Crimson Legion Champion [Tiefling Hybrid Paladin|Warlock / Questing Knight / Legendary Sovereign]

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This build was inspired by Dragon 381 - Winning Races: Tieflings.
Paraphrasing: The Crimson Legion are paladin/warlocks who formerly served Asmodeus before they were betrayed.  They now seek their revenge.


The focus of this build is going to be building up simultaneous divine sanctions and curses on large numbers of targets while occasionally making them violate those marks in counterproductive ways.  Using the THP from infernal pact boon to fuel your health off the destruction of foes will make surges last longer and the solid defenses will avoid damage without rising to the level that would make going after your allies more attractive than avoiding mark retribution.

The Crimson Legion Champion is a Tiefling Hybrid Paladin|Warlock:
* Paladin of Oghma, the judge of ideas and collector of histories.
* Star Pact Warlock - perhaps, just once, you went a bit too far looking for the answers.


Pump Reflex for both hybrid defenses.  You'll need all the help you can get on that one.
Starting scores:
Str 10, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 16
  +2 Cha/+2 Int Racial for Tiefling.
Keep pushing Cha and Con at every increase.  Cha will drive the majority of ability accuracy, damage, and bonuses for both classes.

[sblock Heroic]
Feat 1: Hybrid Talent (Paladin Armor Proficiency)
Get into that plate armor right away.
At-will 1: Enfeebling Strike
The primary at-will.  Marked targets will get an additional -2 to attack rolls when you hit them with this.
At-will 1: Dire Radiance
A radiant ranged power, this will have more utility later...
Encounter 1: Valorous Smite
When you hit -> close burst 3 Divine Sanction (DS).
Daily 1: Majestic Halo
A radiant attack, plus an aura 1 of DS marking for the rest of the encounter.


Feat 2: Imperious Majesty
This is a great level.  It starts with using your Cha for initiative and debuffing enemies you get the drop on...
Utility 2: Charm of Hearts
and ends with a daily utility that is a sustainable +2 to defenses and immunity to OAs.  That is very useful if you want to mix in some warlock ranged powers.


Encounter 3: Lure of Minauros
Make an enemy hit himself or his buddy.  After adding infernal pact in paragon, this will also have some catch-22 damage for enemies that attack.  Importantly, the damage they take from attacking you (Cha) will always stay below the damage from violating a DS mark (Cha+tier scale).


Feat 4: Wrath of the Crimson Legion
Grants a minor action encounter power to DS all enemies in close burst 5 for a round and makes your MBA Cha based.


Hybrid daily 5: Tyrannical Threat
Close burst 3 curse power with a catch-22 effect.  After adding infernal pact in paragon, will curse even targets you miss.


Feat 6: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade, Rod)
It's time for some accuracy bonuses.
Utility 6: Call of Challenge
And a second burst DS, this time close burst 3.


Encounter 7: Far Realm Phantasm
You made a mistake and are out of position.  You couldn't get there in time.  Maybe you are just feeling malicious.  "The target spends its next standard action making a basic attack against the empty air."  That sounds like a good way to keep him busy.  (And later on it can be used to set up immediate punishment powers on his turn.)


Feat 8: Power of Trickery
You or an ally can shift 1 around a target you hit with Enfeebling Strike.  Solid for adjusting position and setting up CA for strikers.


Daily 9: Decree of Khirad
Close blast 3 rearrangement and forced attacks.


Feat 10: Starfire Womb
Free saving throws when you deal damage with fear or radiant.  That's almost everything in this build.  This is where Dire Radiance comes in as a backup at-will that is radiant.
Utility 10: Troublesome Aid of Caiphon
Make a surge count for double HP.  At the small price of a death saving throw...  Great for some top-off healing at the end of encounters when you want to hit those extra milestones.
[/sblock]


Paragon Path: Questing Knight
Time to begin the quest to redeem the Crimson Legion.  And by redeem I mean deliver horrible bloody vengeance upon Asmodeus.
* Strength of Ten is a close blast 3 DS marking attack with a shift.  A great foundation for what's to come.
* At 12, Quester's Discipline is a once a day get out of jail free vs blind, daze, dominate, stun, or weaken.
* At 16, you can use your second wind as a free action while bloodied.
* Other: bonuses to defenses, a saving throw with +2 bonus on AP and a 4W fear attack at 20 that weakens.


