Robe of Useful Items: A little broken or very broken?

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So, something I just noticed. The Robe of Useful Items' power replenishes whenever the item disappears. The Artificer's Arcane Rejuvenation kicks in whenever you use a daily item power. Am I missing something, or is this an eternal fountain of THP at the cost of a minor action? There's no reason not to carry a Robe of Useful Items around for pre-combat buffing, and Avengers and Monks have very good reasons to just use the robe all day period. Has any errata been issued to nerf this combo? Has anybody else noticed it?
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
The item needs to disappear, which happens after it lasts an hour. It is also armor, so it isn't exactly the easiest thing to take on and off right before combat.
Cloth Armor IS easy to take on and off though. You can fluff it as a boxer robe even (boxer pants are your armor).

And what I was thinking of is, nothing says you can't take out an item that will self terminate. Say, a burning scrap of paper. Sure, the DM can **** you over, but we're assuming RAW here since no sane DM will allow this exploit.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Cloth Armor IS easy to take on and off though. You can fluff it as a boxer robe even (boxer pants are your armor).



You can't have two of the same item slot function at the same time. That's going to get legitimately tricky for anyone who wants to wear non-cloth armor or for that matter wants cloth armor that has some additional purpose.

And what I was thinking of is, nothing says you can't take out an item that will self terminate. Say, a burning scrap of paper. Sure, the DM can **** you over, but we're assuming RAW here since no sane DM will allow this exploit.



Even if that piece of paper is burned to a crisp, there's still a crisp which hasn't disappeared...
Cloth Armor IS easy to take on and off though. You can fluff it as a boxer robe even (boxer pants are your armor).



You can't have two of the same item slot function at the same time. That's going to get legitimately tricky for anyone who wants to wear non-cloth armor or for that matter wants cloth armor that has some additional purpose.

And what I was thinking of is, nothing says you can't take out an item that will self terminate. Say, a burning scrap of paper. Sure, the DM can **** you over, but we're assuming RAW here since no sane DM will allow this exploit.



Even if that piece of paper is burned to a crisp, there's still a crisp which hasn't disappeared...



Right, you can't. One of them overrides the other. Which is the Robe, ideally.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
RAW it takes 5 minutes to change any item slot other than weapon/implement.

Also RAW the object you get from the robe lasts 1 hour.

So no, sorry, this doesn't work.  Cool idea though.
RAW it takes 5 minutes to change any item slot other than weapon/implement.

Also RAW the object you get from the robe lasts 1 hour.

So no, sorry, this doesn't work.  Cool idea though.



Source on that first quote? Because if that's the case, that's the most hilariously fail rule in the whole edition. It literally takes you five minutes to put a jacket on, no matter what.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Source on that first quote? Because if that's the case, that's the most hilariously fail rule in the whole edition. It literally takes you five minutes to put a jacket on, no matter what.

PHB1, pg212.

"Putting on a suit of armor always takes at least 5 minutes, which means that it’s an activity you can undertake only outside combat (likely while you’re taking a short rest)."

It's not as silly as it sounds, though:

1) They assume you're not going to go into battle starkers.
2) "A jacket" doesn't really work as cloth "armor" flavorwise, since it doesn't give you full torso coverage, nor arm, leg, or head coverage as most Cloth "armor" would.
3) A lot of Cloth armors would probably involve buckles, belts, pockets, pieces of clothing, etc.  It's not "put on a jacket and you're done lol", you're basically dressing up for a formal (sans haircare and other weird unnecessities) whenever you're getting ready for battle.

Source on that first quote? Because if that's the case, that's the most hilariously fail rule in the whole edition. It literally takes you five minutes to put a jacket on, no matter what.

PHB1, pg212.

"Putting on a suit of armor always takes at least 5 minutes, which means that it’s an activity you can undertake only outside combat (likely while you’re taking a short rest)."




Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Source on that first quote? Because if that's the case, that's the most hilariously fail rule in the whole edition. It literally takes you five minutes to put a jacket on, no matter what.

PHB1, pg212.

"Putting on a suit of armor always takes at least 5 minutes, which means that it’s an activity you can undertake only outside combat (likely while you’re taking a short rest)."




Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



It's called Cloth Armor, ain't it?
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Source on that first quote? Because if that's the case, that's the most hilariously fail rule in the whole edition. It literally takes you five minutes to put a jacket on, no matter what.

PHB1, pg212.

"Putting on a suit of armor always takes at least 5 minutes, which means that it’s an activity you can undertake only outside combat (likely while you’re taking a short rest)."




Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



It's called Cloth Armor, ain't it?



Yeah, but while my memory could be faulty, I recall that bit of the...think it was Equipment or Adventuring chapter, to be referring to the bigger armors (heavies specifically). Otherwise people somehow go into frame-by-frames of getting dressed. Which hey, it can be a fun thing to poke at, but it doesn't make the rule less wonky.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
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"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
Yeah, but while my memory could be faulty, I recall that bit of the...think it was Equipment or Adventuring chapter, to be referring to the bigger armors (heavies specifically). Otherwise people somehow go into frame-by-frames of getting dressed. Which hey, it can be a fun thing to poke at, but it doesn't make the rule less wonky.



You're just hitting one of the limits of refluffing - just because you can refluff armor into being a jacket, doesn't mean it suddenly gets to ignore the limitations of being armor. Unless you're doing something mechanical like this, it ought to never be a problem.
Yeah, but while my memory could be faulty, I recall that bit of the...think it was Equipment or Adventuring chapter, to be referring to the bigger armors (heavies specifically). Otherwise people somehow go into frame-by-frames of getting dressed. Which hey, it can be a fun thing to poke at, but it doesn't make the rule less wonky.



You're just hitting one of the limits of refluffing - just because you can refluff armor into being a jacket, doesn't mean it suddenly gets to ignore the limitations of being armor. Unless you're doing something mechanical like this, it ought to never be a problem.



It's not refluffing. Think about it, Cloth Armor provides no bonus without an enchantment. Its description pretty much is that it's clothing. So it really does take people five minutes to put any sort of clothes on, be it jackets, robes, or frilly boxers with pink hearts a la Ghouls and Ghosts. It's about as silly as the Rejuvenating trick would be if it worked, which is why I'm pointing that out. I don't have an issue with it per se because I understand the reasons for it, but I do find it odd that a rule has this very 3.5esque edge case.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
RAW it doesn't work. We deal with RAW here, and you know that. 
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RAW it doesn't work. We deal with RAW here, and you know that. 



This kind of got cleared up like ten posts ago. Conversation's moved to a different place, specifically poking fun at how everybody in D&D does frame by frame dressing up.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
When I get up in the morning I put on boxers, pants, a belt, and a shirt, and then I put socks and shoes on and lace up my shoes and then maybe put on a jacket. My regular, unenchanted suit of Cloth Armor takes me about five minutes to put on. The crazy thing here is not slow-mo dressing, it's firing my bow twice, running forty feet, and then pulling a coil of rope out of my backpack all in six seconds that's crazy.
Screw that, if I can't Magical Girl Transform, or Ultimate Form some new armor every time I Second Wind/Action Point/Use a Daily then I don't know why I'm even playing this game!
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
When I get up in the morning I put on boxers, pants, a belt, and a shirt, and then I put socks and shoes on and lace up my shoes and then maybe put on a jacket. My regular, unenchanted suit of Cloth Armor takes me about five minutes to put on. The crazy thing here is not slow-mo dressing, it's firing my bow twice, running forty feet, and then pulling a coil of rope out of my backpack all in six seconds that's crazy.



Didn't English Yeomen shoot like several arrows in the space of ten seconds? Rope aside, I'm positive this isn't actually unrealistic, funnily enough.

Screw that, if I can't Magical Girl Transform, or Ultimate Form some new armor every time I Second Wind/Action Point/Use a Daily then I don't know why I'm even playing this game!



Zathris gets it. A game with no cool duds is not a game worth having!
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Didn't English Yeomen shoot like several arrows in the space of ten seconds? Rope aside, I'm positive this isn't actually unrealistic, funnily enough.


A good rate of fire was around 1 every 6 seconds IIRC, or around 10 arrows/minute.  And that was in a pitched battle situation where you didn't really have to aim much, just loose and you'd probably hit something.

The most comical 'do it in 6 seconds' thing is crossbow twin strike.  The fact that a ranger can potentially make 6 to 8 attacks with his crossbow in 6 seconds is just hilarious if you consider that it takes ~30 seconds to reload even the best crossbows, once.
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Summoned ArmorLevel 6+ Uncommon

One need never worry about being caught unarmored while possessing this extraordinary armor.
































