Viability of RDW in new Extended?

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Seeing as how the new extended format has all sorts of fun cards from our favorite multicolor set (Not you Alara) all the way through the new scars of Mirrodin, I've been tinkering with a RDW list that I think might be viable for Extended:

9x mountain
4x Teetering Peaks
4x Smoldering Spires
4x Scalding Tarn

4x Goblin Guide
4x Kiln Fiend
4x Countryside Crusher
4x Goblin Bushwhacker

4x Lightning Bolt
4x Manamorphose
4x Assault Strobe
4x Needle Drop
4x Shard Volley
3x Devastating Summons


Sideboard:
4x Gutteral Response
4x Volcanic Fallout
4x Tunnel Ignus
3x Act of Treason

I basically modified a T2 RDW, with a nicer (I think) sideboard.  Still the usual awesome-sauce combos--turn three whacker/summons, turn three kiln fiend pumped by burn/assault strobe.  The nice pieces are manamorphose and shard volley, both of which bring good bonuses to the kiln fiend, and Countryside crusher is a beast finisher that almost ensures your draws are relevant.  The only thing i'm on the rocks about is Needle Drop, but it's been good to me in the past (i've had turn 1 goblin guide, turn two kiln fiend, then had my opponent drop a wall of omens.  the turn three manamorphose-shard volley-needle drop-assault strobe gave me a very nice 13/2 doublestriker to swing with unopposed.
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the best way to go with rdw in extended are the demigod red lists.  they just have a faster, more reliable clock and aren't so suseptible to one removal spell.  a lot of choices you've made aren't very good, to be quite honest.  where's stuff like boggart ram-gang, flame javelin, figure of destiny, hellspark elemental?  cards like shard volley, manamorphose, and needle drop are just no-no's.  i know, i know, cute effects with kiln fiend, but since they all suck otherwise, that indicates that kiln fiend isn't to be built around.  too much of an all in strategy and it will get blown out often, i can promise that based on what the format will likely be.  summons/whacker might be ok, but i can't say for sure.

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Best Pauper Deck in the format, not close:

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/2974646#comment-49713276

 

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Gonna have to go with B_F on this issue.

Extended is a format filled with a litany of spot removal. Path, Bolt, Doomblade, terminate (not to mention Volcanic Fallout). Going all in on Kiln Fiend and getting a Volcanic Fallout in response is probably just auto scoop phase.

DemiDeckWins is good because it features a package of quality burn spells and a number of resilient creatures that pack haste, are credible threats, or a combination of both. This is incredibly important in a format with Kitchen Finks (which is one of your worst nightmares).

This is basic shell I would play

4 Figure of Destiny
4 Goblin Guide
4 2 drop of choice: This is either Plated Geopede or Hellspark Elemental. I am partial to hellspark because of haste/trample/unearth and it doesn't rely on land drops to be a credible threat.
4 Boggart Ram Gang
4 Ball Lightning
4 Demigod of Revenge

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Flame Javelin
4 Searing Blaze/Volcanic Fallout (Depends on the fae presence in your meta)
Depends on where the meta is. If fae keeps being huge RDW will surely rise. But it's kept in check by 4cc and wargate. honestly I would say jund is better though and can't see myself playing mono red (although mono red is my favorite deck). Access to Blood braid elf and anthemancer as well as options of artifact/enchant removal...
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LSV talks about it here:

www.channelfireball.com/articles/initial...

The Deck he suggests is:

4
Burst Lightning
4
Searing Blaze
4
Goblin Guide
4
Hellspark Elemental
4
Plated Geopede
4
Figure of Destiny
4
Lightning Bolt
4
Boggart Ram-Gang
4
Flame Javelin
12
Mountain
4
Scalding Tarn
4
Arid Mesa
4
Teetering Peaks


I've not played Extended before, usually I only play standard and legacy but my local store is having an extended tournament in a few weeks and I'm thinking of building something similar to this since I own most of the cards already.

For the sideboard I was thinking something like Manabarbs, Earthquake, Richochet Trap maybe leyline of punishment.

I'm curious what people think of Figure vs Kargan Dragonlord, I only own 2 copies of figure, don't know if I'll be able to buy more in time.

Also how important is the 4 damamge from flame javelin, why is it a better choice then say staggershock or similar?

