This thread is for discussion of this week's Limited Information, which goes live Tuesday morning on magicthegathering.com.
Pack 1, Pick 5Firebreathing, Giant Spider, Stave Off, Brink of Disaster, Wall of Torches, Lava Axe, Stormblood Berserker, Tectonic Rift, Sutured Ghoul, Mountain
Firebreathing, Giant Spider, Stave Off, Brink of Disaster, Wall of Torches, Lava Axe, Stormblood Berserker, Tectonic Rift, Sutured Ghoul, Mountain
(Seems a decent draft otherwise. Although hmm, those AIs sure don't pick the Tormented Souls highly enough.)
Round 1:Sphinx of Uthuun (A no-brainer, am I right?)Aether Adept (Yeah, Doom Blade and Day of Judgment are really good, but I already know that I'm blue and Adept is insane. Moreover and more to the point, picking the Day locks you into the control strategy mentioned earlier, whereas Adept allows for control or aggro variants, and in M12 Blue has some sick aggro commons. Sphinx is still amazing in an aggro deck anyway)Doom Blade (Two in a row is too good to pass up, and Looter isn't good enough to warrant staying on color)Skywinder Drake (One of Blue's aggro commons. Note the Blood Ogre and move on) Stormblood Berserker (Bloodthirst is OPEN. As Steve said, beatdown is better than control in this format. Could take Sutured Ghoul or Mana Leak and go control, but...well, no)Divination (Ponder is fine and all, but they go pretty late and I wouldn't really want more than one. Divination, on the other hand, is always welcome)Goblin ArsonistGarruk's Companion (Best card in the pack. Just hate draft it)Tectonic Rift (Pretty solid as a one-of, good for aggro)Goblin Grenade (Also great as a one-of, psuedo-combo with Arsonist)Goblin Grenade (ALL. THE. WAY. Getting two of these this early in a draft allows you to draft around them)Goblin TunnelerFirebreathing (Actually pretty solid, I've found, particularly with the afore-picked Tunneler)Manic VandalForest
Round 2:Warstorm Surge (Duh.)Gorehorn Minotaurs (Geez, this is hard. Bear and Adept are awesome in the deck I'm drafting, but Minotaurs is simply best)Chandra's Outrage (VS Divination)Phantasmal Image (Only other option another Arsonist. This is better)Goblin Fireslinger (YAAAAAAH Bloodthirst!!)Incinerate (Don't enjoy passing another Warstorm Surge, but this is the right pick)Slaughter CryTurn to FrogGoblin Piker (For ze Grenades)Phantasmal Bear (See? Blue aggro, and this consistently goes late)Merfolk MesmeristGoblin TunnelerTormented SoulLifelinkForest
Round 3:Volcanic Dragon (Once again, duh)Fireball (duh)Goblin Piker (could pick Act of Treason, but I need fodder for the Grenades)Phantasmal Bear (Struggled here. Arsonist is the other option, but Bear is just so good. It honestly probably would have been correct to draft the Goblin for Grenade consistency)Goblin Fireslinger (HA! Sick.)Goblin Fireslinger (HAAA!!! Would've been sick-er if it didn't mean passing a Volcanic Dragon)Phantasmal Dragon (VS Hellhound and Pacifism. This guy is insane! Yeah, sometimes he dies to the combat trick, but do you really care that your opponent just used up a top-notch spell? Really, you just want to steer clear of Lawkeeper)Stormfront Pegasus (Hate draft dat sucker)Goblin Bangchuckers (Because the pack sucks and I might need an extra Goblin)Cancel (VS Turn to Frog VS Reverberate. Probably should've taken Frog, and would've taken the rare in real life)Divine FavorMerfolk MesmeristFirebreathingBountiful HarvestMountainDeck:Mountain (10)Island (7)Goblin ArsonistGoblin Fireslinger (3)Phantasmal Bear (2)Stormblood BerserkerGoblin Piker (2)Phantasmal ImageAether AdeptSkywinder DrakeGorehorn MinotaursPhantasmal DragonVolcanic DragonSphinx of UthuunGoblin Grenade (2)IncinerateDivinationChandra's OutrageWarstorm SurgeFireballSideboard:Goblin BangchuckersFirebreathing (2)CancelGoblin Tunneler (2)Tectonic RiftSlaughter CryTurn to FrogEven though I'm a little low on Goblins (6), I figure that Piker and Arsonist are obsolete enough to survive my opponents' removal and stick around until I decide to shove an incendiary device in their mouth and hurl them blindly towards my opponent.17 lands to err on the side of no mana screw.6 one-drops, 4 two-drops, 2-three drops, 4 finishers higher than that.5 burn spells, 1 finisher enchantment, and a card draw spell.Looks good.Only change I'd make is to pick the other Arsonist over the Bear in pack 3.Don't undervalue the consistency of picking Adept. More power can be tempting, even correct, but has a high potential to be costly.
