11/24/2010 BoaB: "Extended Transmuter"

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This thread is for discussion of this week's Building on a Budget, which goes live Wednesday morning on magicthegathering.com.

Interesting deck. I love "toolbox" decks, like Jay Moldenhauer-Salazar's Congregation at Dawn deck from long ago, Survival decks that are tearing up Legacy events at the moment, and of course Wish decks. With the new Extended chock full of artifacts from Shards block and tasty Trinket Mage targets (like Nihil Spellbomb, Pithing Needle, Capsules, and Chimeric Mass), an artifact themed deck could be a contender.

It looks like a really efficient deck there. Master Transmuter + Elixer is just great at instantly taking over a game.

A couple card choices though I was curious about though:

1) Considering you're not really going to be paying full price for the threats once the transmuter is down anyways, wouldn't Myr Battlesphere work better than Precursor Golem? The Sphere puts down more dudes, can end a game with attacking even if he cant get through to the opponent, and doesn't get all his buddies taken away with a removal spell.

2) Grim Poppet can kill creatures, but Triskelion can kill players. I'd have to think that Poppet and Triskelion are going to be pretty comparable when it comes to taking out their critters, but you can use Triskelion bounces as a wincon too.

Other than that, I think the deck looks pretty solid as is. 
@Guest

In case his initial plan doesn't work or he doesn't have Master, he can always pay for the GOLEM which doesn't cost as much.

Poppet has a huge body to boot and -1/-1 counters stay on the critters if it doesn't die. Besides, it can be used to shrink a huge body to manageable size. Direct damage is relying too much on the combo to go off IMHO 
I'm curious what his full esper build looked like?  Adding white seems powerful with tidehollow sculler, ethersworn canonist, and other fun toys coming into play.
In the last game you state that you cast an Elixir of Immortality, however there are none in your deck list.
I love Master Transmuter and after failing to work it into a viable standard deck my well try something like this list.

1) Considering you're not really going to be paying full price for the threats once the transmuter is down anyways, wouldn't Myr Battlesphere work better than Precursor Golem? The Sphere puts down more dudes, can end a game with attacking even if he cant get through to the opponent, and doesn't get all his buddies taken away with a removal spell.



You won't have to worry about Bolt versus Golem since you can always transmute the targetted golem in response to the removal - the Bolt will not resolve, the buddy golems are safe. You could abuse the same with your own pump effects if you so wanted.

I'm supprised not to see [C]Pili-Pala[/C] in a list with Grand Architect


You won't have to worry about Bolt versus Golem since you can always transmute the targetted golem in response to the removal - the Bolt will not resolve, the buddy golems are safe. You could abuse the same with your own pump effects if you so wanted.




I'm pretty sure this doesn't work.  The triggers are going on the stack when the Bolt is targeting (for example) the Precursor Golem itself, so the copies are made for each other Golem.  Even bouncing the original back to hand, doesn't prevent the triggers from happening, because the Golem was there when the Bolt targeted one of the Golems.  Only the original Bolt will fizzle, because the Precursor Golem isn't there anymore upon resolution.  But the copies stay on the stack.
This looks like the strongest deck by BoaB since 8-post. At first 8-post was just a fun little Timmy deck. Who likes casting large repeatable X-spells every turn? And then Ben went on a 25 game winning streak. I know the point of this deck is to play Extended, not be casual, but it looks casual. It's got the Master Transmuter + Thousand-Year Elixir combo which was never good enough before. But then they printed Grand Architect...

In the last game you state that you cast an Elixir of Immortality, however there are none in your deck list.

Good catch. He probably meant Thousand-Year Elixir.

fingermouse - oh boy! If forgoing the easy, infinite colored mana combo was on purpose maybe it was because it watered down the deck? Pili-Pala doesn't do anything on its own. And he's already paying U or 1U for expensive spells, so why bother making it free? I was going to jokingly say "Infinite mana to spend on his free artifacts" but then I remembered what Thousand-Year Elixir did. Maybe you can spend the mana on a bunch of redundant Transmuter activations?

