The Cheesesinger

19 posts / 0 new
Last post
"Come muse, let us sing of cheese."


Seamlessly combines three (four if you count Dilettantecheese) kinds of cheese into delicious deadliness (Frostcheese + Polearmcheese + Chargecheese). This results in a strange defender/controller/striker hybrid.
 
I wasn't particular about the order of the feats; it's the end result I cared about.

Okay, so it should be fairly easy to deduce how this works:
#1: Use Bladesong. Attack monster with minor action Quickened Spellcasting Eldritch Strike. Action Point time? Charge another monster (or same if you use Rushing Cleats for a Slide 2) with Vanguard Rapier that targets Reflex and has all sorts of damage/accuracy bonuses, grants you a +3 bonus to AC from Marauder's, triggers Frostcheese due to Admixtured Eldritch Strike.
#2: Frostbite double dips with Frostcheese which in turn slows the target on each Rapier Eldritch Strike attack.
#3: Enemy enters an adjacent square on your turn, you use the Staggering glaive retrieved from the Diamond Scabbard which sends him flying off prone and is almost sure to hit due to a +5 bonus from Blade Opportunist + Bahamut Boon. If that was the Frostcheese enemy even better because you triggered Frostcheese damage yet again, and have CA to boot. You're set if your party can force the monster to enter an adjacent square.
#4: Swap in your rapier and swap out your glaive as a minor with Master at Arms, charge, sheathe your rapier as a free action with Fast Hands. Proceed to step #2. Rinse and repeat. 


In addition, Defending Dabbler marks every target hit with your Eldritch Strike for more fun, and obvious synergy with Polearm Master's L16 feature. Also Battle Awareness.

Alternately with Rushing Cleats, or using your glaive you can ready an action to attack an enemy when it's their turn to slide him into and trigger Polearm Gamble etc...

Defenses are pretty solid, charging grants +3 AC, Ring of Teros +2 AC that's not factored in the numbers below. Shadowband grants perma Concealment. +1 to all defenses when bloodied from Mercenary. You also have all those neat encounter interrupts and strong defensive dailies via your Wizard utility powers so that's cool too.

Offensive Variant: Take Light Blade Mastery and Arcane Admixture 2 (Cold) for Lightning Ring. I'd recommend swapping out Hafted Defense and Armor Proficiency: Hide.

Didn't care too much about the encounters as dailies because whatever man.


====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======Cheesesinger, level 30
Half-Elf, Bladesinger, Polearm Master, Destined Scion
Level 1 Blade Magic: Blade Magic: Rapier
Epic Heroism: Epic Heroism (Dexterity)
Epic Heroism: Epic Heroism (Constitution)
Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Constitution
Arcane Admixture Damage Type: Arcane Admixture Cold
Half-Elf Power Selection: Dilettante
Quickened Spellcasting: Eldritch Strike
Arcane Admixture Power: Eldritch Strike
Background: Elf - Urban Elf (Thievery class skill)
Theme: Mercenary

FINAL ABILITY SCORES: Str 16, Con 28, Dex 24, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 10.
STARTING ABILITY SCORES: Str 12, Con 16, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8.

AC: 45 Fort: 45 Reflex: 45 Will: 43 HP: 185 Surges: 15 Surge Value: 46
Init: +22

TRAINED SKILLS: Arcana +21, Perception +23, Acrobatics +26, Thievery +26, Endurance +28


UNTRAINED SKILLS: Bluff +15, Diplomacy +17, Dungeoneering +18, Heal +18, History +16, Insight +20, Intimidate +17, Nature +18, Religion +16, Stealth +21, Streetwise +17, Athletics +17

FEATS
Level 1: Wintertouched
Level 2: Wrathful Warrior (retrained to Battle Awareness at Level 14)
Level 4: Hafted Defense
Level 6: Master at Arms
Level 8: Defending Dabbler
Level 10: Improved Defenses
Level 11: Versatile Master
Level 12: Deft Blade
Level 14: Polearm Momentum
Level 16: Blade Opportunist
Level 18: Nimble Blade
Level 20: Arcane Admixture
Level 21: Polearm Gamble
Level 22: Surprising Charge
Level 24: Armor Proficiency: Hide
Level 26: Quickened Spellcasting
Level 28: Epic Will
Level 30: Epic Reflexes