But then I don't really know the format is there an abundance of 4 toughness stuff?

Also do most of the control decks play spreading seas how easy is it going to be to reliably hit tripple red on turn 3?
Figure is much better than dragonlord. The instant speed power up is where it's at. That being said I run both X4

Flame javelin does 4 damage now, staggershock over time. This means that you can kill 4 toughness guys and your opponent.

There are a few 3 and 4 toughness guys that you can kill with it that you couldn't kill with staggershock.

I wouldn't worry about spreading seas, it seems to be forgotten (or decks that can play it feel too full).
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Viable? Yes. Tier 1, no way.

The issue with the deck is that almost all of the cards in the deck get trumped by Burrington Forge Tender (think I spelled that right). And since everyone has access to white mana in this format I just don't see this deck doing better than 5-3 at a PTQ. Because really the only reason to play extended is to go to a PTQ.

You might win a local tourney or 2 but never a big event. 
If you read what I posted I did mention it was for a local tournament, Most of the PTQ's I've seen here in Australia are Sealed or Draft don't think we ever get any constructed PTQ's.

I'm not really bothered about hate cards, especially since as you pointed out its not a teir 1 deck so why would people bother wasting slots in their sideboard for it. If people do look like playing it I can get around it the same why I get around Kor Firewalker in standard with unstable footing or leyline of punishment.

Testing a bit online I've seen a lot of decks use kitchen finks and other similar lifegain against red. So I think the leyline is a better choice since it blanks lifegain.


Forge tenders usually come in against jund in alot of matchups. This hurts RDW's viability. Also RDW while not completely viable will show up and any deck needs to have a plan formed around it. RDW is used in my guantlet, but I wouldnt take it to a PTQ currently. FNM I may if they did that around here, but I'd probably try out a real deck.
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Haha what other "real" decks are there then? I'm not spending a bunch of money for a once off tournament for a format I'll probably never play again (at least until next set rotates in).

Fairies, I don't own any of the cards
Jund well I could build a crappy list (I have a set of BBE, Blightning and putrid leech, don't own any Maesltrom pulse and hardly any of the non basic lands).
I don't own a set of cryptic commands which rules out any blue lists.

I could build some sort of White Weenie deck, RDW, or maybe some sort of tribal goblins list.

So based on that I'm going to keep testing RDW and try to come up with a good list, I don't really know anyone in my area that plays extended regualarly but I'd expect most people will just net deck a list for the tournament which should give me a bit of an edge.
Faries, jund, wargate/omen, esper steel, I know I'm forgetting some.

If you want to build RDW because it's budget, thats fine. But that wasn't the question.

If I wasn't going to try for the PT or GPs then I would likely be playing a standard deck in any extended tourny. To each their own.
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I've done some testing RDW in Extended and I agree with BF that Demigod is really good in extended.
Additionally, you can play Hell's Thunder.

I like a splash of black for Thoughtseize in the deck and a couple other cards.
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For those who were around a couple of eyars back, play the RDW version we had then, just upgraded:

4 Goblin Guide
2 Anathemancer
4 Figure of Destiny
4 Hellspark
4 Demigod of Revenge
4 Boggart Ram Gang

4 Blightning
4 Flame Javelin
4 Bolt
2 Burst Lightning

That's pretty much the old list, but with bolt and guide added
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Naya is a hard match, between the Kitchen Finks and the Card for card advantage of Ranger Of Eos, Bloodbraid Elf, and Vengevine....

I had a friend (a former state champion at that) scrub out hard in Indy playing RDW.
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I played in that extended tournament I mentioned on page 1 yesterday went 3 -2 with RDW I think it is a good deck to play at the moment. I tested my build on magic online a fair bit before I played and was feeling pretty good, most decks on MODO seem to be 4 colour control and Ramp and I was beating those pretty well. Unfortunately my local meta was nothing like online didn't see a single ramp deck and only person was playing a control deck.

Here is the list I played. I ended up splashing green for raging ravine and bloodbraid elf and some sideboard cards.

