What Will It Takes For You To Buy DotP 2013?

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We all know that DotP 2012 has a lot bugs (desyncing, misprogrammed cards, skip stepping, etc). So aside from bug fixes, is there anything else that you feel needs to be included in DotP 2013 for you to purchase it?

My number one priority is some sort of implementation for manual land tapping. It's asinine how often two- or three-color decks find themselves in situations where they can't make optimal plays because the land tapper makes a dumb move. I honestly don't know if I can buy another iteration of this game if this continues. And yes; I've heard all the arguments abow how it will slow the pace of the game down, and I understand. But there has to be some sort of compromise here besides only playing single color decks.

My second priority is expanded deck editing. 2012 was a huge improvement over 2009, and I hope that we see a similar improvement in 2013. Whether it's full deck editing, the "common pool" approach, or even just more cards per deck, I want to be able to do more with my decks.

Finally, give us an end step already! Sure it'll add another couple of seconds per turn to watch the timer tick down, but it's sooooo worth it if my White Sun's Zenith can't get immediately wiped by a Slagstorm.

What about you guys?
I want mana tap, end step and more control/combo decks and less agro decks, my ultimate wish is a U/G Madness deck with basking rootwalla and wild mongrel, but i know is impossible

Oh hypocrisy! A World full of n00bs indeed!

I think the easiest solution to the mana tapping problem would be to simply design the engine with a mana pool which the engine will take mana from first to cast the card, failing that it will continue to automatically tap the lands for mana as it does now. If you want to override the engine, you tell it by manually filling the mana pool yourself first, otherwise play as the engine already does. It would also allow you the ability to defensively tap all your lands when faced with a copperhoof vorrac for instance, particularly if you are playing a deck without instants!

I want cards to follow the rules, and fixes when they don't. 

Robvalue: Copy target bug or glitch. You may choose a new card for the copy...

Will never buy games made by Arena Net again.

Will not buy Duel 2015 until 2HG reinstated.

 

Grei wrote:

Orc_Welfin wrote:
 I've removed content from this thread. 


Nice to know removing content is a company wide policy.
Manual mana selection isn't super difficult to implement.  For most spells, even with a three color deck, there's actually a very finite number of land combination permutations.  If you're playing Trinity of Elements, for example, and are trying to cast something like Gaea's Revenge, and you've got 10 untapped lands, well there actually aren't that many different configurations, despite the high generic cost.  If your lands consist of 5 forest, 2 islands, and 3 mountains, for example, then you're potential combinations are (numbers here denote number of the subsequent letter, not generic mana cost):

2G, 2U, 3R
3G, 1U, 3R
3G, 2U, 2R
4G, 3R
4G, 1U, 2R
4G, 2U, 1R
5G, 2R
5G, 1U, 1R
5G, 2U

And I think that's it.  If the algorithm that supplied options had no filters on it, you're only talking about cycling through 9 options.  And that's a fairly complicated one.  Most spells are easier than that, because of the lowest generic cost.  Regardless, the basic UI is this.

Normal cast, using default mana selection:  Highlight card and press A.
Cast, using manual mana selection: Highlight card, hold A; while holding A, use right bumper (or equivalent) to cycle through mana tapping options.

Since the whole thing would be part of the overall time allotted for a turn, there's no net time lost in the game due to manual land selection.

And - not that I trust Stainless to do this - you could also filter the options such that configurations that do not have a) correspondence to any unplayed but playable cards in hand and b) correspondence to ability costs of permanents under player control are excluded.  So in the example above, if you're holding a Counterspell and an Incinerate, then the selection function could exclude all options that didn't keep 2U untapped or at least 1R untapped, which would cut down the total number of selection options one would cycle through.
I like everything suggested. Another big request for me is the ability to save multiple deck configurations.
I just want proper communication and support.  Wizards always gets really friendly on the forums right before their next game launches and if history has shown us anything, they immediately ignore the community right after its release.  I guess we will see how willing Wizards is to support the community this time around; it has only taken them three years to acknowledge this issue.

