So the Great Beast of Innistrad went into Hibernation?

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I was just curious... So let me get this straight, most of the giant creatures of Innistrad were asleep when all hell on earth broke through the doors of the four provinces?

Yeah, I'm not going to lie, the behemoth doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me...
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Yeah.
Aside from that, I don't much like the beast either. It's a bit of a no-brainer card.
Yeah, this feels like one of the Naya gargatuans should've taken that left at Albuquerque and ended up on Innistrad. Creative was able to make dumb vanilla fatties like Hollowhenge Beast to fit in. This guy just feels...off.

That won't stop me from snapping one up for my Omnath edh deck though. 
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Well, at least the wurms don't look so out of place now...
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Damn I knew it felt kinda forced with all these other creatures coming into play. Its kinda like "HAHAHA SURPRISE GUYS GODZILLA WAS HIDING FROM VAMPIRES, ZOMBIES, AND DEMONS."
Perhaps the sphinxes will come out of hiding too. Can't have a block with no sphinxes these days.
Evil doesn't always triumph. - Ajani Goldmane
The Grid must be filled.

Yes, ginormous creatures are weird on Innistrad. But not doing any ginormous creatures warps the metagame and favors certain colors. So we do our best to put them in the setting flavor-wise even though they're not necessarily a natural fit. 
I can respect that.
I guess this is just one of those natural areas where flavor and mechanics can't overlap.

You know, though, I feel like this wouldn't have stuck out so weirdly if it hadn't been one of the first previews. Kind of funny when you think about it that way. It's just an odd preview choice from a flavor perspective, although, again, it's a big splashy card from a mechanical perspective.

(Also, anyone else psyched to see Brady poking his head in more often? ;) )
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The Grid must be filled.

Yes, ginormous creatures are weird on Innistrad. But not doing any ginormous creatures warps the metagame and favors certain colors. So we do our best to put them in the setting flavor-wise even though they're not necessarily a natural fit. 



Eh, I don't blame you guys for having it show up. I can understand the pressures of needing to introduce things like dragons.

I just hate how much of a Timmy card it is. It just requires no brain to drop it and smash the other guy.
Don't get me wrong, I like some Timmy cards (Lorthos for example) but this is a big swingy dumb card.
Yes, ginormous creatures are weird on Innistrad. But not doing any ginormous creatures warps the metagame and favors certain colors. So we do our best to put them in the setting flavor-wise even though they're not necessarily a natural fit. 



I guess you could go the other way... have a werewolf pack or a swarm of bugs... or rats. Alot of threats that add up to a big creature.
… and then, the squirrels came.
>.< I don't mind at all... I just felt like the explanation of why no giant creature showed up until now were kinda forced on us.
I feel like the green fatties never quite worked, honestly. I mean, they did a pretty good job with what they had to work with, but there was something a little out of place about them.

Maybe it's just because I tend to be pretty bored with Big Monster Horror in general, though.
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I think the beasties work. They fit well with the ancient pagan theme had on Innistrad: ancient mysterious forces of nature nobody knows about. That is The Great God Pan style of terror, and to me it works much better than retarded demons and zombies.
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I've never had a problem with beef on Innistrad, but that may stem from the fact that megafauna that puts dinosaurs to shame is such a ubiqitous part of Magic's IP that its absence would disturb me.

And because my queen is always looking for more troops
My problem with him:

Not terrifying, the art actually looks passive and majestic.

It looks like a naya beast, regal and godly.

This is also a problem as a top down factor: the mechanics are obviously poinnting to a creature that leads or cause a stampede in it's wake/before it. That art doesn't give that feeling.


But the card looks fun. I love big finishes like this. And amazing in EDH (my Riku deck will just gobble this guy up). But I can see why people have problems with the mechanic.  
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Most of the Overrun type cards leave it up to the player's imagination to define what caused the stampede in the first place.