[sblock Paragon]
Feat 11: Twofold Pact
It's time to recruit infernal allies to help you in your quest.  The infernal pact boon will be a key HP pool for you from now on. 


Always keep the focus target cursed, and try to keep everything cursed using a Rod of Corruption or Tyrannical Threat.  Then, when anything dies you get your level in THP.


Feat 12: Bloodied Boon
Feels good doesn't it?  How about you get that THP every time something is bloodied too.  Don't forget to recurse.


Encounter 13: Castigating Strike (replaces Valorous Smite)
Just a damage upgrade from Valorous Smite.


Feat 14: Protective Hex
Stack some more penalties on to something you hit by turning curses into a pseudo-mark.


Daily 15: Knight's Defiance (replaces Majestic Halo)
Pull everything in burst 5 to you and DS it (save ends).  Then smack something.


Feat 16: Contagious Challenge
An extra way to give out a DS each turn will help in extended battles that use up all the burst DS encounter powers.
Utility 16: Divine Aegis
Boost the defenses of you and your frontline allies.


Ecounter 17: Cursegrind (replaces Lure of Minauros)
This just seemed like too much fun to ignore with all the curse spreading going on here.  Close burst 20 against all cursed.



Feat 18: Paragon Defenses (retrained to Robust Defenses at Level 21)
Mmm, defenses.


Daily 19: Delusions of Loyalty (replaces Decree of Khirad)
Make an enemy help you defend.  Then punish him for not attacking you.  Sustain and repeat.


Feat 20: Armor Specialization (Plate)
[/sblock]


Epic Destiny: Legendary Sovereign
It's time to gather the Crimson Legion from their dispersed service to various gods and reunite them under your banner.
* Level 21 - your crits provide a basic attack (melee or ranged) for all allies within 10.
* Level 30 - Sword of Kings - Keep using Strength of Ten until you miss with it.  Stack this up with Divine Mastery and you can keep using this power to burst mark for many rounds.
* The other powers are flavorful and useful.


[sblock Epic]
Feat 21: Weakening Challenge
Weaken anything that defies your mark.  Key for keep enemies from wandering off as things scale up.


Feat 22: Warding Curse
Use the curses to make your defenses better as well now that we have the weakening to threaten with.
Utility 22: Holy Wings
Flying is necessary sometimes, and the +4 against OAs will help if you need to cast a ranged spell with adjacent enemies when Charm of Hearts is not running.


Encounter 23: Demand Respect (replaces Castigating Strike)
Zap, prone, and blind an enemy that attacks an ally.  Does not require a mark to be present.


Feat 24: Epic Reflexes
Reflexes has been falling behind so bring it up to par.


Daily 25: Discipline the Unruly (replaces Knight's Defiance)
Sustainable additional punishment for attacking allies, no marks required, just within 5.


Feat 26: Divine Mastery
Bring back one of your burst marking encounter powers when you spend an AP.  Paladin's Wrath and Strength of Ten are prime choices depending on how clustered things are.


Encounter 27: Wrathful Flame (replaces Cursegrind)
Close burst 5 daze all marked enemies.

Feat 28: Student of the Athanaeum
Use this to have Charm of Hearts twice a day, or maybe Tyrannical Threat, or maybe...


Daily 29: Caiphon's Abominable Melody (replaces Delusions of Loyalty)
A nice accurate power that drops deaf, blind, and slow on a target with separate save ends and makes them take damage until they save vs all three.  The real gem here is the last two sentences of the Hit line.  "Until the end of the encounter, any time you take damage, roll a d20.  If you roll 10 or higher, reduce the damage to 0."  Don't miss.


