End Its Pain: A Nearly Immortal Paladin Build

22 posts / 0 new
Last post
So here's the story: I was toying around with Paladin builds based on the Raven Queen, and came up with this... Thing. This masochistic monstrosity that cannot die, eats damage and poops rainbows.

Now, I know that all the pieces of this build have been floating out there for awhile. It is very likely that someone else has already completed a similar build. I haven't been able to find it. But, I would appreciate any feedback and some clarification on a few of the finer turnings of The Thing.

Updated 07/14

SUMMARY:
The Thing is essentially an optimization of the Raven Consort's LV24 ability Cycle of Life. This vile Terminator-like abomination actually wants to die. Only it can't, because Hell already pissed its pants like 6 levels ago.

The Thing does not drop when you cut off its head or rip out its guts. It just stands there and forces you to watch. Watch it get stronger. It might go something like this:

1) Orcus hits The Thing with Touch of Death. The Thing is at 0 hp.
2) Orcus action points and crits The Thing with its Wand of Orcus. The Thing takes 0 damage, after resists.
3) The Thing gets a standard, move, and minor. The Thing auto-revives using a surgeless heal, gaining a cumulative +2 untyped bonus to saves and defenses.
4) Repeat ad nauseum.

The Thing revives using surgeless heals whenever it rolls 20+ on a death saving throw. According the PHB, this will not fail even on a natural 1 if you have a high enough modifier. Every time it rolls a death saving throw, The Thing gains a cumulative +2 bonus to saves and all defenses.

The Thing gains a full standard, move, and minor at sub-zero hit points due the Ghostly Vitality feat. Furthermore, while at sub-zero hit points, The Thing is insubstantial (all damage halved), and has damage resistance 43 to all.

When The Thing (not if) auto-revives, it will heal back up to 1/4 total hit points with higher defenses than before. As this does not require a healing surge (yet), there is no limit to the number of times this blasphemy can occur.


THE NERDY BITS:
While The Thing is at sub-zero hit points, it also gains insubstantial, damage resist all, and decent bonuses to attack, damage, and defenses.

Bonus to all saving throws: +3 item (Nullifying Ring)
Bonus to death saving throws: +1 untyped (Death Scorned) +2 feat (Unyielding Fortitude) +2 item (Periapt of Recovery) =
TOTAL +8 to death saving throws.

Resist all: +13 (Deathless Warrior) +30 while at 0hp or less (Belt of Sonnlinor Righteousness) =
TOTAL 43 (effective damage resist)

As was pointed out, the effective damage resist from the Deathless Warrior feat does stack with the Belt of Sonnlinor Righteousness.

This bonus will increase by 2 every time you roll a death saving throw, so it is only a matter of time until it gains a high enough bonus to auto-revive every time. In the meantime, it cannot fail a saving throw and thus cannot die (except by negative hit points). If you're in a rush, here are some options to speed the surgeless revive along:

Option #1: Divine Mettle (encounter)
+7 power bonus to next saving throw.

Option #2: Conviction (encounter)
+5 power bonus to next saving throw.

Option #3: Potion of Spirit (level 30 consumable)
+6 power bonus to death saving throws until the end of the encounter.


With a Soulforged Armor equipped, The Thing cannot even be killed by negative hit points until the end of its next turn. At that point, it doesn't matter how many DPR whores you have lined up if you can't stop The Thing from healing on its turn or reviving on its next death saving throw.

Towards the end of the build, The Thing can be as lazy as it wants, munching damage like popcorn, and auto-attacking until sweet baby Jesus cries himself into a coma. That said, this build will likely ruin your campaign just as easily as it will mine.

Please enjoy responsibly.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Reis, level 30
Revenant, Paladin, Avenging Haunt, Raven Consort
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade)
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Holy Symbol)
Choose your Race in Life: Shadar-kai

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 26, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 24.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 11, Con 14, Dex 12, Int 8, Wis 14, Cha 16.