EDIT:  And I want a random deck option (and playlist if possible). 
My Minimum:

Less Glitches
Better Card Choices
Forced Thinking in Deck Building
Multiple Viable Stategies for the Same Deck
More Cards per Deck (36 Unlocks Would be Cool)
The Vampire Deck must stay Mono-Black
Nothing Done About Double Decking
Planechase Mode since they are expanding it in June
Mana Pools

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What will it take me to buy dotp 2013? A few button presses when it hits XBL
Wow, I've never played DotP, but from reading your guys' complaints about its current problems, I don't think I would ever play it. You can't choose which lands you tap? 30 second time limit to declare blocks? No end step?? Cards that don't play by the rules?!! I already knew about the limited deckbuilding options and the imbalance in the game, but jeebus. This just sounds like an awful, awful way to play. Unless you've never played paper Magic or MTGO before, I don't see how you could stand this. I know any one of those problems would drive me right up the wall, and probably my controller through my TV screen.
What will it take?

A significant discount for people who have 2012 installed.
Apart from the obvious bug fixes/card rule mistakes, in no particular order...

*Manual land tapping - There have already been many good suggestions for manual land tapping. Any of these would be better than the current system.

*End step - Should be a given...just add on one extra phase at the end...how hard is that?

*Ability to tweak land ratio manually when editing decks - Should also be easy to implement; like now, the game could automatically choose how many lands you get depending on how many cards are in your deck, 25 for a 60 card deck for example, but then you get to tweak how many of each of those 25 land are of a specific colour.   

*More varied deck builds giving a range of playstyles - Wizards/Stainless should just look to this board for deck ideas...so many good deck suggestions on here, nearly all of them better than the decks we have currently.

*A more forgiving blocking timer when there are a lot of creatures in play - Maybe you could get the standard 30 second timer as currently, but if there are over 5 attacking creatures you would get 3-5 seconds extra per one creature over that 5 limit...so for 6 creatures you get the standard 30 seconds plus 3-5 seconds extra added, if there were 10 creatures you would get the standard 30 seconds plus another 15-30 seconds for the 5 extra attacking creatures, 

*A better UI/display of information - Currently, it is almost impossible to navigate to specific cards when there are a lot on screen; for easier selection of cards in general - press a button on the controller to allow the cursor to go into free scroll mode and you can move it around like a mouse, when you press it again it clicks to the card nearest the cursor. When trying to select a specific attached equipment or enchantment - instead of having to use the right stick to try and select a specific attached card (a nightmare when there are more than 2 cards or more attached to a creature), highlight the creature that the artifact/enchantment is attached to, click triangle and the game brings up all the cards attached to said creature onto the screen horizontally for selection, very similar to how the graveyard is shown when viewed currently.

*Decks being similarly powered - Decks like Dragons Roar and Apex have very little chance against the top decks like Vamps etc.  Make the decks all similarly powered so that all decks are viable to play...would improve the online component immensly; how many of the 19 decks actually get regular play online? About 5 or 6? Make all the decks viable choices to play online and it will increase the longegivety/replayability of the game immensly.

Most of these would be easy to implement and I feel are needed to make me interested in purchasing the next game.
Wow, I've never played DotP, but from reading your guys' complaints about its current problems, I don't think I would ever play it. You can't choose which lands you tap? 30 second time limit to declare blocks? No end step?? Cards that don't play by the rules?!! I already knew about the limited deckbuilding options and the imbalance in the game, but jeebus. This just sounds like an awful, awful way to play. Unless you've never played paper Magic or MTGO before, I don't see how you could stand this. I know any one of those problems would drive me right up the wall, and probably my controller through my TV screen.



Don't be misled. The game isn't as bad as they say.

I agree with Ocal. I'll be buying 2013 simply because I'm finished with 2012 and want to play Magic but don't want to pay hundreds of dollars.
Sold.

personally what id like:

*Land: in addition to manual tapping, id like at least 4x terramorphic expanse or similar in every multicolor deck, and please count them as LANDS, not spells, seriously, whos going to remove the expanses in decks like machinations???? it makes multicolor decks weaker by taking slots for more useful spells.

Ideally, i prefer lands like crumbling necropolis, or even better, lands like celestial colonnade and creeping tar pit would make the game more complex and interesting, for example, a kicked mold shambler could be more relevant.

*phases/step: IMO all steps should be added (upkeep, beginning and end of combat and end step, if im not mistaken), it would slow down the game, but i prefer to play it properly, and we could see new cards.

*gang blocking: i didnt know this before robvalue mentioned it, but id like them to fix this too, i mean, assigning damage to blockers, then being able to cast instants or activate abilites.  

everything else has being mentioned.

