Hybrid monk/druid: Is this an awesome combo or am I missing something?

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I am really trying to put together a melee controller, preferably one with striker-ish qualities. I wasted a lot of time trying different wizard combos before finally settling on a predator druid. Then today I thought: Wouldn't monk be a workable addition to the druid? Centered flurry of blows does 2+wis damage, they can both use staves as implements, both have awesome mobility. AC would need some work, but that is why we have feats and magic. 

I guess I am just afraid that I am missing something. Usually when I think a combo is too good to be true, there is something important I have overlooked.  

So....problems with my idea? Ideas? Suggestions?

Thanks! 
The big problem is probably going to be that you have to use Monk powers to trigger FoB, meaning you'll have to spend a minor action to get out of beast form to use it.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
I actually like this combo a lot, and it does pair together well, but it in the end it doesn't really end up filling a role very well.  It doesn't hit quite as hard as a striker would, and doesn't control quite as well as a controller would.  I don't think it's ever going to be an optimal combo in terms of performance, but it is fun to play and you can make some interesting characters with it.
I actually like this combo a lot, and it does pair together well, but it in the end it doesn't really end up filling a role very well.  It doesn't hit quite as hard as a striker would, and doesn't control quite as well as a controller would.  I don't think it's ever going to be an optimal combo in terms of performance, but it is fun to play and you can make some interesting characters with it.



Yeah, I figured.  I am willing to give up some control to do more damage when we need it. And we have a stiker (hexblade) so I don't have to do awesome damage all the time. 
The big problem is probably going to be that you have to use Monk powers to trigger FoB, meaning you'll have to spend a minor action to get out of beast form to use it.




Can't you take a feat to turn Shapeshifting into a free action? Fast/Quick Wild Shape or something like that.
The big problem is probably going to be that you have to use Monk powers to trigger FoB, meaning you'll have to spend a minor action to get out of beast form to use it.




Can't you take a feat to turn Shapeshifting into a free action? Fast/Quick Wild Shape or something like that.



Yeah, at paragon level you can. 
The trigger for FoB is just hitting with an attack (any attack) during your turn.  No need to worry about using Monk powers or getting out of wildshape.
The trigger for FoB is just hitting with an attack (any attack) during your turn.  No need to worry about using Monk powers or getting out of wildshape.



That's true for normal Monks, but not for Hybrids.
Personally I like Druid MC Monk -- and take a power swap.

Go predator, get a staff of the traveler and at paragon you are teleporting as a free action on your turn...

Go githzerai for zuoken's centering, now you have decent HP/surges. 
I had a Half-Elf Druid|Monk build I was working on for my level 14 game. 

Taking Formless Predator, Versatile Master and Wild Dilettente means you can use all your at wills in beast form. Which was what I was aiming for, but may not be directly on target for you. :P
I guess I am just afraid that I am missing something. Usually when I think a combo is too good to be true, there is something important I have overlooked.



It isn't all that great. It has lots of flaws, mostly based on choice of focus.
I built a similar character like this and i like it very much. He's a sentinel hybrid monk with MC net and world serpents grasp. So all my (implement) attacks (including summons) slow on a hit and every further hit prones them, while slow remains. I also have constant CA on many druid powers for the animals aura. I mostly stay at range and use druid area bursts, so i don't use FoB much, but it's nice to have a close burst 1 at-will power.

This one is DEX/WIS based, so you don't need CON to AC. AC sucks at first, unless you invest hybrid talent for sentinel druid armor proficiency. It also has less healing surges than normal sentinels, so you might run out if your DM likes to pop your animal. You could take the feat "durable" and a cloak of the chirurgeon, to counter this. I played some LFR games with it and never had this problem, however (even during a 4th core adventure). Most DMs stop attacking the animal after it was killed once or twice and realise, that it only costs me a minor and HS, to recreate it.

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hybrid monk|druid is great. Just get a flail and Kulkor Arms Master. (har har).

Jokes aside, here's a couple of similar builds I've worked on. There have been rules revisions since then (I think the Hindering Shield version has 1 less attack bonus now due to revisions to Hybrid Sentinel)

community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...

There really isn't much point for such a build to use anything but a spiked chain, now, however. That plus flail expertise. And all the light blade accuracy feats. Mm.

I think sentinel works better than druid, primarily because you're not burdened with Wild Shape, which is very confusing. 
CharOp relies too much on mark of storms. I never played a game where it was legal and i assume 80% of the ppl here are not doing so, either. But without it, there's hardly any means to add forced movement or proning effects to any attack.

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Have you seen Flail expertise? It blows lightning + PM out of the water. Also, check out the polearm momentum guide. Plenty of builds on there without lightning weapons.

Why would you assume that 80% of the people here play with DMs that disallow dragonmark feats? Seems like a strange kind of assumption.

Also, the Hindering Shield build doesn't rely on mark of storm to prone. It uses Hindering Shield (and various other things such as Battle Standard of the Hungry Blade) combined with WSG to do it.
I would definately suggest looking at feats like Whip Training and Net Training, as one of the unique features of a Druid|Monk is being able to use Druid powers though weapons.  Tacking on slow (Net Training) or an Attack Penalty (Whip Training) is a definite plus.
Interested in a rambling collection of game ideas? Check out Schemes of the Dancing Chimera.

