Dragon's Roar is a sick deck.

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I don't get why people think DR is the worst deck. I am experimenting with a build right now and am currently enjoying about a 75% win rate...give or take 5%.

I tried making this a mono red and was having moderate success just pumping the 2/2 whelps and spanking my opponent for 10 dmg a turn but I ran into problems with removal...i didn't have it and my whelps were getting removed.

I also threw in the life gain cards just for the hell of it. It was pretty funny playing against unquenchable fire. I had all three out and was actually gaining 1 life each time he cast punishing fire.

My current build is red black...mainly because I wanted to keep the demon dragon discard card...wow is it ever game over if I ever get that thing out. Some mana problems occasionally. Took the whelps out and put as many black cards in there as possible so I have about 50/50 red/black land.

The deck doesn't have hexproof so many times you lose a dragon or two..but i kept the grave diggers in which gets me them right back. I also left in the the artifact cards that reduce the casting cost of my birds. Took out all of the volcanic dragons due to mana curve. I like the rorik bladewing for haste.

Thoughts? The scorpion death touches are good too. Anyone else like the deck?
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
i love how in 2HG that combined with the Grave Whispers deck, the discarding ability of the GW and the hastiness of some dragons. Buys some time to get some awesome dragons.
I love to play with the underdog decks, and have had a lot of success with fine tuned Apex/Cloudburst decks but I simply cannot win consistently with the dragon deck.

I've tried mono red and it surprised some people with big fast flyers if I could keep dragonspeaker shaman alive, but at only 2/2 he is easily burned away before I can get any dragons on the board. 

When using black/red I have even less success. Everything is so slow, the giant scorpion can be cast on turn 3 to slow a ground attack, but at best they trade themselves for something bigger, and cannot do any damage with 1 power.
Assassinate is the worst removal in the game imo, you have to wait for a creature to be cast, attack you, and then spend 3 mana to kill it during your own turn as it is a sorcery.
Rally the forces is a very poor version of thunder strike, it costs more to cast and only has an effect when you are attacking.
Sure if one of your dragons bites the dust, you can bring him back to your hand with gravedigger but you have to spend 4 mana to cast it and you are stuck with a 2/2 creature on the board defending you at a critical point in the game (if you have enough land to have dragons on the board, your opponent will have something dangerous out as well).


I love Dragons and play it a lot. Honestly might be my favorite deck. Currently running mono red. Either you get the perfect hand and destroy them quickly or you lose. I keep all of the Volcanic Dragons because I like the haste, and I also run Crucible of Fire. I tried it B/R but the mana problems always seem to kill you. I've never tried Malfegor because it just does not seem worth it.

My final word though is that it is not one of the better decks.

@JJDM: Rally the Forces is sick! Catches people offgaurd a lot, since I don't think many people run it. Use it as removal with your goblins to take out their 2/2's.
I'm curious, since every deck you happen to play seems to be god tier, what do you think are the 3 worst decks?
I'm curious, since every deck you happen to play seems to be god tier, what do you think are the 3 worst decks?



I don't know if it's the deck maybe it's just me. I play my opponent, not my cards and probably outplay most people. The way I tweek the deck def might be part of it also. I see people use so many useless cards in their builds it's incredible. I also see people leave out some really underrated cards that can be game changers...wall of air for example in ROI.

Three worst decks? All of the decks are decent in the right hands. You can only really say some decks have more unfavorable match ups than others.

1. cloudburst (its paper and everything else is scissors except ROI, which it consistently crushes) the only favorable match up is ROI for CB.

2. Apex pred (should statistically beat UF and SoS the majority of the time)

3. SoS

With the worst being CB and the second worst AP, etc.....

Overall the game designers did a decent job with balancing issues with the exception of auramancer, which is way overpowered. The "worst" deck CB consistently winning against the "best" deck ROI is a nice touch by design team.

Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
The reason aura is over powered is there is a high probability that you can be dealt a "nut hand"...that's a poker term that means "unbeatable hand" to which there is no counter by any deck....it's simply game over.