It would also allow you the ability to defensively tap all your lands when faced with a copperhoof vorrac for instance, particularly if you are playing a deck without instants!



is this possible in real magic??? tapping lands even without casting any spell??? Surprised
Yes in full Magic you can tap lands for mana any time it's your turn to act, whether or not you intend to spend it. The mana floats around in your "mana pool" ready for you to use in the future. At the end of each phase and step of each turn, all players' mana pools are emptied. This used to result in taking damage for unspent mana, but recently the rules were changed so you just lose the mana without any other consequences.

I've still had no official answer about the gang blocking issue, and why DoTP has this in reverse of the real Magic rules. So I still don't know whether or not this was intended (although I can see absolutely no reason why it would be) or a mistake that they won't own up to (more likely). For anyone who plays full Magic, the error in this and the loss of strategy for the game is blindingly obvious.
I am a Rules advisor. Feel free to send me any questions as a private message! Check if you have found a bug in Duels 2013 Report a bug Report a technical issue I have written several guides to help new DoTP players here, move to the first post to start reading. They are also in Wordpress format here. The principles involved should still be useful for Duels 2013!
Useful links:
Find other DoTP players - a database of friendly players, find a match or post your name here to be added to the list! I'll add a D13 section if anyone would like. Ask a rules question - ask anything about DoTP, Magic in general, or to check out if you've found a bug by asking if the rules are being followed. Community thread for general chatter in the DoTP part of the forum! Guide to Yugioh on Xbox live: A beginner's guide focusing on the similarities and differences to Magic.
DotP is a great way to intro new players to Magic. I never would have/or will play paper. The problem is, once you learn it, love it, become good at it, it's flaws become clear and debilitating. It's clear it is built to become obsolete and drive players to paper. Only, that's not going to happen.

As tempting as it may seem, no one will turn the digital world into revenue streams of old (paper). EA is going to try it with mandatory DLC for Mass Effect 3 and there is already backlash. The game will sell but EA and the Mass Effect franchise will suffer in the end.


The game needs:


More diverse decks built to last and compete. This tiered, intentionally crippled deck stuff is a horrible idea.  Especially if you like multicolored decks which tend to be more strategic and chess-like if you will.

Manual land tapping or at the very least situational land prompts if the AI can handle that.

Mana pool.

Not sure Archenemy needs to stay.

Bug fixes.

Graphic engine optimizaton.

Synch issues resolved.


I would buy it flawed on GFWL, I won't buy Steam at all. I won't buy Xbox without rave community reviews. I can play on PC on the side, but if I'm going to sit in front of Xbox, it has to be 10/10.             
I'm probably going to buy 2013 no matter what, but a few things I would love to have:
*Manual land tapping.
*Non-basic lands+mana pool (more consistent mana).
*Some of the truly iconic and classic decks in Magic.
*Stronger decks.
*An end step.

Damn the system and its hypocrites! You quit your quest and venture into the slums of the Gruul Clans!
Damn the system and its hypocrites! You quit your quest and venture into the slums of the Gruul Clans!
Take THE QUEST FOR RAVNICA today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.

 

I'm probably going to buy 2013 no matter what, but a few things I would love to have:
*Manual land tapping.
*Non-basic lands+mana pool (more consistent mana).
*Some of the truly iconic and classic decks in Magic.
*Stronger decks.
*An end step.



What do you mean by stronger decks? i think RoI, BH, MtW and Bek are way too strong...

Oh hypocrisy! A World full of n00bs indeed!

What do you mean by stronger decks? i think RoI, BH, MtW and Bek are way too strong...


In the context of 2012, maybe those decks were too strong, but that was just a matter of poor balancing.

I think the decks in DoTP are too weak and not optimized enough.
I don't like playing with or against bad cards such as Runeclaw Bear, Lightning Elemental, Craw Wurm, Assassinate, Wind Drake, Essence Drain, Ember Shot, Rotting Legion ..and the list goes on..
All 90 cards in a deck should be at least playable.

I enjoy playing with good and consistent decks against other consistent decks.

As an example; imagine Apex with 2xPelakka Wurm instead of 2xCraw Wurm.
Wouldn't that be nice?

Damn the system and its hypocrites! You quit your quest and venture into the slums of the Gruul Clans!
Damn the system and its hypocrites! You quit your quest and venture into the slums of the Gruul Clans!
Take THE QUEST FOR RAVNICA today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.