I really hate splashing a third colour in M12 so I stayed UB after picking doom blade over day of judgement. Might not be the greatest deck but its the style of deck I like to play.creatures3x Tormented Soul1x phantasmal image2x skywinder drake1x bloodrage vampire1x aether adept1x Cemetery Reaper1x gravedigger1x aven fleetwing1x phantasmal dragon1x spinx of uthuunnon creatures3x doom blade2x mana leak1x dark favor1x negate2x divination1x consume spiritland9x swamp8x islandI don't really like ponder in draft, I definitely prefer divination. This is a fast format though so maybe ponder is better. I would be confidant sleeving this up in a draft, I think really aggressive starts would be difficult if I fail to draw control pieces but most of my non souls cards would trade for similar value.
Don't undervalue the consistency of picking Adept. More power can be tempting, even correct, but has a high potential to be costly.
I admittedly made an absolute hash of this first time around, passing the DoJ (wrongly, I admitted later) reasoning that I had already put my left into white that I needed to ensure that person stayed out of blue. That turned out to be garbage reasoning. Anyway, I ended up playing an aggro blue-green.
sphinx of uthuunGideon's Lawkeeperarbalest elitegravediggerbloodrage vampirestampeding rhino
are all fine choices. I've listed them in order of immediate preference. In those instances I tend to ask if each player casts the respective card, who wins? In many respects, its the lawkeeper, since he can (by himself) keep all the others locked down, and of course he hits the table 6 turns (at least) before the sphinx.However, the sphinx unanswered wins games by itself. lawkeeper wins games with another card. Plus, sphinx is more durable...
P2P1Nothing remarkable here. I'm kind of all over the place when it comes to colors. warstorm surge can be a beast, but I am not looking to splash red just for that. In the end, I take the card which shuts down my early drops.arachnus webAt the moment I'm not really in green, and I want to pick up some good black.P2P2Another dilemma. Here we have a few choices that could work:crown of empiresaether adeptphantasmal beardrifting shadestampeding rhinoIn the end, the crown would 'beat' all the others on the list in a 5-way fight, so I take the crown.P2P3There's a lot of spirit mantles floating around and that is something to look out for. Meanwhile I am torn between green and black for my second color.I can't help but think that if I switch into green now, I could still get the mana-fixing to splash for the doom blade. If I switch into black now, I'm likely to be in a weak blue-black.I take the jade mage.P2P4Phantasmal Image is a no-brainer, but I note the lack of good black.P2P5Another pack with little to offer outside of green. That's it, my second color is green.Sacred Wolf
Arachnus WebFireballRootbound CragPhantasmal BearAven FleetwingAven FleetwingPhantasmal DragonTrollhideBrindle BoarTurn to FrogReclaimGladecover ScoutLlanowar ElvesIslandMountainAggro Blue-GreenCreatures (13)1 x Sphinx of Uthuun1 x Merfolk Looter1 x Skywinder Drake2 x Runeclaw Bear1 x Jade Mage1 x Phantasmal Image1 x Sacred Wolf2 x Phantasmal Bear2 x Aven Fleetwing1 x Phantasmal DragonSpells (10)1 x Mana Leak1 x Ponder2 x Trollhide2 x Arachnus Web1 x Crown of Empires2 x Turn to Frog1 x FireballLands (17)1 x Rootbound Crag7 x Forest8 x Island1 x MountainSideboardDoom BladePlummetKite ShieldAmphin CutthroatFogDivinationCoral MerfolkLevitationGladecover ScoutWurm's ToothNaturalizeBrindle BoarReclaimGladecover ScoutLlanowar Elves
Round 2:Arachnus WebGideon's LawkeeperDivinationIce CageM: Stonehorn Dignitary S: armored warhorseAW's color requirements means it is unlikely to be a 2 drop, and as a 3 drop it is only marginally better than a 1/4. However, for a deck that wants to stall this four drop will still do that for a turn even if doom bladed.DivinationM: Pride Guardian S: Coral MerfolkOkay, so I didn't know I would get a bunch more. However I think for a defensive deck this is a no-brainer. Pride effectively blocks two creatures (ie. if they swing with a 2/2 and a 3/3 I get to cancel both attacks). Plus with kite shield I can even block heavy hitters such as vastwood gorger. This fits a strategy that wants the opponent to load up for a DoJ.Turn to FrogPride GuardianM: Grand Abolisher S: Phantasmal BearNot even close. GA doesn't just shut down countermagic, but also Lawkeepers, opponent's combat tricks and EOT kills. That this wheeled is incredible.Pride GuardianUnlike steve, I won't mind running 3.Pride GuardianDoh!Tormented SoulLifelinkForest