These scenarios include the ledgewalker or sacred wolf card in the starting hand with plenty of land and some juicy auras with the trash aura that creates the 1/1 saplings so a sacrifice creature card has no effect, they just sack the saplings.

The other scenario is plenty of creatures and the aura that makes a creature hexproof.

the auramancer deck is just silly and has no business being in a competitive card game.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali


I've tried mono red and it surprised some people with big fast flyers if I could keep dragonspeaker shaman alive, but at only 2/2 he is easily burned away before I can get any dragons on the board. 






Believe me if get that card, it stays in my hand. At least until I have enough land where I can cast a haste dragon the same turn. Try it, just don't give them the opportunity to burn it. You don't have to cast every card in your starting hand right away.

The same goes for the card that produces a free dragon if you control 5 lands. Don't cast that one until you have 5 lands.

Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
I tried to like this deck but i simply cant, :R::B: is a deadly combination (just look at Edge of Madness in d09), but here, its a waste, being 90% mono-red, crappy black removal and dragons (with a few exceptions) and mana issues are enough to not like it, and i still think this is the worst deck in the game, even worse than cloudburst.










It would be cool without the goblins. More burn, better removal than Assassinate and just dragons, shamans and maybe some drakes.
Malfegor is becoming one of my favorite cards to play. He's such a beating and I've only been displeased once to cast him only because I missed a third mountain drop for Rorix the turn before and I couldn't wait any longer to wreck my opponent's side. Outside that one time, I find it fairly easy to sit on excess lands and bad cards and turn them into Cruel Edicts off my dragon. It's all about timing to get the most advantage out of him. It does suck to see him eat removal right away though or if you ever have to play him where your opponent still has like 4+ cards in hand and you just dumped yourself to zero as they know you have nothing and they could still be sitting on threats. Whatever, fun card and highly rewarding to play.


I've tried mono red and it surprised some people with big fast flyers if I could keep dragonspeaker shaman alive, but at only 2/2 he is easily burned away before I can get any dragons on the board. 






Believe me if get that card, it stays in my hand. At least until I have enough land where I can cast a haste dragon the same turn. Try it, just don't give them the opportunity to burn it. You don't have to cast every card in your starting hand right away.

The same goes for the card that produces a free dragon if you control 5 lands. Don't cast that one until you have 5 lands.




This defeats the whole purpose of Dragonspeaker. By the time you could play the Shaman along with a hasted dragon, you'd be at 7 mana and wouldn't need it anyway.
Holding back the Outcast is important though, as it doesn't help much early on and will probably see less removal later on. 
Dragon's Roar is one of my favorite decks and definitely very underestimated by a lot of players. A lot of cards in the deck don't look impressive at first but you can create some nice combos. DLC1 unlocks didn't improve the deck that much but they helped imroving the mana count. I hope we actually see 2x [C]Terminate[/C] in DLC2. This card is a must for this deck.

IMAGE(http://oi39.tinypic.com/14mvxh5.jpg)

Not nearly as good as the Dragon Deck in DoP 2009 but still can be fun.


I've tried mono red and it surprised some people with big fast flyers if I could keep dragonspeaker shaman alive, but at only 2/2 he is easily burned away before I can get any dragons on the board. 






Believe me if get that card, it stays in my hand. At least until I have enough land where I can cast a haste dragon the same turn. Try it, just don't give them the opportunity to burn it. You don't have to cast every card in your starting hand right away.




That doesn't even make sense.   By the time you could cast the shaman and a haste dragon in the same turn, you could have simply cast the haste dragon 2 turns earlier.  If you already have board control i guess you could afford to wait, but at a point where you are just casting your first dragon, you wouldn't want to wait 2 turns and let your opponenet either get a few attacks in and/or let your opponent get away from taking 8 or more damage.  So, you are either wasting 2 turns when you could have ended the game earlier or you are just making a bad play.

You're a lose cannon.