AC: 47 Fort: 42 Reflex: 44 Will: 44
HP: 223 Surges: 19 Surge Value: 55

TRAINED SKILLS
Religion +20, Insight +23, Endurance +28, Intimidate +33

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +14, Arcana +15, Bluff +22, Diplomacy +22, Dungeoneering +18, Heal +18, History +15, Nature +18, Perception +18, Stealth +14, Streetwise +22, Thievery +14, Athletics +12

FEATS
Level 1: Melee Training (Charisma) (retrained to Superior Implement Training (Warding symbol) at Level 11)
Level 2: Death's Quickening (retrained to Ghostly Vitality at Level 21)
Level 4: Restless Dead
Level 6: Devoted Paladin
Level 8: Versatile Expertise
Level 10: Power of Winter
Level 11: Death Scorned
Level 12: Unfailing Vigor
Level 14: Lasting Frost
Level 16: Wintertouched
Level 18: Psychic Lock
Level 20: Iron Will (retrained to Unyielding Fortitude at Level 22)
Level 21: Deathless Warrior
Level 22: Paladin's Truth
Level 24: Epic Reflexes
Level 26: Indomitable Will
Level 28: Pious Champion
Level 30: Echo of Letherna

POWERS
Lay on Hands: Lay on Hands
Paladin at-will 1: Enfeebling Strike
Paladin at-will 1: Ardent Strike
Paladin encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Paladin daily 1: Majestic Halo
Paladin utility 2: Bless Weapon
Paladin encounter 3: Invigorating Smite
Paladin daily 5: Unyielding Faith
Paladin utility 6: Divine Bodyguard
Paladin encounter 7: Price of Cowardice
Paladin daily 9: Knightly Intercession
Paladin utility 10: Conviction
Paladin encounter 13: Castigating Strike (replaces Valorous Smite)
Paladin daily 15: True Nemesis (replaces Unyielding Faith)
Paladin utility 16: Higher Cause
Paladin encounter 17: Enervating Smite (replaces Invigorating Smite)
Paladin daily 19: Visage of Sorrow (replaces Knightly Intercession)
Paladin utility 22: Inspiring Hymn
Paladin encounter 23: Demand Respect (replaces Price of Cowardice)
Paladin daily 25: Discipline the Unruly (replaces Majestic Halo)
Paladin encounter 27: Astral Thunderbolt (replaces Enervating Smite)
Paladin daily 29: World in Winter (replaces True Nemesis)

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Shield of Ultimate Protection Heavy Shield (epic tier), Sorrowsong Blade Longsword +6, Warding symbol of Dire Fate +6, Belt of Sonnlinor Righteousness (epic tier), Nullifying Ring (epic tier), Sorrowsworn Ring (epic tier), Circlet of Indomitability (epic tier), Bloodsoaked Bracers (epic tier), Gloves of the Healer (epic tier), Boots of Quickness (epic tier), Breakchain Tattoo (epic tier), Periapt of Recovery +6, Soulforged Godplate Armor +6
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======
Resistances don't stack, only the highest applies.  So if you have Resist 5 All, Resist 10 All, and Resist 20 Fire, you would only have resist 10 against a non-fire attack and you would only have resist 20 from a fire attack.  Make sense?
He has Resist 30 all while below 0 with the belt, resists of the same type don't stack.

Also unless you actually need the minor action from Ring of Free Time, you can save quite a bit on character wealth by just reducing your AC by 2 and going wtih Tarrasque plate (which also has resist 5 all).

Your understanding of Death Saving Throws is correct.
Deathless Warrior stacks with resistance, because it's "reduce damage by X" rather than Resist X.  Add Ghostly Vitality (revenant, epic feat) to gain insubstantial while below zero HP.  With 26 con, you're looking at an effective resist 43 to all, and you'd divide any remaining damage in half.  An attack that hit you for 60 would do a grand total of 8.  Anything that hits you for 44 or less does 0
[20:53] [SadisticFish] yeah Llamas convinced me
I didn't actually look up Deathless warrior, was just adding to the post above mine. If that is the language used you're golden.
The thing I like most about this build is it works with any class. As long as you stick with being a Revenant Shadar-Kai, nothing else matters.

Frankly, no class loses out on being unkillable. It's why so many versions of this build exist.
Thanks, everyone.

