Is it Time for a Forum Consolidation?

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I think it is.  Lots of forums get no activity, which means nobody goes to them, and the cycle gets worse.

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The turnover times for the forums (i.e., how quickly a thread drops off the first page) are:


  • D&D Fundamentals


    • 4e General Discussion (12 hours)

    • 4e Rules Q&A (1 day)

    • 4e Character Optimization (14 hours)

    • 4e Character Development (2 weeks)

    • 4e Strikers (1 week)

    • 4e Controllers (2 months)

    • 4e Defenders (1 month)

    • 4e Leaders (2 months)

    • 4e Multiclassing, Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies (1 month)

    • 4e Races and Monsters (1 month)

    • 4e Combat: Traps, Terrain and Tactics (1 month)

    • 4e Rituals, Equipment & Magic Items (1 month)



  • Board Games


    • Castle Ravenloft (2 months)

    • Wrath Of Ashardalon (1 month)



  • D&D Worlds


    • Dark Sun (2 weeks)

    • Eberron: Eberron Lore (2 months)

    • Eberron: Running Eberron (2 months)

    • Forgotten Realms: General (2 months)

    • Forgotten Realms: Realmslore (3 months)

    • Running the Realms (6 months)

    • Gamma World (3 weeks)

    • Other Published Worlds (no subforum has turn over of less than a year)



  • D&D Community


    • What's a DM to Do? (2 days)

    • What's a Player to Do? (2 weeks)

    • Campaign & Adventure Workshop (1 week)

    • House Rules & Homebrew (1 week)

    • Off-Topic Tavern (2 days)

    • Astrid's Parlor (5 months)



  • D&D Insider


    • D&Di Announcements (1 month)

    • D&Di General (2 weeks)

    • Character Builder (2 weeks)

    • Dragon/Dungeon (4 weeks)

    • Dragon/Dungeon Article Discussion (3 weeks)

    • Monster Builder (1 month)

    • Technical Discussion (6 months)

    • Digital D&D (3 months)



  • D&D Previous Editions


    • Classes & Class Features (1 month)

    • Spells, Invocations, and Magic Items (2 months)

    • Monsters and Races (2 months)

    • Previous Editions General (3 weeks)

    • Adventures, Campaigns, and Encounters (2 months)

    • Equipment, Skills, and Feats (2 months)

    • Psionics (7 months)



  • RPGs


    • d20 Character Optimization (2 weeks)

    • d20 Character Development (9 months)

    • d20 Modern RPGs (2 months)

    • General Discussion (9 months)





These are too long and there are too many forums making it too difficult to find stuff.  Also check out the tabular format I made at the end of the thread.  I recommend changing it as follows (edited as of 6/9/11, 9:30 a.m. EST):

(Move Astrid's Parlor to Legacy and shut it down, or make it a subforum of Off-Topic Tavern.  Send the Legacy forums to archives somewhere.  Move Other RPGs to another section.  I wish we could have redirect links like we could on the old forums.)

All right.  Here are my four suggested formats in my order of preference:

Vertical Tabular Layout with Graphics




































































LOOKING TO PLAY D&D?
D&D PRODUCTS
D&D COMMUNITY
D&D VINTAGE
D&D Encounters


Future Releases


4e General Discussion

4e Rules Q&A

Vintage General Discussion


Living Forgotten Realms


Product Reviews

Product Errata

What's a DM to Do?

Campaign Development
4e Campaign Mechanics

Vintage DM Discussion

RPG Gamer Classifieds


Online Content

Magazine Errata


What's a Player to Do?

Character Development
4e Character Mechanics
4e Character Optimization

Vintage Player Discussion

Vintage Optimization
Play by Post

Play By Post Haven
Real Adventures

Online Tools

Technical Issues

4e Worlds

Core World • Forgotten Realms
EberronDark Sun • Gamma World


Vintage Worlds

Birthright DragonlanceGreyhawk
Mystara
Planescape Spelljammer
Core Coliseum


Board Games

Forum Management


Other RPGs





Off-Topic Tavern

Astrid's Parlor



Vertical Tabular Layout without Graphics




































































LOOKING TO PLAY D&D?
D&D PRODUCTS
D&D COMMUNITY
D&D VINTAGE
D&D Encounters


Future Releases



4e General Discussion
4e Rules Q&A


Vintage General Discussion


Living Forgotten Realms




Product Reviews
Product Errata



What's a DM to Do?
Campaign Development
4e Campaign Mechanics

Vintage DM Discussion



RPG Gamer Classifieds




Online Content
Magazine Errata




What's a Player to Do?
Character Development
4e Character Mechanics
4e Character Optimization

Vintage Player Discussion
Vintage Optimization



Play by Post
Play By Post Haven
Real Adventures


Online Tools
Technical Issues


4e Worlds
Core World • Forgotten Realms
EberronDark SunGamma World

Vintage Worlds
Birthright DragonlanceGreyhawk
MystaraPlanescape Spelljammer
Core Coliseum

