6/18/2010 Announcement

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This thread is for discussion of the announcement which goes live on Thursday, June 18, 2010.
Oh glory! Much needed bans and a huge totally awesome shift in how Extended works. I always hated that power cards reigned for so long.
Wizards, hold up! You guys realize that we spend a TON of money on CARDBOARD because we like to make you guys money, then you go ahead and do this to people? What if I just spent $1000 on an extended deck that won't be legal in 2 weeks! You guys need to realize that anyone who did that might as well have flushed that money down the toilet? THIS IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO TREAT LOYAL CUSTOMERS!
NOOOOOOO NONONONONOOOOOOOOO.  THIS IS TERRIBLE.
On the flip-side, non-tournament players like myself will enjoy reduced prices on cards that were also once fairly cheap.  Dark Depths, I'm looking at you.  With stars in my eyes.  Or is it Legacy viable?  I sure hope not.
WotC.. You are really really stupid. TY
Jun 19, 2010 -- 10:50PM, JaketheLate wrote: have you ever SEEN Yoked Plowbeast!? It's totally BROKEN!!!11ONEONEONE It has five power AND it cycles!!111ELEVEN You can either get rid of it early, or play it lategame for a serious ****ing beatdown; it's ****ING NUTS!!111ELEVENONEONEONE
Time spiral is legacy? somehow this doesn't seem right
This announcement better be important. I'm attributing it to the reason why it's taking the website so long to load.
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Wizards, hold up! You guys realize that we spend a TON of money on CARDBOARD because we like to make you guys money, then you go ahead and do this to people? What if I just spent $1000 on an extended deck that won't be legal in 2 weeks! You guys need to realize that anyone who did that might as well have flushed that money down the toilet? THIS IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO TREAT LOYAL CUSTOMERS!



Maybe the customers shouldn't have assumed that WOTC will never change policy.

I would not have minded the change as much if they had introduced some other format to cover the older sets for people that don't have dual lands. I just got back into magic after putting it down for a few years and was on the verge of building the shambles of an extended deck with the cards I had from Mirrodin, Kamigawa, Ravnica, and Coldsnap (I haven't bought any packs Time Spiral +) and then I find this out. :/

Oh well. I guess I'll just stick to playing casually until a newer set catches my eye enough to warrant me putting money into it.
Wizards, hold up! You guys realize that we spend a TON of money on CARDBOARD because we like to make you guys money, then you go ahead and do this to people? What if I just spent $1000 on an extended deck that won't be legal in 2 weeks! You guys need to realize that anyone who did that might as well have flushed that money down the toilet? THIS IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO TREAT LOYAL CUSTOMERS!


Blah, blah, blah.
Go play Limited like a good little consumer and throw your cards away after two hours - and then buy them all over again next week, unless of course another flight is starting tonight.
Whoa. Simultaniously killing Ravnica Duals (Scapeshift), Jitte (Zoo, et al), Dark Depths, Thopter Combo, Hypergen., All In Red, and Dredge.... What did I miss? Yikes folks....

Do I smell a new format on the horizon? Is that rumor being subtly confirmed??
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This just in: Goyf is about to rotate out of Extended. He only has a few months left.

*facepalm* Now what am I supposed to do with 4 digital copies of FtV: Exiled Mystical Tutor? (The foil version was $4, the original Mirage uncommon was $8. Online is awesome like that.)
Guess I'm going to have to assemble "Living End."
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Sweet...I don't like that TSP (my favorite Block) will rotate out in the Fall but will try to hit up GenCon with something.  ^_^
Wizards, hold up! You guys realize that we spend a TON of money on CARDBOARD because we like to make you guys money, then you go ahead and do this to people? What if I just spent $1000 on an extended deck that won't be legal in 2 weeks! You guys need to realize that anyone who did that might as well have flushed that money down the toilet? THIS IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO TREAT LOYAL CUSTOMERS!


Any policy change they ever make will inevitably hurt some of their customers that invested in the current policy. It's incredibly unfortunate that you're on that side of the fence (although if you're worried about spending $1000 on one deck, you're probably doing OK, or can just play Legacy with your expensive cards).
It's better that they change their policy and please lots of loyal customers instead of not harming few loyal customers by perpetuating a dying format that's apparently not doing it's job.