Feat 30: Paladin's Truth
Ignore resists and immunities on marked targets.  Simple enough, and needed for the big game you'll be hunting. Asmodeus won't go down easy.


[/sblock]


The equipment laid out in the final build is just one way of kitting this character out.  Many choices were driven by theme as much as by mechanical benefit.


[sblock Sample Equipment Rationale]
Key equipment:
Rod of Corruption +1 - If your THP is already topped off, spread the curses around instead of taking the boon.
Bracers of Zeal (epic tier) - Cursed target just on the edge of death?  Use THP to make sure it dies and refill the THP.
Holy Avenger Longsword +6 - Weapon and implement, plus a daily power to help your party defenses.
Swiftstrike Shoes (paragon tier) - Get in place fast in the first turn, and get a daily teleport 20.
Symbol of Unified Defense +2 - Share defenses as a Daily II to protect against a nasty multi-target attack against your team.
Spell Anchors (heroic tier) - There's a fair amount of sustain in this build.  You don't want to drop a sustain because of action denial effects.
Eye of Awareness (epic tier) - Initiative goes to +29 with this and helps will defense.
Eager Hero's Tattoo (paragon tier) - Pre-charge the THP pool after each short rest.


More generic choices:
Imposter's Godplate Armor +6 (I picked this purely because it seemed RIGHT for the concept.)
Brooch of Vitality +6
Belt of Vitality (epic tier)
Ring of Free Time (epic tier)
Ring of Tenacious Will (epic tier)
[/sblock]


[sblock Final Sheet]
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Mar, level 30
Tiefling, Paladin|Warlock, Questing Knight, Legendary Sovereign
Hybrid Paladin: Hybrid Paladin Reflex
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Star Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Hybrid Talent: Paladin Armor Proficiency
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade)
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Rod)
Twofold Pact: Infernal Pact
Sword of Kings: Strength of Ten
Background: Tiefling - Dark Secret, Arcane Sentinel, Out for Revenge (+2 to Arcana)


FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 24, Dex 10, Int 16, Wis 14, Cha 28.


STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 16.



AC: 46 Fort: 42 Reflex: 42 Will: 44
HP: 202 Surges: 17 Surge Value: 50


TRAINED SKILLS
Bluff +31, Religion +23, Arcana +25


UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +13, Diplomacy +24, Dungeoneering +17, Endurance +20, Heal +17, History +18, Insight +19, Intimidate +24, Nature +17, Perception +17, Stealth +15, Streetwise +24, Thievery +15, Athletics +14


FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Imperious Majesty
Level 4: Wrath of the Crimson Legion
Level 6: Versatile Expertise
Level 8: Power of Trickery
Level 10: Starfire Womb
Level 11: Twofold Pact
Level 12: Bloodied Boon
Level 14: Protective Hex
Level 16: Contagious Challenge
Level 18: Paragon Defenses (retrained to Robust Defenses at Level 21)
Level 20: Armor Specialization (Plate)
Level 21: Weakening Challenge
Level 22: Warding Curse
Level 24: Epic Reflexes
Level 26: Divine Mastery
Level 28: Student of the Athanaeum
Level 30: Paladin's Truth


POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Dire Radiance
Hybrid at-will 1: Enfeebling Strike
Infernal Pact: Hellish Rebuke
Hybrid encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Hybrid daily 1: Majestic Halo
Hybrid utility 2: Charm of Hearts
Hybrid encounter 3: Lure of Minauros
Hybrid daily 5: Tyrannical Threat
Hybrid utility 6: Call of Challenge
Hybrid encounter 7: Far Realm Phantasm
Hybrid daily 9: Decree of Khirad
Hybrid utility 10: Troublesome Aid of Caiphon
Hybrid encounter 13: Castigating Strike (replaces Valorous Smite)
Hybrid daily 15: Knight's Defiance (replaces Majestic Halo)
Hybrid utility 16: Divine Aegis
Hybrid encounter 17: Cursegrind (replaces Lure of Minauros)
Hybrid daily 19: Delusions of Loyalty (replaces Decree of Khirad)
Hybrid utility 22: Holy Wings
Hybrid encounter 23: Demand Respect (replaces Castigating Strike)
Hybrid daily 25: Discipline the Unruly (replaces Knight's Defiance)
Hybrid encounter 27: Wrathful Flame (replaces Cursegrind)
Hybrid daily 29: Caiphon's Abominable Melody (replaces Delusions of Loyalty)


