won't be in this set.
Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.
Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.


You know, that's a good point. This guy looks more like a Kamigawan ogre than an oni.

IMAGE(http://steamsignature.com/status/default/76561197995631463.png) No longer a commander as of 7/29/13.

Is there anything on the art that identifies it as clearly Kamigawa? Perhaps he's from another plane that has ninja's. This is Planeshift after all.


I am disappointed. Why oh why isn't the new ninja a legend!? I really want a b/u ninja legend to command my ninja commander deck! Preferably one with ninjutsu that works from the command zone. I don't want some random wizard chick at the head of my ninja forces- I could have done that with the cards I already have. The ninja deck had been at the top of my "must buy" list, but now I am not so sure. With over half the cards spoiled, it makes me think the ninja of my dreams won't be in this set.



This =(
I thought they learned from Legendary-Werewolfgate 
I am disappointed. Why oh why isn't the new ninja a legend!? I really want a b/u ninja legend to command my ninja commander deck! Preferably one with ninjutsu that works from the command zone. I don't want some random wizard chick at the head of my ninja forces- I could have done that with the cards I already have. The ninja deck had been at the top of my "must buy" list, but now I am not so sure. With over half the cards spoiled, it makes me think the ninja of my dreams won't be in this set.



Well, there really isn't a better Commander for a Ninja deck than Vela. She's absolutely nuts with it.

Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.



I came here to vent this exact problem. They really dropped the ball on this one. I can kind of accept an Oni Ninja, but it absolutely has to be a Spirit.

76125763 wrote:
Zindaras' meta is like a fossil, ancient and its secrets yet to be uncovered. Only men of yore, long dead, knew of it.

Is there anything on the art that identifies it as clearly Kamigawa? Perhaps he's from another plane that has ninja's. This is Planeshift after all.


It's an Oni. Oni is the Kamigawan name for Demon. The art also follows the general rules for Kamigawan Demons, with the three-eyed thing.
76125763 wrote:
Zindaras' meta is like a fossil, ancient and its secrets yet to be uncovered. Only men of yore, long dead, knew of it.

This =(
I thought they learned from Legendary-Werewolfgate 



We're far too close to thta event for it to have had any effect on this product, I'd imagine.
In relation to the casual deck, I like Signal Pest as a good ninjitsu target, it's cheap, colourless and normally unblockbale.  I certainly prefer it to rats here.
Silent-Blade Oni is actually similar in form to Gutwrencher Oni and Painwracker Oni.  The only issue is the lack of the sprirt creature type and the associated floating objects.

As for the lack of a legendary UB ninja, while they could have made one, Ninjutsu does not work particularly well with commanders.  The commander they did give works quite well with ninjas since it gets your creatures through and hurts your opponent every time something leaves the battlefield.  Both abilities have a very strong synergy with Ninjutsu that the general given seems perfectly fine. 
IMAGE(http://pwp.wizards.com/1205820039/Scorecards/Landscape.png)
As for the lack of a legendary UB ninja, while they could have made one, Ninjutsu does not work particularly well with commanders.  The commander they did give works quite well with ninjas since it gets your creatures through and hurts your opponent every time something leaves the battlefield.  Both abilities have a very strong synergy with Ninjutsu that the general given seems perfectly fine. 



It's a flavor vs function thing.
So... It's a Mindleech Mass. Only it's a ninja. Yay.

Also, I can't get over how silly the art is. Can you imagine that poor guy trying to sneak into a guarded building?

"Hey Ken, what's that giant thing tip-toeing towards us?"

"I'm stealthy! You can't see me!"

"I don't know. I think it's some sort of ogre. Maybe one of Hidetsugu's?"

"Hahaha! I am invisible! I will now sneak past you and play your Gray Ogres!"
I really liked Ninjas.  So I'm happy to see another ninja printed, even if it is only playable in casual theme decks.  The mechanic was fun.  I also like that the guy is both Blue and Black. 

I also would love to see a return to Kamigawa.  I loved the books and the first two sets of Champions and Betrayers.  Saviors maybe the worst set published while I've been playing MTG.  Which is a pity.

The cards in hand mechanics in Saviors were clunky and unfun. 

Kami block was fun because of all the legends, even if it was hard to remember their names it was fun. 

I know we are going to Ravnica, and its my second most favorite block since I've been playing, but Kamigawa was my first most favorite.  Hopefully, we'll get back to Kamigawa soon.
Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.



I didn't notice this first quick glance at work.  Man, that is terribly dissappointing.  I'd say errata him immediately.  This is a huge mess up for a casual card that Vorthos should be able to appreciate.
I know we are going to Ravnica, and its my second most favorite block since I've been playing, but Kamigawa was my first most favorite.  Hopefully, we'll get back to Kamigawa soon.