 

 

"I played 70 card decks before it was cool to play 70 card decks." -Random M:tG hipster


Three worst decks? All of the decks are decent in the right hands. You can only really say some decks have more unfavorable match ups than others.

3. SoS

Overall the game designers did a decent job with balancing issues with the exception of auramancer, which is way overpowered.



I play SoS a lot and win a lot too. There's really no secret with it; just smash your opponent. I think that's kind of the theme of the deck anyways.

I don't know whether Auramancer is overpowered, but I don't hate it for it. I love playing it and don't think it should be removed. Machinations can beat it, and I just beat I guy with Dragons. Aura is a fast, reliable deck, but I don't have a problem with it the way you do. RoI can obviously also beat it.

Speaking of RoI, I don't run Wall of Air and don't know why anyone ever would.

edit: on second thought, probably the most important card in SoS is Spikeshot Elder. Best utility card ever. Never play him turn one. The ultimate homerun play is turn 7, drop him and Claws of Valakut. 8 damage at instant speed to a creature or the face. Love it.

That doesn't even make sense.   By the time you could cast the shaman and a haste dragon in the same turn, you could have simply cast the haste dragon 2 turns earlier.  If you already have board control i guess you could afford to wait, but at a point where you are just casting your first dragon, you wouldn't want to wait 2 turns and let your opponenet either get a few attacks in and/or let your opponent get away from taking 8 or more damage.  So, you are either wasting 2 turns when you could have ended the game earlier or you are just making a bad play.



You don't get it. Neither does geliosch.

Playing the dragonspeaker shaman on turn three is awful play. That was my main point. You'd be suprised how often I see an opponent blow a burn card on a goblin or something crappy just because they are impatient or don't want to get chump blocked. If the they keep the board clean they think they can swing in for 3 damage every turn and are set. I'm just speaking from experience, which you may or may not have playing this deck.

So wait to turn six and then cast the shaman. You should have a few goblins down by then and they might think ur card dead. That only gives the opponent one turn to decide if they want to play their big creature or burn your crappy 3 mana card. Since you are playing the shaman late mid game they might wrongly assume you just drew it off of the top of your library and don't hold any haste dragons in your hand. This is because most idiots play the shaman on turn three if they have it in their starting hand. So they might be willing to gamble with you that or don't have a dragon, or they may have used up all of their instants at that point. Last point is that a 2/2 creature played late middle game might not be percieved as the main threat. You could easily have a 3/3 or better creature out at that point which appears more menacing. Of course when I play the shaman, I'm sitting on a rorix or that bad ass demon dragon.

Last and final point to consider is that because of the red ruby card, it is possible to cast a dragonspeaker shaman, and not one but two dragons, in a single turn. Neither of you took that card into consideration and the synergy it has with the shaman.






Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
you wouldn't want to wait 2 turns and let your opponenet either get a few attacks in and/or let your opponent get away from taking 8 or more damage.  So, you are either wasting 2 turns when you could have ended the game earlier or you are just making a bad play.



Ideally,....you have a giant scorpion down and it's a stalemate because they don't want to lose a good creature to the death touch ability.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
you wouldn't want to wait 2 turns and let your opponenet either get a few attacks in and/or let your opponent get away from taking 8 or more damage.  So, you are either wasting 2 turns when you could have ended the game earlier or you are just making a bad play.



Ideally,....you have a giant scorpion down and it's a stalemate because they don't want to lose a good creature to the death touch ability.



g0mbl3rr,

Want to post your deck with a card analysis?

That doesn't even make sense.   By the time you could cast the shaman and a haste dragon in the same turn, you could have simply cast the haste dragon 2 turns earlier.  If you already have board control i guess you could afford to wait, but at a point where you are just casting your first dragon, you wouldn't want to wait 2 turns and let your opponenet either get a few attacks in and/or let your opponent get away from taking 8 or more damage.  So, you are either wasting 2 turns when you could have ended the game earlier or you are just making a bad play.



You don't get it. Neither does geliosch.