This guy is so big (and yes big things can be scary as hell--see Godzilla circa 1998) that he causes animals to run in terror creating an overwhelming stampede all by itself much like how the citizens of Manhattan reacted to a certain big fella stomping around the city. Not only that, but the larger ecosystem he happens to be in (the more creatures that happen to be in his vicinity), the more he eats, the larger he becomes and the more terror he strikes in any area he happens to be in.

Capturing the very essence of survival of the fittest and the circle of life in a neat package.

I like the card.
Most of the Overrun type cards leave it up to the player's imagination to define what caused the stampede in the first place.

This guy is so big (and yes big things can be scary as hell--see Godzilla circa 1998) that he causes animals to run in terror creating an overwhelming stampede all by itself much like how the citizens of Manhattan reacted to a certain big fella stomping around the city. Not only that, but the larger ecosystem he happens to be in (the more creatures that happen to be in his vicinity), the more he eats, the larger he becomes and the more terror he strikes in any area he happens to be in.

Capturing the very essence of survival of the fittest and the circle of life in a neat package.

I like the card.



1. I like the card too.
2. I agree with you on every point, other than Godzilla being terrifying.
3. The problem for me is the art doesn't work as part of the whole. The art doesn't show the stampede. It doesn't show a creature savagely feasting. It shows a slightly obscured majestic Naya God. I actually feel very serne looking at that art. That's the issue. The art doesn't match what the card is obviously trying to convey mechanically.
 
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1. I like the card too.
2. I agree with you on every point, other than Godzilla being terrifying.
3. The problem for me is the art doesn't work as part of the whole. The art doesn't show the stampede. It doesn't show a creature savagely feasting. It shows a slightly obscured majestic Naya God. I actually feel very serne looking at that art. That's the issue. The art doesn't match what the card is obviously trying to convey mechanically.
 



I saw Godzilla when I was a kid, and although my love of dinosaurs pretty much stymied any real terror I had of him, the concept of running from something so big that the mere act of running accomplishes nothing, is in fact very terrifying.

Yes, I agree that the art really doesn't capture any sort of depiction of a stampede, but the art is still pretty cool in my opinion. I like the fact that you don't necessarily have to go back to Naya (from a new set standpoint) to find a card that from an artistic (and mechanical as well) perspective could be a near perfect fit in a Naya themed deck if you chose to include it (compared to other cards that sort of make me cringe when I shove them in a themed deck such as Student of Warfare in my Selesnya themed deck--the Zendikons make it a very jarring inclusion). Although the trees in the art do seem to be uncharacteristic of the trees found in the Naya Jungle.


I saw Godzilla when I was a kid, and although my love of dinosaurs pretty much stymied any real terror I had of him, the concept of running from something so big that the mere act of running accomplishes nothing, is in fact very terrifying.

Yes, I agree that the art really doesn't capture any sort of depiction of a stampede, but the art is still pretty cool in my opinion. I like the fact that you don't necessarily have to go back to Naya (from a new set standpoint) to find a card that from an artistic (and mechanical as well) perspective could be a near perfect fit in a Naya themed deck if you chose to include it (compared to other cards that sort of make me cringe when I shove them in a themed deck such as Student of Warfare in my Selesnya themed deck--the Zendikons make it a very jarring inclusion). Although the trees in the art do seem to be uncharacteristic of the trees found in the Naya Jungle.



Oh the art is beautiful. It just isn't right for the card. 

Each part is good on it's own, but feels lacking together.

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Oh the art is beautiful. It just isn't right for the card. 

Each part is good on it's own, but feels lacking together.




I think the major issue dealt with capturing the size of this thing correctly. If you tried to show a stampede with him at the center, the most you would have caught would maybe have been his leg. Which doesn't really provide a very satisfactory image for a creature.

Just my .

Hollowhenge Scavenger
Hollowhenge Beast
Splinterfright
Boneyard Wurm
The various dragons
Essence of the Wild
Gravetiller Wurm
Kindercatch
Vorapede
Moldgraf Monstrosity

The fatties have always been there, they've just never been the focus.





