Online CB now approaching feature parity with offline CB!

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In case any DDI users missed the fanfare, in today's update they finally added the capability for houseruled feats and powers (selected from the existing lists of game elements).

I think creating custom game elements is the last remaining (major) feature missing for parity -- the dream is almost a reality!

Returned from hiatus; getting up to speed on 5e rules lawyering.

I dont suppose you can add custom feats/powers as of yet??
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58033128 wrote:
I still get bewildered by the idea of Good races and Bad races. I mean, D&D presents a world where there are literally dozens of sentient humanoid races. And then there's a line drawn down the middle, and some races, such as elves, dragonborn and humans, to name but a few, are put on one side and called Good Guys. And with that they are People. They have Rights. And on the other side go a bunch of other races, goblins, orcs, kobolds, and so on. These are called Bad Guys, and as such, they are not People. It is considered ok by many players to track them down and slaughter them. It shatters my suspension of disbelief to see someone who calls their character a hero, a noble sort of person who tries their damnedest to right wrongs and fight evil, making sure that those goblin women and children don't get away, because, you know, they're goblins. They're not just stupid beasts. They have societies, culture and language. They have goals, and motivations. I can believe that someone would kill a drow or an orc at first sight, because they probably were up to something. But don't try to tell me that that was a Good act and that you did it because you are a Good Person. When I'm considering what to do with a group of "bad" humanoids, and I come up with an idea, I mentally replace whatever the "bad guy" of the week is with humans. If it isn't ok to do it to a human, I won't do it to any sentient race.
My Views on the Alignment System:
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Killing something because it might be evil = evil Killing something because it might do something evil = evil Killing something because it is planning to do something evil = neutral Killing something because has done something evil = neutral Killing something because it is doing evil = good
As in something brand new created from whole cloth?  Nope.  It's the last remaining major feature missing.

Returned from hiatus; getting up to speed on 5e rules lawyering.

In case any DDI users missed the fanfare, in today's update they finally added the capability for houseruled feats and powers (selected from the existing lists of game elements).

I think creating custom game elements is the last remaining (major) feature missing for parity -- the dream is almost a reality!



It's still in the cloud, isn't it? Meaning they will probably pull the plug soon after 5e comes around. And you'll have to pay continuously for DDI subscription to use it. Until those two things change, it's not as good as the old one.
I agree, and the only thing that may change my mind in regards to an online subscription is if they offer something that is useful like an easy to use virtual table top that is integrated with the online character builder, and allow third party material. It seems like a fairly steep set of requirements based on what they currenly offer.
How do you do this?
The ability to access the CB from anywhere with a net connection is more important to me than being able to houserule, so I've thought it was better than the offline CB for a while now, but I am very pleased that they've added in that functionality. It is a very welcome addition.

Nice to hear but I still wont be using it. Being able to use the old one wherever I take my laptop is much more handy.

How is it really houserule when you can only select from a list of other game elements?  At least that's how I'm understanding the OP's post.  This doesn't seem like an improvement to me.  So with my understanding(which I admitted may be wrong, so correct me if I am) this means that what, you can select choices that you normally can't legally pick?  Is that it?  That really doesn't seem like an improvement for me.  I mean I get that it's an additional feature added, but even if I used the online CB(no account, and even when I did I only used it to look up feats) the ability to add powers/feats that normally can't be selected just doesn't seem like improving anything.  I mean I guess I can see why someone may want to take a feat that normally they can't select or something...but eh whatever I guess to each their own this just seems like junk.  And not really much of "houseruling".
Meh.

Most of my houserules aren't things that really wind up on a character sheet, so not a big deal.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
I agree, and the only thing that may change my mind in regards to an online subscription is if they offer something that is useful like an easy to use virtual table top that is integrated with the online character builder, and allow third party material. It seems like a fairly steep set of requirements based on what they currenly offer.


There is a virtual tabletop that allows you to import characters from the character builder and monsters from the online compendium.  No 3rd party importing, but you can do that by hand, with the exception of tiles.
Ours is a world where people don't know what they want, and are willing to go through hell to get it. -Don Marquis
How is it really houserule when you can only select from a list of other game elements?  At least that's how I'm understanding the OP's post.  This doesn't seem like an improvement to me.  So with my understanding(which I admitted may be wrong, so correct me if I am) this means that what, you can select choices that you normally can't legally pick?  Is that it?