Round 3:Assault GriffinDoom BladeM: Plummet S: Divine FavorI have seen one volcanic dragon go by and my best creature has flying. Plus if I need to go into green (eg. sengir vampire) then I can justify having two plummets and a web instead of dom blades.M: Auramancer S: elite vanguardI think it is here that our strategies diverge. I favor running pride mages in the 1-drop and waiting. I just don't think the vanguard is going to be threatening anyone much with this deck. The auramancer however could find a slot depending on what I draw.M: Aven Fleetwing S: Peregrine GriffinI already have one griffin and I'm not trying to build a griffin deck. A second five drop seems a little late in the day for me.M: Aven Fleetwing S: Stormfront PegasusAgain with the fast creatures, but I think its too little too late for that. I'd rather wait a turn to drop this one which can't be hexed and has 1 more toughness. With this and the auramancer I am now considering grabbing a few auras, should they come my way.M: Phantasmal Dragon S: Benalish VeteranYes, PDiddy dies to everything. But if they have nothing, it kills in four turns. If they had a doom blade or a pacifism, it was dead anyway.M: Spirit Mantle S: Skywinder drakeThis was tough. But I have an auramancer and two hexproof creatures. Putting the mantle on a hexproof flyer is going to cause a real problem for an opponent.Mighty LeapTurn to FrogM: Divine Favor S: PlummetBoth our other choices wheeled. Go figure.Stave OffLlanowar ElvesIslandMountain
Round 2:Slaughter CryGorehorn MinotaursChandra's OutrageGoblin ArsonistBloodrage VampireIncinerateSlaughter CryManic VandalGoblin PikerTormented SoulZombie GoliathGoblin TunnelerNaturalizePlainsForest
Round 3:Volcanic DragonFireballGoblin BangchuckersGoblin ArsonistGoblin FireslingerVolcanic DragonFiery HellhoundDisentombDistressReverberateBrink of DisasterPhantasmal BearFirebreathingIslandMountain
Unfortunately its all irrelevant. We should have been in Red-Black bloodthirst.BR BloodthirstCreatures (15)2 x Bloodrage Vampire1 x Blood Ogre1 x Stormblood Berserker1 x Manic Vandal3 x Goblin Arsonist1 x Fiery Hellhound1 x Tormented Soul1 x Gorehorn Minotaurs1 x Goblin Piker2 x Volcanic Dragon1 x Goblin Fireslinger1 x Goblin BangchuckersSpells (9)2 x Doom Blade2 x Goblin Grenade1 x Slaughter Cry1 x Chandra's Outrage1 x Incinerate1 x Fireball1 x ReverberateLands (16)10 x mountain6 x swampSideboardPlummetManic VandalKite ShieldGoblin TunnelerWall of TorchesSlaughter CryGoblin TunnelerNaturalizeDistressBrink of DisasterFirebreathing
I first-picked Sphinx, and I can't imagine any reason not to do so. (Unless you know the people at the table and they all hate White or something.)It's a fast environment, but not Zendikar fast. It could be a single lone high-drop even in an aggro deck.To me Sphinx's card text reads "You can't lose this game if you get to survive until the next turn, regardless of whether the Sphinx itself lives." (Well, the opponent might draw into a Sorin's Vengeace or something, but still...)Taking the Lawkeeper here feels like the equivalent of taking an Incinerate over a Mind Control for the sake of "mana efficiency." It might become correct if you get a super Red Deck Wins curve, but how do you know what's flowing at this point? Taking the Lawkeeper feels like making the assumption at P1P1 that a smooth, flawless curve consisting of efficient white & blue flyers, Phantasmal Bears, Benalish Veterans and tempo tricks are going to be flowing my way, because I think that's what it takes for the efficiency of the Lawkeeper to beat out the raw power of the Sphinx.I followed a path very similar to Steve's picks, but as others mentioned, I would have taken the Phantasmal Dragon. Also, I would have taken the Divination over Ponder because I don' t just want draw quality, I want draw quantity for laying out lands. However, 1 Ponder and 2 Divination might be better than 3 Divinations, although there's no way of knowing it would turn out like that in advance. In hindsight, going Black over White also makes sense.