ITEMS
Rod of Corruption +1, Imposter's Godplate Armor +6, Brooch of Vitality +6, Holy Avenger Longsword +6, Belt of Vitality (epic tier), Ring of Free Time (epic tier), Ring of Tenacious Will (epic tier), Swiftstrike Shoes (paragon tier), Bracers of Zeal (epic tier), Spell Anchors (heroic tier), Symbol of Unified Defense +2, Eager Hero's Tattoo (paragon tier), Eye of Awareness (epic tier)
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======


[/sblock]

Thanks to AlphatheGreat and the gang in ##4e for suggestions and feedback!

You know I'm a fan of the build.

Just a couple thoughts:

Armor of Dark Majesty is +2 to all defenses against cursed targets.
I fear you may be selling your mark punishment a little short in epic...against more powerful opponents(such as those in the new MM3), weaken is as good as Aegis of Shielding...and you get it more than once per turn.  I'd say you can afford to boost your defenses a little.

I'm curious about your choice of domains.  You chose trickery for the mobility.  What do you think of Power of Madness for throwing a heavier debuff on your Enfeebling Strike target?



I could see a human variant that picks up Virtuous Strike and Power of the Moon or Sea for opportunity attack goodness.
Thanks for the comments.

Armor of Dark Majesty is +2 to all defenses against cursed targets.


It's only available in Leather and Hide.


I fear you may be selling your mark punishment a little short in epic...against more powerful opponents(such as those in the new MM3), weaken is as good as Aegis of Shielding...and you get it more than once per turn.  I'd say you can afford to boost your defenses a little.


Selling it short in that intro paragraph?  I agree that weaken is good, I was just trying to find the right balance between debuffs, marks, and defenses.  What ways do you see to boost defenses?

Currently, defenses are:
46/42/42/44 in general.  48/44/44/46 if you have Divine Aegis or Charm of Hearts running.  50/46/46/48 if the attacker is cursed in addition.  Getting 2 or 4 extra to all defenses from powers and curses allows some flexibility.


I'm curious about your choice of domains.  You chose trickery for the mobility.  What do you think of Power of Madness for throwing a heavier debuff on your Enfeebling Strike target?

I could see a human variant that picks up Virtuous Strike and Power of the Moon or Sea for opportunity attack goodness.


The at-wills and domain is an area where a lot of customization can take place.   The MBA in this build is Cha based from Wrath of the Crimson Legion, but changing out the paladin at-will and taking a different domain may give you something stronger.  This build doesn't focus on MBA like a White Lotus Riposte build would.  I think I did have Virtuous Strike/Power of the Moon in there at one point but I changed it when I went through and made it meet LFR character rules.

For the human variant, what would we put in the slots vacated by Imperious Majesty and Wrath of the Crimson Legion?  Probably an Initiative boosting feat (retrained as better become available) would be one of them.
It might be worth it to grab Eldritch Strike at level 1 for an MBA out of the gate and then retrain to Dire Radiance at level 4 when you pick up wrath of the crimson legion. 
Unfortunately, no Pact Boon for this build; you need the feat Hybrid Talent (Warlock Pact Boon) to get access to those.  Still works, just don't get the THP or Star-pact bonuses.
My fantasy novel: Continent in the Clouds
Unfortunately, no Pact Boon for this build; you need the feat Hybrid Talent (Warlock Pact Boon) to get access to those.  Still works, just don't get the THP or Star-pact bonuses.



