It's simple WoTC

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You once told us that you needed to make all the other tools before you made a VT, because all those tools have to work with the VT. Some of those tools you told us about were Campaign manager, Encounter Builder, Map maker, Treasure Builder, that kind of stuff. You even backed that choice of direction up with a poll that you said showed 85% of those asked wanted other tools before a VT. And when the integrity of that pole was question, you defended it.

And the need to change the CB and MB to online versions, was so that those tools would work with the VT you are working on.

So what about the other tools? You've stopped talking about them all together. That's not confirmation that you have decided not to make them, but your general pattern is that when you change your mind on something, you stop talking about it for a long time and eventually announce that you have changed directions.

You told us the plan was to come out with all of these other tools first, which would be needed before a VT could function. Can we assume that those other tools have been shelved?

I can understand that things change. If you come and tell us that yes, for the 4th time, you've changed directions with DDi, fine. I personally will just go away. If DDi isn't what going to be what you've been telling for the past three years, fine, I can accept that.

Yes, it does mean you've lost me as a DDi customer. But you also know that you are always going to be losing customers as you gain customers, so yeah, no big deal. More then likely, however, you've lost a customer for life, for all your products.

Not because DDi isn't what I want, but because of how you have handled your customers. You can't keep failing on small and big levels, while taking money from me, and expect me to feel that's ok. If you want to keep reducing the amount of service I get for DDI, without reducing the price either, that's your choice. Just like how I chose to turn of auto renewal.

WoTC, you make me feel like I'm not wanted, nor is my money. I've spent more time giving positive feedback, suggestions and more, then being negative. In return, I feel I've gotten less and less, to the point now where it seems like I'm not the customer you want.

If I'm not the person you want as a customer, just tell me that. Don't keep me thinking that DDi is suddenly going to be what you told me it was going to be. If you feel that how I currently view you is wrong, then do something to re-earn my trust and make me see you as you feel you should be seen.

Maybe this is the end of the road for me and WOTC. I'm certainly willing to continue spending money on your products providing they are what you claim them to be.

But as it is now, I can't tell what DDi is supposed to be, because frankly, you won't tell us.
i think its simple to assume that encounter, treasure and map builder things are all going to be features of the VTT since those are linked to the CB and the MB it kind of moots your point

i mean why have a seprate tool to do something the VTT is perfectly capable of doing on its own?  
When I first started poking around the Insider forums, Dane popped into a majority of negative threads to defend WotC.  Now this.

Maybe it's a sign you're doing something wrong, WotC.  Not just on the tools brought up here, but on the whole approach to DDI over the past year or so.
[20:53] [SadisticFish] yeah Llamas convinced me
"Your loss is delicious to the lady."

In all seriousness, I agree with LlamasNotsheep.  Many of us have had disagreements on direction and how we have been treated by WotC, yet here we are today.

This is not a situation where I wanted to be right.  I would love to have been proven wrong and we could all be using excelent new tools today.  Sadly that is not the case.
i think its simple to assume that encounter, treasure and map builder things are all going to be features of the VTT since those are linked to the CB and the MB it kind of moots your point

i mean why have a seprate tool to do something the VTT is perfectly capable of doing on its own?  



They have already, in the beta forums, said no to those ideas. It's not what they intend for the VT.

For example, you can make maps in the VT, but they have no plans on allowing you to export that. They have no plans on allowing you to import your own map art.

They have no plans on allowing you save your characters back into the CB, because they have no plans to let the VT act like a campaign manager.

I'm in the beta, I and many others have suggested all of this.

You can import your characters and monsters. You can make maps that are specific only to that adventure. You are limited on the size of your dungeons. Using the drawing tools eats up a lot of memory, making the size of your dungeon even smaller.

You can track conditions, hit points and intitative in the vt and that's about it.

Since they don't have any plans to include these kinds of tools as part of the vt, it's why I'm asking.
It is pretty obvious that DDI does not have the resources and/or the skillset to provide everything that they had initially intended to.  One can presume that is why they used a 3rd party engine for the VT and why the organization and community utilities (such as find a game) for the VT are so primitive.  It also explains why we are not going to get many of the items addressed that are requested of the VT.