POWERS
Dilettante: Eldritch Strike
Bladesinger at-will 1: Unseen Hand
Bladesinger at-will 1: Dazzling Sunray
Bladesinger at-will 1: Frost Bite
Bladesinger Cantrips: Mage Hand
Bladesinger Cantrips: Ghost Sound
Bladesinger Cantrips: Light
Level 1 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Charm of Misplaced Wrath
Level 1 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Orbmaster's Incendiary Detonation
Level 2 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Fast Hands
Level 5 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Blissful Ignorance
Level 5 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Radiant Pillar
Level 9 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Fire Sea Travel
Level 9 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Phantom Foes
Level 6 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Shield
Level 6 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Wizard's Escape
Level 10 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Repelling Shield
Level 10 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Blur
Level 15 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Dark Gathering
Level 15 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Hold Monster
Level 16 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Stoneskin
Level 16 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Displacement
Level 19 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Mass Charm
Level 19 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Horrific Shadow
Level 22 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Time Stop
Level 22 Bladesinger Utility Powers: Wraithform
Level 25 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Charm of False Heroism
Level 25 Bladesinger Daily Powers: Acid Storm

ITEMS
Staggering Glaive +6,
Bracers of Mighty Striking (epic tier),
Marauder's Roc Hide Armor +6,
Horned Helm (epic tier),
Bahamut's Protective Ward (level 28),
Badge of the Berserker +6,
Belt of the Witch King (paragon tier),
Golden Ring of Teros (epic tier),
Shadow Band (epic tier),
Gloves of Ice (epic tier),
Vanguard Rapier +6,
Backlash Tattoo (heroic tier),
Diamond Scabbard (epic tier) (2),
Zephyr Boots (epic tier),
Dice of Auspicious Fortune (paragon tier),
Siberys Shard of Merciless Cold (epic tier) (2)
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======


Yeah...  when the best way to build a class is by completely ignoring it's primary stat... there's something a bit wrong with the class.  This reminds me those early Avenger builds where the goal was to take as few actual Avenger powers and feats as possible in order to be a competitive striker.
Yeah...  when the best way to build a class is by completely ignoring it's primary stat... there's something a bit wrong with the class.  



What do you mean? He took plenty of dexterity. Given the stupidity of maxing Dex/Int, isn't that the primary stat for Bladesingers?

Small note, you can't draw a Halberd from a scabbard. Heavy and Light blades only. You might want to grab yourself Fast hands at level 2, using a background for theivery. 
Halberd is a Heavy Blade. It has come to my attention though that the Diamond Sheath does not permit free sheathing so I will be taking your advice, as I'd rather not lose out on the +3 AC for charging by swapping out Marauder's for Battle Harness.
Halberd is an Axe/Polearm. A glaive is a Heavy Blade/Polearm. Perhaps that is what you were thinking of?
I can't say I see a halberd fitting into a scabbard :p
How do you plan on hitting in heroic tier with that setup?  Lots of pew pew pew with magic missile?

That's the problem with the Half-Elf Eldritch Strike build.  Either you take melee training, or you spend ten levels dragging the party down.

If you're going half-elf, you're probably better off MCing into Cleric, taking Morninglord, wielding that mace that does half radiant damage (Crusader's Weapon?), admixturing cold onto Eldritch Strike, and dropping the polearm stuff altogether.  You'll do significantly less in [W] damage, but you tap both vulnerable Radiant 10 and Cold 5 so it balances out.  And looks a hot mess.
Melee training (CON).  Should be in there at first.
Harrying your Prey, the Easy Way: A Hunter's Handbook - the first of what will hopefully be many CharOp efforts on my part. The Blinker - teleport everywhere. An Eladrin Knight/Eldritch Knight. CB != rules source.
Halberd is an Axe/Polearm. A glaive is a Heavy Blade/Polearm. Perhaps that is what you were thinking of?



Aye. Fixed and updated.

 I can't say I see a halberd fitting into a scabbard :p



Nor a glaive, but hey, there you go :P

And yes, Melee training (CON) should be in early if you plan to actually run this build pre-paragon. That said, this isn't the only feat order optimization that needs to be done; I might get around to doing that later, but I just wanted to throw the concept together and have it looking pretty by epic.