 

Count me as a fan for stronger decks as many of the decks we're used to playing are pretty mediocre in design. So I definately would like to see an increased quality in that area. Along the quality of the Event Decks they have started to release seems like a good level for the decks and their "cores". With this higher quality, the unlocks can focus on customizing the deck rather than straight outright improving the deck like the process is currently where players take out the blantantly obvious poor cards. Unlocks could focus on different paths too, such as slightly improving the initial role of that deck as well cards that allow for variation builds. An example off the top of my head would be a core UW Tempo/Aggro-Control deck that can either shift into hard control or further supplement the Aggro-Control route without entirely going full aggro. I'm not entirely sure how hard this kind of design would be from a balancing standpoint or if one could make two competitively viable builds like this.

By the way, I feel 2012 ended up with too many decks and we saw a lot of overlap in playstyle because of this. I'd rather play with a reduced deck count, if it meant we had a higher quality and larger deck balance between them all. Also, I would like to see each playstyle represented as evenly as possible. Some X number of dedicated Control, X number of dedicated Aggro, a few Midrange-y builds, and possibly a combo deck. If pure combo is too hard to balance or something, try and incorporate combo elements into some of the other playstyles, like Aggro-Combo or Control-Combo where it's more like a subtheme and can be substituted out via unlocks should the player desire.
What do you mean by stronger decks? i think RoI, BH, MtW and Bek are way too strong...


In the context of 2012, maybe those decks were too strong, but that was just a matter of poor balancing.

I think the decks in DoTP are too weak and not optimized enough.
I don't like playing with or against bad cards such as Runeclaw Bear, Lightning Elemental, Craw Wurm, Assassinate, Wind Drake, Essence Drain, Ember Shot, Rotting Legion ..and the list goes on..
All 90 cards in a deck should be at least playable.

I enjoy playing with good and consistent decks against other consistent decks.

As an example; imagine Apex with 2xPelakka Wurm instead of 2xCraw Wurm.
Wouldn't that be nice?



Ahhh now i get what you mean and i agree with you.

Oh hypocrisy! A World full of n00bs indeed!

2012 had a major selling argument in form of 60 card decks, so it was an instant buy.

The next installment needs to be a pretty huge improvement to stop me from playing 2012 and buy a new version instead...

If they just re-re-release the same old decks (theme wise), fix some bugs and call it a game, I will just keep playing 2012. I won't pay a third time, just to play with the same decks again...

It's the same with FIFA for me, I still play the 2009 version simply because the "improvements" aren't worth another full release. I will tread Magic just like that. (and just like FIFA I will probably just stop playing at all and go back to "normal" games if the new installment isn't worth it)

On the other hand it will probably be an instant buy if they include an import feature for existing decks and add more cards/unlocks to each deck. I don't even need new decks, I rather want more cards per deck.

Oh and btw. the game needs to be pretty good right out of the box. I usually expect games like this to improve with addons / DLC / patches but as we all know now, that won't happen - ever...

Well, no matter what, I'm dead curious how they are going to advertise the next game. I really don't think they will provide any of the things we demand but rather just give us another rehash of the same game. And the advertisement for such a game probably will be quite hilarious... :D
What do you mean by stronger decks? i think RoI, BH, MtW and Bek are way too strong...


I don't like playing with or against bad cards such as Runeclaw Bear, Lightning Elemental, Craw Wurm, Assassinate, Wind Drake, Essence Drain, Ember Shot, Rotting Legion ..and the list goes on..
All 90 cards in a deck should be at least playable.

I enjoy playing with good and consistent decks against other consistent decks.

As an example; imagine Apex with 2xPelakka Wurm instead of 2xCraw Wurm.
Wouldn't that be nice?


Yeah I know what you mean. Another prime example: Ancient Depths deck uses crap Kraken Hatchling for and Giant Octopus for . What was wrong with Wall of Blossoms or Wall of Roots as a replacement for the Kraken Hatchling ? And Aven Fleetwing or Windrider Eel to replace that stupid Giant Octopus ?

I know they want to keep the overall level down, but wouldn't it be better to not include Mass Polymorph and Rite of Replication ? They are the cards that make the Ancient Depths deck so unbalanced in 2HG and Archenemy, but they have to include those vanilla creatures ?

I'll be the last one to say this game is crap but making every deck in this game basically Aggro, limits the overall MtG experience. Why not unlock aggro-combo and aggro-control decks or the possibility to make it into one ?
Illusions is pretty aggro-control within the constraints/themes of the game..
If pure combo is too hard to balance or something, try and incorporate combo elements into some of the other playstyles, like Aggro-Combo or Control-Combo where it's more like a subtheme and can be substituted out via unlocks should the player desire.