I'm building this right now with Myr Battlesphere in place of Precursor Golem. I like the PC better, but I want to try to squeeze Lodestone Golem in there, and the creature type sharing is unfortunate. I'm want to play Mirrorweave as a 1x because it works well with either Grand Architect or Myr Battlesphere, but I probably won't.
I hate extended.

But Master Transmuter was my favorite card from the last few sets in a while. Esper was awesome, and Scars is a great set.

Casually I play transmuter in my decks all the time, unfortunately my friends know its power and I'm forced to play with the elixir. You can't play any transmuter deck without it!

Great decklist and ideas, I'm definitely thinking about going in to extended next year!
According to everyone on these forums. You should only play the best decks in whatever format you want. You are a bad player and should just quit if you intend on using anything else.
if the golem is targeted with bolt or doom blade, you need to let the copy trigger resolve and then bounce the precursor golem, all the old tokens will die but you will get 2 new ones.

One thing he states that you can bounce the transmuter and so be able to keep everything else safe, but once they airm removal at transmuter, the transmuter activiates and while the put an artifact into play ability is on the stack they can kill whatever else they want to. 

Myr battlesphere makes more bodies but 1/1 bodies are not that scary, 3/3 bodies are. I can cast the golem and then immediately return it before they can target leaving ever increasing numbers of tokens in play and never having to worry about copied removal.
I personally would try to fit a copy of Darksteel Colossus in here...that is one my favourite cards, and it's a threat that an opponent has to deal with quickly
I'm pretty sure this doesn't work.  The triggers are going on the stack when the Bolt is targeting (for example) the Precursor Golem itself, so the copies are made for each other Golem.  Even bouncing the original back to hand, doesn't prevent the triggers from happening, because the Golem was there when the Bolt targeted one of the Golems.  Only the original Bolt will fizzle, because the Precursor Golem isn't there anymore upon resolution.  But the copies stay on the stack.



quite right, my bad


fingermouse - oh boy! If forgoing the easy, infinite colored mana combo was on purpose maybe it was because it watered down the deck? Pili-Pala doesn't do anything on its own. And he's already paying U or 1U for expensive spells, so why bother making it free? I was going to jokingly say "Infinite mana to spend on his free artifacts" but then I remembered what Thousand-Year Elixir did. Maybe you can spend the mana on a bunch of redundant Transmuter activations?


I would alter the list somewhat, maybe [C]Ethersworn Adjudicator[/C] might work.

EDIT: another thought came to mind, but I'm wrong again. This would also have required [C]Filigree Sages[/C] maybe a few too many bridges too far!









well here is my version of the deck










22 lands

4  
Creeping Tar Pit
4  Darkslick Shores
9  Island
5  Swamp









27 creatures




4  
Grand Architect
1  Triskelion
4  Master Transmuter
3  Platinum Angel
2  Myr battlesphere 


1 Enigma Sphinx
4  Silver Myr


4  Sphinx Summoner
2  Trinket Mage
1 Sharuum the Hegemon
Darksteel Colossus 




11 other spells

1 Scourglass
4  Everflowing Chalice
2  Executioner's Capsule
3  Thousand-Year Elixir
1  Voltaic Key




 


 








please any ideas for the sideboard are very welcome
hey guys

I love the transmuter and was so excited to see this deck that I immediately tested it!

But one point evades me: Why the Platinum Angel is so imortant for this deck? If I am below 0 life and somebody points e.g. pte or doom blade at my PA I lose the game in anyway, don't I?

And the deck definitely needs some mass removal against creature strong decks...scourglass is nice, but cannot be hardcasted...so consume the meek?
hey guys

I love the transmuter and was so excited to see this deck that I immediately tested it!

But one point evades me: Why the Platinum Angel is so imortant for this deck? If I am below 0 life and somebody points e.g. pte or doom blade at my PA I lose the game in anyway, don't I?

And the deck definitely needs some mass removal against creature strong decks...scourglass is nice, but cannot be hardcasted...so consume the meek?



