11/30/2011 BoaB: "How Could You Be So Heartless?"

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This thread is for discussion of this week's Building on a Budget, which goes live Wednesday morning on magicthegathering.com.

This thread is for discussion of this week's Building on a Budget, which goes live Wednesday morning on magicthegathering.com.


The list seems like it needs a wurmcoil engine(s), but i understand that is not a budget card as it pushes $20, Overall i love the deck, and while i personally like abusing grand architect and Heartless Summoning together, i would be happy to play this deck at any tournament.

On a more Modern note, MATYR OF SANDS... please.
This is pretty neat.  It's quite a bit like those "Eggs" deck back in Odyssey era.
Of course, when a drawback is leveraged into an advantage instead, that's about the time cards get banned or Manaburn gets removed from the rules.
Wow this deck looks like an absolute riot to play with. Although it's not as budget as some people may like, standard right now is pretty tough to play in without some powerful, pricy cards. I can't wait to see what a deck like this does for the current standard meta.
My Heartless Summoning casual deck runs Perilous Research, which makes for some suprise awesomeness. Just thought I'd throw that out there.
Nice deck. I liked reading about some replacements for the expensive cards (Simulacrum and lands). I think it's important to keep that up.

Also, playing Rune-Scarred Demons and Phyrexian Metamorphs like Squadron Hawks is hilarious. I wants.
76125763 wrote:
Zindaras' meta is like a fossil, ancient and its secrets yet to be uncovered. Only men of yore, long dead, knew of it.
This deck looks powerful and fun.  Pricewise, it's in the $100-200 range, which is dirt cheap if you consider recent incarnations of standard that started somewhere in the $300-400 range before you even built the rest of your deck.  I realize that this column has taken more of a competetive slant lately.  I don't expect the $30 cap that previous BOAB authors used, but lament the fact that competetive play has increased so radically in admission, and would like to see you really try at something competetive, but closer to that previous precedent, even if only every once in a while.  I would definitely like to see your thoughts in article form on heartless summoning in modern.  The power/restriction combination of heartless summoning is enticing to many deckbuilders, and I'd like to see if it used and abused in as many formats as it's viable.  Nice article, got my juices flowing!
 Eventually, I decided that it wasn't a huge issue if the deck had one card that was difficult to acquire.



Wouldn't that be Phyrexian Metamorph already?
Im playing a RB Heartless with Inferno Titan,Urabrask and Phyrexian Rager. Once Faithless Looting will be up, it will be even easyer to get your Heartless (been using gitaxian probe just for this reason).

I think best combo for Rune-Scarred is if you have 2 heartless in play: you need 5 mana for: 3 - Rune scarred, 0 - all metamorphs in deck (copy rune scarred, cast metamorph and so on) and 2 - urabrask the hidden (whitch you fetch whith the last metamorph). 

Im also playing 3 mimic vats for recycling.

Good part is that it trashes any token decks with the massacre wurm (should be siboarded) or andy grave titan contol deck.  
Personally, I'm working on a Heartless Summoning / Master Transmuter deck for Modern right now, and I must say that it's looking pretty good. [...] I'd be especially happy if you'd be interested in a Heartless Summoning deck for Modern.

Yes. Yes yes yes. Master Transmuter is one of the most fun cards to play with ever. I'd love a chance to play it competitively.
This is one of your better decks. 

It has a lot going on, which makes it able to change strategy mid-game. A lovely feature that every spike likes. It doesn't seem to break heartless summoning, but it does make it playable in a nice way.

It is funny that it wasn't a loss for your article not to have a sideboard, but i do feel that now that you shorted your article by not having it, you could show more of your thought process designing and refineing your decklist. Afterall, the most important for us to learn building decks is to see others thought-process. It is often much harder to scale back from deck list to the thought process than beginning with thoughts and then make a decklist. besides, it is easy enough to find deck list, finding detailed articles about how to make those decks is much harder.

Again, i like the deck and i think gonna go a head and try to port it into Casual (legacy)^^
How to Autocard
card: [c]cardname[/c]-> [c]Vampire Nighthawk[/c] -> Vampire Nighthawk
Yes. Yes yes yes. Master Transmuter is one of the most fun cards to play with ever. I'd love a chance to play it competitively.



It's one the least fun cards to play against ever. Protecting as a cost? =(
JVL, would love to see your Transmuter list for Modern!
Also, I have been using Heartless Summoning/Rune-scarred/Metamorph in a straight black deck with mixed results, but much prefer your build. Guess I need to get my hands on some Solem Simalcrums.
Also, Sheoldred Whispering One- would fit nicely in the decklist. She dominates and is a great finisher after a boardsweep.
You could further budgetize the deck by replacing the Phyrexian Metamorphs with Clones. You don't have the option of paying life instead of mana, so you can't do that cast-one-Rune-Scarred-Demon-tutor-Metamorph-cast-it-as-a-Demon-for-six-mana-total trick*, but other than that it's just as good. It doesn't die to artifact removal, and you don't have any noncreature artifacts in the deck you'd want to copy anyway**. If you made that swap, the only cards in this deck that cost more than $2 are the dual lands and the Black Sun's Zenith.