Isnt trinity of elements kind of aggro-combo??? specially a turn 3 primal forcemage. Or my favorite

turn 2: rampant growth
turn 3: bloodbraid elf, rakka mar(unblocked) or permanent "pump" (i prefer fires of yavimaya)
turn 4: primal forcemage and rip-clan crasher, or hellspark elemental.

Yeah I know what you mean. Another prime example: Ancient Depths deck uses crap Kraken Hatchling for and Giant Octopus for . What was wrong with Wall of Blossoms or Wall of Roots as a replacement for the Kraken Hatchling ? And Aven Fleetwing or Windrider Eel to replace that stupid Giant Octopus ?

I know they want to keep the overall level down, but wouldn't it be better to not include Mass Polymorph and Rite of Replication ? They are the cards that make the Ancient Depths deck so unbalanced in 2HG and Archenemy, but they have to include those vanilla creatures ?

I'll be the last one to say this game is crap but making every deck in this game basically Aggro, limits the overall MtG experience. Why not unlock aggro-combo and aggro-control decks or the possibility to make it into one ?



Lol how is Kraken Hatchling a "crap" card? You've got to be kidding. And it actually fits the theme of the deck really well unlike your suggested replacements.

Don't be misled. The game isn't as bad as they say.

I agree with Ocal. I'll be buying 2013 simply because I'm finished with 2012 and want to play Magic but don't want to pay hundreds of dollars.
Sold.



This is the fallacy that stops them fixing the game.

Wizards think, "they're getting this for a pittance in comparison to Paper, they should be grateful for whatever we give them", and when people like you agree, basically treating neglect as generosity, then it emboldens them. They're not doing you a favour at all, they're a business making a profit, and as a paying customer you have a right to expect a working product for your money.

I have no intention to play Paper and never have, so I'm not comparing this in value to Paper, where admittedly it is a bargain (but only because Paper is so ludicrously overpriced) I am comparing it to other 360 titles, which is the true area where it's competing for my time, and in that comparison it fails.

For people who buy it instead of Paper, it's a bargain. For people who buy it instead of Shadow Complex, or Castle Crashers, or Trials HD, or Braid, then it's a broken, feature lacking mess that should be fixed immediately. That's the true comparison.

Paper has just given people a kind of battered wife syndrome, where they are eternally grateful for whatever crumbs Wizards deem them deserving of. I'm not a Magic player, I'm a 360 player, and I am used to and demand better.


We've had this discussion half a dozen times at least. You might be happy saying the same crap over and over, but I'm tired of saying the same crap over and over.

I'm buying the game because I like playing Magic, I'm interested in seeing what they do with it and for $10.00 it's not costing me a lot.
You're not buying the game. Period. So get over it and move on. You want to agree to disagree, fine. But don't presume to sit there and tell me I'm wrong for buying it just because you're bitter, jaded, and overly demanding. 

This post, by the way, has been toned down out of respect for you. Keep that in mind before you lace your response with things along the lines of "people like you". You obviously don't know me very well, you obviously don't like what I like, and you obviously took my post out of context. I would appreciate if you tread more carefully next time.


Instead of a thread of what people want in 2013, how about a thread of people who will and wont buy. When all is said and done and 2013 is sat on the dashboard, youve some points to spare and a few hours to kill. Who wont be tempted?


Dont waste time on the demos neither, both demos for both DOTP games are just terrible  
Instead of a thread of what people want in 2013, how about a thread of people who will and wont buy. 



The thing is: Many people do not know if they'll buy the next game or not because we do not know how 2013 will look like. Will it be a truly improved version? I'll propably buy it but I really want improvements like:


- Less bugs
- Correct card rules
- Decks that are balanced. Less bombs, better deck quality (at least 4x[C]Evolving Wilds[/C] in every multicolored deck.
- A better variety of deck strategies: aggro, combo, control
- Improved deck editing: 30-50 card unlocks per deck would be great.
- A new unlock system that also features whole new unlock items such as personas, game tables, titles. You can unlock these things by completing ingame challenges for example: Win 50 ranked matches with (insert Dragon deck name) - Unlock [C]Moonveil Dragon[/C] as a persona.
- More than just one boring track during multiplayer matches!!! I can't hear Garruk's theme from 2012 anymore!
- A sound effect overhaul.
- No double-decking in 2HG
- Ranked 2HG Friend Invite
- Ranked Archenemy
- A mana pool
- Planeswalker cards
- Cards with more complex mechanics like levelers, infect and double-faced cards.