It's obvious the solution is not going to come from WotC/DDI.  There are solutions out there now that surpass the scope of the VT.  My suggestion is to invest your time and money in one of those.  Most have demos, so you can make an educated decision where to spend your money.  Whatever you choose, you are guaranteed to be much happier than focusing on DDI's shortcomings.

The VT and DDI is what it is.  This controversy has been ongoing in some way, shape, or form for about 3 years now.  Based upon that, I would expect more of the same until they prove otherwise.

Bottom line, I too was a full supporter and flagbearer of WotC.  DDI converted me into a DDI non-believer.  But I'm not going to get worked up over it, particularly since there are solutions available that meet most of my needs.  Those remaining needs will be addressed by my own hands.  If DDI turns it around, great.  I'll be a full supporter again.  Until then, I'll just continue to root for their success, since I would love to see the best digital support come straight from the source.

Good luck finding peace.



EDIT:  There's a pretty slick looking 3rd party game table shaping up here.  Looks like a pretty fine project to get behind.

Celebrate our differences.

You once told us that you needed to make all the other tools before you made a VT, because all those tools have to work with the VT. Some of those tools you told us about were Campaign manager, Encounter Builder, Map maker, Treasure Builder, that kind of stuff.

[snip]...lots of good stuff.....[/snip]




I have just a couple of things: WOW, WOW and WOW.  That is not a good WOW either. So far, most (if not ALL) of the heaviest supporters of DDI from a couple of years ago have REVERSED their view on DDI.

This is not a good way to keep customers.  I keep coming back hoping to see some life, even though I have mostly moved on from WotC products becuase of the same things above.  We continue 1 4E campagin, but none of us have bought 4E stuff in 6 months or more.
WOTC Podcast: "The web is a shortcut" "Piracy was a big thing"
I've gotta echo the WOWs there.  No importing custom map art = epic fail.  I'm sure it's intended to A) avoid copyright issues, and B) encourage people to buy/rent official adventures for use in the VT.  I play largely/primarily using MapTool, and when I find awesome maps online, they're often enough to inspire an encounter or even an entire adventure.

If WotC could crank out a set of really good, interconnected tools, it would absolutely define the future of the genre.  It's obvious at this point that isn't going to happen.  It's a huge disappointment, but I agree: they clearly don't have the resources they need.  Maybe by the time 5E rolls around, one of the free options (hi2u MapTool 1.4!) will have laid the groundwork so that WotC can drop a cheap knock-off.

This post wasn't going to be that negative.  Then I realized just how disappointed I am to learn about the lack of VT features, and it started to change pretty rapidly.  I let my sub expire a few months ago and haven't really missed anything, but I was expecting to re-up for the combined VT/CB/MB once things move out of beta, or at least have some basic features and are available to all insiders.  Apparently they aren't going to have the basic features even once they leave beta, though (if they ever do).

Blerg.  I'm really disappointed. 
[20:53] [SadisticFish] yeah Llamas convinced me
I've gotta echo the WOWs there.  No importing custom map art = epic fail.  I'm sure it's intended to A) avoid copyright issues, and B) encourage people to buy/rent official adventures for use in the VT.  I play largely/primarily using MapTool, and when I find awesome maps online, they're often enough to inspire an encounter or even an entire adventure.

If WotC could crank out a set of really good, interconnected tools, it would absolutely define the future of the genre.  It's obvious at this point that isn't going to happen.  It's a huge disappointment, but I agree: they clearly don't have the resources they need.  Maybe by the time 5E rolls around, one of the free options (hi2u MapTool 1.4!) will have laid the groundwork so that WotC can drop a cheap knock-off.

This post wasn't going to be that negative.  Then I realized just how disappointed I am to learn about the lack of VT features, and it started to change pretty rapidly.  I let my sub expire a few months ago and haven't really missed anything, but I was expecting to re-up for the combined VT/CB/MB once things move out of beta, or at least have some basic features and are available to all insiders.  Apparently they aren't going to have the basic features even once they leave beta, though (if they ever do).

Blerg.  I'm really disappointed. 

I'll tell you this...  If the community was given the source code to the VT and a decent API to the compendium, you'd likely have everything that you could ever hope for in a VT in a matter of 3-6 months.  Heck, even with just the API you probably would.