This is a good article and looks like a good deck. I might try to make it myself. The demons and sphinxes are going for less than 50 cents each...

* At least not unless you have two Heartless Summonings out, and if you have two Heartless Summonings the trick in JVL's version of the deck wouldn't cost six mana either, so never mind.

** Sure, you could also use it to copy your opponent's noncreature artifacts. One time I was playing my Wolf Run Ramp variant deck and pulled my Metamorph out of the sideboard and wound up copying my opponent's Sword of Feast and Famine. This deck, though, can just Mana Leak any sword it sees.
Did you try Semblance Anvil?  Added redundancy, worse drawback?
Sometimes, this deck just goes insane. Playing a similar deck with Grand Architect as back-up, it has done 5 rune-scarred demons on turn 5 which is 25 flying power.
Nice decklist. I should mention that the Budget part of the deckbuilding could use some work. I was afraid you might start with Wurmcoil engines, but you did not even mention them, good job!

Steel Hellkite is a very good addition to make short work of any permantents your opponent has, and works good as a finisher.

I would have preferred a deck based on the more budget friendly Grand Architect, but alas, you are not Ben.. mise..

Deck as is (without SB) will set you back around 100$. (just providing info here, you draw the Budget conclusion for yourself and your wallet.)
 Eventually, I decided that it wasn't a huge issue if the deck had one card that was difficult to acquire.



Wouldn't that be Phyrexian Metamorph already?



I got a free one just for showing up to a limited event. That card wasn't hard to get at all.


To Jacob, I'd love to see competitive modern decks that don't contain 4x tarmagoyf.    
jacob leave this colum plz.
jacob leave this colum plz.



Why? He just created an entirely competitive, entirely rogue deck for standard. If it costs $100-so what? The card pool is very limited right now. I made a Kuldotha Rebirth deck that costs less than $10. It sucks. It needs Hero of Oxid Ridge. That sets you back $8.50*4=$34. Currently, I play rally the forces in place of the Hero-a strictly WORSE card.

Budget really is subjective, based on the format and the deck. Currently, we've got a 5 set standard environment. That's ridiculously small. The card pool of good Spike cards is limited, therefore driving up the price. Of the final list, I don't have the dual lands (replaceable), solemn simulacrums (replacable), BSZ (easy-ish to get where I play) and 3 rune-scarred demons (Who the heck wants Rune-Scarred Demon?). He lists replacements for each card that's really hard to get. I picked up a playset of Metamorph at the RELEASE of New Phyrexia, because I identified it as a ridiculously good card, and got it before the increase in price.

I've also got a playset of Nevermore, which is VERY good, and will only be a while before people notice it. I identify undervalued cards to trade for a profit when they go up. I held onto the Scars Elspeth because I saw that someone was going to break the card eventually. I traded for it at it's low price, then when Token decks started blowing up, I traded it off for an entire deck's rares. It's not that hard. Watch the rogue decks that start winning, and pick up their major cards.
Great improvement in article.
Yes, the deck as built mid ranges at $140.
However, he clearly states how to replace dual lands which are $60.
Only 2 Metamorphs in deck which are Avg $6 and were promos.
2 Black suns Zeniths at $4 avg is not bad.  4 Heartless summoning averages $2.50ish
Even the single massacre wurm averages under $3.
Rune Scars are under $1 with 4 of in the deck

Magic isn't cheap, but being able to buy 13 staple of the deck for under $40 with only the Simulacrum as an outlier.
He talks about the Simulacrum at $9 which is pricy for a budget but budget means choosing your resources so you can allow 4 of sometimes.

Current state, $140 isn't something you rush and spend but at $80 for the land and if you have 1/4 of the cards, you spend $20 a month for three months and you're there.
You could further budgetize the deck by replacing the Phyrexian Metamorphs with Clones.

Clone is not currently legal in Standard; it was in M11 but not M12.
I love the deck, and am currently running a BUDGET Laughing version, using 4xSphinx, and 2xSteel Hellkite, instead of Simulacrums & Metamorphs. That will change soon enough tho.

Anyway, yes, please do some Modern decks! 

I do not wish to participate in this Community Site.

Jacob, thanks for the great article. A lot of good ideas in there.

I'm currently toying with a blue/black draw/discard deck for standard and was looking for a good finisher. This deck gave me lots of ideas to incorporate. It was also eye-opening to see your thinking in the first match about killing your opponent's one-mana drop knowing that they likely wouldn't have a turn two play. Having been away from MTG for so many years these kinds of insights are very helpful in getting back into the game with some amount of competitive play.