IMAGE(http://oi39.tinypic.com/14mvxh5.jpg)

Instead of a thread of what people want in 2013, how about a thread of people who will and wont buy.


Well, this thread IS what it will take for people to buy 2013. That means explaining what you want that will entice you to buy it. You and I, our business here is done, we're set on buying it. I just didn't appreciate that position coming under fire because someone didn't like 2012. Accusing me of being "part of the problem" really didn't help.
Really for $10 if the decks are good I'll buy it. I just won't buy all the deck packs and such unless there are '09 decks, jund, or Shards of Alara. I already know I'm not doing the annual cycle again, and again. I think I've learned enough about the Magic paper culture to know they're not going to do all the things everyone is asking for in DotP.
What if 2 People have a lot of Fun Playing the same Deck X and they end up in a 2HG team. Its happened to me a lot.

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If pure combo is too hard to balance or something, try and incorporate combo elements into some of the other playstyles, like Aggro-Combo or Control-Combo where it's more like a subtheme and can be substituted out via unlocks should the player desire.



Isnt trinity of elements kind of aggro-combo??? specially a turn 3 primal forcemage. Or my favorite

turn 2: rampant growth
turn 3: bloodbraid elf, rakka mar(unblocked) or permanent "pump" (i prefer fires of yavimaya)
turn 4: primal forcemage and rip-clan crasher, or hellspark elemental.

Yeah, I was going to use Trinity as an example since it has some combo elements in it. If we use Trinity as the example, my vision of an ideal setup for the next game would have a deck like Trinity start out as a solid RG Aggro deck, and the unlocks would hold the combo pieces like the Primal Forcemages and Pandemoniums, not to mention other cards that might apply to the general aggro strategy, like burn or extra utility creatures. Putting even a larger emphasis on the unlocks, they can even get away with hiding extra colors in the deck unlocks, letting players choose what colors they want to run, similar to what players do with Machinations. So let's say Trinity starts out :R::G:, but there are enough [worthwhile] blue cards to make a :U: splash should the player desire going into three colors.

That's probably the easiest way to incorporate combos into the game by the way. I'm not sure the game could have its own "pure" combo deck. It would end up being a lot like Ancient Depths, where it sets the pace of the format and once it hits a specific turn, it's supposed to win. I mean, plenty of people complain about AD getting "I win" cards that I can't imagine how people would react when the combo deck "goes off" and wins. Many of those AD complaints rest in the fact that a lot of decks cannot respond or disrupt some of the resolved threats though (like Rite of Replication since many decks cannot off their own creatures in response). Thus, the problem could be alleviated slightly if decks should be given a larger set of answers, like discard (targeted such as Duress is pretty important) or counterspells to possibly disrupt the combo and making sure aggro decks are slightly faster than the combo deck. Seems like a hassle to balance properly though, and there's also challenge of balancing the deck in all modes of play such as 2HG and FFA, which seems like a daunting task. It's probably best to take a card or set of cards that act like combo pieces, and incorporate it into another deck that doesn't necessarily require them to win. Treat it more like an alternate win condition rather than the main one.


To stick to the spirit of the thread topic:
It might be obvious from my posts, but deck contents are pretty important to me, including correct card implementation as I don't want to play with broken cards. I feel this way because a lot of the other stuff generally "works", even if they could be improved upon, the decks and the cards they consist of are what we play with the most so I hold them to a pretty high standard. Rehashed old decks will get old for me, incorrectly coded cards will get frustrating, as will "simplified" rules if they attempt anything too complex. So do a good job on core deck and unlock design and making sure the cards work, and I'll probably pull out the cash for another round of this game. I'm sure the playerbase isn't exactly the full of the "newbies" that first started playing the '09 version. Show them what Magic is capable of.

I do feel pretty strongly about proper phase and step implementation, but it's not exactly a dealbreaker for me. At least I don't think it is, although I've been pretty frustrated by the lack of the End Phase lately. They already have to throw the upkeep and end step in for certain cards because they included cards that trigger at those steps (which I  think can be responded to with instants?), why not just finally incorporate it all the time? It's just better from a gameplay standpoint in my opinion with all the instants that are starting to pop up and will add another skill element to the game.