Make a DDI subscription a requirement for the API/VT's usage, and they would likely see subscriptions boom.

Celebrate our differences.

No doubt there. The VT is just a Java program, and even I know how to mess around in Java. It could be truly majestic.

In fact, an open API and VT would be something that brought me back. They've got nothing I want right now (save the compendium, but buying for that is an implicit approval of the rest, which I refuse to provide), but open up the guts, and I'm totallly down. I would buy it so hard
This is pretty amazing. Whatever is going on with DDI it's not even satisfying your strongest supporters. 

Personally I feel like D&D has lost it's way. That they are trying too many changes to find a young audiance and it's not working out.  I think money is tight. I was just reading a sales blurb for the new Shadowfell book and it didn't look like they even read it before posting it:

It also includes provides information on other locations heroes are likely to visit beyond the city’s dark walls.  

Honest mistake? Probably. Not one I'd expect from a multimillion dollar company who lives and dies on thier publishing skills.

 
When I first started poking around the Insider forums, Dane popped into a majority of negative threads to defend WotC.  Now this.

Maybe it's a sign you're doing something wrong, WotC.  Not just on the tools brought up here, but on the whole approach to DDI over the past year or so.



I feel like so many of the DDI members are guys who fell asleep at a party, a party that was pretty cool at first and then started to get lame.  They only wake up when they realize they're getting nacho cheese smeared on their faces and getting written on with sharpies, then they try as hard as they can to wake the other guys up, but some people are just way to drunk and can't wake up.

The odds that this party is going to get cool again have gotten pretty low at this point.  Wake up and go home, or find a different party.  I, for one, am very glad to see that Dane is awake.

Hell, even I defended WotC a year ago, and now I'm a damn poster boy for the paranoid conspiracy-theory forum trolls.  It's possible I'm just paranoid, but it's looking more and more like my insight checks have been rolling nat 20s all along.
I have just a couple of things: WOW, WOW and WOW.  That is not a good WOW either. So far, most (if not ALL) of the heaviest supporters of DDI from a couple of years ago have REVERSED their view on DDI.



Yeah in the early days I was very pro-D&DI, I'm the only person in our group that signed up to it. Still the membership numbers seem to be rising so they must be doing something right. Mind you if Plaguescarred ever says he doesn't like something then it's all over.

Still the membership numbers seem to be rising so they must be doing something right.

Name recognition is still a powerful selling tool.  My thoughts are that Essentials are probably more successful than people want to admit.  With DDI offering less than before, I just can't back your horse.

True story:  A friend of mine just subscribed for no other reason than to manage the characters via the CB for the campaign I run.  After trying it out, he's rather disappointed in the CB.  I warned him, but his options are pretty limited, so he went with it anyhow.  Moral to the story: sometimes bad options are your only options.

Celebrate our differences.

That's what really bothers me, what has change at WotC, that the D&DI service level and actual content they are producing is dropping while the money it must be making must be rising because the numbers are going up.

Was the D&DI so vastly over subsidised at the start, so that even though the numbers are still rising to actual have it pay for itself the number of staff supporting it has had to drop significantly? That seems the obvious answer.

The D&DI was given so long to start turning a profit and it hasn't managed it in that time. They know the concept is sound and like the fact subscriptions are still rising, and the predicatable income they provide, so they don't want to can it completely, but they now need to make it pay for itself and quickly.

 
There's a pretty simple answer, actually.  New customers don't have the same expectations of DDI as us longer-standing customers have.  As a result, they are much easier to please and maintain.  And those new customers don't seem to be joining the forums, either.  I don't see many "Hi guys, I'm new here!" posts as I used to.

As a straight up cash cow, DDI is a pretty huge success, and I am sure that is all that WotC/Hasbro cares about.  As for quality...  well, that speaks for itself.  They can't even get the proper links put into their web site on any consistent basis.

Celebrate our differences.

I've been playing D&D since AD&D came out.   I buy everything.    I love the idea of DDi as a professional programmer and I see the potential so much.   An open API would solve everything in such a short time - it would make DDi the best investment in the world.

I'm a DDi subscriber and I remain so - ONLY for the compendium and this is only because this way I can build MapTool tokens directly from it using my own program I wrote.     I keep wondering if I should quit my subscription but I probably won't as it would actually make playing D&D a lot harder for me and my group.