So I fixed up the math a little bit, and reworked the build some to be more playable at lower levels. I threw in some psychic lock and frost to help out the rest of the party. Soulforged Armor prevents negative hp death now. If you're not worried about that, a Fireblood Armor gives you some extra auto damage when coupled with Paladin's Truth.

I ditched the rogue multi-class and went with the Shadar-Kai Avenging Haunt PP instead. It loses out on some DST bonus, but will not die until it fails 6 DSTs. It takes a couple rounds to achieve perfect auto-revive, but it is still pretty much impossible to kill until then.

I suppose it can still be petrified.


I suppose it can still be petrified.



Buy some Oil of Flesh Returned (lvl 10 consumable 200gp) and hand it out to your friends. That should solve that problem.
He has Resist 30 all while below 0 with the belt, resists of the same type don't stack.

Also unless you actually need the minor action from Ring of Free Time, you can save quite a bit on character wealth by just reducing your AC by 2 and going wtih Tarrasque plate (which also has resist 5 all).

Your understanding of Death Saving Throws is correct.



This has probably already been said, but the OP appears to be correct.  Deathly Warrior does not grant resistance, it reduces damage.  As such it should still stack with normal resistance.

EDIT: Yes, as I assumed I am late to this particular party.

Anyway, very nice job.

Eqip this guy with the new magic missile and 30 rounds later Bahamut will be dead.  Really you can solo anything as long as they don't have regen you can't beat (but an optimized Magic Missile can still do ~50 damage a pop, so the chances of anyone's regen beating that seems... quite low.
I built an assassin build along these lines (Revanant(Human) Assassin/Avenging Haunt). It was a plane hopping campaign that never took place, and the characters would have owned a astral ship. One of my purchases? A Folding Astral Skiff. And I can pilot it, albight at slow speed, by myself, I had a magic map item that would give me the nearby terrain.

I had basically stumped the DM as to how to kill me off, as almost all methods I could get out of. I didn't want to abuse this, but it was nice to have the options, and would have fit my character's survivalist instinct.
Take a look at my Handbook: The Pet Store: A Familiar Keeper's Handbook Nacht: "Vecna can do ANYTHING given preptime. He's like an undead lich god Batman."
One slight problem with the build, I believe you only have a +6 bonus to death saving throws because nullifying ring and periapt of recovery are both item bonuses.

Personally, my current character is planning on using a similar concept on its build, only I'm using Sage of Ages as my Epic Destiny and arcane maxing(character is a swordmage) to allow me some nice side benefits. As I recall, I end up with a +8 to all saving throws, +9 to death saving throws, and +10 to saving throws against dazed, dominated, and stunned. I don't use Shadar-Kai as the revenant base race, but that was tp expand some of my other options.  
Mind Flayer Mastermind is another danger: Devour Brain or Create Thrall.
gargoyle ring can help avoid petrification.

As far as devour brain goes, while it is a potential threat, it only kills if it actually reduces your HP, meaning it would have to do 44+ damage with the triggering attack if you were already below zero. More likely to kill you if you were close to zero like against any other character.
At lvl 30, a PC with the avatar of death ED can kill any revenant pulling this trick. My group had a level 30 group brawl 1-shot (with lots of custom rules to make it more fun) and one of the guys brought an example of this build and made the mistake of bragging about it before the fact.

I showed up with Avatar of Death and wrecked shop. Much fun.
At lvl 30, a PC with the avatar of death ED can kill any revenant pulling this trick. My group had a level 30 group brawl 1-shot (with lots of custom rules to make it more fun) and one of the guys brought an example of this build and made the mistake of bragging about it before the fact.

I showed up with Avatar of Death and wrecked shop. Much fun.


So could a daggermaster who can auto-crit for 500ish damage... not sure PCs are particularly relevant.
[20:53] [SadisticFish] yeah Llamas convinced me
With the armor, he's not dead at negative bloody until the end of his turn.
Another weakness(er thing not covered by the build?) is a miss with Orcus's Touch of Death is capable of killing you if you are already in negative HP.

Oh and falling damage can mess you up if you fall from an airship or something.....falling into lava too depending on what damage you DM rules it deals.

With the armor, he's not dead at negative bloody until the end of his turn.