I get that, I guess my only problem was that it didn't fit the Pagan theme as someone else said.
Or maybe because the way how it was presented, and having creative go "OH HEY GAIZ, You know all these creatures were kinda waiting for Avacyn to return before they could go back and do their duty as nature... Because well they were sleeping." But its just me, yah know.




Oh the art is beautiful. It just isn't right for the card. 

Each part is good on it's own, but feels lacking together.




I think the major issue dealt with capturing the size of this thing correctly. If you tried to show a stampede with him at the center, the most you would have caught would maybe have been his leg. Which doesn't really provide a very satisfactory image for a creature.

Just my .




But why does he need to be so large? We already have a 5/5 green beast that wasn't as jarringly huge. The size, from the art not the card, is what is bothering people. 

Whatever the reason: The feeling of the art doesn't fit. And for me it is a problem of aesthetically enjoying the card. If they couldn't capture that feeling with such a large creature then maybe they should have made him smaller. 
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See, Craterhoof Behemoth doesn't like zombies and vampires and werewolves. They make him sad. So he hides away. He likes angels. Because the angels are back, he is happy, and decided to come out and play.

Evil doesn't always triumph. - Ajani Goldmane
See, Craterhoof Behemoth doesn't like zombies and vampires and werewolves. They make him sad. So he hides away. He likes angels. Because the angels are back, he is happy, and decided to come out and play.





LOLOL... Ok fine I'll take that explanation anyday.
To me he more conveys the message of "I just want to eat and to be me and I know that I'm bigger than you but please I'm going out of my way and doing my best to make sure we can both be happy in this place" while some red-eyed cathar is trying to kill the shy misunderstood monster. Which is great. But not on this card

There's plenty of room to make monsters of the wild depicted as a pine forest in which all the trees are being violently torn apart right towards you, where you can see nothing but that and eyes glowing in the dark. That is also really really green, fits with the flavour, and connects with 'strad far better.
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So I'm the only one who got a sort of Cloverfield vibe huh?

well something that gargantuan feels like a trope they didn't really cover before.  it's hard to be terrified of godzilla because he's on a tiny screen (even a movie screen is tiny by comparison) but if you take a second and put yourself in the place of the people looking up at him it's creepy as hell.

Go to a really tall building, a skyscraper or something.  Walk all the way next to the wall and look straight up.  It's daunting and a little creepy. 
I don't think anyone's arguing that giant monsters aren't horror.

The problem is that they're not classical gothic horror.

Though I don't remember these same complaints about The Blob
I don't think anyone's arguing that giant monsters aren't horror.

The problem is that they're not classical gothic horror.

Though I don't remember these same complaints about The Blob



Because the blob is awesome, that's why.
This.

Same with something like The Thing--it's in its own breed of horror because it involves consumption and corruption and a perversion of nature. This is, in contrast, just nature.

But again, I find big monster horror pretty dull, so I'm definitely not the target audience here.
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I think the key here is atmosphere. While big creatures aren't really a major part of horror, most big creatures in Innistrad are given a horror vibe. They are bugs, or ghosts.

This guy looks like something from Naya.

It's like what they did with dragons. You need dragons in Innistrad, but they don't fit the gothic horror theme. So you make dragons gothic.
… and then, the squirrels came.
Creatures begin to surface that have not been seen on Innistrad before, some that had gone into hiding during the dark times, and some entirely new, forged for divine duty by Avacyn herself.




So either this giant thing hid in a cave for thousands of years with nobody finding it because it was afraid of all the werewolves and vampires out there, or Avacyn created the village destroying monster while she was bored. What seems more likely to you?

It seems worth noting that wizards seems to have abandoned the horror theme in AVR, so this doesn't reallly need to fit in with that anymore.
Creatures begin to surface that have not been seen on Innistrad before, some that had gone into hiding during the dark times, and some entirely new, forged for divine duty by Avacyn herself.




So either this giant thing hid in a cave for thousands of years with nobody finding it because it was afraid of all the werewolves and vampires out there, or Avacyn created the village destroying monster while she was bored. What seems more likely to you?