Other stuff like better UI and board navigation would be a plus, but those are at an acceptable level for playing. That doesn't mean they shouldn't try and improve them though, as I certainly think they need improvement. I especially like the idea of being able to use a cursor for movement at times on the console versions. The game in general could use improved game options as well so it doesn't feel like so bare bones, like a more fleshed out/varied campaign, easy to set up tournament options, customization options for in game, deck saves, AI deck saves. Not at all necessary though, but they can all help in the games longevity. I know I'd like better offline game options as I'm sometimes stuck offline. Sometimes I just want to play some Magic, and being so limited in options isn't that enjoyable.
Instead of a thread of what people want in 2013, how about a thread of people who will and wont buy.


Well, this thread IS what it will take for people to buy 2013. That means explaining what you want that will entice you to buy it. You and I, our business here is done, we're set on buying it. I just didn't appreciate that position coming under fire because someone didn't like 2012. Accusing me of being "part of the problem" really didn't help.



Youll have to fill me in im totally lost. Youre the problem for 2012? I dont get it


Anyway, im sure everybody here will buy 2013. Wether theyll keep playing it afterwards is down to how well stainless pull this off. Thinking about it, they have no choice but to get this right. Get it right, or fail forever.  
Instead of a thread of what people want in 2013, how about a thread of people who will and wont buy.


Well, this thread IS what it will take for people to buy 2013. That means explaining what you want that will entice you to buy it. You and I, our business here is done, we're set on buying it. I just didn't appreciate that position coming under fire because someone didn't like 2012. Accusing me of being "part of the problem" really didn't help.



Youll have to fill me in im totally lost. Youre the problem for 2012? I dont get it


Anyway, im sure everybody here will buy 2013. Wether theyll keep playing it afterwards is down to how well stainless pull this off. Thinking about it, they have no choice but to get this right. Get it right, or fail forever.  




Splatter:  It was Steveolutionary that used the line "people like you" on the last page.  You quoted him earlier.  I think you got him and Ocal mixed up.  Ocal didn't say you are part of the problem.

That business aside.



What would it take for me to buy 2013?   A Miracle!  That's obviously hyperbole but, something is going to have to be pulled out of someone's arse to get this thing fixed.  Do they think that I would believe they are going to get all of the card rulings corrected in the next 2-3 months?  And that's all they have folks, probably less.  This new game should be coming when?  June?  July?  August?    They better be testing the final product now or very soon if they plan on meeting that deadline.

No upkeep and final phases?  Oh well.
No mana pool?  To bad.
Silly design decisions that make it near impossible to target things?  (talking enchantments on fliers)  I don't care THAT much.
Cards that do not play by rules that have been in the making for over a decade?  That's where I draw the line.

You're a lose cannon.

 

 

"I played 70 card decks before it was cool to play 70 card decks." -Random M:tG hipster

I'm pretty sure I'll be buying duels13, I still find myself playing dotp more than any other game I own, Including skyrim, which I consider an absolute masterpiece. I cant help it. even with all this games flaws. MTG is just so damn addictive... but part of me does feel like wizards is taking advantage of this crack-like addiction, to get away with complete lack of support. Its like their saying "its MTG, we could cover it in cow dung and they'll still buy it!" So I actually could be on the fence with 2013, For me deck theme is going to be a huge factor. I'm SO SICK AND TIRED of tribal aggro decks, as others have pointed out, magic allows for so many cool and unique theme's, Its a shame to see 5 different colors of the same build--vamps, knights, illusions, elves, etc. If they want me to keep buying, I'm going to have to see more "strategic" decks with far more variation in theme.


Youll have to fill me in im totally lost. Youre the problem for 2012? I dont get it.


Ocal, my response to you was that you have, for all intents and purposes, fulfilled your obligation to the thread and so have I. The thread is asking "what will it take to sell you on Magic 2013?" and both of our answers are "Nothing, I  intend to buy it when it comes out."

Stevolutionary disagrees with that and has stated (and reiterated) that I'm pretty much the catalyst to his displeasure with the game. Which, is stupid by the way. 
My "people lile you" comment was at Splattercat, complaining how some posters (usually Paper vets) leap to the defence of a game that (regardless of to what extent you feel it damages the game or not) is unquestionably suffering from many unfixed bugs and poor customer service.


And I didn't read the rest because once again, you are accusing my wish to play the next iteration of the game as the reason you don't like 2012.