I dunno, the armor only states you remain conscience not that you don't die. Either way, being stunned until the end of a turn combined with a bad death saving throw(lower than 13) could still screw him up here.
The paragon tier feat "Mettle" can handle the touch of death miss.
The paragon tier feat "Mettle" can handle the touch of death miss.


Unless I am remembering the monster symbols incorrectly, Touch of Death is a melee attack. Mettle only works on close and area attacks.
+3 item (Nullifying Ring) ... +2 item (Periapt of Recovery)



Hrm.  I dunno if this is kosher.  I mean, if you have +2 power bonus to fire damage and +2 power bonus to damage, they wouldn't stack, right?  I have to imagine this works the same way.
I'm not sure if I'm convinced that Soulforged Armor keeps you from dying by being reduced to negative bloodied.  It states you stay conscious, and that's it.

Is the idea that you aren't killed based on the part that says "...you fall unconscious (or die)..."?

Is it normal consensus that this is how it works?  Is there a CS ruling on it?
Sig
Yes, I killed your BBEG with his own lair:
Setting: Tomb with a perilous bridge and cliff 100 feet above a lava pit. Mummy pops out of his sarcophagus, initiative: Felix, Half-Elf Artificer: Twin Strike with crossbow. Trump (ala Donald), Eladrin Warlord: Charges mummy with Opening Shove, pushing off the cliff. Mummy fails saving throw, and falls into pit. Sanshiro (ala Japanese "superhero" Segata), Minotaur Barbarian: Strength check to lift sarcophagus and carry to cliff. Free action, drop sarcophagus into square above mummy. Sarcophagus drops on mummy, shoving him further down into lava. Mummy: proceeds to make a series of horrible athletics checks to swim and climb cliff. Dies a horrible death with lava permeating every orifice. Entire Party: Watches on in delight, faces alit with the glow of lava and flaming undead.
Original CharOpper
I soap myself up, and turn up the hot water in the shower, so my sweat mixes with the soap, slickening my skin: +5 to grapple I use my own legs as a shield since only upper-body hits matter: +5 defense I use my teammates bodies to construct a vehicle for myself, and dual-wield their weapons because as long as I win, we all win: +10 attack, +10 defense I completely ignore the enemy, their attacks, the devastating damage they are dealing to me and my team, and strike directly for their base, completely obliterating them, their way of life, and any chance they had at survival as a species: WIN Ender: The Original CharOpper and Power Gamer.
+3 item (Nullifying Ring) ... +2 item (Periapt of Recovery)



Hrm.  I dunno if this is kosher.  I mean, if you have +2 power bonus to fire damage and +2 power bonus to damage, they wouldn't stack, right?  I have to imagine this works the same way.

Correct, it does not stack.  However, there's plenty of other ways to get +2.

'm not sure if I'm convinced that Soulforged Armor keeps you from dying by being reduced to negative bloodied.  It states you stay conscious, and that's it.

Is the idea that you aren't killed based on the part that says "...you fall unconscious (or die)..."?

Is it normal consensus that this is how it works?  Is there a CS ruling on it?

I don't think "dead" is reversed from gaining HP, "dying" is, but not "dead".  So if your at -bloodied, your dead, even if your still concious.  And if you heal, your still dead, just with positive HP.

Thus soulforged armor is pretty useless.  Taking Verve armor instead would be helpfull, giving you the +2  (untyped) you need to not fail DST.

guides
List of no-action attacks.
Dynamic vs Static Bonuses
Phalanx tactics and builds
Crivens! A Pictsies Guide Good
Power
s to intentionally miss with
Mr. Cellophane: How to be unnoticed
Way's to fire around corners
Crits: what their really worth
Retroactive bonus vs Static bonus.
Runepriest handbook & discussion thread
Holy Symbols to hang around your neck
Ways to Gain or Downgrade Actions
List of bonuses to saving throws
The Ghost with the Most (revenant handbook)
my builds
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.

Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.

Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.

King Fisher Optimized net user.  Moderate.

Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.

Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.

Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.

Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.

Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.

Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.

Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.

Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.

Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.  One of THE most abusive character in 4e.

Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.

Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.

Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.

Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.

Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.

The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.

Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power.

Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken.

Rune of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.

Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.

Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.

Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight with items, making it far more broken.

Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.

Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.

Sign In to post comments