That's why there are two in the list. But you can only get them if you draw sphinx summoner, you can bounce him to find both, once you have two in play then you can't lose, short of a board sweeper, but decks that play bpard sweepers would tend not to put you below 0 life early on anyway.

@slicedbeardman, enigma sphinx? without whiute mana to ncast it will never cascade so mit's pointless a better transmuter target is Sphinx of the steel wind.
That's why there are two in the list. But you can only get them if you draw sphinx summoner, you can bounce him to find both, once you have two in play then you can't lose, short of a board sweeper, but decks that play bpard sweepers would tend not to put you below 0 life early on anyway.

Why not Platinum Emperion over Platinum Angel?  Harder to kill, and protects you better against non-mill/non-poison decks.  It's a less reliable clock, but is that really a big concern?
Thanks to everyone who helped with the design of the plane of Golamo in the Great Designer Search 2!
My Decks
These are the decks I have assembled at the moment:
Tournament Decks (4)
Kicker Aggro (Invasion Block) Sunforger/Izzet Guildmage Midrange (Ravnica/Time Spiral/Xth Standard) Dragonstorm Combo (Time Spiral/Lorwyn/Xth Standard) Bant Midrange (Lorwyn/Shards/M10 Standard)
Casual Multiplayer Decks (50)
Angel Resurrection Casual Soul Sisters Sindbad's Adventures with Djinn of Wishes Sphinx-Bone Wand Buyback Morph (No Instants or Sorceries) Cabal Coffers Control Zombie Aggro Hungry, Hungry Greater Gargadon/War Elemental Flashfires/Boil/Ruination - Boom! Call of the Wild Teysa, Orzhov Scion with Twilight Drover, Sun Titan, and Hivestone Slivers Rebels Cairn Wanderer Knights Only Gold and () Spells Captain Sisay Toolbox Spellweaver Helix Combo Merfolk Wizards Izzet Guildmage/The Unspeakable Arcane Combo Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind and his Wizards Creatureless Wild Research/Reins of Power Madness Creatureless Pyromancer Ascension Anarchist Living Death Anvil of Bogardan Madness Shamen with Goblin Game/Wound Reflection Combo Mass damage Quest for Pure Flame Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle/Clear the Land with 40+ Lands Doubling Season Thallids Juniper Order Ranger Graft/Tokens Elf Archer Druids Equilibrium/Aluren Combo Experiment Kraj Combo Reap Combo False Cure/Kavu Predator Combo Savra, Queen of the Golgari Sacrifice/Dredge Elf Warriors Eight-Post Sneak Attack Where Ancients Tread Zur the Enchanter with Opal creatures Tamanoa/Kavu Predator/Collapsing Borders Esper Aggro Mishra, Artificer Prodigy and his Darksteel Reactor Theft and Control Unearth Aggro Soul's Fire Vampires Devour Tokens Phytohydra with Powerstone Minefield Treefolk Friendly? Questing Phelddagrif Slivers Dragon Arch Fun I'm probably forgetting a few...
That's why there are two in the list. But you can only get them if you draw sphinx summoner, you can bounce him to find both, once you have two in play then you can't lose, short of a board sweeper, but decks that play bpard sweepers would tend not to put you below 0 life early on anyway.

Why not Platinum Empyrion over Platinum Angel?  Harder to kill, and protects you better against non-mill/non-poison decks.  It's a less reliable clock, but is that really a big concern?


well its "non-mill/non-poison" and without flying , i just don't see much of an upside-
That's why there are two in the list. But you can only get them if you draw sphinx summoner, you can bounce him to find both, once you have two in play then you can't lose, short of a board sweeper, but decks that play bpard sweepers would tend not to put you below 0 life early on anyway.