Playing the dragonspeaker shaman on turn three is awful play. That was my main point. You'd be suprised how often I see an opponent blow a burn card on a goblin or something crappy just because they are impatient or don't want to get chump blocked. If the they keep the board clean they think they can swing in for 3 damage every turn and are set. I'm just speaking from experience, which you may or may not have playing this deck.

So wait to turn six and then cast the shaman. You should have a few goblins down by then and they might think ur card dead. That only gives the opponent one turn to decide if they want to play their big creature or burn your crappy 3 mana card. Since you are playing the shaman late mid game they might wrongly assume you just drew it off of the top of your library and don't hold any haste dragons in your hand. This is because most idiots play the shaman on turn three if they have it in their starting hand. So they might be willing to gamble with you that or don't have a dragon, or they may have used up all of their instants at that point. Last point is that a 2/2 creature played late middle game might not be percieved as the main threat. You could easily have a 3/3 or better creature out at that point which appears more menacing. Of course when I play the shaman, I'm sitting on a rorix or that bad ass demon dragon.

Last and final point to consider is that because of the red ruby card, it is possible to cast a dragonspeaker shaman, and not one but two dragons, in a single turn. Neither of you took that card into consideration and the synergy it has with the shaman.




The only one missing the point is you. Almost all your dragons are 6 mana or less, so what's the point of holding back your replacement for mana acceleration until you don't need it anymore? Even if I only hold back the Shaman until turn 5, there's still a good chance I'll be able to cast my dragon with the next landdrop anyway. Great, your mid-late game Shaman survived, but it doesn't serve it's purpose anymore. Maybe your opponents are absolutely right to ignore it, as it is indeed not the main threat once you have more than 4 lands.

This leads to the next point: Which removal do you want to bait, the one on your shaman or the one on your dragon? Everything similar to Doomblade or Go For The Throat will be better spent on the actual dragon, rather than the weenie that makes it come out 1-2 turns earlier. Then there's things like burn or Vicious Hunger among others that aren't quite enough to kill a dragon on their own. In case they have multiple copies of these, I'd prefer them to waste one on the shaman to reduce the chances of my dragon getting nuked. Playing the Shaman asap will not only make the most out of it's ability if unanswered, it makes your dragons more likely to survive if answered. The longer you hold it back, the less likely it is to have either of these beneficial effects and be reduced to a 2/2 with a pointless ability.

Once again your flawed logic paired with a healthy dose of arrogance is funny and sad at once.
I had a much longer post, but Gegliosch kind of posts what I was going to say.

I can understand trying to keep the Shaman as a lategame play, but I don't think the deck actually rewards you for such a play. Unless you can take advantage of the extra mana you might generate the following turns, the Shaman is not nearly the same threat it is in the early game. Early game, it's a threat as it potentially grants the ability to dump any of your threats on the table the next turn. At that point in the game, your opponent pretty much needs removal for that dragon as it'll be difficult to answer in combat. This usually means the Shaman is removal bait. Depending on the removal used on it, this can be a good thing.

I think Gegliosch is right with threat assessment lategame. The Shaman isn't the threat, but the dragon that threatens to win the game. Unless you can ensure multiple threats a turn for the following turns or control the board with disruption with the extra mana along with a threat, the Shaman is pretty much useless. Too bad the deck doesn't have a way to generate continuous card advantage to keep a hand full of threats and answers.
You can play the shaman as removal bait but i personally don't. to each his own. I don't put all my cards on the table unless I need to. Losing one of two shamans to a burn like vicious hunger is a huge waste of a turn, a card, and a valuable resource. I haven't posted my deck list yet but I suspect it may be different from most peoples. haste is huge. when you can cast 2 6/6 dragons with haste in a single turn and have a gravedigger in your hand, that's huge.

I've maximized the efficiency/synergy. There's no card I haven't thought about. everything is included for a reason. I may not type out the decklist / reasoning now because it is a lot of typing.