Board Games

Forum Management

Other RPGs





Off-Topic Tavern

Astrid's Parlor



Outline Layout



Horizontal Tabular Layout


























































































































LOOKING TO
PLAY D&D?
>>
D&D Encounters
>>
Living Forgotten Realms>>
RPG Gamer Classifieds
>>
Play by Post
>>
Core Coliseum








Play By Post Haven
Real Adventures


D&D
PRODUCTS

>>
Future Releases>>
Product Reviews
>>
Online Content
>>
Online Tools
>>
Board Games




Product Errata
Magazine Errata
Technical Issues

D&D
COMMUNITY

>>
4e General Discussion
>>
What's a DM to Do?>>
What's a Player to Do?
>>
4e Worlds
>>Forum Management


4e Rules Q&A





Campaign Development
4e Campaign Mechanics




Character Development
4e Character Mechanics
4e Character Optimization



Core World
Forgotten Realms
Eberron
Dark Sun
Gamma World


D&D VINTAGE
EDITIONS

>>
Vintage General Discussion>>
Vintage DM Discussion
>>
Vintage Player Discussion
>>
Vintage Worlds
>>Other RPGs






Vintage Character Optimization




Birthright
Dragonlance

Greyhawk
Mystara
Planescape
Spelljammer




Off-Topic Tavern
Astrid's Parlor









I would also suggest that there be some sort of a link to the RPG Gamer Classifieds; though I think a better solution for that would be to link to the RPG gamer classifieds from here. I think that the PBP gaming section should be linked also on that page.

On another note, what is the purpose of this?

On the other hand, I like the individual forums for roles. I never visit the striker forum, occasionally look at the defender and controller forum,  and frequent the leader forum. I think that if it wasn't a separate forum, the threads about leaders might be pushed off the page without getting a full answer. I do think that the Leader forum needs a "You want to play a Leader; this is what you need to know" thread pinned though.
I agree! This place is one crowded forum. 

Thoughts:



  • D&D HQ

    • Community Business

    • Future Releases

    • GSL (This seems less necassary, given how ignored this is. Just lump it in with Community Buisness)

    • Off-Topic Tavern

    • Books Errata (keeping individual books as subforums)

    • Board Games (keepign individual games as subforums)



  • D&D Fundamentals


    • 4e General Discussion

    • 4e Rules Q&A

    • 4e Character Optimization

    • What's a DM to Do?

      • 4e DM Options: Monsters, Encounters, Adventures, and Traps

      • Homebrew Haven: House Rules and Custom Campaigns



    • What's a Player to Do?


      • 4e Player Options: Classes, Abilities, Races, and Equipment

      • Character Development





  • D&D Worlds (I like the one-forum/world format much more)


    • Dark Sun

    • Eberron

    • Forgotten Realms

    • Gamma World

    • Other Published Worlds (leave the subforums)



  • D&D Insider


    • D&Di General (Place Announcements in a rolling sticky thread here)

    • Character Builder

    • Dragon/Dungeon General

    • Dragon/Dungeon Article Discussion (I've often wondered why this forum exists, when the D/D General forum and the General Discussion forum serve much the same purpose.)

    • Monster Builder



  • D&D Previous Editions and Other RPGs


    • Previous Editions General



    • Previous Editions DMs: Monsters, Adventures, Traps and Encounters

    • Previous Editions Players: Races, Classes, Magic, Psionics, and Equipment



    • d20 Character Optimization

    • Other RPGS






5 Minute WorkdayMy Webcomic Updated Tue & Thur

The compilation of my Worldbuilding blog series is now available: 

Jester David's How-To Guide to Fantasy Worldbuilding.

I really like wrecan's suggested consolidation.

Regarding Timmeh's concern for the role-based forums, perhaps those could be consolidated into a single Forum (Character Roles) with four sub-forums. I agree that the turnover seems to make them less important as discussion forums, but I think they are very useful as browsing forums. Or as four sub-forums under Character Optimization?

I don't think there needs to be separate subs for Dragon/Dungeon General and Dragon/Dungeon Article Discussion. A simple consolidation as Magazines is sufficient, or, if some think it necessary, separate subs for Dungeon and Dragon.
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion:
  • Three Basic Rules (p 11)
  • Power Types and Usage (p 54)
  • Skills (p178-179)
  • Feats (p 192)
  • Rest and Recovery (p 263)
  • All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
Doesn't look too bad.  I want to second Timmeh's request for a link to the Gamer Classified board, too.  We get a ton of LFG posts in the Tavern and have to tell those folks where to go.  It seems it's nigh impossible for some people to find on their own - which makes it pretty much useless for what it's intended to do.  Moving the Tavern to HQ (something I'm not opposed to) would potentially make that worse.  Just something to consider.  It's an important board that nobody that needs it seems to be able to find.
Resident Prophet of the OTTer.