Why not Platinum Emperion over Platinum Angel?  Harder to kill, and protects you better against non-mill/non-poison decks.  It's a less reliable clock, but is that really a big concern?

 well its "non-mill/non-poison" and without flying , i just don't see much of an upside-

The upside is that once you drop the Emperion, they can't hurt you.  If you were at 10 life and played Platinum Angel, they can keep attacking with an intent to get the Angel off the board later, when you're at 0.  If you play the Emperion, they can't do anything to you until they get rid of that Emperion.  Against aggressive decks, it could be like a free Time Walk every turn it's on the battlefield.
Thanks to everyone who helped with the design of the plane of Golamo in the Great Designer Search 2!
My Decks
These are the decks I have assembled at the moment:
Tournament Decks (4)
Kicker Aggro (Invasion Block) Sunforger/Izzet Guildmage Midrange (Ravnica/Time Spiral/Xth Standard) Dragonstorm Combo (Time Spiral/Lorwyn/Xth Standard) Bant Midrange (Lorwyn/Shards/M10 Standard)
Casual Multiplayer Decks (50)
Angel Resurrection Casual Soul Sisters Sindbad's Adventures with Djinn of Wishes Sphinx-Bone Wand Buyback Morph (No Instants or Sorceries) Cabal Coffers Control Zombie Aggro Hungry, Hungry Greater Gargadon/War Elemental Flashfires/Boil/Ruination - Boom! Call of the Wild Teysa, Orzhov Scion with Twilight Drover, Sun Titan, and Hivestone Slivers Rebels Cairn Wanderer Knights Only Gold and () Spells Captain Sisay Toolbox Spellweaver Helix Combo Merfolk Wizards Izzet Guildmage/The Unspeakable Arcane Combo Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind and his Wizards Creatureless Wild Research/Reins of Power Madness Creatureless Pyromancer Ascension Anarchist Living Death Anvil of Bogardan Madness Shamen with Goblin Game/Wound Reflection Combo Mass damage Quest for Pure Flame Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle/Clear the Land with 40+ Lands Doubling Season Thallids Juniper Order Ranger Graft/Tokens Elf Archer Druids Equilibrium/Aluren Combo Experiment Kraj Combo Reap Combo False Cure/Kavu Predator Combo Savra, Queen of the Golgari Sacrifice/Dredge Elf Warriors Eight-Post Sneak Attack Where Ancients Tread Zur the Enchanter with Opal creatures Tamanoa/Kavu Predator/Collapsing Borders Esper Aggro Mishra, Artificer Prodigy and his Darksteel Reactor Theft and Control Unearth Aggro Soul's Fire Vampires Devour Tokens Phytohydra with Powerstone Minefield Treefolk Friendly? Questing Phelddagrif Slivers Dragon Arch Fun I'm probably forgetting a few...
What about Prophetic prisms instead of Silver Myrs? They are redundant most of the time and prisms+transmuter makes your hand full often. And also you can change mana from chalices to blue you need to transmute.

I was also thinking how to work in fabricate and scourglass, but that might be stupid.
Prophetic Prism is a nice idea and I used to run it when I played this deck in standard.  The only issue I guess is that it is not mana acceleration and much of the deck comes out at 4 or 5.

I'd probably run the Prism over the Myr as its just much harder to kill.  In fact, I'd probably run Etherium Sculptor as it basically is a 1/2 tap for in this deck.

I also think this is a great deck for Mistvein Borderpost as its an artifact and helps smooth over the mana.

Master of Etherium is a great finisher for these decks, especially if you go with Flight Spellbomb.
Oh, and if we are going outside budget, Tezzeret the Seeker is insanely powerful in this deck.
Prophetic Prism is a nice idea and I used to run it when I played this deck in standard.  The only issue I guess is that it is not mana acceleration and much of the deck comes out at 4 or 5.

I'd probably run the Prism over the Myr as its just much harder to kill.  In fact, I'd probably run Etherium Sculptor as it basically is a 1/2 tap for in this deck.(Vedalken Engineer is better in this case because it can be used for Transmuting and can be untaped for more fun) 


I also think this is a great deck for Mistvein Borderpost as its an artifact and helps smooth over the mana.

Master of Etherium is a great finisher for these decks, especially if you go with Flight Spellbomb.
(yes and no..... you're only going to have 3-5 artifacts out at a time unless you're bouncing for tokens- so you just got 5/5 when you could get something like



But as far as i know, engineers are not extended-legal. I agree that Master of Etherium  is not that good for this deck.

