A couple of psion power problems

14 posts / 0 new
Last post

Force Punch: It reads, "...you push the target and each enemy adjacent to you one square."  Since it's a melee 1 power, the target, unless it's an ally or an object, is an enemy adjacent to you.  This means that another way of phrasing it would be, "you push the target one square, you push the target one square, and you push each other enemy adjacent to you one square," i.e. the target is pushed 2 squares and other enemies are pushed 1 square, and with something like Gauntlets of the Ram it would be 4 and 2, respectively.  Phrasing it "each other enemy" would make more sense.

Dream Blade: It's a Close Burst 5, but that doesn't seem to mean anything: the dream form makes a melee attack, but there doesn't seem to be any limitation on where the dream form is.  What does the CB5 have to do with it?

"Edison didn't succeed the first time he invented Benjamin Franklin, either." Albert the Alligator, Walt Kelly's Pogo Sunday Book  
The Core Coliseum: test out your 4e builds and fight to the death.

For the second one: You can only create effects in squares within range.  I'm not sure if that would mean the dream form or its target or both would have to be in the close burst though.

Dreamwalker PP page 95
True Dream Form: this level 20 daily power does not specify if the dream form is identical as the 11th level at-will power.
Does the form occupy space?
Can it be attacked?
If it can then the Instinctive Effect will almost guarantee the form's destruction in a single round.
Because out of 21 at-wills in Paragon/Heroic 19 will provoke and the form will be destroyed by a single hp of damage. In addition any effect that does 1 hp could destroy it including the Psion's since the personal immunity clause is also missing.

All Psionic classes have less encounter powers than any other class at higher levels. If a full augment is an encounter power, a 17th-20th Psion has 9 (11 with psionic paragons) power points. That equals:
1x 17th level (4)
1x 13th level (4)
1x 7th level (2) ONLY if psi paragon path.

At best that is 3 encounter powers, or only 2 if you chose a non-psi paragon.
This compares to a non psi character who has 4 encounters at levels 17- 20.

If this is supposed to be offset by enabling multiple LOW level encounter (augmented at-wills) then that means a level 1 and 3 encounter power (taking 2 actions mind you) is as effective as a 17th? Or is the lesser augments as powerful/effective as a regular encounter power?
Dreamwalker PP page 95 True Dream Form: this level 20 daily power does not specify if the dream form is identical as the 11th level at-will power.

Because it doesn't specify, it's not identical.  It's a totally separate power--Dream Form is no more related to True Dream Form than it is to Flaming Sphere.  This means that abilities that refer to "your dream form" don't apply to your true dream form.  This may or may not be intentional.

"Edison didn't succeed the first time he invented Benjamin Franklin, either." Albert the Alligator, Walt Kelly's Pogo Sunday Book  
The Core Coliseum: test out your 4e builds and fight to the death.

Demoralizing Strike. Page 24
Text that follows
"Augment 2
Close burst 1
Target:"
Change "Each creature in burst" to "Each enemy in burst"

As written this power will debuff your allies' defenses by 1+Con mod as well.
Demoralizing Strike. Page 24 Text that follows "Augment 2 Close burst 1 Target:" Change "Each creature in burst" to "Each enemy in burst" As written this power will debuff your allies' defenses by 1+Con mod as well.

Yes, it will, and it will deal damage to them, too, if it hits them.  And your point is?  Many bursts--more than half, by my guess, though more area than close bursts--will target allies as well as enemies.  This is no cause for errata, unless you think the power is too weak as written.

"Edison didn't succeed the first time he invented Benjamin Franklin, either." Albert the Alligator, Walt Kelly's Pogo Sunday Book  
The Core Coliseum: test out your 4e builds and fight to the death.

Force Punch: It reads, "...you push the target and each enemy adjacent to you one square."  Since it's a melee 1 power, the target, unless it's an ally or an object, is an enemy adjacent to you.  This means that another way of phrasing it would be, "you push the target one square, you push the target one square, and you push each other enemy adjacent to you one square," i.e. the target is pushed 2 squares and other enemies are pushed 1 square, and with something like Gauntlets of the Ram it would be 4 and 2, respectively.  Phrasing it "each other enemy" would make more sense.