Pack 1, Pick 5Firebreathing, Giant Spider, Stave Off, Brink of Disaster, Wall of Torches, Lava Axe, Stormblood Berserker, Tectonic Rift, Sutured Ghoul, Mountain
Pick: Mana Leak????Hax.
I think this is the strongest deck type that can be made from the cards available but I would recommend a couple of changes:- Goblin Bangchuckers (really, a 2/2 for 4 that has a 50:50 chance of killing itself, no thanks)- Reverberate (while I do like this card, I think that it is better suited to a longer term strategy. You want to draw creatures, play creatures, swing and repeat)+2 Goblin Tunnellers (more fodder for grenades, fill in a very empty 2 slot and allow the Hellhound to go in for massive damage).As always, just my thoughts.
Round 2:Diabolic TutorGideon's LawkeeperGravediggerIce CageTormented SoulDuskhunter BatSlaughter CryDark FavorHunter's InsightGrand AbolisherMerfolk MesmeristPride GuardianFlightLifelinkForest
Round 3:Assault GriffinDoom BladeSerra AngelStave OffPeregrine GriffinStormfront PegasusPacifismStormfront PegasusMighty LeapArachnus WebPlummetGladecover ScoutLlanowar ElvesBountiful HarvestMountainDeck:2x Gideon's Lawkeeper3x Doom Blade2x Stave Off2x Peregrine Griffin2x Stormfront Pegasus1x Serra Angel1x Pacifism1x Assault Griffin1x Gravedigger1x Tormented Soul1x Duskhunter Bat1x Dark Favor1x Grand Abolisher1x Mighty Leap1x Pride Guardian1x Demistify1x Lifelink9 Plains8 Swamp
Round 1:Sphinx of UthuunDoom BladeDoom BladeBlood OgreStormblood BerserkerDevouring SwarmGoblin ArsonistDisentombManic VandalTormented SoulFiery HellhoundGoblin TunnelerWall of TorchesRuneclaw BearForest Round 2:Warstorm SurgeGorehorn MinotaursChandra's OutrageGoblin ArsonistGoblin FireslingerIncinerateSlaughter CryManic VandalGoblin PikerTormented SoulHunter's InsightGladecover ScoutNaturalizeLifelinkForest Round 3:Volcanic DragonFireballAct of TreasonGoblin ArsonistGoblin FireslingerVolcanic DragonChild of NightDisentombDistressTormented SoulDivine FavorPhantasmal BearLlanowar ElvesBountiful HarvestMountain Deck: Creatures (16):1 Blood Ogre1 Stormblood Berserker1 Devouring Swarm1 Fiery Hellhound1 Gorehorn Minotaurs1 Goblin Tunneler1 Manic Vandal1 Goblin Piker2 Goblin Fireslinger2 Volcanic Dragon1 Child of Night3 Tormented Soul Other Spells (7):2 Doom Blade1 Warstorm Surge1 Chandra's Outrage1 Incinerate1 Fireball1 Act of Treason
Lands (17):9 Mountain8 Swamp
Round 1:Sphinx of UthuunDoom BladeDoom BladeSkywinder DrakeSutured GhoulDivinationMind UnboundDisentombNegateTormented SoulFlightFogWall of TorchesRuneclaw BearForest
Round 2:Diabolic TutorDrifting ShadeRune-Scarred DemonPhantasmal ImageBloodrage VampireDuskhunter BatDisentombWarpath GhoulZombie GoliathPhantasmal BearMerfolk MesmeristKraken's EyeTormented SoulLifelinkForest
Round 3:Cemetery ReaperDoom BladeDisentombPhantasmal BearMana LeakDevouring SwarmPhantasmal DragonSkywinder DrakeDistressTurn to FrogBrink of DisasterMerfolk MesmeristRuneclaw BearBountiful HarvestMountainThere were alot of really nice U/B cards in the draft. My only regret might be my low count of creatures, but I still think a deck made from these would do well.
I don't post much anymore.
3 goblin fireslinger, 2 goblin arsonist, 2 blood ogre, 2 goblin grenade, 1 incinerate, 1 chandra’s outrage, 2 shock, 1 stormblood berseker
1 gorehorn minotaurs, 1 fireball, 1 fiery hellhound, 1 bonebreaker giant, 1 goblin piker, 1 volcanic dragon, 1 act of treason, 1 slaughter cry
1 goblin tunneler, 1 reverberate
I was wondering if it is really possible to draft mono red in magic 2012 drafts? Or it's always necesary drafting at least 2 colors?