It's more for things like "Everyone gets Expertise as an extra feat at level 1."

The slots for extra feats (I haven't checked powers) apparently also allow ANY feat to be chosen. I have a level-6 Gnome now with the Half-Elf racial Paragon feat "Versatile Master". Of course it doesn't actually do anything for the character and I am not going to bother to save the character in this state...

You still can't create a custom feat, but consider what the old CB did for custom feats: it let you put the name on the character sheet. Wow.

And customizing of existing stuff apparently applies only to gear.
"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
Nice. I give my players Expertise feats and Improved Defenses for free, and this means they can finally update their "official" character sheets to reflect this!

Nice to hear but I still wont be using it. Being able to use the old one wherever I take my laptop is much more handy.


+1

Nice. I give my players Expertise feats and Improved Defenses for free, and this means they can finally update their "official" character sheets to reflect this!


Precisely.  One less thing to edit in the xml before uploading the character to iPlay4e.

Returned from hiatus; getting up to speed on 5e rules lawyering.

How is it really houserule when you can only select from a list of other game elements?  At least that's how I'm understanding the OP's post.  This doesn't seem like an improvement to me.  So with my understanding(which I admitted may be wrong, so correct me if I am) this means that what, you can select choices that you normally can't legally pick?  Is that it?  That really doesn't seem like an improvement for me. 



Its baby steps. For example, I grant an expertise feat for free, and occasionally others depending on class (ie, chain and shield for shamans), so its nice to be able to have the builder reflect that. I also offer an additional at will at 8th level, so being able to add powers is nice.

Its still not up to the old builder, which DOES have the ability to implement full house rule powers with the proper know-how. For example, people have added all the essentials classes to the offline one.

Meh. Only took a year to catch up. Wake me when it does something new and interesting.
How is it really houserule when you can only select from a list of other game elements?  At least that's how I'm understanding the OP's post.  This doesn't seem like an improvement to me.  So with my understanding(which I admitted may be wrong, so correct me if I am) this means that what, you can select choices that you normally can't legally pick?  Is that it?  That really doesn't seem like an improvement for me. 



Its baby steps. For example, I grant an expertise feat for free, and occasionally others depending on class (ie, chain and shield for shamans), so its nice to be able to have the builder reflect that. I also offer an additional at will at 8th level, so being able to add powers is nice.

Its still not up to the old builder, which DOES have the ability to implement full house rule powers with the proper know-how. For example, people have added all the essentials classes to the offline one.


I submit that is not actually a feature of the old builder.  

I could use my notebook to hammer in a nail with the right knowhow too, but that's more of an alternate use than a selling point.

INSIDE SCOOP, GAMERS: In the new version of D&D, it will no longer be "Edition Wars." It will be "Edition Lair Assault." - dungeonbastard

My question: How broken would it be to grant Hybrid Talent for free at L1 to encourage my players to try Hybrid classes? I'm already giving them expertise + melee training for free at 1, also.
My question: How broken would it be to grant Hybrid Talent for free at L1 to encourage my players to try Hybrid classes? I'm already giving them expertise + melee training for free at 1, also.

No worse then giving them any other feet free.

Just don't let them get 2 hybrid talent's for free.  That will hurt things.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

The new houserule options allow you to add as many free feats and powers as you want. In addition, you can add any feat or power from the game even if you don't qualify for it. The first thing I did is let everyone in my campaign to take two free feats: one expertise (or master at arms) and improved defenses. I already did this, but it was a pain to be updating the sheets constantly. It's just nice to let the builder do the math for you.

Extra feats is hugely welcome in my campaign because I sometimes let the PC's pick up temporary feats as rewards for accomplishments. For example, I'm considering giving a wizard an arcane familiar for a level for saving the feywild from destruction.

If you activate these options (orange button on the top of the feat or power page) your character gets labelled in the builder as houseruled BUT it is not labelled as HR'ed on the character sheet. WotC needs to fix this for people who run organized play events so we can quickly check character sheets.

The other new change is "custom items", which really should be called "reflavored items" because our options for customization are very limited at this point. Basically you add an item you want, then click on it in your inventory and you'll see a "customize" button at the bottom. This allows you to rename the item and change its flavor text (note field). If the item is a weapon you change its damage dice. There is currently no way to change the powers or properties of the item. There is, however, the option to add an augment (ex. shard) or a curse. To do this you have to add the augment or curse to your inventory and then it will appear in the drop down field when you customize the item. Note that you have to know the name of the augment or curse to add it because the search filter won't pick them up in the filters.