Section Six Soldier

Front Door of the House of Trolls

[b]If you're terribly afraid of your character dying, it may be best if you roleplayed something other than an adventurer.[/b]

I updated my proposal.  I'm not a fan of the power suorce forums.  It creates too many places fo rpeople to look for advice (Char Op, Rules Q&A, Role forums, What's a Player to Do?).  Instead, I think a sticky thread for each role could be placed into the Player Options subforum, or even better a single thread with links to the various guides by roles on the Char Op Wiki (here's the one for Leaders)
The big thing about the Roles forums is that I don't think that everyone is interesting in optimizing. If you put it under character optimization, I would expect some people to just stay away and that isn't something that I would want. Furthermore, even if you put it under optimization, then you have the problem of "This build is too optimized for my game". The initial idea of having one forum for all of the roles is better than putting it under Char-Op; and I think Seeker95's idea for it captures a good middle ground.

I also think that Char-Op may need to have some subforums of it's own. There are builds, guides, and discussion threads on char-op. It would be nice to have it organized better. I'm going to point this thread to some of the bigwigs over at Char-Op so they can get some input into this.
PLEASE keep the role forums. Even as one forum. Don't dump them into Charop- they serve as a useful filtering feature to keep the vast majority of utter dumb-arsedry out of Charop.

Oh Content, where art thou?
PLEASE keep the role forums. Even as one forum


Yes, it would be the Players Option forum, which is a subforum of What's a Player to Do?
I like the proposed changes, however I do share ZB's worry about us getting more LFG posts in OTT.

Also, I don't know if anyone's noticed, but we OTTers are an odd bunch. Sure you want us front and center?
http://guild.medialoungeca.com/index.php?action=forum The Guild I'm apart of. We're in WOW, STO, Rift and soon Star Wars feel free to register and hang out. http://sparkster11.deviantart.com/ my deviantart Wheelman of the House of Trolls, "I love it when you watch" Carrier of Section 2, 3 and 6 cargo. Resident Driver Stud God of Transportation and Lust.
Micha, aside from OTT, where the hell have you been? I have missed you.
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion:
  • Three Basic Rules (p 11)
  • Power Types and Usage (p 54)
  • Skills (p178-179)
  • Feats (p 192)
  • Rest and Recovery (p 263)
  • All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.

I agree as well. The boards are growing and should be shrunk down a bit.

I like your suggestions, but cpt_micha has a point. OTT shouldn't be near the top.

There should be a link to the RPG Gamer Classified, and that would probably go near the top.

As for the role forums, that's something R&D wanted. I'll ask around and see what if anything can be done. (Personally, not everyone thinks in terms of roles. It's fine when designing a game, but as far as players are concerned, they think in terms of "I want to be a fighter." or "I want to be a wizard." Not so much "I'd like to play a controller this time." "I'm always stuck as a leader.".

Show
Of the two approaches to hobby games today, one is best defined as the realism-simulation school and the other as the game school. AD&D is assuredly an adherent of the latter school. It does not stress any realism (in the author's opinon an absurd effort at best considering the topic!). It does little to attempt to simulate anything either. (AD&D) is first and foremost a game for the fun and enjoyment of those who seek the use of imagination and creativity.... In all cases, however, the reader should understand that AD&D is designed to be an amusing and diverting pastime, something which an fill a few hours or consume endless days, as the participants desire, but in no case something to be taken too seriously. For fun, excitement and captivating fantasy, AD&D is unsurpassed.As a realistic simulation of things from the realm of make-believe or even as a reflection of midieval or ancient warfare or culture or society, it can be deemed only a dismal failure. Readers who seek the later must search elsewhere. - Gary Gygax. 1e DMG.
Micha, aside from OTT, where the hell have you been? I have missed you.



I've been in STO, for quite abit of it. Couple of gamin buddies moved that sort of thing didn't help much either.

I'm helping my guild rebuild after some Jersey Shore style trauma..  I mean drama went down. Or I had been. They're mostly stable now, so I am slowly aiming my focus back abit on D&D and some other games.

I've missed you too buddy.
http://guild.medialoungeca.com/index.php?action=forum The Guild I'm apart of. We're in WOW, STO, Rift and soon Star Wars feel free to register and hang out. http://sparkster11.deviantart.com/ my deviantart Wheelman of the House of Trolls, "I love it when you watch" Carrier of Section 2, 3 and 6 cargo. Resident Driver Stud God of Transportation and Lust.
Micha, aside from OTT, where the hell have you been? I have missed you.



I've been in STO, for quite abit of it. Couple of gamin buddies moved that sort of thing didn't help much either.