I just shat all over elves two times in a row with earthquake. Last night I took out a really good player with what I consider the best BH build (cultist, aristocrat, malakir, flying skeletal synergy).

I'm not saying you're going to win everytime with dragons. Sure you can get counterspelled to hell or run into your friend sacred wolf with giantaform or angelic destiny.

All i'm saying is that the deck doesn't get enough credit and is extremely under-rated. In the hands of a deep thinking player like myself, you can tear new orifices.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
Losing one of two shamans to a burn like vicious hunger is a huge waste of a turn, a card, and a valuable resource.



If the Shaman was indeed a good late-game card that would be true. However, it is not and you should play it at the peak of it's usefulness. If it baits removal, even better, your opponent loses time and resources as well and chances are you're playing the slower deck, benefiting more from this trade-off. Plus the removal doesn't hit one of your real threats.

when you can cast 2 6/6 dragons with haste in a single turn and have a gravedigger in your hand, that's huge.



Oh that's how you win this consistently, you have these awesome imaginary 6/6 haste dragons that even put Rorix to shame with his 6/5. When you're ready to play two of these in one turn after your 8th land drop and with a Shaman out, the game shall be yours indeed.

In the hands of a deep thinking player like myself, you can tear new orifices.



I refused to think you're trolling for quite some time, but I honestly hope I was wrong.
Holding back your Dragonspeaker Shaman is bad play imo. It's a ramp card and thats how it should be played. It's mostly useless after you have 5-6 lands.

I do wish there was some way to make the dragons hexproof/shroud though. DR is far too vulnerable to removal with its expensive flying fatties and no way to keep them alive. Mind Control is even worse of course.
DR is far too vulnerable to removal with its expensive flying fatties and no way to keep them alive. Mind Control is even worse of course.



That's why holding onto the shaman is a good play. The ideal strategy is waiting for one big "kill turn". a turn where you overrun with haste.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
In order to have a big "kill turn" you'd have to cast your Dragonspeaker Shaman for 3 cmc, followed by Volcanic Dragon, Hellkite Charger or Rorix Bladewing which have cost 4 cmc after the shaman is on the board. If you had 7 lands you could summon one of these dragons the same turn as your shaman and you'd only inflict 6 damage at the most.

I feel like most of the time I'm already finished by turn 7 when using this deck. 

dreaming of situations where you have a smooth ramp to 11 lands so you can play 2 big dragons after your shaman is not realistic.  the game is over quite often by then ( & even then, this nets you a whopping 1 mana benefit--yeh!! ).

shaman is a glorified gray ogre.  it CAN be awesome, but that is usually up to your opponent to decide, not you.  i don't like that.  give me 4 rubies any day.

small note on assassinate--it has niche benefits against creatures with tapping abilities.  you can pause during your second main phase after their creature effects have resolved & cast at sorcery speed.  ( i agree it still sucks--please give us terminate, omg. )
small note on assassinate--it has niche benefits against creatures with tapping abilities.  you can pause during your second main phase after their creature effects have resolved & cast at sorcery speed.  ( i agree it still sucks--please give us terminate, omg. )

What's slightly annoying here is that Assassinate is getting an added benefit it shouldn't have assuming the other player knew what he was doing. When I want to activate Prodigal Pyromancer, in most cases I want to activate it during the end step to ping an opponent for one. Sadly, the game doesn't have an end phase so all activated abilities that are done during "end step" are technically second main phase as far as the game cares.

Ok here it is. Pro malfegor build + stats/reasoning.