Twofold Pact.
Yeah, using Twofold Pact to get both Boons seems a little dicey...  Be prepared to get hit with the nerf hammer. 

It looks like you didn't go that route previously, the other build used the Hybrid Multiclassing if I'm not mistaken.
Yeah, using Twofold Pact to get both Boons seems a little dicey...  Be prepared to get hit with the nerf hammer. 

It looks like you didn't go that route previously, the other build used the Hybrid Multiclassing if I'm not mistaken.

I wasn't assuming both boons in this version.  CB currently only grants you the new boon, which doesn't match the RAW of the feat.  The RAW of the feat seems clearly broken to me when viewed in the context of hybrids.  I fully expect something to change with this feat in the near future.
Added to the Ultimate Defenders thread.
I'm running a similar build in a campaign I'm in now.  Lvl 12.  I opted for Eldritch Strike as my primary At-Will, Crimson Fire for 1d10 curse damage against cursed+challanged targets... you get the idea. 

My only concern with the Crimson Legion build is Hybrid Challenge/Sanction has much lower damage output than pure Paladin builds are capable of, which causes some loss in stickyness.  But there are ways to compensate.

I am playing a 16th level Tiefling Paladin|Warlock Feytouched in LFR and he is EXTREMELY versatile and effective. Here's the build below so you can see some of the things I've done. I call it the Elusive Knight build:

Elusive Knight, Level 16
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Miro Von Mandikov, level 16
Tiefling, Paladin|Warlock, Feytouched
Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Charisma
Hybrid Paladin: Hybrid Paladin Will
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Star Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Will
Hybrid Talent: Paladin Armor Proficiency
Arcane Implement Proficiency: Arcane Implement Proficiency (heavy blade group)
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade)
Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Holy Symbol)
Twofold Pact: Fey Pact
Background: Amn, Born Under a Bad Sign (Born Under a Bad Sign Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 11, Con 12, Dex 11, Int 20, Wis 9, Cha 24.


STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 11, Dex 10, Int 14, Wis 8, Cha 18.



AC: 35 Fort: 22 Reflex: 28 Will: 31
HP: 112 Surges: 9 Surge Value: 28


TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +20, Endurance +10, Bluff +22


UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +4, Diplomacy +15, Dungeoneering +7, Heal +7, History +13, Insight +7, Intimidate +15, Nature +7, Perception +7, Religion +13, Stealth +6, Streetwise +15, Thievery +4, Athletics +4


FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Arcane Implement Proficiency
Level 4: Versatile Expertise
Level 6: Warlock's Wrath
Level 8: Turathi Weapon Training
Level 10: Imperious Majesty
Level 11: Twofold Pact
Level 12: Arcane Familiar
Level 14: Danger Sense
Level 16: Secrets of Belial (Twilight Teleport -> Mantle of Unity)


POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Virtuous Strike
Hybrid at-will 1: Eldritch Strike
Hybrid encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Hybrid daily 1: Majestic Halo
Hybrid utility 2: Call of Challenge
Hybrid encounter 3: Otherwind Stride
Hybrid daily 5: Forceful Assault
Hybrid utility 6: Racing Fire of Ulban (retrained to Wrath of the Gods at Level 10)
Hybrid encounter 7: Price of Cowardice
Hybrid daily 9: Ray of Reprisal
Hybrid utility 10: Ethereal Sidestep
Hybrid encounter 13: Castigating Strike (replaces Valorous Smite)
Hybrid daily 15: Knight's Defiance (replaces Ray of Reprisal)
Hybrid utility 16: Hero's Defense