Why would you assume that 80% of the people here play with DMs that disallow dragonmark feats? Seems like a strange kind of assumption.



Maybe he assumes 80% play LFR? That's probably too generous though.
Actually, some non-LFR DMs disallow dragonmark feats for the same reason LFR does - they are inherently tied into the setting of Eberron and so it isn't automatically appropriate to allow them in any and all non-Eberron games. Also, there's something to be said about requiring that these feats (which are notably above average in power) to bring with them the storyline implications that they would have in an Eberron game, where they either mark you as effectively nobility or an abberrant freak which some people will be out to murder by default. 
I guess I've just never actually met someone that plays LFR in real life... Leading me to conclude that its a lot less than 80%.

I've banned dragonmark feats before but I've been in more campaigns that have allowed them. Ive never played non-homebrew 4e though ;)
I guess I've just never actually met someone that plays LFR in real life... Leading me to conclude that its a lot less than 80%. I've banned dragonmark feats before but I've been in more campaigns that have allowed them. Ive never played non-homebrew 4e though ;)



LFR has two great(in theory) features from a CharOp perspective:
You can start at 11th with some big magic item limitations.
If you find a legal combo, the DM can't house rule it into non-existance. He has to do it via the rules.

On the other hand, that also means that there isn't the usual safety valve mechanism of the DM saying, "Stop ruining my game." The table as a whole has to apply social pressure to get what it wants. 
Yeah, a lot of the regulars play LFR and/or AoA. Most living campaign players lurk on these forums and none of them allow dragonmarks. I have only played in one game that allowed them and I don't think that's unusual. Many campaigns allow eberron stuff, but ban dragonmarks, just like LFR does.
Haven't run into a campaign that didn't allow them so far and I allow them in games I run. The only thing that ties them to Eberron is fluff and fluff is adaptable. 
Yeah, a lot of the regulars play LFR and/or AoA. Most living campaign players lurk on these forums and none of them allow dragonmarks. I have only played in one game that allowed them and I don't think that's unusual. Many campaigns allow eberron stuff, but ban dragonmarks, just like LFR does.



What does AoA stand for?
Marks are not used in my campaign or any of the campaigns I play. They're more specifically tied to the campaign setting than most things in DnD 4e. You have to be a member of the house that these feats belong to in order to get them. DMs I know feel they're a-kin to blessings and if you want it that bad you're going to have to do something to get it.

If a group was willing to do a side-quest in order for a character to obtain it they might make an exception but because many of them are just used to cheese out builds based around them many DMs I know would refuse anyway.
The reasons for my 80% assumption:

1. The marks are OP, compared to normal feats. So DMs should only hand them out for special reasons in home campaigns.
2. Dragonmarks are not legal in LFR (or at least they weren't in the past).
3. I personally never played eberron, because my DMs don't like the setting. For them, it has a too much futuristic feeling.
4. Many ppl on boards said when asked, that they also don't play eberron.

Want anime-style Power cards? Then try the Touhou Power Cards!

Yeah, a lot of the regulars play LFR and/or AoA. Most living campaign players lurk on these forums and none of them allow dragonmarks. I have only played in one game that allowed them and I don't think that's unusual. Many campaigns allow eberron stuff, but ban dragonmarks, just like LFR does.



What does AoA stand for?



Ashes of Athas - basically Living Dark Sun.
Back to Basics - A Guide to Basic Attacks You might be playing DnD wrong if... "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
For what it's worth, none of the 4 DMs I've played under have cared about dragonmarks, and none have applied any fluff to them.  I allow them in my game as well with no fluff restrictions.  None of these are Eberron games.  I don't see them as any more powerful than other top tier feats.

I've also never met anyone that played LFR, though I've seen signs for it at 2 out of 3 of the local gaming stores....  /shrug
Haven't run into a campaign that didn't allow them so far and I allow them in games I run. The only thing that ties them to Eberron is fluff and fluff is adaptable. 



Ditto.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
This thread just goes to show that very few of us play in a representative subset of D&D games. For some of us, disallowing Dragonmarks is quite uncommon, and for some of us, allowing them is quite uncommon.

Then again, the participants in this thread are going to be a biased subset of all D&D gamers. Not that it really matters, because presumably advice given on these forums should be tailored towards the people that are actually likely to read said advice :D 
This thread just goes to show that very few of us play in a representative subset of D&D games. For some of us, disallowing Dragonmarks is quite uncommon, and for some of us, allowing them is quite uncommon.

Then again, the participants in this thread are going to be a biased subset of all D&D gamers. Not that it really matters, because presumably advice given on these forums should be tailored towards the people that are actually likely to read said advice :D 


Well spoken, so let's get back to topic. As you said, prone can be achieved at-will with other feats, besides mark of storm.

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The reasons for my 80% assumption:

1. The marks are OP, compared to normal feats. So DMs should only hand them out for special reasons in home campaigns.
2. Dragonmarks are not legal in LFR (or at least they weren't in the past).
3. I personally never played eberron, because my DMs don't like the setting. For them, it has a too much futuristic feeling.
4. Many ppl on boards said when asked, that they also don't play eberron.



I don't know the %'s, but I'm in the column of never allowed (save for an actual Eberron game). Not in LFR or AoA. Not in home campaigns.