January in the works: Heores of the Elemental Chaos and more.

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Right here:

www.wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4...

Wizard power previewed, what does Charop think?
Crack the Wall looks like spiffy fun, long as there's plenty of forced movement in play to constantly inflict 8d10 damage every time they're pushed on top of it again (should they fail their save).

I am hoping to sweet, sweet god that the Elementalist actually gives the Sorcerer a huge amount of legroom in regards to powers and other possible poachable elements - because this is pretty much the only time they're probably going to get any support of significance.
The intent of the power seems to be that you don't actually get to throw anyone in the crack, you just get to remove them from play for a bit and create a bit of terrain that could be helpful.

But since the terrain has to follow wall layout, it's irrelevant.  Basically all monsters can "take 1" to jump 5 feet from a standing start after about level 15 or so, and it's a level 29 power.

At 29, half the monsters have a fly speed, so won't take serious damage even if forced into the pit.  The other half have a teleport speed, and almost all of them are large.  So ... the terrain part's really just flavor, or an excuse by the DM to have someone on team PC take 8d10 damage.

So basically, it's a "Ally friendly Removed from Play AoE", which is about right for a level 29 daily.  Except the miss effect's a little weak.

(The confusing part about figuring out where the wall is that doesn't appear to exist and is just used for the targeting template?  Eh... hopefully your DM will be able to figure it out.  You can stack walls if you want to get someone to fall a bit further ... should you actually ever find a target you could use that trick on.)

"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima

Crack the Wall looks like spiffy fun, long as there's plenty of forced movement in play to constantly inflict 8d10 damage every time they're pushed on top of it again (should they fail their save).

I am hoping to sweet, sweet god that the Elementalist actually gives the Sorcerer a huge amount of legroom in regards to powers and other possible poachable elements - because this is pretty much the only time they're probably going to get any support of significance.



Hilarious and appropriate typo. Or was that intentional?
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Because we didn't have enough Wizard support, right?
Because we didn't have enough Wizard support, right?



Well, the thing is, they don't feel magical enough.

Then again, the rest of the Wizard powers could actually be horrible anyway.
I really, really hope they're not bringing in ANOTHER new Wizard build. I'd say that they're pushing it by even giving that class more powers than it already has.
I really, really hope they're not bringing in ANOTHER new Wizard build. I'd say that they're pushing it by even giving that class more powers than it already has.



Last I knew, the sha'ir was confirmed as a wizard build long ago.

And from the looks of the line " includes elemental character themes such as the earthforger, firecrafter, watershaper", people who wanted this book to be Avatar-y got their wish.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
I really, really hope they're not bringing in ANOTHER new Wizard build. I'd say that they're pushing it by even giving that class more powers than it already has.



Last I knew, the sha'ir was confirmed as a wizard build long ago.

And from the looks of the line " includes elemental character themes such as the earthforger, firecrafter, watershaper", people who wanted this book to be Avatar-y got their wish.



And yet, they forgot the true four elements: ">There's DJing, Breaking, Graffitting, and then there's the MC.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
5th wizard subclass?  Alright!  This will be the sorcerer wizard, as opposed to the warlock wizard, the swordmage wizard, and the two wizard wizard subclasses...  I wonder if we are ever going to get a bard wizard.  That would just about round it out as far as all arcane classes just being wizard right?  ;)
No, you forgot the artificer wizard.
No, you forgot the artificer wizard.




Dang it, knew I forgot something...  I guess the implement focused wizard could take over for the atificer...  he'd have to swap ritual for alchemy, but that wouldn't be much of a problem.  Then that just leaves the mage as the only wizard wizard build left.
I'm hoping for more racial support for Genasi and maybe a new Elemental race or two.  Also, I think the Shaman should get a subclass with this book.  Of *all* the primal classes, that one is the one which screams "GIVE ME ELEMENTAL ACCESS!" in some way.  I know they have the Animist shaman in Dark Sun, which kind of does this too, but I was more than that.

Also, another fun subclass which would be neat would be for one of the martial classes.  An elemental Warlord would be fun.   
No, you forgot the artificer wizard.



Leave it to the developers to forget about the Artificer.
5th wizard subclass?  Alright!  This will be the sorcerer wizard, as opposed to the warlock wizard, the swordmage wizard, and the two wizard wizard subclasses...  I wonder if we are ever going to get a bard wizard.  That would just about round it out as far as all arcane classes just being wizard right?  ;)



Actually, the swordmage and the warlock are definitely wizard offsprings (the gish archetype and the "evil" summoner/binder etc).

Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός

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And they work just nicely as separate classes, thank you very much.  At the rate they're going they might as well fold the entire Arcane power source into the Wizard class.
5th wizard subclass?  Alright!  This will be the sorcerer wizard, as opposed to the warlock wizard, the swordmage wizard, and the two wizard wizard subclasses...  I wonder if we are ever going to get a bard wizard.  That would just about round it out as far as all arcane classes just being wizard right?  ;)



Actually, the swordmage and the warlock are definitely wizard offsprings (the gish archetype and the "evil" summoner/binder etc).





Yeah, I know they derive from the wizard originally, but in the last year we've gotten the bladesinger (The wizard-swordmage) and the witch (The wizard-warlock).

They made all these great classes to cover all the different styles of arcane workings, and instead of supporting each class, they instead made subclasses of the wizard to cover all those roles as well. 
And they work just nicely as separate classes, thank you very much.  At the rate they're going they might as well fold the entire Arcane power source into the Wizard class.



Oh, i'm not saying we should go back. Both are very well thought classes.

Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός

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I think they said in one of the Rules of Three articles that they originally had planned to make the Bladesinger be a subclass of the Swordmage but they decided to make it a subclass of the Wizard because that's what it was in older editions - a prestige class requiring someone to be a wizard to gain access to it.

Nevermind that it also required you to be an Elf.

I would have loved to have it be a subclass of Swordmage.  My Gnome swordmage wants to be something else.....   
Nevermind that it also required you to be an Elf.



Still is. Yes, this is as dumb as it sounds.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Nevermind that it also required you to be an Elf.



Still is. Yes, this is as dumb as it sounds.



That's not quite how the 4e Bladesinger works.

The fluff heavily encourages you to be an elf, yes, but that's all. 
I think they said in one of the Rules of Three articles that they originally had planned to make the Bladesinger be a subclass of the Swordmage but they decided to make it a subclass of the Wizard because that's what it was in older editions - a prestige class requiring someone to be a wizard to gain access to it.  



No no no, what that Rule of Three said was that they wanted to have the Bladesinger have iconic wizard spells like Fireball....and a day or two later they erattaed the Rule of Three to say a different spell after the....clear mistake with that statement was pointed out many times.
I think they said in one of the Rules of Three articles that they originally had planned to make the Bladesinger be a subclass of the Swordmage but they decided to make it a subclass of the Wizard because that's what it was in older editions - a prestige class requiring someone to be a wizard to gain access to it.

Nevermind that it also required you to be an Elf.

I would have loved to have it be a subclass of Swordmage.  My Gnome swordmage wants to be something else.....   



Actually it was originally a proficiency that you could take as an elf but you did not have to be a wizard (though to get the full benefits you needed to bea fighter/wizard) and oddly the prestige class did not require you to be a wizard (though that would be the most classic choice).
I think they said in one of the Rules of Three articles that they originally had planned to make the Bladesinger be a subclass of the Swordmage but they decided to make it a subclass of the Wizard because that's what it was in older editions - a prestige class requiring someone to be a wizard to gain access to it.

Nevermind that it also required you to be an Elf.

I would have loved to have it be a subclass of Swordmage.  My Gnome swordmage wants to be something else.....   



Actually they made it a wizard subclass because bladesingers historically had very iconic wizard powers, and the best way they had to give the build those powers was to make it a wizard. It had nothing to do with being a prestige class and everything to do with power selection.

And they work just nicely as separate classes, thank you very much.  At the rate they're going they might as well fold the entire Arcane power source into the Wizard class.



Give that they're trying to push "class" toward being more of an "archetype" I don't doubt this, nor do I mind it. You'd have "Warrior" "Rogue" (maybe ruffian?) "Leader" "Arcanist" etc, etc.

Demonstrating how all those classes branch so effectively from that one tree, I don't at all have a problem with them going that direction in the next-ed of the game. That would actually justify the number of powers the class gets. 

"Not only are you wrong, but I even created an Excel spreadsheet to show you how wrong you are." --James Wyatt, May 2006

Dilige, et quod vis fac

The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.



Isn't that more or less exactly what Resourceful Magician does, and part of the reason it's so good? I wouldn't say it's broken to let a Wizard get that as a PP, but for just about free? No.
Re: Crack the world.

What happens if I miss, but choose not to push the target?
The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.



That is actually a fantastic way to work it.  I might look at using this idea in 4E as well.  
I'm hoping for more racial support for Genasi and maybe a new Elemental race or two.  Also, I think the Shaman should get a subclass with this book.  Of *all* the primal classes, that one is the one which screams "GIVE ME ELEMENTAL ACCESS!" in some way.  I know they have the Animist shaman in Dark Sun, which kind of does this too, but I was more than that.

Also, another fun subclass which would be neat would be for one of the martial classes.  An elemental Warlord would be fun.   