ITEMS
Symbol of the Champion's Code +3, Strongheart Dagger +1, Siberys Shard of the Mage (paragon tier), Sehanine's Mark of the Dark Moon (level 18), Cloak of Translocation +3, Rod of Corruption +1, Helm of Able Defense (paragon tier), Incisive Dagger Dagger +3, Gloves of Eldritch Admixture (heroic tier), Summoned Warplate Armor +4, Bradaman's Khopesh +4, Absorbing Shield Heavy Shield (paragon tier), Ring of Dimensional Escape (paragon tier), Eladrin Boots (paragon tier)
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======



Note that with the Tranny Cloak and the Helm of Able Defense, my starting defenses are substantial. When I use Warlock's Wrath, they my AC hits 46, my NAC defenses are in the mid-high 30's. On the following round, I use Mantle of Unity to not only extend the bonus for another round, but to hand it out to my allies as well.

Symbol of the Champion's Code makes my sanction very threatening, and between Castigating Strike, Call of Challenge, Majestic Halo, and Knight's Defiance, I am able to keep many creatures sanctioned, which is just as powerful as your typical paladin's sanction.

I use the Khopesh over a Longsword primarily for flavor, and because I use implement powers way more often than weapon powers and decided that +1 damage (and an extra .5 on melee attacks due to brutal 1) is worth more to me than +1 attack on weapon powers.

Depending on how you interpret hybrids working and whether or not the Bradaman's Weapon works as an implement on Warlock powers on its own, Arcane Implement Proficiency can be swapped for Twofold Curse (the CB has flip-flopped from working and not between the last 3 releases).

Otherwind Stride will be replaced for Delban's Eye at 17 (really powerful and synergistic for this build). I'm trying to decide whether or not Hero's Defense will pay more dividends than Infuriating Elusiveness.

Obviously I'm not thrilled about Summoned Armor, but that's what I could get in LFR, and I'm running low on item slots, so I'll wait for a good +5 armor to upgrade.
Dave Kay LFR Writing Director Retiree dkay807 [at] yahoo [dot] com
 As I understand this, do you wield the sword in one hand, and the wand in the other? No shield? I really dig the flavor of this build, I just want to make sure I understand how it all works.
 As I understand this, do you wield the sword in one hand, and the wand in the other? No shield? I really dig the flavor of this build, I just want to make sure I understand how it all works.

Yep, that's it exactly.
Inferenz, any updates to this build in the last 2 months?

Specifically, would you still go with Questing Knight or would you go with something else?

Im also curious if youre still happy with the power choices.

Im truly looking to build a defender for our group that can also abuse DoB paired with Bloodied Boon for THPs along with all of the the other defender goodness of a Paly.
Sorry, Why tief.ing though?
Sorry, Why tief.ing though?



Wrath of the Crimson Legion
Having trouble understanding the defenderlock, sorry :p
So, you don't actually get a pactboon at lv1 until you take two fold pact right?
Having trouble understanding the defenderlock, sorry :p
So, you don't actually get a pactboon at lv1 until you take two fold pact right?



Correct. You get the riders on powers and meet prerequisites, but you don't get the actual boon when a cursed enemy hits zero. When you take Two-fold Pact, you do get the boon for your new choice, so you don't want your original Hybrid Talent choice to be the one you eventually choose for full boon (unless your GM allows you to switch them around).
I realize it's been 7 months since the last post on this, but I'm having issues building this in the character builder.  I am unable to find the powers Call of Challenge, Decree of Khirad and Troublesome Aid of Caiphon.  Can anyone help me with this?  Were these powers renamed and I'm just missing them or were they removed?

ed. ~ I am building this to level 11 for the start of a new campaign.  So I won't be able to replace the Decree
I haven't had time to check it out yet, but if I remember correctly these powers are taken at alternative levels. Call of Challenge is a level 2 power but I believe it's taken at six. I'm pretty sure this happens throughout the build.
That was it, thank you.
No problem.
Here's a rough build of my friend's PC, given a level 5,4,3 magic item (w/ cash for another lvl 3), but since he downgraded for a level 4 sword, I allowed him the extra $ to buy another lvl 4 item (his neck slot) By combining his Imperious Majesty, Enfeebling Strike, and armor property, a foe could take a -8 to attacks against him.