And if you want to play with everything, that's what Legacy is for., although I would not be surprised if another eternal format is on the horizon. Key word: horizon. They certainly need to see how the new extended works out before building a whole new format based on the hope that it does its job of extending Standard.

Personally, the only Extended decks I dreamed up in the past usually had to do with "Oh darn, that would have gone great with the mechanic that just rotated!" Well, now I can do that more successfully.
Having never even thought of playing Extended, now I kinda want to. I approve.

This doesn't just hurt a few players... it hurts anyone who owned fetches and rav duals, which is most people who've been playing extended for a year or so and some that haven't. They expected rav duals to stick around for at least another 2 years, even if they were never reprinted. And you can't just sell them to Legacy players, since those players have original duals. (Though maybe the duals have some use if the "Masques and onward" eternal format that's being talked about gets made). And while Zendikar fetches are still legal in all formats, they're going to see less play in Extended without rav duals to fetch. It looks like Shadowmoor lands and 10th ed painlands might be getting another run... sucks to be anyone who sold them when they rotated out.

Second problem. They just fast tracked the exit of the best block they ever have made (and probably ever will make). Now that Ravnica's just a part of Legacy, it won't be part of the player base consciousness anymore. The new face of Magic will be the piece of trash Alara set, which is not very good for their image. Even Kamigawa and Mirrodin were better.

My prediction... the return of those bloody Faeries. We were all sick of playing against blossom and cryptic even before shadowmoor came in, though they had to stick around for another year... and now they're back.

Wouldn't it have just been easier to ban a few specific cards to get rid of some combos in Extended and leave the rest of the sets in?

Wow, that's really gutsy of them.  It would certainly be interesting if Extended makes it as an FNM format.
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Kinda strange to rotate out three years of cards and give two weeks notice.  Please wait to announce the new eternal format while I get all the good cards for cheap.
(Though maybe the duals have some use if the "Masques and onward" eternal format that's being talked about gets made)


Don't get your hopes up too much.
It's pretty obvious the plan is to let Legacy wither, while cards rotate out of Extended into Siberia.  Better abuse the hell out of eighty-dollar Jace whie you still can - he's got about three years left before he's tossed aside into the abyss.

This looks like it will be a pretty sucky format from a spectator standpoint. I have to say I am truly glad I hung up my tournament shoes when I did. It's still a little bit of a shock that the set I came back with a few years ago is suddenly leaving Extended, but I guess for all intents and purposes I wasn't going to play it at all seriously. All my decks will be Legacy and Vintage from this point, or I suppose of they did have some other idea to bridge to Legacy they could be legal there.

I guess they really are sorry about Tarmogoyf and Time Spiral block in general.

This better be some sort of sick joke...

Wow, what a crazy decision to make with so little warning.  Not that it really matters, but Coldsnap rotated with Time Spiral in the past, why change that now, for the sake of a few months?  Surely it's not that hard to ban Dark Depths.


That faeries comment is horrifying *shudder*.  I don't want to see even more Faeries, thanks!  Please let linear decks like that compete in a larger pool of modular cards.  What's the point of this transition, anyway?

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So they killed the hypergenesis deck I made but never played...oh well. But they ban mystical tutor? Are you freaking kidding me? The card is not overly powerful! Is is card disadvantage! Good way to screw over ANT and Reanimator. I just cannot believe this. WOTC please explain yourselves.
This better be some sort of sick joke...



Sadly, no. It is not. DCI decided to ban Mystical because????? Oh right no empirical evidence. Taking a quick count on deckcheck,manually. As of March of 2010 there have been 40 ssomething ANT and Animator decks, the only decks that play 4. Yes, Fourty something Ad Naus Tendrils and Reanimator decks in top 8's.   55 Merfolks, fifty five -getting this DCI?- 75 Zoo decks(most, still with me DCI?)..