Get over yourself.
No worries pal. This game is pretty flawed but not unplayable. If its a rehashed engine from 09 then that explains the bugs and lack of fixes for me, well some not all. As for 2013, if its a brand new engine, i cant see there been many bugs. If they are, itll be the last DOTP game i, or indeed a lot of people, will buy. Im banking on this company wanting more money, so i can see the bugs being fixed on the whole. Not to say this forum wont explode when the first tiniest bug is found, and everybody will cry foul which is a shame.


If 2013 is buggy, its night night stainless. What would you do in their shoes? 

My displeasure with you (and others) is that you try to de-legitimise anyone who has a complaint by implying we should be grateful we get anything considering the price, which is unhelpful to say the least, and in my opinion an argument based on a fallacious comparison.


Quotes please.

I'm pretty sure I'll be buying duels13, I still find myself playing dotp more than any other game I own, Including skyrim, which I consider an absolute masterpiece. I cant help it. even with all this games flaws. MTG is just so damn addictive... but part of me does feel like wizards is taking advantage of this crack-like addiction, to get away with complete lack of support. Its like their saying "its MTG, we could cover it in cow dung and they'll still buy it!" So I actually could be on the fence with 2013, For me deck theme is going to be a huge factor. I'm SO SICK AND TIRED of tribal aggro decks, as others have pointed out, magic allows for so many cool and unique theme's, Its a shame to see 5 different colors of the same build--vamps, knights, illusions, elves, etc. If they want me to keep buying, I'm going to have to see more "strategic" decks with far more variation in theme.


They have the right idea with SoS, Trinity, and CB but crippled them all. And a mana pool would help out a great deal with multi-colored decks.

To be honest, I'm not sure how crippled they are in and of themselves, but in a game with bombs and bomb combos and removal heavy black decks, they're crippled.  
They have the right idea with SoS, Trinity, and CB but crippled them all. And a mana pool would help out a great deal with multi-colored decks.

To be honest, I'm not sure how crippled they are in and of themselves, but in a game with bombs and bomb combos and removal heavy black decks, they're crippled.  

There are generally a lot of things I could pick them apart for that make them "bad". Card selection, mana curves, [lack of] deck identity, etc. I mean, just look at Strength of Stone at a glance. Four Earth Elementals, an Earth Servant, and two Tephraderms. Did the deck need seven extremely similar finishers, most which fall under the category of "average"? No, and that's excluding a lot of other cards at that slot, like the hasty Hellions, Phoenix, and the Manticore. Even Tephraderm is kind of a joke of a choice considering you're punished by your better cards (sweepers) when running it. It feels so sloppy. I don't enjoy picking on Strength of Stone either, as it's so close to a deck I would've loved, but it displays some of the issues I have with the game's overall deck design and balance. These are issues that are inherent in a lot of decks though and this "crippled" nature needs to disappear.

Looking back on the tribal aspect, which felt like they went overboard with, they weren't all exactly similar. Illusions was more aggro-control; Zombies, Treefolk and Vampires are all pretty midrange-y, while Elves and Knights are your all-in aggro decks. So that makes them kind of different in certain aspects. I think that because a lot of the decks feel like it's about turning the largest number of dudes sideways and winning that way makes everything feel like "all aggro". In fact, many decks are what I consider "a pile of cards" that probably resemble a midrange mess rather than actually being real aggro decks. So it feels a little wrong to say everything was aggro, but there was definately a lack of solid control playstyles represented in this iteration.

Since the goal is to swing in with the most or best creatures, this turns a lot of matches into an arms race to see who gets the bigger and baddest creatures out. When some decks have creatures on an entirely different level (compare Strength of Stone's "bomb" quality to say, Blood Hunger's), the "stronger" deck of cards might have an easier time achieving victory. Especially true if they can minimize construction problems by eliminating mana curve issues or having a better defined deck role which play a huge part in getting consistent draws. For example, playing low tier decks, I'm usually thinking I can win if I draw specific set of cards. However, if I'm playing a better deck like Realm of Illusions, I'm never really thinking, "I hope I draw Bribery." even though it's a good card. It's because the rest of the deck is good and functions as a whole which can outperform most of the competition featured in this game.

My displeasure with you (and others) is that you try to de-legitimise anyone who has a complaint by implying we should be grateful we get anything considering the price, which is unhelpful to say the least, and in my opinion an argument based on a fallacious comparison.


Quotes please.



Just read his previous posts; he's made it rather clear.
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