Highly unlikely. Also, when did you start playing? =p
Well, there really isn't a better Commander for a Ninja deck than Vela. She's absolutely nuts with it.

I'm pretty happy with Sygg, River Cutthroat as the general for my Ninja/Rogue deck.  I do wish Vela had been a rogue, though; I hate having to include wizards in the deck.  (And why is Vampire Nighthawk a Shaman?  Should clearly be a rogue or possibly an assassin.)
Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.

I didn't notice this first quick glance at work.  Man, that is terribly dissappointing.  I'd say errata him immediately.  This is a huge mess up for a casual card that Vorthos should be able to appreciate.

It's been thousands of years since the Spirit War?  Maybe the oni have evolved since then.

Regarding the survey, my guess for why Gisela, Blade of Goldnight won is that this time the angel vote wasn't split four ways.

Thanks to everyone who helped with the design of the plane of Golamo in the Great Designer Search 2!
My Decks
These are the decks I have assembled at the moment:
Tournament Decks (4)
Kicker Aggro (Invasion Block) Sunforger/Izzet Guildmage Midrange (Ravnica/Time Spiral/Xth Standard) Dragonstorm Combo (Time Spiral/Lorwyn/Xth Standard) Bant Midrange (Lorwyn/Shards/M10 Standard)
Casual Multiplayer Decks (50)
Angel Resurrection Casual Soul Sisters Sindbad's Adventures with Djinn of Wishes Sphinx-Bone Wand Buyback Morph (No Instants or Sorceries) Cabal Coffers Control Zombie Aggro Hungry, Hungry Greater Gargadon/War Elemental Flashfires/Boil/Ruination - Boom! Call of the Wild Teysa, Orzhov Scion with Twilight Drover, Sun Titan, and Hivestone Slivers Rebels Cairn Wanderer Knights Only Gold and () Spells Captain Sisay Toolbox Spellweaver Helix Combo Merfolk Wizards Izzet Guildmage/The Unspeakable Arcane Combo Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind and his Wizards Creatureless Wild Research/Reins of Power Madness Creatureless Pyromancer Ascension Anarchist Living Death Anvil of Bogardan Madness Shamen with Goblin Game/Wound Reflection Combo Mass damage Quest for Pure Flame Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle/Clear the Land with 40+ Lands Doubling Season Thallids Juniper Order Ranger Graft/Tokens Elf Archer Druids Equilibrium/Aluren Combo Experiment Kraj Combo Reap Combo False Cure/Kavu Predator Combo Savra, Queen of the Golgari Sacrifice/Dredge Elf Warriors Eight-Post Sneak Attack Where Ancients Tread Zur the Enchanter with Opal creatures Tamanoa/Kavu Predator/Collapsing Borders Esper Aggro Mishra, Artificer Prodigy and his Darksteel Reactor Theft and Control Unearth Aggro Soul's Fire Vampires Devour Tokens Phytohydra with Powerstone Minefield Treefolk Friendly? Questing Phelddagrif Slivers Dragon Arch Fun I'm probably forgetting a few...
Lulzy image
Are they going to have a planechase 2012 release event?
I am disappointed. Why oh why isn't the new ninja a legend!? I really want a b/u ninja legend to command my ninja commander deck! Preferably one with ninjutsu that works from the command zone. I don't want some random wizard chick at the head of my ninja forces- I could have done that with the cards I already have. The ninja deck had been at the top of my "must buy" list, but now I am not so sure. With over half the cards spoiled, it makes me think the ninja of my dreams won't be in this set.



Well, there really isn't a better Commander for a Ninja deck than Vela. She's absolutely nuts with it.

Either the creative department really messed up, or that guy isn't from Kamigawa. All the Kamigawan oni were kami. They had the creature type "demon spirit" and the classic floating energy orb thingies. They had the wierd aesthetic of the kami, as seen on Seizan, Perverter of Truth's giant head and Kuro, Pitlord's floating hipbone. That demon looks pretty ordinary for a kami.



I came here to vent this exact problem. They really dropped the ball on this one. I can kind of accept an Oni Ninja, but it absolutely has to be a Spirit.


Yes, Vela is good in a ninja deck, but she isn't a ninja! I am disappointed because she doesn't fit my theme. I play Ramirez de Pietro as the commander for my pirate deck, not because he works well with the other pirates, but because he fits the tribal theme. I want a ninja to command my other ninjas, not some wizard. As far as flavor goes, Vela leaves a lot to be desired for the ninja deck. 
Silent-Blade Oni is actually similar in form to Gutwrencher Oni and Painwracker Oni.  The only issue is the lack of the sprirt creature type and the associated floating objects.