DR 63 total cards

24 land
16 mountains
8 swamps      **this is the max amt of swamps possible. you need all 8 approx drawing 2 swamps every 15 cards if you run malfegor. This means every black card MUST be included for the malfegor build** Having 7 or less swamps in your deck is just silly if you intend to play malfegor.

burst lightning 2x great for surgically taking out a 2 tough card or kicked can take out a serra angel Going directly for opponent with both kicked cards can knock him down to 12 life, which is 2 haste dragons away from a win.
disfigure 3x a terrible card but must be included to maximize swamps for malfegor
dragonmaster outcast 1x always played on a turn where you will have 6 lands the following turn. No sooner than that. Put your opponent to the test by casting this even later, on the same turn as a big dragon. You want the other player making big decisions not you.

earthquake 1x game winner vs elves/vamps/wielding steel. can be used to take out hexproof creatures.
pyroclasm 1x another game winner vs above decks + your giant scorpions will survive it.
ruby medallion 2x bad card but in this creative build works well with dragonspeaker shaman + not many decks with artifact removal
slavering nulls 2x great early game for some discard if you are lucky. food for voracious dragon late game
festering goblin 2x same as above except can be used to remove an annoying 1/1 like tormented soul
dragon fodder 3x "" chump blockers/food
assassinate 2x needed for swamps
dragonspeaker shaman 2x played mid/late game unless you start with 2 of them. He's not useless despite what the inexperienced posters above believe. You can use him to cast multiple dragons and win in 1 turn late game or just use the card as a creature sac when you play malfegor. You want as many cards in your hand as possible when you play the demon dragon.
giant scorpion 2x great blocker. fits the strategy of the deck perfectly...stall early game, then destroy late game.
crucible of fire 1x deadly combo with furnace whelp early/mid game
furnace whelp 3x initially i took these out..reasoning being not as many mountains to pump but realized no other good creatures in this mana range + can get a nice bonus from above card.
grave digger 2x keep these in your hand to get back a dragon or to discard after playing malfegor.
voracious dragon 2x great burst from devour which can be used to remove creatures or direct damage. the goblins are worthless by the time you can play this card anyway.
hellkite charger 1x phenomenal finisher.
malfegor 1x one of the most fun cards to play in the game. The reason you don't play all of your cards early and the reason you have all of the black cards in the deck.
rorix bladewing 1x great card.
furyborn hellkite 1x you may want to run 1x volcanic dragon instead. up to you. This deck loses to blue mindcontrol/bribe anyway, might as well have a 12/12 dragon.
dragon's claw 2x I'm going to get criticized for including these, but they win games against UF and SoS if you can get just one of them out.

My matchup stats:

vs any BH build: 60% winrate, slightly favored.
vs GoTW: 80% winrate
vs AP: 90% winrate
vs WS: 70% winrate unless they have stoneforge mystic in opening hand and then promptly get sword of war and peace
vs CB: 40% winrate. This will be higher against builds that do not have air servant or unskilled opponents.
vs AM: 30% winrate. Although this is not as bad as it looks. You still have ways of dealing with hexproof...see above.
vs ROI: 10% winrate. mind control bribery counterspell repulse...nuff said. cant win em all.
vs AD: 45% winrate. usually comes down to luck and who gets a good draw.
vs GW: 20% winrate. Discard ruins the malfegor strategy.
vs UF: 65% winrate. No dragon's claw and this drops. DR is the only deck i use the lifegain cards.
vs SoS: 70% winrate. ''''

So out of the other 11 decks, around 5 are favorable matchups and a few come down to a coin toss. not bad for the "worst" deck. gl.


Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
This build is reasonable, except the dragon's claws you already predicted to get criticised. Also, you really should go down to 60 cards, especially with the mana issues this deck has. Every card beyond 60 basically reduces your chances to draw your swamps.

Your winrates don't say anything about the deck's power level, if anything they tell us how difficult a matchup is for you compared to the others. I've been playing a tweaked version of this list for quite some time and I can assure you it's still the worst deck. Of course you can win with it and if you're not half bad, you probably even have positive matchups against the random online opponent, but that doesn't change the decks theoretical value.
Dragonspeaker Shaman2x played mid/late game unless you start with 2 of them. He's not useless despite what the inexperienced posters above believe. You can use him to cast multiple dragons and win in 1 turn late game or just use the card as a creature sac when you play malfegor. You want as many cards in your hand as possible when you play the demon dragon.



No one ever said it was a bad card, they are saying the method you use it in isn't optimal for what the deck supports.