I am amazed to find myself writing this but I too am beginning to think WotC have screwed up and that things are just going from bad to worse.  Trouble is I don't see how they can get out of this mess (without the afore mentioned API) and yet I think I'm stuck as a subscriber due to needing the compendium for my games.

Blakey
Trouble is I don't see how they can get out of this mess (without the afore mentioned API) and yet I think I'm stuck as a subscriber due to needing the compendium for my games.

I think a lot of us are in this exact situation.  I dub this The Compendium Conundrum.

Celebrate our differences.

Trouble is I don't see how they can get out of this mess (without the afore mentioned API) and yet I think I'm stuck as a subscriber due to needing the compendium for my games.

I think a lot of us are in this exact situation.  I dub this The Compendium Conundrum.




It is very interesting to me how different people use DDi in different ways.  I alomst never used the Compendium, but I use the Character Builder at least weekly and the Monster Builder almost daily sometimes.  I have recently begun using the Compendium more because I am creating Item Cards similar in size and style to the old Encounters Reward Cards.  I hand these out "in game" so the players have something tactile to hold on to, and to hold the relevant rules until they can get their character updated in the CB.  Copying and pasting that info from the Compendium makes this task quick and easy.

[Edit] For those who may be interested in what I am talking about...


Kalex the Omen 
Dungeonmaster Extraordinaire

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Concerning Player Rules Bias
Kalex_the_Omen wrote:
Gaining victory through rules bias is a hollow victory and they know it.
Concerning "Default" Rules
Kalex_the_Omen wrote:
The argument goes, that some idiot at the table might claim that because there is a "default" that is the only true way to play D&D. An idiotic misconception that should be quite easy to disprove just by reading the rules, coming to these forums, or sending a quick note off to Customer Support and sharing the inevitable response with the group. BTW, I'm not just talking about Next when I say this. Of course, D&D has always been this way since at least the late 70's when I began playing.

Very nice Kalex.   However my group plays totally online now via MapTool so there are no dice, no minis, no board and no handouts.   However the majority of us sit around the same table in the same room in a LAN party and a couple of people who could not play with us without MapTool due to geographical remoteness dial in from their homes.

It's been a steady progression but we'll never go back to minis and dice.   And for this reason we need the Compendium.

But I would pay twice the current subscription for a fully featured API.
It is very interesting to me how different people use DDi in different ways.  I alomst never used the Compendium, but I use the Character Builder at least weekly and the Monster Builder almost daily sometimes.  I have recently begun using the Compendium more because I am creating Item Cards similar in size and style to the old Encounters Reward Cards.  I hand these out "in game" so the players have something tactile to hold on to, and to hold the relevant rules until they can get their character updated in the CB.  Copying and pasting that info from the Compendium makes this task quick and easy.




Holy broken forum layout! :D

I tended to use the Compendium because I was a GM, and I needed to import monsters into MapTool. I only usually had to import a character one time, and then the MapTool framework would handle all the level-up stuff and so forth, so the CB became unnecessary after the single use to generate the initial character. But you always need monsters to fight, so I raided the compendium frequently for monsters to drop into MapTool.

Never much used the monster builder, because if I needed to reskin or level a monster, I'd drop it from the Compendium into MapTool, and do the reskinning/adjustments there (and besides, I thought the interface sucked canal water).

I don't run any games anymore so I don't need it any more, but I did like the easy lookup (I actually liked the old version better, even if it was uglier, because I found it simpler to navigate).
It is very interesting to me how different people use DDi in different ways.  I alomst never used the Compendium,



Careful if you don't use things they take them away. 
Careful if you don't use things they take them away. 

Sometimes they take them away even when you do use them.

Celebrate our differences.

I have just a couple of things: WOW, WOW and WOW.  That is not a good WOW either. So far, most (if not ALL) of the heaviest supporters of DDI from a couple of years ago have REVERSED their view on DDI.



Yeah in the early days I was very pro-D&DI, I'm the only person in our group that signed up to it. Still the membership numbers seem to be rising so they must be doing something right. Mind you if Plaguescarred ever says he doesn't like something then it's all over.