It's a work in progress, so hopefully more will be done for him. The items and stuff will change, as I'm probably going to use rarity rules and such, but this is the basis for his Crimson Legion Tiefling. He's a long-time D&D'er, but somewhat new to 4e, so he's still mulling over some concepts.

How's he look?

level 4
Tiefling, Paladin|Warlock
Hybrid Paladin: Hybrid Paladin Reflex
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Infernal Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Hybrid Talent: Paladin Armor Proficiency
Background: House of Lies (+2 to Bluff)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 19, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 19.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 12, Wis 12, Cha 16.


AC: 21 Fort: 17 Reflex: 16 Will: 17
HP: 47 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 11

TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +8, Religion +8, Bluff +15

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -1, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +3, Endurance +4, Heal +3, History +3, Insight +3, Intimidate +6, Nature +3, Perception +3, Stealth +1, Streetwise +6, Thievery -1, Athletics

FEATS
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Imperious Majesty
Level 4: Wrath of the Crimson Legion

POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Dire Radiance
Hybrid at-will 1: Enfeebling Strike
Hybrid encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Hybrid daily 1: Majestic Halo
Hybrid utility 2: Charm of Hearts
Hybrid encounter 3: Fiery Bolt

ITEMS
Rod of Corruption +1, Dazzling Plate Plate Armor +1, Sunblade Longsword +1, Lucky Charm +1
RIP George! 4-21-11 RIP Abie! 1-2-13
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Building a Paly|Lock and I'm looking to cast everything through my weapon. It looks like this build does that. Can someone explain?

The only options I know of are:


  • Arcane Implement Proficiency - does not work for paladin implement abilities

  • Star of Corellon at the cost of gold to have 2 different items.


Any suggestions?
Building a Paly|Lock and I'm looking to cast everything through my weapon.





Any suggestions?


Under the new implement and multiclassing rules, it's easy:  Wield a sword and then multiclass swordmage.  Your sword is now an implement, and you can use it for both your paladin and warlock powers.
Under the new implement and multiclassing rules, it's easy:  Wield a sword and then multiclass swordmage.  Your sword is now an implement, and you can use it for both your paladin and warlock powers.


It doesn't look like this build does that.

Beyond that it seems silly that every Paly|Lock (common build) would be forced to MC Swordmage. 
Under the new implement and multiclassing rules, it's easy:  Wield a sword and then multiclass swordmage.  Your sword is now an implement, and you can use it for both your paladin and warlock powers.


It doesn't look like this build does that.

Beyond that it seems silly that every Paly|Lock (common build) would be forced to MC Swordmage. 


1.  This build predates essentials.  I think he used a specific magic weapon to make it work.
2.  You're right, it's silly to force Paladins to keep up both an implement and a weapon.   And yet, there it is.
3.  Arcane Implement Proficiency works just as well.  Since swordmages use blades as implements, you can use AIP to grab a blade as your implement, and it'll still work with all your powers(and you won't have to MC swordmage).

1.  This build predates essentials.  I think he used a specific magic weapon to make it work.
2.  You're right, it's silly to force Paladins to keep up both an implement and a weapon.   And yet, there it is.
3.  Arcane Implement Proficiency works just as well.  Since swordmages use blades as implements, you can use AIP to grab a blade as your implement, and it'll still work with all your powers(and you won't have to MC swordmage).


1. He used the Sword that lets him use paladin implement powers it seems. Don't think it's legal to cast his warlock spells with it and his rod is +1 just for the buff.
2. Ya I know MID has been discussed for a long time. I assumed WoTC would have fixed it by now?
3. AIP actually wouldn't work with paladin implement powers.

Blaah. I hate these kind of dumb usability rules. Why must Paladin/Cleric/Avenger have MID?