As for the Cleric Multiclass, nah. Polearmcheese is super strong, especially in a party with forced movement if your DM rules that triggers Polearm Gamble (whether it actually does is a little ambiguous); I'd much rather autohit anything that approaches me, knock it prone, mark it, and slide it across the room for a follow up charge with Frostcheese damage/CA than exploit vulnerable Radiant 10. Morninglord is also setting dependent which I dislike (so are the shards you might argue, but they're integral to Frostcheese, and I try to keep setting specific stuff to a minimum).
Also, forced movement does not trigger polearm gamble (at least according to majority concensus).
Also, forced movement does not trigger polearm gamble (at least according to majority concensus).





The build is not contingent on forced movement triggering PG; it just makes the Cheesesinger that much better if it does.

Also, forced movement does not trigger polearm gamble (at least according to majority concensus).





The build is not contingent on forced movement triggering PG; it just makes the Cheesesinger that much better if it does.



Defensive Advantage also does not combo with wintertouched because with that you only have CA while attacking. You don't have CA against them when they are attacking you. You would need a continuous CA feature or condition (like a dazed enemy).
Defensive Advantage also does not combo with wintertouched because with that you only have CA while attacking. You don't have CA against them when they are attacking you. You would need a continuous CA feature or condition (like a dazed enemy).



True it's for the attack only; I'd consider fitting in Deadly Draw, but it almost seems a waste, because that's 2 feats for +2 conditional AC, as the build has CA already against anything that triggers Polearmcheese or has been hit the turn before. I suppose I can substitute Defensive Advantage for Hide Proficiency.

Defensive Advantage also does not combo with wintertouched because with that you only have CA while attacking. You don't have CA against them when they are attacking you. You would need a continuous CA feature or condition (like a dazed enemy).



True it's for the attack only; I'd consider fitting in Deadly Draw, but it almost seems a waste, because that's 2 feats for +2 conditional AC, as the build has CA already against anything that triggers Polearmcheese or has been hit the turn before. I suppose I can substitute Defensive Advantage for Hide Proficiency.




Not a bad swap. I do like the comboing of Defending Dabbler with Polearm Master PP, giving you pretty much a full defender feature as long as you keep hitting. You might want to consider power swapping for something like Kirre's Roar for an encounter multi-mark that also gives you resist all.
Think it might be worth swapping out Hafted Defense for Light Blade Mastery.
Alternatively, you can replace Hafted Defenses and Improved Defenses for the White Lotus chain. Unless the Bladesinger has a good source of immediate attacks. Don't know, really.

Since you are going strictly for frostcheese and not trying to mix frost and radiant, you might want to admixture cold onto lightning ring and use that instead, so you get an extra ping of damage to trigger cold vulnerable with the slide from eldritch strike. So your first MBA applies the cold vulnerable and then you slap on the lightning ring which will ping the vulnerable, and then then first time they move before the end of your next turn (which includes forced movement, so when you hit them with eldrtitch strike again), they get pinged again by the secondary effect of lightning ring.
No polearm gamble, but when you talk bladesinger and polearm "cheese" it makes me kick around a Dragonborn Spearsinger in the back of my head.

Pump Str/Dex, pick wizard encounters that don't have attack rolls or have nice effects, carry a spear/trident/tratnyr as your weapon, multiclass Fighter, pump the push effects, toss on Draconic Arrogance and Polearm Momentum, permafrost...  May not be the most op, but it would be interesting.
Since you are going strictly for frostcheese and not trying to mix frost and radiant, you might want to admixture cold onto lightning ring and use that instead, so you get an extra ping of damage to trigger cold vulnerable with the slide from eldritch strike. So your first MBA applies the cold vulnerable and then you slap on the lightning ring which will ping the vulnerable, and then then first time they move before the end of your next turn (which includes forced movement, so when you hit them with eldrtitch strike again), they get pinged again by the secondary effect of lightning ring.



You know, I had considered it, but I wasn't sure if it was worth the cost of a feat, and Frost Bite's additional control. That said, I think it's definitely worth listing as a notable variant at least.