Yep. You are one of the people that I mean when I say that. Look, I have been very very skeptical of the whole project, but I payed for the cb for 2 years because I liked the program. I just never fell into the belief that it was every going to come together. I lived through it before.
WOTC Podcast: "The web is a shortcut" "Piracy was a big thing"
It is very interesting to me how different people use DDi in different ways.  I alomst never used the Compendium, but I use the Character Builder at least weekly and the Monster Builder almost daily sometimes.  I have recently begun using the Compendium more because I am creating Item Cards similar in size and style to the old Encounters Reward Cards.  I hand these out "in game" so the players have something tactile to hold on to, and to hold the relevant rules until they can get their character updated in the CB.  Copying and pasting that info from the Compendium makes this task quick and easy.




Holy broken forum layout! :D

I tended to use the Compendium because I was a GM, and I needed to import monsters into MapTool. I only usually had to import a character one time, and then the MapTool framework would handle all the level-up stuff and so forth, so the CB became unnecessary after the single use to generate the initial character. But you always need monsters to fight, so I raided the compendium frequently for monsters to drop into MapTool.

Never much used the monster builder, because if I needed to reskin or level a monster, I'd drop it from the Compendium into MapTool, and do the reskinning/adjustments there (and besides, I thought the interface sucked canal water).

I don't run any games anymore so I don't need it any more, but I did like the easy lookup (I actually liked the old version better, even if it was uglier, because I found it simpler to navigate).





I hardly ever used the compendium. We used the cb and the mb alot. I would download every compiled mag as they where made available and view the PDF on my iPad. In fact, we never used laptops at the game table except for the DM. I have a projector game board (using map tools) that we use minis on and the DM uses tokens. It just works out pretty good for us that way. I have just recently started to use the iPad for my character sheet as well as notes. Laptops for players seemed to get in the way too much for my liking. We never got into using the compendium during the game because the rules came late and we already solved our problem in that regard.

Btw, we get together ever week and play face to face. I don,t begrudge the online stuff, but it everything should not be slanted that way and leave the rest of us with nothing. My biggest complaint with the online stuff is that you play it their way or you don,t get to use the tools. This was somewhat in place in the old tools as well, but we could decide that this update was way to much of a deal breaker for us and then just not update from then on. When we found "the tool" we started using tht. We know have custom content, and real control over the way we want to play our games (well the only 4e game that we play anymore).
WOTC Podcast: "The web is a shortcut" "Piracy was a big thing"
No arguments from me. That was just my response to the comment that it was interesting how differently people used the service.

I wish I could play face-to-face with my group. Sadly, it is not to be (and hasn't been for years).
So what about the other tools? You've stopped talking about them all together. That's not confirmation that you have decided not to make them, but your general pattern is that when you change your mind on something, you stop talking about it for a long time and eventually announce that you have changed directions.

You told us the plan was to come out with all of these other tools first, which would be needed before a VT could function. Can we assume that those other tools have been shelved?



To clarify, are you meaning that they said they were going to work on the others first in regards to the now-vaporware VTT, or the current VT with the cloud-based toolset?
D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition
Very nice Kalex.   However my group plays totally online now via MapTool so there are no dice, no minis, no board and no handouts.   However the majority of us sit around the same table in the same room in a LAN party and a couple of people who could not play with us without MapTool due to geographical remoteness dial in from their homes.

It's been a steady progression but we'll never go back to minis and dice.   And for this reason we need the Compendium.

But I would pay twice the current subscription for a fully featured API.



I wouldn't give up playing with minis, handouts and battlemats for anything.  This is partly due to my ~2300 mini DDM collection.

Kalex the Omen 
Dungeonmaster Extraordinaire

OSR Fan? Our Big Announcement™ is here!

Please join our forums!

Concerning Player Rules Bias
Kalex_the_Omen wrote:
Gaining victory through rules bias is a hollow victory and they know it.
Concerning "Default" Rules
Kalex_the_Omen wrote:
The argument goes, that some idiot at the table might claim that because there is a "default" that is the only true way to play D&D. An idiotic misconception that should be quite easy to disprove just by reading the rules, coming to these forums, or sending a quick note off to Customer Support and sharing the inevitable response with the group. BTW, I'm not just talking about Next when I say this. Of course, D&D has always been this way since at least the late 70's when I began playing.