1. He used the Sword that lets him use paladin implement powers it seems. Don't think it's legal to cast his warlock spells with it and his rod is +1 just for the buff.
2. Ya I know MID has been discussed for a long time. I assumed WoTC would have fixed it by now?
3. AIP actually wouldn't work with paladin implement powers.

Blaah. I hate these kind of dumb usability rules. Why must Paladin/Cleric/Avenger have MID?


1.  Yes it is.  Hybrid rules pre-essentials allow you to use any implement from one class as an implement from another.  If a magic weapon says you can use it as an implement with your paladin powers, then a pal|lock can also use it as an implement with his warlock powers, per the hybrid rules.  The only exception would be if it said "you can cast your paladin implement powers through this weapon," which I don't think any of the weapliment enchants do.

2.  Nope.  I'd like to give them that much credit, but nope.  Essentials half-fixed it, but not completely.  In some ways it's worse now, as they changed weapon focus so that it no longer applies to implement powers with a weapliment.

3.  Essentials rules say that if you can use an implement, you can use it with all your powers.  Period.  If the paladin can use a sword as an implement with his arcane powers(AIP), he can use it as an implement with all his powers.  Period.
And being a pal|lock makes you arcane so you CAN take AIP.
Awesome, thanks for all the help Alpha.

So it seems there are a few options:


  • AIP feat/MC Swordmage

  • Pact Blade/Paladin weapons

  • House-rule WoTC's sillyness

My Pallock uses a Crusader's Weapon, nothing like radiant/psychic abuse all in one character!
Oh, looks like Arcane Implement Proficiency will work now, as they've dropped the "with your arcane powers" bit it used to specify.  Pact blades will work, as they're just an implement.  The paladin-intended weapons are still all over the place, as some (like Scepter of Bane, Disrupting, & Holy Avenger) say that you can use them as a holy symbol, so they're good for warlock powers, but others (like Unforgettable Cudgel, Weapon of Evil Undone, Bradaman's, & Lion's Heart Hammer) specify that you can only use them as a holy symbol for divine powers, which won't work for this build by RAW (but if I were GMing, I'd let it work).

2.  Nope.  I'd like to give them that much credit, but nope.  Essentials half-fixed it, but not completely.  In some ways it's worse now, as they changed weapon focus so that it no longer applies to implement powers with a weapliment.



One thing to note is that the racial proficiency feats still apply to both weapon and implement attacks, so if you're a tiefling and don't mind a scimitar instead of a longsword, you can use Turathi Weapon Training for a universal damage feat bonus.
Also add Vigilant Blade to the former list with the new Hybrid rules.
Is it possible to create an Eladrin variant of this build that's still great at his job?
why use a rod of corruption at level 4? if the hybrid doesnt give you the pact boon then surely the rod never actually activates...

"whenever your pact poon is triggered, instead of taking its normal benefit, you can transfer your curse to target within 5"

note the word 'triggered', since the hybrid warlock does not give you the pact boon it can never trigger.

also the wording 'instead of taking its normal benefit'...if there is no benefit to take, because you have no boon, then surely you can not swap something you do not have for the cursing everything within 5?
By taking Two Fold Pact, you get the pact boon of what ever pact you pick (Mine being infernal.) So now if you have rod of corruption at any level, if you kill the thing you can then decide to not gain the TBH and spread your pact around to everything in 5 squares. So what you could end up doing is use AIP to have all your powers being cast through your sword, in which case, as long as you keep the rod of corruption +1 in your free hand, you can get the awesome benefit of cursing everything, while not having to worry about upgrading it and instead find a good sword and get another good item.
Congrats, on not only regurgitating stuff that was already well known, but necroing a thread that has been long dead. 

 
I love this build but be aware that you have to stop pumping Con and add at least a point of Int at level 28 to be able to grab the feat Student of the Athanaeum... you may as well hit Int again at level 30 to boost your reflex since an odd number on your Con don't really help you at capstone level?? Is there a way to rearrange stats to avoid this without sacrificing anything major?