Lvl 6+21,800 gpLvl 21+5225,000 gp
Lvl 11+39,000 gpLvl 26+61,125,000 gp
Lvl 16+445,000 gp

Armor: Any


Enhancement Bonus: AC


Power (Minor Action)


You banish this armor to a secure extradimensional location. At any point in the future, unless you are wearing armor, you can use another minor action to recall the armor. The armor appears on you as though you had donned it normally.


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I have never found a D&D comic more appropriate to a thread before.




Sometimes, there's only one thing left to say. And sometimes, that thing is
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Oh Goblins always good for a laugh.
When I get up in the morning I put on boxers, pants, a belt, and a shirt, and then I put socks and shoes on and lace up my shoes and then maybe put on a jacket. My regular, unenchanted suit of Cloth Armor takes me about five minutes to put on. The crazy thing here is not slow-mo dressing, it's firing my bow twice, running forty feet, and then pulling a coil of rope out of my backpack all in six seconds that's crazy.



Y'know , you could use the Minor Action every 6 seconds or so, for ... something ... Wink

Here comes your 19th forums breakdown ... ohh who's to blame, it ain't 5E driving you insane.

 

So, something I just noticed. The Robe of Useful Items' power replenishes whenever the item disappears. The Artificer's Arcane Rejuvenation kicks in whenever you use a daily item power. Am I missing something, or is this an eternal fountain of THP at the cost of a minor action? There's no reason not to carry a Robe of Useful Items around for pre-combat buffing, and Avengers and Monks have very good reasons to just use the robe all day period. Has any errata been issued to nerf this combo? Has anybody else noticed it?



You could possibly use the Genasi Voidsoul racial power to cause the item to vanish. ;)
This thread went from interesting to awesome. :D
So, something I just noticed. The Robe of Useful Items' power replenishes whenever the item disappears. The Artificer's Arcane Rejuvenation kicks in whenever you use a daily item power. Am I missing something, or is this an eternal fountain of THP at the cost of a minor action? There's no reason not to carry a Robe of Useful Items around for pre-combat buffing, and Avengers and Monks have very good reasons to just use the robe all day period. Has any errata been issued to nerf this combo? Has anybody else noticed it?



You could possibly use the Genasi Voidsoul racial power to cause the item to vanish. ;)



This...probably totally works. Any reasons why it wouldn't, gentlemen?
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
So, something I just noticed. The Robe of Useful Items' power replenishes whenever the item disappears. The Artificer's Arcane Rejuvenation kicks in whenever you use a daily item power. Am I missing something, or is this an eternal fountain of THP at the cost of a minor action? There's no reason not to carry a Robe of Useful Items around for pre-combat buffing, and Avengers and Monks have very good reasons to just use the robe all day period. Has any errata been issued to nerf this combo? Has anybody else noticed it?



You could possibly use the Genasi Voidsoul racial power to cause the item to vanish. ;)



This...probably totally works. Any reasons why it wouldn't, gentlemen?


Except that the robe also disappears. Unless you also take that off, and that's one way to get 6 torches. Undecided
If you only need the item to "disapear"....  presidigitation can turn it invisible for a few seconds...  

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Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



Actually, I suggest you time yourself getting dressed some day.  Don't be all in a rush, just get dressed like normal.

I bet you it will take 2-3 minutes, counting shoes, pants, shirt, undergarments, socks, etc.

Now imagine doing that without zippers or velcro.


5 minutes to remove cloth armor doesn't sound like a huge stretch to me.  Sure, it can be done faster, but 5 min is a fairly good benchmark.  Of course, 5 minutes for heavy armor is rather silly in the opposite direction, but you can't win them all.  ;)

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Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



Actually, I suggest you time yourself getting dressed some day.  Don't be all in a rush, just get dressed like normal.

I bet you it will take 2-3 minutes, counting shoes, pants, shirt, undergarments, socks, etc.

Now imagine doing that without zippers or velcro.


5 minutes to remove cloth armor doesn't sound like a huge stretch to me.  Sure, it can be done faster, but 5 min is a fairly good benchmark.  Of course, 5 minutes for heavy armor is rather silly in the opposite direction, but you can't win them all.  ;)



The problem is that this kinda falls down when you realize shoes and co. are actually item slots. This is why it looked so absurd to me. If you assume Cloth Armor includes everything you wear except specific items that changes, of course.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).


Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



Actually, I suggest you time yourself getting dressed some day.  Don't be all in a rush, just get dressed like normal.

I bet you it will take 2-3 minutes, counting shoes, pants, shirt, undergarments, socks, etc.

Now imagine doing that without zippers or velcro.