I turned off my auto-renew last month. simply put, the online CB was my primary tool and when they switched to the new one I lost so much functionality that it was easier to do everything by hand. Plus I didnt like that there was a limit to the number characters I could store OR that I could not store them on my own computer.

Several other issues snow balled that let me to give up on DDI after two years as a subscriber:


1)discontinuation of the original CB and MB.


2) discontinuation of compiling  complete issues of Dragon and Dugeon magazine.


3)Purposely delaying and ultimately never updating the original CB and MB to include Dark Sun material.


4) changes to the compendium which removed previously included  RPGA material.


5) Claiming all spring and summer of 2010 that the essentials line was simply going to be a 10 product run, and then annoucing in the fall after the changes to the Essentials model of character building and product format would be the standard going forward. My biggest issue with essentials is it broke away from the strict class structures which made 4E characters all balanced and easy for a DM to prepare balanced encounters for all in order to try and bring back die-hard  3.5 players who prefer a system where not all classes are equal.     


My group had gotten fully behind 4E when it came out and we really enjoyed it. But after seeing the direction the game has taken with essentials and the drop  in useful services that DDI once provided we have taken our money elsewhere.


It's a shame because I had always held WoTC in high regard when they resurrected D&D from the ashes of TSR. I just cannot bring myself to support DDI anymore.
So what about the other tools? You've stopped talking about them all together. That's not confirmation that you have decided not to make them, but your general pattern is that when you change your mind on something, you stop talking about it for a long time and eventually announce that you have changed directions.

You told us the plan was to come out with all of these other tools first, which would be needed before a VT could function. Can we assume that those other tools have been shelved?



To clarify, are you meaning that they said they were going to work on the others first in regards to the now-vaporware VTT, or the current VT with the cloud-based toolset?



That's what they said. There was no indication that they were changing the scope of the VT before they actually announced it. It was just, HEY! we are going to do a VT now! Which is why all the tools had to be moved online.

And it's been asked, what does this mean for the other tools. And seriously what came back was, "That's a good question!" I mean, really?

So, if we go off what they say, all the tools to run a VT are going to be developed before a VT can be made. Now the VT is being made. Does that mean we have all the tools we need?

That's a good question!

And being inside the beta, and hearing things like the VT is intended for those player that don't have a group near them or if someone wants to play and their regular group can't meet. So, not a player like me, who has regular play groups and a large circle of gaming friends. Fine not everything is meant for me, they need to be diverse.

But the tools were changed so they could support the VT. Ok fine. But that seems to mean taking a lot out of the tools that I found useful. Like customization.

And now in the beta, they are taking a lot of the adventures in Dungeon and the adventures for Encounters and asking us to run sessions testing those. Ok, fine. But what about the ability to use these tools to customize our home face to face games.

That's a good question! We don't even get Soon anymore.

Forget the big things like other tools. We have to wait for ever for small things now.





I'm still slightly confused as to what your gripe is. 

[] Lack of the originally-promised VTT and its associated shinies (3D visualizer, etc)
[] Shift to online CB and MB while cutting off the (limited) support for the offline versions
[] Slow pace of develpoment of new online tools, including lack of customization
[] Presence of a beta VT eating into development time of tools you would otherwise use in a home game
[] Saying that they needed fully-functional support tools in order to make a VT, and then making a VT in absence of those fully-functional support tools
[] VT itself having limited applicability in your home game
D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition

I wouldn't give up playing with minis, handouts and battlemats for anything.  This is partly due to my ~2300 mini DDM collection.

I am converting my 47" flat screen into our new battlemat.  A worthy upgrade to our PnP table.    I'll likely make use of FG's (or another) combat tracker on it as well.

Celebrate our differences.

I really enjoy making props. It's a great excuse to play with paper-mache! I probably won't switch completely digital for some time.
I really enjoy making props. It's a great excuse to play with paper-mache! I probably won't switch completely digital for some time.

Not sure if you are familiar with WorldWorks, but they make some fantastic 3D tilesets you print to cardstock and assemble.

Celebrate our differences.

I'm still slightly confused as to what your gripe is. 