And if we get out of budget for Tezzeret, then Mox Opal might be nice addition too.
But as far as i know, engineers are not extended-legal. I agree that Master of Etherium  is not that good for this deck.

And if we get out of budget for Tezzeret, then Mox Opal might be nice addition too. 


-my bad-

another fun card for this deck to get , Memnite . Its like a free mana source with Grand Architect in play.




hm...i did play around with the deck. Using the original BoaB list I feel that the Trinket Mage is not good enough. I very often have the problem that I either lack the transmuter or the elixir and the trinket doesn't fetch either of them. without the elixir (which i missed about 80% of the matches) it's impossible to play transmuter than in almost every match he was removed within the turn i played it.
so i added a fourth elixir and play 3 trinket mages.

tezzeret and mox opal would be extremely nice additions for obvious reasons, but i don't know how much I am gonna play this deck, yet, so I want to avoid larger investments.

i also thought about memnage...he's an insane creature for transmuting, but the problem is that the deck is extremely mana intensive and so its difficult to fit in memnite.

i really have trouble against fast, creature-based decks, since the deck takes long to buid up...any sideboard ideas?
So maybe the fabricate instead of trinket mages? I know it has no body, but you can find anything you want. In that case i would put scourglass in SB against creature-heavy decks or against ascension and similar decks. Also smother seems a good SB card and consume the meek and doom blade.
(sorry but i still dont know how to make autocard:D )
hm...i did play around with the deck. Using the original BoaB list I feel that the Trinket Mage is not good enough. I very often have the problem that I either lack the transmuter or the elixir and the trinket doesn't fetch either of them. without the elixir (which i missed about 80% of the matches) it's impossible to play transmuter than in almost every match he was removed within the turn i played it.
so i added a fourth elixir and play 3 trinket mages.

tezzeret and mox opal would be extremely nice additions for obvious reasons, but i don't know how much I am gonna play this deck, yet, so I want to avoid larger investments.

i also thought about memnage...he's an insane creature for transmuting, but the problem is that the deck is extremely mana intensive and so its difficult to fit in memnite.

i really have trouble against fast, creature-based decks, since the deck takes long to buid up...any sideboard ideas?



fast creature decks that are red/green can be dealt with by sphinx of the steel wind, which can be cheated into play with transmuter or at least cast for reduced cost thanks to architect.
I've been playing this deck for a bit now and have found it to be quite competitive but I have made it more aggressive by using Steel Overseer and Master of Etherium.  I also run Arcane Sanctum so I can splash white for Scourglass and Sharuum.  2*Tezzeret have also been a big bonus.

My worst match-up so far has been against UBR - Cruel Ultimatum Control running 12 Counterspells and JTMS.
anyone have a non-budget list they could post... or perhaps a link to one?
For those having trouble with quick aggro decks -- Try Wurmcoil Engine over Platinum angel.  It fills a similar role in protecting you from dying, replaces itself when it dies, and costs less.  Online, the promo version is about 3 tix... not too bad.  For the guy who asked about the non-budget list, I think this is definitely a good substitution.  Other options for non-budget... Jace?  It doesn't really fit the deck, but hey, you're playing blue.

Other options are Shrivel and Infest, depending on the size of the creatures you're being attacked by.  You could max out on Grim Poppet's or Triskelions in hope of drawing them more frequently.  I'm probably missing something...

 
I've been playing this deck for a bit now and have found it to be quite competitive but I have made it more aggressive by using Steel Overseer and Master of Etherium.  I also run Arcane Sanctum so I can splash white for Scourglass and Sharuum.  2*Tezzeret have also been a big bonus.

My worst match-up so far has been against UBR - Cruel Ultimatum Control running 12 Counterspells and JTMS.




What's your list looking like?

(for casual) Thoughts on adding Glimmervoid, and Artifact lands from Mirrodin?