In short, the customization is a step in the right direction but I don't think people will be happy until we get the ability to create new items from scratch. The same can be said for feats and powers. At least WotC is showing us they're working on it.

In my opinion, the last real feature the old CB had that the new one doesn't is the ability to customize the character sheet and that's not something I'm going to worry about. Oh, and of course the ability to operate offline
Its still not up to the old builder, which DOES have the ability to implement full house rule powers with the proper know-how. For example, people have added all the essentials classes to the offline one.




I'm calling BS on this. The old CB did not have the ability to fully houserule powers and add Essentials classes unless you knew a LOT of "know-how" and were willing to do a lot editing. What you're describing is modding the software, it wasn't something that WotC offered or approved of. I'm sure that someone with the right "know-how" could also mod the online CB to do exactly what you're describing.

Just because you can edit a program to do what you want doesn't make it a feature of the software. I used to mod the old DOOM game so all the monsters were Marvel superheroes and I had infinite ammo and could walk through walls. Calling that a feature of the game is ridiculous.
Does it let you Houserule and select a theme that you don't qualify for? or do I still need to trick the system to do so (i.e. for Pack outcast - select human, select pack outcast, go back and change race)

The guide allows players to take it for Half-Elves if the DM allows but my player couldn't select it until I tricked the system
Welcome to ZomboniLand - My D&D Blog http://zomboniland.blogspot.com/
Its still not up to the old builder, which DOES have the ability to implement full house rule powers with the proper know-how. For example, people have added all the essentials classes to the offline one.




I'm calling BS on this. The old CB did not have the ability to fully houserule powers and add Essentials classes unless you knew a LOT of "know-how" and were willing to do a lot editing. What you're describing is modding the software, it wasn't something that WotC offered or approved of. I'm sure that someone with the right "know-how" could also mod the online CB to do exactly what you're describing.



 The fact is, with a little effort, WOTC COULD have made it user friendly. Instead they lied that it couldnt accept the new style classes/themes, when they worked just fine in the program's existing database structure.  

We've been strung along for over a year with something crappier than what they already had. The main purpose of the online DB was to diminish the rights of the consumer.

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We've been strung along for over a year with something crappier than what they already had. The main purpose of the online DB was to diminish the rights of the consumer.




Huh? Can you explain how your rights were diminished? WotC changed their product offering and the old one was no longer supported. Did Microsoft diminish your rights when they stopped supporting Windows 95? Or did Apple diminish your rights when they stopped supporting iTune version 1.0?

Don't forget you still have the right to cancel your subscription and ask for a refund. When the online CB was launched many people did just that and WotC gave them their money back.

I didn't agree with the shift to an online only model but at the time WotC was still giving me enough value through the compendium that I didn't cancel. However I knew that they were offering refunds on outstanding subscriptions so I didn't feel ripped off. If didn't want the service, I still had my old CB and I could get my money back. I was mad as hell they weren't supporting the old builder, but I knew clearly what my rights were as a customer: I could demand a refund for services I was paying for but not receiving.
The cons outweigh the pros for me still, so STILL an overall negative review of the online CB overall.  But it IS getting better.

Cons: resizing the window is problematic.  Printing is problematic.  The character sheets suck, there should be a way to customise them.  The "old" offline CB had that almost from start!  Come on folks!  At the very least, add an option to print in the "old" offline CB style.

Minor Pro: the 'ritual book' feature is quite nice!  Add a 'feat' book feature for us epic level guys with more feats that fingers!       

Pro: online anywere, anytime. 
Con: as long as the servers don't crash and you keep paying, although you can export your PCs offline if you are going to unsubscribe for a while, then import them back when you resub

Pro: can now add extra feats (click the #7 Feat green button, then the little orange house icon near the top middle)
Con: can now add extra feats, so all my players' sheets need to checked often in case they 'accidentally oops!' add extra feats  *wink*

Pro: can now customise items by changing their names, silvering them, and changing their damage dice
Con: the "old" offline CB had this feature and the "new" online one HAD this feature and then it disappeared.  That kind of thing is irksome.

Pro: you can make characters quite easily with 'choose all for me'.  
Con: these characters aren't playable, however (unless you like hopeless!)