I'm helping my guild rebuild after some Jersey Shore style trauma..  I mean drama went down. Or I had been. They're mostly stable now, so I am slowly aiming my focus back abit on D&D and some other games.

I've missed you too buddy.



What is this? An upbeat attitude on these boards? Shared love of a fellow man? This will just not do.

Micha, from now on, you'll suspect that Seeker95 is Pro-Basic Attacks, Anti-Daily Powers, and Anti-Hawaiian Shirts.
Seeker95, from now on, you'll suspect that Micha is Pro-Alignment Restrictions, Anti-Class Features, and Pro-Smouldering Pile of Seeker95's books.

And.. I had something constructive I wanted to say. Didn't I?

Oh right. Char-Op should have 2 subforums; "Builds" and "Guides". Guides would be things like class guides, item guides, etc., where builds would be specific characters or variations of that character. The main forum would be used for discussion.









d20 Modern

7 hours ago by Kira_Howler


FYI the d20modern forum is still alive and has had post in it with in the last few days

ThorvaldHafgrimsson wrote:
Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.
NastasiaLorn; wrote:
But then you have to pay the liability insurance.
A note about character and world creation
Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
57949688 wrote:
Why doesnt anyone ever sig my qoutes!?
On the subject of who post in the Off-Topic Tavern:
57131438 wrote:
most of them are bored, immature adults.
Offical troller of the House of Trolls
I'd suggest consolidating the role forums into a single one named "Classes and Roles", which also addresses the concern that players tend to think in terms of the former. It would make more sense as a subforum of "What's a Player to Do?" than CharOp though.
I merged D&D HQ and Insider into a group called "D&D Products" and put it up top.  I renamed D&D Fundamanetals to D&D HQ, and moved Off-Topic Tavern to the end of that group.  I recommend a single forum at the very top of the page called "Looking to Play 4e?"  Within the forum, which would be locked, would be threads that have links and explanations to Living Forgotten Realms, the D&D Group (which has info on Encounters), the Play-by-Post Group, and the RPG Gamers Classifieds.

There is a subforum in the What's a Player to Do? forum that is called "Players Options" where players can discuss, classes, roles, races, powers, pretty much any mechanics that playerse employ.  A second subgroup is Character Development, which is the current CharDev forum.

And yes, I understand the d20 Modern forum has had ten active threads in the past week.  I don't think that's enough activity to warrant its own forum.  It's an unsupported RPG, and can now be merged into Other RPGs (which had two active threads in the past week).  Merging those two forums with d20 Character Development (which had 1 active thread in the past week), wouldn't make the forum any less usable, and might aggregate more users to make it more vibrant.

I like the most recent version.  Jus' sayin'. 

Resident Prophet of the OTTer.

Section Six Soldier

Front Door of the House of Trolls

[b]If you're terribly afraid of your character dying, it may be best if you roleplayed something other than an adventurer.[/b]

:| There's more out there than just the Haven for PbP. It's probably the easiest to advertise and the place where you're most likely going to get 4e; but Real Adventures is also pretty good.
On a side-off-topic-note, it would be nice if the blogs could get more organized.
I mentioned changing the community page on the main wizards.com/dnd to have links to PbP areas and the RPG gamer classifieds. I would consider this almost essential; don't most new people come to these boards from the Wizards site, and then bookmark the community if they want to stick around?

BTW, do we have old guys WoTC looking at this thread? I think I saw mudbunny looking around here; but I can't remember.
Good ideas.  I added a reference to the Real Adventures Group in the "Looking to Play 4e?" forum.

I like the most recent version.  Jus' sayin'. 