Dragonspeaker Shaman costs 3, and reduces the cost of your dragons by 2.

All of your haste dragons cost 6, with a single shaman out they cost 4, with two shaman they drop down to 2(except Rorix, which only drops down to 3)

So assuming we have a shaman and a haste dragon in hand and want to cast both on the same turn. We would need a total of 7 mana, so this likely wont be possible until at least the 7th turn(barring multiple shaman/rubies). This is a full turn later then you could have hard casted the haste dragon without the shaman anyways. If you would have cast Shaman 3rd turn instead, the haste dragon could come out and start attacking on turn 4, the turn after shaman was played.

Even later on holding onto the shaman isn't a great idea. Shaman+2x Haste Dragon=11 mana. In just about all cases you would be better off just playing the shaman 3rd turn, since the dragons would accumulate more damage faster coming out earlier and attacking throughout the turns you would have spent holding onto them until you hit 11 mana.

I guess this leaves the Shaman more open to removal, but that's not a bad thing either, as every Doom Blade aimed at a Shaman is one that wasn't aimed at your dragons, which are what you use to close out games.

The only time I could ever see this really being worth it is if you start with an overabundance of acceleration in your hand, aka 2x Shaman+1x Ruby or something similar, even then it is questionable. T2 Ruby, T3 Shaman, T4 Shaman, Hellkite Charger is about the best you could hope for, and you better hope really hard, because its extremely unlikely.

I guess it could work alright with Malfegor but at that point your discarding other win-cons which could come back to bite you should Malfegor get removed. I don't play Malfegor myself, so I can't really comment too much.
"I have existed from the morning of the world and I shall exist until the last star falls from the night. Although I have taken the form of Gaius Caligula, I am all men as I am no man and therefore I am a God."
Trimmed it down to 60. I think I found the sweet spot.

Added volcanic dragon 2x
dragon's claw 3x


Took out:

12/12 dragon
voracious dragon
goblin fodder
goblin wardriver
I'm loving it.

Arguments for dragon's claw:

It's a dragon deck.
It ruins UF and SOS and increases the favorable matchups the deck has.
Mana curve.
You have to survive and it is a slow deck.
lots of red spells.
wtf are you going to use instead? Adding 2 more big dragons creates nightmare starting hands.
Most decks are full of really good cards that are preferable to the lifegain spells, this deck, however, isn't.

Arguments against:

You could put in some haste goblins i guess. or add rally the forces.
2. ???




I just had a really satisfying duel vs WS. I ruined his weenies with pyroclasm. Then he brought out baneslayer angel thought I was screwed because of dragon immunity. I had only a whelp a scorpion and the +3 dragon enchant.

Then I drew malfegor. had 5 lands only 1 swamp. drew a mountain. didn't play the mountain. drew a swamp next turn, played mal discarded 2 cards.
9/9 dragon and no opposition. win.



Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
Dragon's Claws are better against mono red than against other decks, but it's nothing gamechanging, you still have to get ahead in board presence and this card doesn't really help achieve it. Dragon Fodder and Voracious shouldn't be dropped for them.
Dragon's Claws are better GODLY against mono red than against other decks, but it's nothing gamechanging, you still have to get ahead in board presence [AGREE but DC doesn't prevent that! It's cast on turn 2 when you have nothing else to cast!] and this card doesn't really help achieve it. Dragon Fodder and Voracious should be dropped for them!!



Fixed to make it seem like you have some actual experience with the DR deck.

dragon's claw is great when it is just you who are casting red spells.

Other decks that have red:

cloudburst (forgot about that one!)
unquenchable fire
strength of stone

By adding just three cards, you can ruin 3 other decks hopes of beating you!!1

Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali


I guess this leaves the Shaman more open to removal, but that's not a bad thing either, as every Doom Blade aimed at a Shaman is one that wasn't aimed at your dragons, which are what you use to close out games.



If your opponent has a doom blade you're toast anyway...no matter what order you play your cards...well unless you get a huge suck out and he gets land screwed.