One of the best things that you can do with this deck is to add Kuldotha Forgemaster.  Forgemaster + Myr Battlesphere = awesome as you net two artifacts when you use Forgemaster's ability.  Coupled with Master Transmuter and Thousand-Year Elixir it is a powerful combo deck.  Some of us have been working of the decklist and have come up with this so far. 




































































Artifacts
1x Contagion Engine
4x Fieldmist Borderpost
4x Mistvein Borderpost
4x Thousand-Year Elixir
2x Veinfire Borderpost
1x Filigree Angel
4x Kuldotha Forgemaster
3x Faerie Mechanist
4x Master Transmuter
2x Myr Battlesphere
3x Sphinx Summoner
4x Etherium Sculptor
2x Mox Opal
1x Sharuum the Hegemon
Creatures
4x Grand Architect
3x Vedalken Certarch
Land
12x Island
2x Swamp


Greetings all.
I have been playtesting different Transmuter builds over the last few weeks, to the point of I could receive a PHD in deckbuilding with it! By talking with a few players on MTGO who were also playtesting the deck, we shared ideas and came up with a few things. As cool as the Transmuter is, sadly it is not a viable strategy against the top decks - Jund, Faeries, or Valakut. Which sucks because it sure can do some cool things!

The problems are speed and opening draws. Transmuter relies heavily on a great opening draw. More often than not, you can have pieces to the puzzle but not what you need...I.E.- a transmuter in play but no fatties or Summoning Sphinx to dig up said fatties. A Faeries match-up is always headaches due to their speed and countering. Fae and Jund can win games even with a sub-par draw, where you as a Transmuter player are on the clock from the opening land drop.

So here is what works well with Transmuter, but haven't quite worked out in a viable Extended deck-build.-

I experimented with White mana cards ALOT trying to find anything that works, Path to Exile, Ethersworn Cannonist, Revoke Existance, Scourglass, Oblivion Ring, Journey to Nowhere, Day of Judgement, Wall of Omens...while all are great cards, they dont help Transmuter Ramp up in the crucial early turns to where it needs to be.

BLUE- Fabricate, Master of Etherium, Trinket Mage and Grand Architect. Not where this deck wants to be at a 3-drop. All cool, all worthwhile, but clunky. I tried hard to make the Architect work for the mana ramping but there are better choices. 

ARTIFACTS- Prophetic Prism (card-draw), Platinum Angel, Wurm-coil Engine, Shinx of the Steel Wind, Philigree Angel, Tidehollow Sculler, Steel Overseer, Scourglass...there are better creature choices IMO. Myr Battlesphere works amazingly well, early testing showed alot of promise by bouncing the Battlesphere until you had enough Myr in play to attack for the lethal direct damage. Precursor Golem is an all-star in here, but too fragile! I may go back to them with some more testing. BTW-all of these creatures are incredible when imprinted on a Mimic Vat.

My solution is to steal some plays out of the Faeries playbook- Thoughtsieze, Inquistion of Kozilek, Duress, Doom Blade, Spellpierce, Mana Leak, Ponder, and Preordain. These cards give you a chance to hit other decks where it hurts.

So here's my current deckbuild. (sorry don't know how to link and def not budget)

4x Darkslick Shores
4x Creeping Tar-pit
9x Island
5x Swamp

4x Master Transmuter
4x Etherium Sculptor
4x Sphinx Summoner
1x Grim Poppet
1x Platinum Emperion
1x Inkwell Leviathan
1x Darsteel Colossus

4x Thoughtsieze
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
3x Ponder
3x Preordain
4x Mimic Vat
3x Everflowing Chalice
1x Mox Opal
1x Semblance Anvil

(You may notice there is no 4x Thousand-year Elixer. I pulled them in place of the 4x Mimic-Vat.)

Sideboard
4x Tectonic Edge
4x Duress
4X Dispell
3x Doom Blade 

So there it is, I'm thinking of re-adding the 4x Precursor Golem because they are easy enough to get into play by turn 4 with a mana left over to Play any of the 1 casting cost spells. Also they can be a nightmare for the Faerie player. Imprinting them on a Mimic Vat is a bonus!

Anyone else planning on adding a Blightsteel Colossus and some Treasure Mages?
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