That's ok I like pre-E 4E. Looks like we're both being slowly relegated to the back burner...
"Unite the [fan] base? Hardly. As of right now, I doubt their ability to unite a slightly unruly teabag with a cup of water."--anjelika
1-4E play style
The 4E play style is a high action cinematic style of play where characters worry less about being killed in one hit and more about strategy and what their next move is and the one after it. The players talk back and forth about planning a battle and who can do what to influence the outcome. 4E play is filled with cinematic over the top action. An Eladrin teleports out of the grip of the Ogre. The Fighter slams the dragons foot with his hammer causing it to rear up and stagger back in pain. The Cleric creates a holy zone where their allies weapons are guided to their targets and whenever an enemy dies the Clerics allies are healed. 4E is about knowing when to lauch your nova attack, whether its a huge arcane spell that causes enemies to whirl around in a chaotic storm, or if its a trained adrenaline surge that causes you to attack many many times with two weapons on a single target, or a surge of adrenaline that keeps you going though you should already be dead. Its about tactics and the inability to carry around a bag of potions or a few wands and never have to worry about healing. Its about the guy that can barely role play having the same chance to convince the king to aid the group as the guy that takes improv acting classes and regularly stars as an extra on movies.
Stormwind Fallacy
The Stormwind Fallacy, aka the Roleplayer vs Rollplayer Fallacy Just because one optimizes his characters mechanically does not mean that they cannot also roleplay, and vice versa. Corollary: Doing one in a game does not preclude, nor infringe upon, the ability to do the other in the same game. Generalization 1: One is not automatically a worse role player if he optimizes, and vice versa. Generalization 2: A non-optimized character is not automatically role played better than an optimized one, and vice versa. ...[aside]... Proof: These two elements rely on different aspects of a player's game play. Optimization factors in to how well one understands the rules and handles synergies to produce a very effective end result. Role playing deals with how well a player can act in character and behave as if he was someone else. A person can act while understanding the rules, and can build something powerful while still handling an effective character. There is nothing in the game -- mechanical or otherwise -- restricting one if you participate in the other. Claiming that an optimizer cannot role play (or is participating in a play style that isn't supportive of role playing) because he is an optimizer, or vice versa, is committing the Stormwind Fallacy.
The spells we should getLook here to Check out my adventures and ideas. I've started a blog, about video games, table top role playing games, programming, and many other things its called Kel and Lok Games. My 4E Fantasy Grounds game is currently full.
:| There's more out there than just the Haven for PbP. It's probably the easiest to advertise and the place where you're most likely going to get 4e; but Real Adventures is also pretty good.
On a side-off-topic-note, it would be nice if the blogs could get more organized.
I mentioned changing the community page on the main wizards.com/dnd to have links to PbP areas and the RPG gamer classifieds. I would consider this almost essential; don't most new people come to these boards from the Wizards site, and then bookmark the community if they want to stick around?

BTW, do we have old guys WoTC looking at this thread? I think I saw mudbunny looking around here; but I can't remember.



WotC really needs to make a mapquest style find a game/players webpage, then give other websites access to it for free. Kind of a centralized area for everyone to look for games/gamers. Instead of every website having their own locater...
"Unite the [fan] base? Hardly. As of right now, I doubt their ability to unite a slightly unruly teabag with a cup of water."--anjelika
1-4E play style
The 4E play style is a high action cinematic style of play where characters worry less about being killed in one hit and more about strategy and what their next move is and the one after it. The players talk back and forth about planning a battle and who can do what to influence the outcome. 4E play is filled with cinematic over the top action. An Eladrin teleports out of the grip of the Ogre. The Fighter slams the dragons foot with his hammer causing it to rear up and stagger back in pain. The Cleric creates a holy zone where their allies weapons are guided to their targets and whenever an enemy dies the Clerics allies are healed. 4E is about knowing when to lauch your nova attack, whether its a huge arcane spell that causes enemies to whirl around in a chaotic storm, or if its a trained adrenaline surge that causes you to attack many many times with two weapons on a single target, or a surge of adrenaline that keeps you going though you should already be dead. Its about tactics and the inability to carry around a bag of potions or a few wands and never have to worry about healing. Its about the guy that can barely role play having the same chance to convince the king to aid the group as the guy that takes improv acting classes and regularly stars as an extra on movies.
Stormwind Fallacy
The Stormwind Fallacy, aka the Roleplayer vs Rollplayer Fallacy Just because one optimizes his characters mechanically does not mean that they cannot also roleplay, and vice versa. Corollary: Doing one in a game does not preclude, nor infringe upon, the ability to do the other in the same game. Generalization 1: One is not automatically a worse role player if he optimizes, and vice versa. Generalization 2: A non-optimized character is not automatically role played better than an optimized one, and vice versa. ...[aside]... Proof: These two elements rely on different aspects of a player's game play. Optimization factors in to how well one understands the rules and handles synergies to produce a very effective end result. Role playing deals with how well a player can act in character and behave as if he was someone else. A person can act while understanding the rules, and can build something powerful while still handling an effective character. There is nothing in the game -- mechanical or otherwise -- restricting one if you participate in the other. Claiming that an optimizer cannot role play (or is participating in a play style that isn't supportive of role playing) because he is an optimizer, or vice versa, is committing the Stormwind Fallacy.
The spells we should getLook here to Check out my adventures and ideas. I've started a blog, about video games, table top role playing games, programming, and many other things its called Kel and Lok Games. My 4E Fantasy Grounds game is currently full.

And yes, I understand the d20 Modern forum has had ten active threads in the past week.  I don't think that's enough activity to warrant its own forum.  It's an unsupported RPG, and can now be merged into Other RPGs (which had two active threads in the past week).  Merging those two forums with d20 Character Development (which had 1 active thread in the past week), wouldn't make the forum any less usable, and might aggregate more users to make it more vibrant.



I'd like to note that we had this same argument back when an employee who i shall not name tried to merge it with the d20 CD and CO forums,before he scared off the forumites of that area. Merging it with other RPGS, i have no big issue with and frankly i've always thought that having that forum was a silly thing to have to begin with.