Again, I play my opponent, not my cards. Strategies I've mentioned in this thread are going to vary depending on the deck im facing. If I know I'm on a time limit (facing gravewhispers or ancient deeps for example) im casting everything ASAP. The exception being if I start with malfegor against ancient deeps and I know hes going to be able to cast hexproof (he has a fast start).

Against other decks, I'm looking for an opening ...waiting for them to be tapped out or slip up somehow, then I snap their spine with a few dragons. A lot of the time in the early game, i'm leaving my land uptapped to I can play disfigure or lightning bolt during my opponents turn to react to what he does.

DR isn't a very noob friendly deck. It takes skill and a lot of luck to be successful with. And a different strategy against each deck. Which is why i like it. I like the challenge of playing with bad decks. It's not just the same everytime...like cast sacred wolf then cast angelic destiny, then attack.


I guess it could work alright with Malfegor but at that point your discarding other win-cons which could come back to bite you should Malfegor get removed. I don't play Malfegor myself, so I can't really comment too much.



you could be on to something.

Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
Had some great duels last night with DR.

Had 2 festering goblins out. other guy had a ton of creatures out (machinations fast build). I castpyroclasm..his board gets wiped. i use the goblins ability + a burst lightning to finish off one of his 6/6 flyers.

great fun.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
Again, I play my opponent, not my cards. Bla bla etc. bla


Yeah, we get it, you're a genius...
Again, I play my opponent, not my cards. Bla bla etc. bla


Yeah, we get it, you're a genius...



few points off unfortunately...
i guess close only counts in horsehoes and handgrenades right
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali
forgot to mention some dominating encounters with cloudburst the other day.

guy wasted 9 mana on lightning serpent. i just disfigured it and his whole turn was wasted. at that point i was sitting on 28 life. had 2 dragon's claws out. guess he didn't build the deck correctly cause it was full of all of the haste creatures, and i was just nuking them before they swung in after reaping the benefits of the life gain cards.

basically could have toyed with him and finished the job at will, but i decided against it. it's frusterating enough to get beaten by a dragon deck. no need to rub it in.
Extensive deck tester for duels 2012 and aspiring rules advisor "When you're as great as I am, it's hard to be humble." -Ali


DR isn't a very noob friendly deck. It takes skill and a lot of luck to be successful with. And a different strategy against each deck. Which is why i like it. I like the challenge of playing with bad decks. It's not just the same everytime...like cast sacred wolf then cast angelic destiny, then attack.




I thought the whole point of this thread was that DR was "sick."  Now you're calling it a "bad deck"  You just pointed out the main reason why it is considered the worst deck.  Luck.  There are too many ways DR can dump on you at the worst possible time.  With the perfect hand, it's excellent, but that's true for all decks.  If you're milled to 60 you'll have a leg up on over half of the people who play (at least that's the way it is on Xbox Live).  So the deck may appear to be better than it really is.  You may draw the perfect hand, but the perfect hand for DR will be worse than the perfect hand for a deck like ROI or BH.  The deck is "bad" simply because other decks are better.  I can't remember ever thinking "Oh no...They're playing dragons..." 

One other thing, I don't think that Dragon's Claw is that great against UF.  Sure you gain 1 life every time they play anything, but that balances out with Punishing Fire.  They just get their burn back over and over and over.  So a Flame Slash hits your newly dropped Volcanic Dragon and then the recovered Punishing Fire is able to burn off your Dragonspeaker Shaman.  Sure it costs a bit of mana to do something like that, but you already have 6 or more mana by then if you follow your play order logic, so your opponent is likely to have the same.  Combine that with the ability to use punishing fire to resurrect Chandra's Phoenix and things could go very badly for you.
Of all things, Death is least permanent.
Honestly, lifegain is not necessary to win against UF, Dragon's Claw is not worth including.

I mean, it is great when u have it in ur starting hand, but what are the odds??? and how often would u face a red deck????
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