Con: 20 character limit.  Sorry folks, that's just not enough (people who DM multiple games know what I mean)
Con: as far as I can tell, there's no way to create  a 'custom campaign' file like in the old CB so as to limit verboten content at the click of a toggle box                      

 
I'm just glad that all the people who were dumping on the builder for not being as good as the old one are happy, now, that it does as much and more as the old one did when WotC stopped supporting it.
D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition
The ability to access the CB from anywhere with a net connection is more important to me than being able to houserule, so I've thought it was better than the offline CB for a while now, but I am very pleased that they've added in that functionality. It is a very welcome addition.



Yep, but I'm happy for the people who really wanted this feature.

Con: 20 character limit.  Sorry folks, that's just not enough (people who DM multiple games know what I mean)
 



So you want what is specifically singled out as not allowed by teh Terms of Use by having one account for numerous people? That's a perfect example of why they went online and impose limits.

Good improvement. Still to do:



  • Raise limits on characters. I need more than 20, and I'm not sharing my account with anyone.

  • Printouts should not require 1Gig of print memory.

  • Old CB had the ability to enter free-form text in many fields. Please return this. It was a really useful place for LFR players to track story awards.

I'd LOVE to have a journal section as part of the online builder. I lost almost all of my LFR info when my OS crashed with the offline builder.

Con: 20 character limit.  Sorry folks, that's just not enough (people who DM multiple games know what I mean)
 



So you want what is specifically singled out as not allowed by teh Terms of Use by having one account for numerous people? That's a perfect example of why they went online and impose limits.




That's not at all why they went online.

Con: 20 character limit.  Sorry folks, that's just not enough (people who DM multiple games know what I mean)
 



So you want what is specifically singled out as not allowed by teh Terms of Use by having one account for numerous people? That's a perfect example of why they went online and impose limits.




I have copy's of all my party's characters from THEIR CB's on my CB, they don't use my CB to make theirs.

Its a great way to keep track of what the party members have.

This is in addition to all the character concepts I build.

My offline CB currently has 96 characters in it.


My offline CB currently has 96 characters in it.


beat ya
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 



My offline CB currently has 96 characters in it.


beat ya



I actually do delete some to avoid clutter Tongue out


My offline CB currently has 96 characters in it.


beat ya



I actually do delete some to avoid clutter



I have a habit of building  them 4 or 5 ways to figure out the way which best evokes the character...
and saving them at different levels.
  Creative Character Build Collection and The Magic of King's and Heros  also Can Martial Characters Fly? 

Improvisation in 4e: Fave 4E Improvisations - also Wrecans Guides to improvisation beyond page 42
The Non-combatant Adventurer (aka Princess build Warlord or LazyLord)
Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness
Reflavoring the Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage - Creative Character Collection: Bloodwright (Darksun Character) 

At full hit points and still wounded to incapacitation? you are playing 1e.
By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one
"Wizards and Warriors need abilities with explicit effects for opposite reasons. With the wizard its because you need to create artificial limits on them, they have no natural ones and for the Warrior you need to grant permission to do awesome."

 

I didn't think the 20 character limit would be a big deal either at first.  Now that I have copies of the 2 groups I DM for Encounters (the guys that aren't using pregens, anyway), 3 different Lair Assault teams (because screw checking that stuff by hand), the characters in my home campaign, and my own gaggle of PCs, it is so cumbersome to keep deleting and re-importing .dnd4e files that I wish I had at least 40 slots.

I could only imagine the extra work the pirates are going through sharing their accounts, but this is at least one feature the cheaters ruined for the paying customers.

INSIDE SCOOP, GAMERS: In the new version of D&D, it will no longer be "Edition Wars." It will be "Edition Lair Assault." - dungeonbastard

I didn't think the 20 character limit would be a big deal either at first.  Now that I have copies of the 2 groups I DM for Encounters (the guys that aren't using pregens, anyway), 3 different Lair Assault teams (because screw checking that stuff by hand), the characters in my home campaign, and my own gaggle of PCs, it is so cumbersome to keep deleting and re-importing .dnd4e files that I wish I had at least 40 slots.

I could only imagine the extra work the pirates are going through sharing their accounts, but this is at least one feature the cheaters ruined for the paying customers.



I imagine the "extra work" those pirates are doing now is still with the offline CB.

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I'd like to point out that disregarding terms of use/EULA's arent illegal. The enforcability is pretty limited.
True, but the sorts of things that were being discussed were more along the lines of violating intellectual property and copyright laws than terms of use.

D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition
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