"Current state, $140 isn't something you rush and spend but at $80 for the land and if you have 1/4 of the cards, you spend $20 a month for three months and you're there."

Of course, in three months there will be a new set to be drooling over and five new "latest and greatest" decks in the meta game ;)
Awesome article, as usual. I would greatly enjoy reading about some budget decks for Modern. I have not been able to beat zoo consistently with anything budget except for the Martyr of Sands.dec, which dies horribly to combo. Help!
This deck looks powerful and fun.  Pricewise, it's in the $100-200 range, which is dirt cheap if you consider recent incarnations of standard that started somewhere in the $300-400 range before you even built the rest of your deck.



Except that $100-200 is not "dirt cheap", even compared to $300-400.  Cheaper, yes, but half the cost does not qualify as "dirt cheap."  I know terms can be somewhat subjective, but "dirt cheap" generally refers to an amount that is so miniscule that you wouldn't think twice about paying for it.  I think there are a lot of players here who would think very carefully before dropping $100-$200 on a deck.

Once again, there are many suggestions in this thread for reducing the cost of the deck, but people shouldn't have to come to the forums to find out how to make a BoaB deck actually budget-friendly, and it definitely should not be necessary for the readers to do JVL's job for him!

it's very simple:
-nice deck
-high price

no way i will (and can) ever build it.
magic isn't realy populair in my surroundings, making trading hard. i dont just spent about 100+ bucks to beat my brother up.
building on a budget isn't about the budget anymore, but about making  rogue decks. 
I really like this deck, thank you for posting it. I also really appreciate the suggestions on how to make it more budget friendly. I could probably acquire the Simulacrums or the dual lands, but not both, and this gives me a good idea on how to replace them. 

I am interested in seeing what the decklist is for the "Dr. Manhattan" deck that this is derived from though. I've been trying to find one on Starcity or tcgplayer, but haven't been able to locate one. Can anyone help me out and point to that list? 

Thanks in advance! 
it's very simple:
-nice deck
-high price

no way i will (and can) ever build it.
magic isn't realy populair in my surroundings, making trading hard. i dont just spent about 100+ bucks to beat my brother up.
building on a budget isn't about the budget anymore, but about making  rogue decks. 



Don't blame the author, the secondary market has gone way up for standard and there's really not many decks that can stand a chance without a few expensive cards.  In reality, as long as you've bought any sealed products of magic, you probably have some stuff you can trade towards the few money cards you need.


On another note, I'd love to see the Heartless Transmuter deck, I've wanted to use that card for a long time now. 

Don't blame the author, the secondary market has gone way up for standard and there's really not many decks that can stand a chance without a few expensive cards.  In reality, as long as you've bought any sealed products of magic, you probably have some stuff you can trade towards the few money cards you need.

 



Just like i said, i do not have a lot of trading possibilities. And just like i said, it is not about building on a budget anymore, your poste is just proving it.
In the past BoaB was about kitchen table and casual magic, it is not now. Just read some of the older article and you will understand.
This deck is Timmy approved!

Timmy-Spike is easily the hardest paired personality archetype to satisfy and I really love it when it comes together (much like the world champ deck).

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From Mark Rosewater's Tumblr: the0uroboros asked: How in the same set can we have a hexproof, unsacrificable(not a word) creature AND a land that makes it uncounterable. How does this lead to interactive play? I believe I’m able to play my creature and you have to deal with it is much more interactive than you counter my creature.

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Post #777

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MaRo: One of the classic R&D stories happened during a Scars of Mirrodin draft. Erik Lauer was sitting to my right (meaning that he passed to me in the first and third packs). At the end of the draft, Erik was upset because I was in his colors (black-green). He said, "Didn't you see the signals? I went into black-green in pack one." I replied, "Didn't you see my signals? I started drafting infect six drafts ago."

***************************************************************************************

MaRo: I redesigned him while the effect was on the stack.


Don't blame the author, the secondary market has gone way up for standard and there's really not many decks that can stand a chance without a few expensive cards.  In reality, as long as you've bought any sealed products of magic, you probably have some stuff you can trade towards the few money cards you need.

 



Just like i said, i do not have a lot of trading possibilities. And just like i said, it is not about building on a budget anymore, your poste is just proving it.
In the past BoaB was about kitchen table and casual magic, it is not now. Just read some of the older article and you will understand.

Are you really complaining about this not being a budget deck to play casual? This is BoaB not Building for Casual Play. It is a super budget for competitive play. You simply aren't playing competitively. That's your problem. If you want to beat your brother with a $30 deck; buy an event deck.

In addition, not many people play STANDARD casually.
In addition, not many people play STANDARD casually.