Do we really need to merge the last left overs of the old d20 forums considering the last time it was tried a froum revolt happened causing a large number of pepople to leave?


EDIT: since we're looking at which forums can be merged or gotten rid of completely,what about the forums liks the duel masters,which most recent acitivty is one week ago,and it even has a board with no messages in it. Then theres dreamblade that hasn't had any activity in over a year or more. Hell,the whole bottom end of the list after the RPGA forums could be done away with. 


ThorvaldHafgrimsson wrote:
Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.
NastasiaLorn; wrote:
But then you have to pay the liability insurance.
A note about character and world creation
Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
57949688 wrote:
Why doesnt anyone ever sig my qoutes!?
On the subject of who post in the Off-Topic Tavern:
57131438 wrote:
most of them are bored, immature adults.
Offical troller of the House of Trolls
That's ok I like pre-E 4E. Looks like we're both being slowly relegated to the back burner...



I meant I liked wrecan's most recent updates to his proposal.  It looks good to me.
Resident Prophet of the OTTer.

Section Six Soldier

Front Door of the House of Trolls

[b]If you're terribly afraid of your character dying, it may be best if you roleplayed something other than an adventurer.[/b]

Good ideas.  I added a reference to the Real Adventures Group in the "Looking to Play 4e?" forum.



What about the CoCo?

Also - I mostly use the little drop-down list at the bottom of the forums to navigate them and one thing I always notice is that there's a HUGE list of book errata forums. Do we really need one for each book.

Finally, the old Play-by-Post forums are obsolete and could be replaced by links to the active groups.
Tried to edit my previous post, but the forums are uncooperative and don't seem to register my edit, so:

Good ideas.  I added a reference to the Real Adventures Group in the "Looking to Play 4e?" forum.



What about the CoCo?

Also - I mostly use the little drop-down list at the bottom of the forums to navigate them and one thing I always notice is that there's a HUGE list of book errata forums. Do we really need one for each book.

Finally, the old Play-by-Post forums are obsolete and could be replaced by links to the active groups.

Also - I mostly use the little drop-down list at the bottom of the forums to navigate them and one thing I always notice is that there's a HUGE list of book errata forums. Do we really need one for each book.

Finally, the old Play-by-Post forums are obsolete and could be replaced by links to the active groups.



same with the market place listings

ThorvaldHafgrimsson wrote:
Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.
NastasiaLorn; wrote:
But then you have to pay the liability insurance.
A note about character and world creation
Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
57949688 wrote:
Why doesnt anyone ever sig my qoutes!?
On the subject of who post in the Off-Topic Tavern:
57131438 wrote:
most of them are bored, immature adults.
Offical troller of the House of Trolls
Do we really need to merge the last left overs of the old d20 forums considering the last time it was tried a froum revolt happened causing a large number of pepople to leave?


If they left, they left.  Why should we be beholden to the flotsam and jetsam of a bygone age?

what about the forums liks the duel masters


I'm only looking at D&D forums.  But, yeah, there's probably lots of relics all over the place.
And I added a link to the Core Colliseum.
Do we really need to merge the last left overs of the old d20 forums considering the last time it was tried a froum revolt happened causing a large number of pepople to leave?


If they left, they left.  Why should we be beholden to the flotsam and jetsam of a bygone age?




because,we still have some that didn't leave? unless the plan is to get them to leave and not come back....


I'm only looking at D&D forums. 



then leave the d20 modern and related d20 forums alone since they are only under D&D due to past mistakes

ThorvaldHafgrimsson wrote:
Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.
NastasiaLorn; wrote:
But then you have to pay the liability insurance.
A note about character and world creation
Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
57949688 wrote:
Why doesnt anyone ever sig my qoutes!?
On the subject of who post in the Off-Topic Tavern:
57131438 wrote:
most of them are bored, immature adults.
Offical troller of the House of Trolls
because,we still have some that didn't leave? unless the plan is to get them to leave and not come back....


From the posting frequency, not enough to keep a relic of a forum open.

leave the d20 modern and related d20 forums alone since they are only under D&D due to past mistakes


As long as they are in the D&D forums, I'll scrutinize them.  You want to recommend sending them to the graveyard known as "General Gaming"?  Be my guest. 

Actually, even better, let's stick in the Legacy Forums with a link to the d20 Modern Group, which is much more active than the d20 Modern Forum.
because,we still have some that didn't leave? unless the plan is to get them to leave and not come back....


From the posting frequency, not enough to keep a relic of a forum open.

leave the d20 modern and related d20 forums alone since they are only under D&D due to past mistakes


As long as they are in the D&D forums, I'll scrutinize them.  You want to recommend sending them to the graveyard known as "General Gaming"?  Be my guest. 