4 Goblin Guide
4 Figure of Destiny
4 Hellspark Elemental
4 Boggart Ram-Gang
4 Bloodbraid Elf

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Burst Lightning
4 Searing Blaze (These were arc trails got talked into searing blaze on the day)
4 Flame Javelin

4 Rootbound Crag
4 Raging Ravine
4 Arid Mesa
4 Scalding Tarn
7 Mountain
1 Forest

Sideboard
4 Leyline of punishment
3 Autumn's Veil These were supposed to be guteral response couldn't find any
3 Volcanic Fallout
3 Back to Nature
2 Manabarbs

Match 1: Jund

Game 1: I keep a pretty slow hand with double figure of desting, lightning bolt and 4 land, opponent has double blightning I loose.

Game 2: I bloodbraid elf into ramgang 2 turns in a row I win.

Game 3: I keep a 2 land hand with 2 goblin guide,  ramgang, Bloodbraid elf and a bolt, Don't see a third land all game I loose.

0-1

Match 2: RDW 
This match is pretty much a coin flip, opponent has black for blightning. He also has ball lightning instead of Ram gang.

Game 1:
I'm on the play and I win.
Game 2:
Opponent on the play, sides in basilisk collar, enough to give him the edge.
Game 3:
I'm on the play again and win.

1-1

Match 3: Jund

Game 1:
I keep a hand that curves out perfectly, turn 1 guide into hellspark into ram gang. Opponent has no turn 1 or 2 play and all he can do is maelstrom pulse the ramgang turn 3. I win.

Game 2:
Long game opponent wins by fauna shaman into a demigod discarding a demigod then lands both and attacks.

Game 3:
Comes down to a race opponent is tapped out with no blockers. I'm dead to whats on board next turn, opponent is on 6 life, I have one card in hand a bloodbraid. I cascade into hell's thunder for the win.

2-1

Match 4: B/W Tokens
Game 1: I get the opponent down to 4 or 5 in first few turns then proceed to top deck creature after creature that just gets chumped by his 1/1 tokens. My opponent dies to bitterblossom a few turns later. Was so frustrated not drawing into any removal.

Game 2: Opponet plays a turn 1 hideaway land. A couple of turns later I make a misplay by forgetting about his hideaway land, he activates it flips up eldrazi monument (ouch).

Game 3: Opponent has double kor firewalker in first 3 turns. (double ouch). I never draw volcanic fallout and die to his army of 1/1 tokens.

2-2

Game 5 Naya ( strange build with KOTR and goblin guide)

Game 1: I have a fast opening hand he gets down a knight of the reliquary but it's only a 2/2 I crack a fetch and searing blaze it on his own turn and then swing for lethal.

Game 2: Opponent is stuck on a 2 lands without white mana. At the end of the game he shows me double firewalker in his hand.

3-2

Overall pretty happy with the results. People here said the Jund matchup is bad I don't think it is this deck is a lot faster then jund and kitchen finks isn't as big a problem as people make out.

I thought the B/W tokens deck was a sweet deck, semi rogue too I'd love to give that deck a try, played bitter blossom, Both Elspeth's, Spectral procession, Ajani Goldmane, Eldrazi monument, finks, figure of destiny plus some removal spells. He ended up doing pretty well with the deck I might try that deck out in the future.

The meta at my store was pretty diverse, Jund was the most comon deck but there was only 2 fairies decks, someone was playing a Doran the Siege Tower deck, there was a sweet deck that looked a bit like the legacy affinity deck (obviously no cranial plating thank god), with memnites, springleaf drum, master of etherium, etched champion etc. I saw very little control decks there was only 1 dedicated control deck I can recall and that was a blue white creature based control (playing stuff like jace, wall of denial and baneslayer angel). I was a bit dissapointed as I'd played so many games online against 4CC yet no one played it most people seemed to think it wasn't a good deck.

I'd change my deck a little bit if I was to play again, I played back to nature to hit stuff like prismatic omen, leyline of sanctity etc. I saw none of that stuff all day. I think naturalise is a better choice as that hits artifacts as well as enchantments. I think ball lightning may be better then hell's thunder most of the instant speed removal in extended seems to be in the form of stuff like path to exile and terminate, saw way less lightning bolts then I thought there would be making ball lightning a better choice.

I think B/W tokens could be a deck to watch even matchups that seem weak on paper for it like jund aren't that bad as it has so many different tokens from stuff like Bitterblossom, Elsepeth and spectral procession that even maelstrom pulse doesn't hurt it that badly.