[] Lack of the originally-promised VTT and its associated shinies (3D visualizer, etc)
[] Shift to online CB and MB while cutting off the (limited) support for the offline versions
[] Slow pace of develpoment of new online tools, including lack of customization
[] Presence of a beta VT eating into development time of tools you would otherwise use in a home game
[] Saying that they needed fully-functional support tools in order to make a VT, and then making a VT in absence of those fully-functional support tools
[] VT itself having limited applicability in your home game



Everyone else seems to get it, so I'm just going to take it that you don't. I don't really feel a need to try and make everyone understand. But I thought that since you asked me a direct question, I would answer.
First time I'm here in months and all I can say is WOW.   Surprised
EDIT:  Looks like Plague ninja'd.

Making Threads addressed to WoTC is getting nowhere.

Nothing seems to be getting anywhere.  Hence, the frustration.  A lot of community in-fighting results from this frustration.  To me, that is an even bigger issue, considering that D&D is a social game and a community that gets along better with each other and the company only helps in D&D's success.

I look to the Neverwinter Nights community as a perfect example.  BioWare did everything it could to support and nurture a community.  They provided excellent utilities, support, gathering places, and software.  The community got along superbly.  The result was a game and social network that grew exponentially than the meager initial code would or could allow.

NWN found tremendous success in this, and the community is still strong to this day.

Dungeons and Dragons needs this strength in community more than a computer game does because the pen and paper game is harder to maintain.  The VT looks to address this in one fashion, but it's inferior, and Wizards does not seem like it takes its customers' ideas seriously enough to address them properly.  The pen and paper community suffers from lack of digital utilities, mostly Wizards' doing as well, thanks to the new restricted license agreement and lack of API.  The one tool that was very useful, they shut down, and did nothing to provide us with an alternative, even though we clamored for it.

So yeah, I get where people are coming from.  I agree with most of the ideas, but not the methods.  And I think we can accomplish more if we work together to find a solution rather than being a part of all of the unnecessary squabbling.  If Wizards isn't going to do it, someone has to.


Celebrate our differences.

Interesting thread.
I havent seen one single person jump in to defend Wotc with a "just hang in there" or really anything. Thats pretty telling.
I agree with a lot of people in here but mostly I agree with Jharii that it appears the business plan is to bring in new subscribers with lower expectations and chase away everyone else. 
I would suggest, "just hang in there; it'll get better," but it looks like his mind is made up.   So the best I can do is wish him safe travels on to other horizons. 

Dane_McArdy did the right thing and sent his concerns to Customer Service – WotC will at least look at his concerns now.  There's not much else that can be done.  It's a sad day to see someone go, but I'm still going to keep playing and hanging in there, regardless of changes.

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

IMAGE(http://images.onesite.com/community.wizards.com/user/marandahir/thumb/9ac5d970f3a59330212c73baffe4c556.png?v=90000)

A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

Interesting thread.
I havent seen one single person jump in to defend Wotc with a "just hang in there" or really anything. Thats pretty telling.
I agree with a lot of people in here but mostly I agree with Jharii that it appears the business plan is to bring in new subscribers with lower expectations and chase away everyone else. 



The reason we don't jump in there with a "hang in there" is because doing so grows as monotonous as these complaint posts.  Honestly, send the OP to as many of the WOTCs as you can.. posting here repeatedly gets to sound like the guy breaking up with his girlfriend..  but to a mirror, instead of actually to the girlfriend.
"Five million Cybermen, easy. One Doctor? NOW you're scared!" - Rose Tyler
Interesting thread.
I havent seen one single person jump in to defend Wotc with a "just hang in there" or really anything. Thats pretty telling.
I agree with a lot of people in here but mostly I agree with Jharii that it appears the business plan is to bring in new subscribers with lower expectations and chase away everyone else. 



The reason we don't jump in there with a "hang in there" is because doing so grows as monotonous as these complaint posts.  Honestly, send the OP to as many of the WOTCs as you can.. posting here repeatedly gets to sound like the guy breaking up with his girlfriend..  but to a mirror, instead of actually to the girlfriend.



The irony here is tangible.  Dane had been one of WotC's/DDI's most vocal and ardent defenders just a few months ago.  This thread is not WotC haters doing what they do, this thread is people who love D&D sick and tired of all the bull.
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