Actually, even better, let's stick in the Legacy Forums with a link to the d20 Modern Group, which is much more active than the d20 Modern Forum.



Frankly,i'd like them to be left alone,since they aren't taking up space nor are they getting in the way of the D&D stuff and the group if you had looked further into it is for PbP.

ThorvaldHafgrimsson wrote:
Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.
NastasiaLorn; wrote:
But then you have to pay the liability insurance.
A note about character and world creation
Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
57949688 wrote:
Why doesnt anyone ever sig my qoutes!?
On the subject of who post in the Off-Topic Tavern:
57131438 wrote:
most of them are bored, immature adults.
Offical troller of the House of Trolls
Frankly,i'd like them to be left alone,since they aren't taking up space nor are they getting in the way of the D&D stuff


In cyberspace nothing takes up space.  If that were the stndard, we'd still have all forty Third Edition forums preserved somewhere. 

the group if you had looked further into it is for PbP.


Right.  So we can resurrect this virtually dead d20 Modern group instead.  I could care less.  d20 is defunct, and d20 Modern is a defunct game.  If AD&D players can tolerate being lumped in with 3e players, I think d20 Modern players can handle a few roving GURPS fans.

And since you brought up GamerZero, his vision is dead.  Wizards.COMmunity is not going to be the Facebook of D&D.  So the impetus to keep players of other RPGs around is a lot less now than it was three years ago.
Now here's a thought. What if the whole shebang were scrapped and we had to build up for forums from scratch? How would you like the forums to look?

Show
Of the two approaches to hobby games today, one is best defined as the realism-simulation school and the other as the game school. AD&D is assuredly an adherent of the latter school. It does not stress any realism (in the author's opinon an absurd effort at best considering the topic!). It does little to attempt to simulate anything either. (AD&D) is first and foremost a game for the fun and enjoyment of those who seek the use of imagination and creativity.... In all cases, however, the reader should understand that AD&D is designed to be an amusing and diverting pastime, something which an fill a few hours or consume endless days, as the participants desire, but in no case something to be taken too seriously. For fun, excitement and captivating fantasy, AD&D is unsurpassed.As a realistic simulation of things from the realm of make-believe or even as a reflection of midieval or ancient warfare or culture or society, it can be deemed only a dismal failure. Readers who seek the later must search elsewhere. - Gary Gygax. 1e DMG.
Now here's a thought. What if the whole shebang were scrapped and we had to build up for forums from scratch? How would you like the forums to look?




Given that, I would focus on splitting it up into the following areas.

1 - Headquarters
2 - For Everyone
3 - Player Resources
4 - DM Resources

Headquarters would have stuff like Community Business, Errata, Future Releases
For everyone would have General Discussion, the DDI stuff (with a narrowed set of forums), etc
Player Resources would have Char Op, the various role forums, Char development, etc
DM Resources would have What's DM to do, the Campaign settings, etc
Mudbunny SVCL for DDI Before you post, think of the Monkeysphere
Heh, and before anyone panics, I'm not saying that's what will happen, but it frees up the though process as to how the boards will look like more than just what boards should be kept/deleted.

I've also sent a note to Trevor to see if there's any direction WotC wants to go in.

Show
Of the two approaches to hobby games today, one is best defined as the realism-simulation school and the other as the game school. AD&D is assuredly an adherent of the latter school. It does not stress any realism (in the author's opinon an absurd effort at best considering the topic!). It does little to attempt to simulate anything either. (AD&D) is first and foremost a game for the fun and enjoyment of those who seek the use of imagination and creativity.... In all cases, however, the reader should understand that AD&D is designed to be an amusing and diverting pastime, something which an fill a few hours or consume endless days, as the participants desire, but in no case something to be taken too seriously. For fun, excitement and captivating fantasy, AD&D is unsurpassed.As a realistic simulation of things from the realm of make-believe or even as a reflection of midieval or ancient warfare or culture or society, it can be deemed only a dismal failure. Readers who seek the later must search elsewhere. - Gary Gygax. 1e DMG.
I'd really crush the separate errata forums or at least crush them, say half a year after the book's release. Imho just doing one errata forum and prefixing threads with the concerned book would be just fine.