Now i know what you may be thinking, because i can tell these things. You are saying " But that makes around 90 decks with 4 Mystical Tutors".  Well Counterbalance has shown up in over 110 decks in the same span.

Not as if any of this should really matter, what about all the players who just went out and purchased Entombs to play Animator or went and purchased ANT? The DCI is a cage of monkeys allowed to drink liqour and smoke pot while making decisions.
Jun 19, 2010 -- 10:50PM, JaketheLate wrote: have you ever SEEN Yoked Plowbeast!? It's totally BROKEN!!!11ONEONEONE It has five power AND it cycles!!111ELEVEN You can either get rid of it early, or play it lategame for a serious ****ing beatdown; it's ****ING NUTS!!111ELEVENONEONEONE

This change might just be what introduces me to Extended, since I only keep cards for about four years.
I'd be sad if Bitterblossom will dominate the new Extended, with the rotation of Dark Depths and the bannings of Sword of the Meek and Hypergenesis. But I wonder how Jund will fare against Faeries?

It will be like monstrosities from two different Standards meet and clash with each other. But my bet's on Jund, since Putrid Leech and friends beat face much faster and harder than Doran, against which Faeries struggled back in the day.


Also, it would be interesting if there is a middling format that allows cards in exactly half of Magic's lifetime. In every two years, a year's worth of cards will rotate. The good thing about this format would be that the newest cards will rotate only after forever (17 years for cards released right now), while also being new enough to avoid most of the power cards that defines the Eternal formats.


Whether we need such a format is another question, but just thinking it might be interesting.

I hate you Wizards.

Wow, what a crazy decision to make with so little warning.  Not that it really matters, but Coldsnap rotated with Time Spiral in the past, why change that now, for the same of a few months?



That faeries comment is horrifying *shudder*.  I don't want to see even more Faeries, thanks!  Please let linear decks like that compete in a larger pool of modular cards.  What's the point of this transition, anyway?





Glad you asked.

After I had my "WTFH3LL!!!!" moment I've been able to logically come up with the following:

#1:  No one really plays Extended unless there is an Extended season.  There's little to no store support for this, and one has to essentially play a top deck in order to win.  Some of the problems with Legacy started showing up in Extended and a change had to be made.  Extended was a broken format anyway with cards rotating to the abyss (and into Legacy) anyway, so it was time to cut it off now to try and fix it (or prepare for a new format).

Their mistake was letting cards rotate out still.  It should cap and be an eternal format from one set onward.

#2:  Zendikar introduced a new set of fetches just as the old fetches rotated out of Extended.  Cutting Extended gives WotC the design space needed in the future to bring back similar style cards (new duals, former keywords, etc) without loading a non-Standard / non-Legacy format with too many money cards.

This causes a problem of cards severely dropping in value once they leave Extended more so than it does now.

#3:  This opens up space for a new eternal non-Legacy format.  Wizards should have announced this too, but they didn't.  I kind of wonder why this is, but we'll wait and see.

Failure to make a new format between Extended and Legacy could really send the wrong message to players.


Whatever happens I look forward to the changes.
The new face of Magic will be the piece of trash Alara set, which is not very good for their image. Even Kamigawa and Mirrodin were better.

Nah, Alara rocks.

Please wait to announce the new eternal format while I get all the good cards for cheap.

If there is a new format. This might be to just push more people into Legacy so it doesn't die due to their previous mistakes.

I hate you Wizards.



This
I love it when I have been a loyal coustomer for 15 years and the company chooses to screw me over and cost me to waste my money so "new" players can have an easier time getting into a format. If you really believe this how about you drop the Mythics that cost new standard players $300 a playset.  Count me out on any new magic, I'll stick to Legacy and EDH and will no longer be buying your product.