It seems worth noting that wizards seems to have abandoned the horror theme in AVR, so this doesn't reallly need to fit in with that anymore.




True... Afterall we're getting a Soratami Planeswalker.
True... Afterall we're getting a Soratami Planeswalker.



What are you talking about?!
Moon rabbits in kimonos are the stuff of nightmares! :B
It seems worth noting that wizards seems to have abandoned the horror theme in AVR, so this doesn't reallly need to fit in with that anymore.


The tone has changed, but the theme on which the setting is built is still gothic horror.
Angels saving the day may not be a common trope in gothic horror, but it can still be made to happen with the tools gothic horror has given to the plane.
Giant monsters cannot coexist with the theme, at all.
It's worth noting that Moldgraf Monstrosity is mechanically even bigger than this fellow, and it was still flavored as some horrible bug creature living in the woods that can't possibly stand more than ten feet high.
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69511863 wrote:
Sure, "the average person" might go see Transformers 3 if s/he wants a good story, but that doesn't stop people from making decent movies. Hell, they even managed to make Batman into a respectable movie. "The average" person might like American Idol or Jersey Shore, but people still made The Wire.
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I think the people who would sit down and listen to a minstrel reciting Homer, or thought that novels were art, or read poetry were always a minority. It's a common viewpoint that art was better in the past because everyone's forgotten the bad stuff, while we haven't had time to forget the awful stuff that is current.
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For almost all Magic fans, the "story" of Ravnica, for example, is that it's a city world with ten guilds -- yes, for most, that's a "story." All but a tiny fraction of the fan base are entirely unaware of an elaborate plot perpetrated by Augustin IV to trick Agrus Kos and Szadek into breaking the Guildpact, thereby enabling the Azorius to take control. Likewise, the vast majority of Magic players don't know who Harbin is, or Nivea, or Al-Hayat, or Feather, or Jared Carthalion, or Rebbec, or Zagorka ... the list goes on and on.
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I'm pulling this out of nowhere and it has nothing like fact attached to it, but it cannot be disproven without breaking the fourth wall, and this is going to be my headcanon because it makes perfect sense. I posit [Tamiyo, the Moon Sage] writes the Planeswalker's Guides to planes.
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It's worth noting that Moldgraf Monstrosity is mechanically even bigger than this fellow, and it was still flavored as some horrible bug creature living in the woods that can't possibly stand more than ten feet high.



Craterhoof Behemoth comes into play as a 6/6 just by itself, which is pretty comparable to Meglonoth that towers over trees in Naya. That's only considering playing the card in a way that really wasn't intended. This guy is only intended to be played when you actually have board presence, which means he will be atleast a 9/9 or higher (three creatures or more).

Same with something like The Thing--it's in its own breed of horror because it involves consumption and corruption and a perversion of nature. This is, in contrast, just nature.

But again, I find big monster horror pretty dull, so I'm definitely not the target audience here.



I'd have to argue against that. The original Gojira was made to be a horror film (to depart from all the war films). Then America saw that and made them ALL HORRIBLE (not that toho did much better from 1960-1988's. bleh, they didnt get better till 85').
Cloverfield is a decent giant monster horror film.

I think horror films are so trivialized at the moment unless its trying to really gross you out (I hate modern day horror).
Well, I was just having fun earlier, but now I have a serious suggestion. This behemoth, like those of Alara, is so big that it tramples down villages without even noticing. So Avacyn had to imprison it in the Helvault to stop him.

But we would have explain why she couldn't just kill it. And the same reason as is given for the demons willl suffice - a new godzilla-like moster would eventually re-form, and trample over villages again. As the Anima once said, "Gods do not sleep soundly in the earth's embrace."

Of course, both me and the Nayan elves could just be insane.
Evil doesn't always triumph. - Ajani Goldmane
Avacyn only used the Helvault on mana-constructs.

This guy seems like a pretty basic wild animal; easily killable.