5 minutes to remove cloth armor doesn't sound like a huge stretch to me.  Sure, it can be done faster, but 5 min is a fairly good benchmark.  Of course, 5 minutes for heavy armor is rather silly in the opposite direction, but you can't win them all.  ;)


Of course, this results in the absurdity of putting on Chain in 5 minutes, or Scale and Plate in anything under 15 minutes.

FWIW, I can go from my skivvies to full BDUs in 3 minutes, add a Flak Jacket and my gear and you get the full 5 (A Wizard would still have an Adventurer's Kit, and you can't just drop those Glass Orbs). A Flight Suit or Riot gear (or Cold Weather gear, for that matter) is going take longer, and not just because of everything not being in the same place, probably comparable to Hide and Chain. I haven't had the pleasure of trying on a space suit, but google reveals 15 minutes to put it on (yahoo answers says 2 hours, but that's absurd, maybe 2 hours to do the paperwork so you can put it on)
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.


Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



Actually, I suggest you time yourself getting dressed some day.  Don't be all in a rush, just get dressed like normal.

I bet you it will take 2-3 minutes, counting shoes, pants, shirt, undergarments, socks, etc.

Now imagine doing that without zippers or velcro.


5 minutes to remove cloth armor doesn't sound like a huge stretch to me.  Sure, it can be done faster, but 5 min is a fairly good benchmark.  Of course, 5 minutes for heavy armor is rather silly in the opposite direction, but you can't win them all.  ;)


Of course, this results in the absurdity of putting on Chain in 5 minutes, or Scale and Plate in anything under 15 minutes.

FWIW, I can go from my skivvies to full BDUs in 3 minutes, add a Flak Jacket and my gear and you get the full 5 (A Wizard would still have an Adventurer's Kit, and you can't just drop those Glass Orbs). A Flight Suit or Riot gear (or Cold Weather gear, for that matter) is going take longer, and not just because of everything not being in the same place, probably comparable to Hide and Chain. I haven't had the pleasure of trying on a space suit, but google reveals 15 minutes to put it on (yahoo answers says 2 hours, but that's absurd, maybe 2 hours to do the paperwork so you can put it on)



Depends what kind of space suit you're talking about - there are several.  If you mean the actual 'float around in the vacuum of space' sort of suit it is a few hours, and you require assistance to do it.  If its the thing they wear floating around in the shuttle yeah, thats pretty quick, 15 min or so.
One thing that needs to be said here: the Artificer was written before Essentials, when item daily powers were limited to 1/2/3 per day +1 per milestone.  Arcane Empowerment and Arcane Rejuvenation aren't meant to operate in a system were item daily powers aren't limited in this way.  This is less an issue of Robe of Useful Items being imbalanced as it is an issue of an O4e class that hasn't been updated to 4eE.


Doesn't that refer to...well, armor? Otherwise you get the Slo-Mo Jacket Montage, which is just nonsensical.



Actually, I suggest you time yourself getting dressed some day.  Don't be all in a rush, just get dressed like normal.

I bet you it will take 2-3 minutes, counting shoes, pants, shirt, undergarments, socks, etc.

Now imagine doing that without zippers or velcro.


5 minutes to remove cloth armor doesn't sound like a huge stretch to me.  Sure, it can be done faster, but 5 min is a fairly good benchmark.  Of course, 5 minutes for heavy armor is rather silly in the opposite direction, but you can't win them all.  ;)


Of course, this results in the absurdity of putting on Chain in 5 minutes, or Scale and Plate in anything under 15 minutes.

FWIW, I can go from my skivvies to full BDUs in 3 minutes, add a Flak Jacket and my gear and you get the full 5 (A Wizard would still have an Adventurer's Kit, and you can't just drop those Glass Orbs). A Flight Suit or Riot gear (or Cold Weather gear, for that matter) is going take longer, and not just because of everything not being in the same place, probably comparable to Hide and Chain. I haven't had the pleasure of trying on a space suit, but google reveals 15 minutes to put it on (yahoo answers says 2 hours, but that's absurd, maybe 2 hours to do the paperwork so you can put it on)



Depends what kind of space suit you're talking about - there are several.  If you mean the actual 'float around in the vacuum of space' sort of suit it is a few hours, and you require assistance to do it.  If its the thing they wear floating around in the shuttle yeah, thats pretty quick, 15 min or so.



... and spending all those Minor Actions on "something".

I just question whether you'd have an Encounter like this, last the whole 5 minutes.
It's not like you are Alpha Striking yourself, but I mean come on ...

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