Some data to back up my suggestion:

Underdark - 3 threads total, last post 3 months old
Rules Compendium - turnover of 8 months
Psionic Power - 9 months
Primal Power - 1 year
PHB Races Tiefling - 5 threads total, last post 1 month old
PHB Races Dragonborn - 4 threads total, last post 8 months old
PHB 3 - turnover 9 months
PHB 3 - turnover 1 year
PHB - turnover 7 months
Plane Below - 6 threads total, last post 11 months ago
Open Grave - not even on the second page yet, last post 5 months ago
Plane Above - 3 threads total, last post 1 week ago
Monster Vault - 7 threads total, last post 4 weeks ago
MM3 - not even one page, last post 3 months ago
MM2 - turnover 2 years
MM1 - turnover 2 years
MP2 - turnover 13 months
MP1 - turnover 1 year
Manual of the planes - not even one page, last post 9 months ago
Heroes of Shadows - on first page, active as it's just been released
HotFL - turnover 7 months
Gamma World - not even 1 page, last post 2 months old
FRPG - turnover 2 years
FRCG - not even 1 page, last post 3 weeks old
EPG - turnover 1 year
EPCG - not even 1 page, last post 1 year ago
DM Kit - 2 threads, 3 posts total (including sticky!)
DMG - 2 years turnover
Dungeon Delve - less than 1 page, last post: 5 months
Metallic Dragons: 4 threads, 11 months old
Chromatic Dragons: less than 1 page, 1 year old
DP: turnover 1 year
Dark Sun CC - less than 1 page, last post 2 months old
Dark Sun CS - turnover 8 months
AP: turnover 1 year
Adventures: turnover 11 months
AV2: less than 1 page- last post 2 months old
AV1: turnover 1 year

***********************************

I'd also put a link to 'want to play 4e?' into the 'what's a player to do' forum.
Hmmm.  Starting from scratch.  I gree with Mysteria about Errata in theory.  I always assumed, though, that the developers wanted the errata boards separate.

Starting from scratch, I'd only have D&D products for these forums.  So Other RPGs and d20 goes elsewhere, as does Astrid's Parlor.  I don't understand why we have a Community Business for each forum.  We have a Wizards.community.

I'd divide it into four topics, each with 4-5 forums, and each forum with no more than three subforums:

  • D&D Products

    • Future Official and Third-Party Releases

    • Product Reviews and Discussion


      • Product Errata (the mods create one thread for each product, to which anyone can respond, but nobody can create a new thread)



    • Online Tools: Monster Builder, Character Builder, Compendium, and, eventually, VTT

      • Technical Issues



    • Magazines and Web Content

      • Magazine Errata



    • Board Games (no subforums)



  • D&D Help

    • General Discussion

      • Rules Q&A



    • What's a DM to Do?

      • Campaign Options: Discuss DM mechanics like monsters and traps

      • Campaign Customization: Make your own house rules and campaign settings



    • What's a Player to Do?

      • Character Options: Discuss player mechanics like classes and races

      • Character Customization: Give your character personality and flair

      • Character Optimization: Optimize your character



    • Off-Topic Tavern



  • D&D Worlds

    • Nentir Valley and 4e Cosmology

    • Forgotten Realms

    • Eberron

    • Dark Sun

    • Gamma World



  • D&D Vintage Editions

    • Vintage General Discussion

    • Vintage DM Help

    • Vintage Player Help

    • Vintage Worlds (combine all the other worlds here -- I wouldn't even give them subforums, though you could.  Being at the bottom of the page helps limit their clutter)



Hmmm.  Starting from scratch.  I gree with Mysteria about Errata in theory.  I always assumed, though, that the developers wanted the errata boards separate.



Maybe, have they been asked? How much do they use the forums as resource?

I think that looks good on first sight, just some thoughts from me:

I'd rename Character Customization to Character Development. Imho, the difference between Customization and Options isn't clear at first sight, at least not with just the title. (I can customize my background, but I can also customize my mechanics. Mechanics are options, but I can also look for options fitting my character's theme.)

The same goes for Campaign Options and Customization. Maybe Homebrewed Campaigns and Rules? (Gah. That does not really sound good either.)

What has the Off-Topic-Tavern got to do with DnD Help? I'm unsure where to put it however, except all on its own.

What about where to play DnD? A sticky thread in What's a Player to Do? Probably also in General Discussion? There's always people asking for that kind of stuff, it should be easy to find.

edit: You might also want to ask those maintaining the links to the magazine articles on their opinions on how to best manage the DDI subforums.
Hmmm.  Starting from scratch.

In the new proposed layout (quoted one line for post reference)...


  • I see no need for "Campaign Options: Discuss DM mechanics like monsters and traps" because this would fall easily into the general "What's a DM to do. The sub-forum for homebrew (Campaign Customizatin) is the only sub-forum I would consider, because it is *always* a deviation from rules or assumed expectations.

  • I also see no need for Magazaine Errata. Line item posts can be sufficient for this. The Magazines Guide can keep an eye out for relevant errata threads and elevate them to the designers when they arise.

  • I would rename Character Options to Character Mechanics, only insofar as (to me) "options" is both too broad and too generic a concept.


Other than these suggestions, I like it. And even these suggestions are more in the vein of "If I had my way".
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion:
  • Three Basic Rules (p 11)
  • Power Types and Usage (p 54)
  • Skills (p178-179)
  • Feats (p 192)
  • Rest and Recovery (p 263)
  • All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
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