Actually I think a lot of people play Standard casually. Sometimes intentionally, as it's easier to design decks to deal with the more limited card pool of Standard. Sometimes unintenionally, purely because they want to design a thematic deck, and sometimes that works best in a block/core set. 

(First time poster)

How about Myr Superion for this deck?
A 5/6 creature for zero mana (when heartless summoning is in play) seems like a pretty good deal. The card isn't very expensive either!
 Are you really complaining about this not being a budget deck to play casual? This is BoaB not Building for Casual Play. It is a super budget for competitive play. You simply aren't playing competitively. That's your problem. If you want to beat your brother with a $30 deck; buy an event deck.

In addition, not many people play STANDARD casually.



BoaB isn't budget for competitive play either jugding by previous authors, so what exectly is your point?

Don't blame the author, the secondary market has gone way up for standard and there's really not many decks that can stand a chance without a few expensive cards.   



Considering that the author has previously stated that he basically doesn't care about his readers' budgets in a column about budget decks, and that he intends to continue to design decks without budget limitations, I think we can definitely blame the author.
 Eventually, I decided that it wasn't a huge issue if the deck had one card that was difficult to acquire.



Wouldn't that be Phyrexian Metamorph already?



I got a free one just for showing up to a limited event. That card wasn't hard to get at all.



That's true but if you want to buy them they're equally expensive. 
I'm sorry, firstly for people like me who likes to read articles on the net that talks about budget deck that we'll agree to it that all the deck is about the same price. one week he released a deck that cost $ 140 worse the week after the deck will cost $ 100 its good that the author, but a limited budget for all the deck and it must not exceed.
any deck that I built but costs between $ -300 $ 200, but some deck costs only $ 60 from the deck kind of curse of prey stalked or deck Phyrexian suicide li took two months before.
I read an article on a deck that is funny to see a play and see the other with a solar flare worse have difficulty in the other run. my best example two months before innistrade happens, I played a deck with Sarkhan the mad. we'll agree that Sarkhan IS very Powerful except that it is not too out of what we're going to deck. The funny thing is that I played and no one is prepared to see Sarkhan back on the battlefield worst that laugh in their faces, everyone was surprised to see that day, I shot 3 caw-blade sense to have the difficulty.
I wander a little off topic, my goal was that people want to read building on a budget spineless see a shady deck, but remaining in the competitive.

















This deck looks powerful and fun.  Pricewise, it's in the $100-200 range, which is dirt cheap if you consider recent incarnations of standard that started somewhere in the $300-400 range before you even built the rest of your deck.  I realize that this column has taken more of a competetive slant lately.  I don't expect the $30 cap that previous BOAB authors used, but lament the fact that competetive play has increased so radically in admission, and would like to see you really try at something competetive, but closer to that previous precedent, even if only every once in a while.  I would definitely like to see your thoughts in article form on heartless summoning in modern.  The power/restriction combination of heartless summoning is enticing to many deckbuilders, and I'd like to see if it used and abused in as many formats as it's viable.  Nice article, got my juices flowing!



One of the things that authors should know, is that they need to give their audience what they want. I could care less how much a competative standard deck costs. I want a budget deck. A "cheap for standard" deck IS NOT budget.

Having said that, this is an entertaining deck. This is something I would expect to see in From the Lab, where budget doesn't matter. With all the build up, I'd have expected more, though. It doesn't impress. It isn't an original idea. It isn't something out of left field. 

This isn't complaining, this is constructive criticism. I did like, and hope he continues, doing the "Making it more budget friendly" section, as an actual BoaB column must wait till the next author comes.

MaRo: One of the classic R&D stories happened during a Scars of Mirrodin draft. Erik Lauer was sitting to my right (meaning that he passed to me in the first and third packs). At the end of the draft, Erik was upset because I was in his colors (black-green).

He said, "Didn't you see the signals? I went into black-green in pack one."

I replied, "Didn't you see my signals? I started drafting infect six drafts ago." ************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************MaRo: During a playtest, I played a Reaper from the Abyss. I attacked each turn, while my opponent would chump block (he had a lot of fliers), and then I killed a second creature. This happened until he had only one creature left. I attack, he blocked, and then the following dialogue occurred:

Him: Kill your demon. Me: What? Him: My guy died so you have to kill a creature.

Me: Yeah, but why would a demon kill himself?

Him: I don't know. He's depressed there's no one left to kill.

Me: That doesn't make any sense. Him: I don't care. It's what the card says. I then take out my pen, and wrote "non-Demon" on it.

Him: You can't do that.

Me: I redesigned him while the effect was on the stack.

Solemn Simulacrum is NOT A FREAKIN' BUDGET CARD, neither is Metamorph. That said, I have a slight budget (I draw the line at 30$ cards) and I would certainly enjoy piloting this beast.
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