It reads fine as is. No one has to be pushed 2 squares. Every other enemy is worse in terms of vagueness.


Dream Blade: It's a Close Burst 5, but that doesn't seem to mean anything: the dream form makes a melee attack, but there doesn't seem to be any limitation on where the dream form is.  What does the CB5 have to do with it?




Uncetain it could imply that the dream form if not already present only has a range of 5 in this instance. Or the attack is supposed to be ranged and melee is a typo or ? This needs clarification.
Demoralizing Strike. Page 24 Text that follows "Augment 2 Close burst 1 Target:" Change "Each creature in burst" to "Each enemy in burst" As written this power will debuff your allies' defenses by 1+Con mod as well.

Yes, it will, and it will deal damage to them, too, if it hits them.  And your point is?  Many bursts--more than half, by my guess, though more area than close bursts--will target allies as well as enemies.  This is no cause for errata, unless you think the power is too weak as written.




Incorrect in keeping with the role of a Leader. Find another close burst encounter leader power that damages and debuffs allies and reconcile that with the role of a leader as you are implying.
Explosive Sacrifice (Shaman 9) can damage and daze allies.
Living Caltrop Swarm (Artificer 27) can damage allies (potentially quite a bit).

But yeah, it appears to be pretty rare to not be enemies only on such things. Looking at something like the invoker that has leader splash, there are plenty more. Not really a problem, of course, but if they happen to decide to fix Demoralizing's scaling problem making it enemies only at the same time might be a reasonable tradeoff.
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Explosive Sacrifice (Shaman 9) can damage and daze allies.



Not a close burst centered on the character. 
Still a damage-debuff that effects everyone, which is pretty unusual for a leader.


Living Caltrop Swarm (Artificer 27) can damage allies (potentially quite a bit).

But yeah, it appears to be pretty rare to not be enemies only on such things. Looking at something like the invoker that has leader splash, there are plenty more. Not really a problem, of course, but if they happen to decide to fix Demoralizing's scaling problem making it enemies only at the same time might be a reasonable tradeoff.



Not a close burst.  Since it is an area burst you can be a bit more careful about placement.
Also only the enemies are subject to the debuff. 

Also neither are level 1 powers.  Demoralizing Strike is something the Ardent is going to have for a long time. 

Maybe the rationale was that this is the tradeoff for having a decent scaling debuff?  Dunno.  As it is any ardent I play would only use this very situationally as the majority of the time he will be tanking front line and the LAST thing he'd want to do is debuff his own defenders. 

I would expect something like this with controller/striker powers which are typically more indiscriminate.  Granted the more recent supplements have given more party-friendly options for controllers, albeit usually at a severe damage debuff. 
As a general rule, you're _not_ adjacent to an ally in melee... so it's really probably less of an issue than you think it might be. Shift into flank, then do it
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director

Force Punch: It reads, "...you push the target and each enemy adjacent to you one square."  Since it's a melee 1 power, the target, unless it's an ally or an object, is an enemy adjacent to you.  This means that another way of phrasing it would be, "you push the target one square, you push the target one square, and you push each other enemy adjacent to you one square," i.e. the target is pushed 2 squares and other enemies are pushed 1 square, and with something like Gauntlets of the Ram it would be 4 and 2, respectively.  Phrasing it "each other enemy" would make more sense.


It reads fine as is. No one has to be pushed 2 squares. Every other enemy is worse in terms of vagueness.

Are you disagreeing with my literal reading of it, or do you think that the target being pushed twice is fine?  There are several "every other" powers, though I can't remember any offhand.

"Edison didn't succeed the first time he invented Benjamin Franklin, either." Albert the Alligator, Walt Kelly's Pogo Sunday Book  
The Core Coliseum: test out your 4e builds and fight to the death.

Be easier to take out the words 'the target and' and just have it be 'each enemy adjacent to you one square'
Keith Richmond Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Fair enough.  It's functionally slightly different, with the oddball chance that you might find a way to hit a nonadjacent enemy, but it's certainly clearer.

"Edison didn't succeed the first time he invented Benjamin Franklin, either." Albert the Alligator, Walt Kelly's Pogo Sunday Book  
The Core Coliseum: test out your 4e builds and fight to the death.