As for the lack of a legendary UB ninja, while they could have made one, Ninjutsu does not work particularly well with commanders.  The commander they did give works quite well with ninjas since it gets your creatures through and hurts your opponent every time something leaves the battlefield.  Both abilities have a very strong synergy with Ninjutsu that the general given seems perfectly fine. 

The easiest fix for ninjutsu on a legendary ninja commander is to just design it with the built-in ability to bounce itself to your hand after you get it into play. This would be a very powerful effect for any ninja to be sure, making it worthy of legendary status. He would not even need a secondary ability, as the fact that he could ride in on the back of any unblocked creature at any time to deal commander damage would be amazing!
A Ninja commander could work if, instead of normal ninjutsu, it just had "[cost], Return an unblocked attacker you control to its owner's hand: Put this card onto the battlefield from the command zone tapped and attacking."
One problem with this, though, is that it bypasses the extra cost for subsequent castings, and it'd be too complicated to get the card to actually count the number of times it's been cast/ninja'd into play.

IMAGE(http://steamsignature.com/status/default/76561197995631463.png) No longer a commander as of 7/29/13.

They could just make a legend that is ninja in name only. One that doesn't have Ninjutsu in any form. Obviously this isn't ideal, but it neatly dodges all of the issues with Command Zone Ninjutsu.
IMAGE(http://images.community.wizards.com/community.wizards.com/user/blitzschnell/c6f9e416e5e0e1f0a1e5c42b0c7b3e88.jpg?v=90000)
I don't like the idea of a ninja being a General anyway. What is this, Naruto? Ninjas are about surprise; how is it surprising, that a ninja face-up in the command zone, going ninjitsu into play from an unblockable creature (unblockable because if it's not everybody would block it unquestionably), with full-information accessible to all players at all times, of what is going to happen? That's not a ninja at all. And again, more specifically, why would there be a ninja overlord? Ninjas don't have ninja masters, they have employers... people like Vela seem a whole lot more flavorfully correct to me than some demon ninja dictator.
I don't like the idea of a ninja being a General anyway. What is this, Naruto? Ninjas are about surprise; how is it surprising, that a ninja face-up in the command zone, going ninjitsu into play from an unblockable creature (unblockable because if it's not everybody would block it unquestionably), with full-information accessible to all players at all times, of what is going to happen? That's not a ninja at all. And again, more specifically, why would there be a ninja overlord? Ninjas don't have ninja masters, they have employers... people like Vela seem a whole lot more flavorfully correct to me than some demon ninja dictator.

I am not sure I agree. One of my favorite fictional ninjas (and arguably one of the most recognizable) is the Shredder from the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. He ran a giant clan of ninjas called "The Foot" as I recall, and he wasn't all that into being stealthy considering the shiny armor he wore, he was about kicking tail with cool ninja moves. Seems to fit well with the whole ninja commander theme to me.

As to the idea that people are going to always block your stuff because they know the ninja is coming, well, they have to consider the cost of blocking and what combat tricks you have. For instance, deathtouch creatures might make them decide to take the hit instead of losing a blocker.
I don't like the idea of a ninja being a General anyway. What is this, Naruto? Ninjas are about surprise; how is it surprising, that a ninja face-up in the command zone, going ninjitsu into play from an unblockable creature (unblockable because if it's not everybody would block it unquestionably), with full-information accessible to all players at all times, of what is going to happen? That's not a ninja at all. And again, more specifically, why would there be a ninja overlord? Ninjas don't have ninja masters, they have employers... people like Vela seem a whole lot more flavorfully correct to me than some demon ninja dictator.



QFT

Ninjas may work in tandem, but I really have to agree that the commander position isn't very suited for a ninja.  If we were to get a legendary ninja for that position, I think it should be low mana cost, low P/T, and efficient, without being amazing.  Something like:

UB
Legendary creature - ninja turtle
Ninjutsu 2UB

When _____ deals combat damage to a player, you may return up to X creatures you control to your hand where X is the damage that player took this turn.

_____ may be played for its Ninjutsu cost from any zone (exile, graveyard, commander, hand).

 1/4

Nothing groundbreaking.  If you put him in and he's the only creature to get through any damage, you're only returning one.  You could choose your commander, so he won't get killed.  Lots of options.
Favorite set: Arabian Nights Favorite planeswalker: Taysir, the One Made of Five Favorite book cycle: Ice Age Favorite creature type(s): Elephant (W), Minotaur (R), Shade (B), Spider (G), Cephalid (U) Myr (Artifact) Pauper: Monoblack Control Modern: Zombie Tribal; Unyaro Stax Cube: The Moons of Mirrodin
Sign In to post comments