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This is sorely disappointing to me. I live in a relatively small town and a couple guys organize weekly tournaments at the local library to play Magic. Everyone around here is a pretty casual player without TONS of money/cards. The format we usually play is Extended because it helps to reach more players in the area. With Wizards cutting out so many sets at once, it's going to cut down on some of our players that don't have a lot of cards Frown. Ohh well, so it goes I guess. The thing that buggers me the most is that they didn't give us any warning that this change was coming, it was just BAM! No more using these cards!
Great Job Wizards,

People couldn't wait for Fairies to leave standard and the same is felt about Jund. Way to ruin extended even more than it already was. Extended will be a fairy jund fest. Grats to the genius that did this one. Oh yeah and way to screw over all the people with the short notice on removing so many sets. You could of given a years notice of the change so people wouldn't be caught with their pants down. Do you even care about the players or is it all about you???

Instead of crying that more people are playing Legacy than Extended. Here is a Novel idea... Support Legacy. Oh wait... people aren't buying packs... hmmm... I guess that won't work. How about you get rid of all formats except Standard and Block and we will just throw our cards away at the end of every 2 years. Oh, Wait you almost did that. Maybe that will be the next announcement. Thanks!

Casey

Like others have mentioned rather than increase my interest in extended this moves me more towards the Legacy group. I'll save up for the next 2-3 years so I can buy a good legacy deck and then never/rarely buy magic cards again.

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Could this be magics death knell? I cannot believe what they are doing. What reasoning to they have for banning mystical tutor and drastically changing extended? Maybe it's time for me to get out of this game...it's been fun.
Just when it feels like I have a grasp on when to invest in the secondary market for extended magic cards, this comes up. Here is a fine of example of why preparing for a season early does not pay off. I invested tons of money in the format because I know how hard it is to get a Tier 1 deck when the season rolls around. Therefore, I spent most of the post/pre season picking up all the format staples. 

Ever since Hasbro bought you guys out, it seems like WOTC is just a bunch of sellouts. The only interest is to make money, and the enjoyment of the game is dead. First mythics, now this. Magic has become something that only the rich can play. If you want to compete in tournament caliber magic, you better have deep pockets, as quality decks go up to $1000 to make. 

Although this decision will not be changed, and this message will probably fall on deaf ears, I hope future magic will be more consistent, and not so much where players who invest more, get screwed over more.

At the end of the day, it's all about the money. Consider yourself a player and buyer lost. 
Legacy had what was coming. Mystical was probably on the edge of a ban for a long time. The added freak out about Ad Nauseum combo AND Reanimator using it probably pushed it over the edge. Even though Legacy is seeing top 8s at major tournaments where not a single copy of Mystical Tutor made it to single elimination rounds.

I'm also glad to see the underpowered ritual and relic of the banned list Grim Monolith come off. And the utterly useless after erratum Illusionary Mask leave the list.

However, Extended is now gone forever and replaced with a different format which happens to share it's name. The article linked to in the announcement made it clear that WotC doesn't want Legacy to be a more popular format than the ones that rotate. In fact I can quote Larabee on the subject
"The long term plan is to make the new Extended format more popular than the current Extended. What I would like to see is this format become more widely played than Legacy."


Now, I have noticed in recent years that Extended is dying, and I fully understand something drastic had to happen to try and save it, which is why I'm not going to really criticize this decision. Something had to be done. I'm just still unhappy that Legacy isn't being picked up for more of a spotlight and having staples reprinted (and the reprint policy ripped up). Preferably in a set that isn't as chaff filled as Chronicles or it's modern equivalent Masters Edition.
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Yeah for casual player in Magic online is a disaster... now I have to play Classic/Legacy as 90% of my decks are invalid. Ugh.

Probably not a real problem as the old exteded was really on decreasing numbers in the casual room, but still I'm annoyed.

Did this came out of the blue or was somewhat a known decision? I did not hear any hint of it before.


M.
well this is just great. i lost my job so to pay my friend who sorted my travel and accom for nationals i was gonna sell my ravnica duals. as magic cards are the only thing of value i have.

so instaed of selling my extended stuff to pay for standard events, im now gonna sell my standard collection to buy some of the rotated stuff on the cheap, some legacy staples and never buy a booster from you again.

not worth the risk.

i feel like i had my life savings hidden under my bed and wizards snuck in through the night took all the notes and left the change. 
i would have like a bigger "heads-up". now we have, what? two weeks to enjoy our old format AND its cards?
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