I'd like genasi support too, but THEY are the elemental race!  Please, no more elemental races, especially not two more!!??!
I'm hoping for more racial support for Genasi and maybe a new Elemental race or two.  Also, I think the Shaman should get a subclass with this book.  Of *all* the primal classes, that one is the one which screams "GIVE ME ELEMENTAL ACCESS!" in some way.  I know they have the Animist shaman in Dark Sun, which kind of does this too, but I was more than that.

Also, another fun subclass which would be neat would be for one of the martial classes.  An elemental Warlord would be fun.   



I'd like genasi support too, but THEY are the elemental race!  Please, no more elemental races, especially not two more!!??!



I wouldn't be surpirsed to see another elf or dwarf subrace elemental style.
Dwarves already have the Forgeborn Heritage feat line, actually. The Forgeborn are basically dwarves who are slaves to elementals. I wouldn't mind seeing a complementary subrace option or theme for them, though.

As for Genasi... Thematically, more Genasi support would be appropriate for the Elemental Chaos book, but they're really on the verge of being oversupported as a race.
Yes and no.  I'd lilke to see more support for them that ISN'T just more elements.  Everytime there's a Genasi article, someone pumps out a bunch of souls and racial powers.  There's like 3 or 4 fire-themed souls right now, which is silly.  More general support would be nice, though.
And they work just nicely as separate classes, thank you very much.  At the rate they're going they might as well fold the entire Arcane power source into the Wizard class.



Fine by me.  Wizards are awesome.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.



This idea is brilliant, although I wouldn't necessarily go with zero class-specific spells, "between zero and very few" would be amazing.

It really depends how the other classes are built in 5E.  Basically, I want wizards to have access to iconic spells like Fireball, Magic Missile, Bigby's various Hand, etc.  I don't, however, mind if other arcane classes have access to them too.  So basically, I'd like to see them be wizard-specific IFF no other class already has them.  If Fireball's a sorcerer spell, and Bigby's Hand is an artificer spell, and Magic Missile is a sorcerer spell (and wizards can pick any or all of them), I'm good with that.
The difference between madness and genius is determined only by degrees of success.
The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.



That is actually a fantastic way to work it.  I might look at using this idea in 4E as well.  



Yes, technically it's a fantasic way to work the wizard class.

But then you notice that your level 3 wizard has access to Explosive Pyre, Sleep and Hellish Rebuke...

Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/14.jpg)

The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.



That is actually a fantastic way to work it.  I might look at using this idea in 4E as well.  



Yes, technically it's a fantasic way to work the wizard class.

But then you notice that your level 3 wizard has access to Explosive Pyre, Sleep and Hellish Rebuke...




You're thinking small, Nausicaa. Flame Spiral, then get yourself a party who chucks people around and be a Genasi for Elemental Empower. How do you like your enemies, reduced to -Max HP or just crispy-fried? And if that doesn't work, well, you can always drop a daily on the fight and watch the fireworks.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
Yeah, actually i meant flame spiral ^^ (that wizard, though, could be done at level 1... oh my goodness!)

Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός

IMAGE(http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/14.jpg)

But since the terrain has to follow wall layout, it's irrelevant.  Basically all monsters can "take 1" to jump 5 feet from a standing start after about level 15 or so, and it's a level 29 power.


It could easily be a 2x4 square layout, or 3x3 (missing any 1 square in the zone) square layout... so it may need to jump 10', 15', or 20' (if it is 2x4 in a 10' wide corridor for instance)... not saying it makes it that much more difficult, but those are all valid wall layouts.
The problem with the Wizard class when it came to trying to implement it in 4e is that it has no identifying mechanics. It's just the generalist magic-user, which translated into it being an all-consuming void of spells and feats that kept (and keeps) trying to implement concepts that fit more naturally into other classes but used to be named "wizard".

There's a way they can negate this weakness, though, and that's to make the next Wizard have no class-specific spells, but the ability to select spells freely from any other arcane class. Combine this with the school specialization concept (school keywords now being used for all spells), and you'll have a class that reflects the wizard as the broad-concept "magic user" without stepping on the toes of the more defined classes.

That is actually a fantastic way to work it.  I might look at using this idea in 4E as well.  

Yes, technically it's a fantasic way to work the wizard class.

But then you notice that your level 3 wizard has access to Explosive Pyre, Sleep and Hellish Rebuke...

There have been repeated suggestions that there should be a short list of class-specific powers for every class (or subclass as seems appropriate), and a larger list of power-source-specific powers for every power source. And some role-specific powers for every role.

"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
If any of the players care about optimisation then that would just exacerbate the problem of all characters being the same.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
So, uh, Heroes of the Elemental Chaos? I think there's a different forum for homebrew discussion.
problem of all characters being the same.



1. They are?
2. This is a problem?
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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