6/10/2010 TD: "Little Changes, Big Results"

33 posts / 0 new
Last post
This thread is for discussion of this week's Top Decks, which goes live Thursday morning on magicthegathering.com.
I can imagine much more fun ways of winning.  The majority of them all include not spending 500-1000 dollars on a deck for standard.  I won't argue whether or not standard is healthy at that price or not.  But the sole fact that standard deck prices have almost doubled-tripled in the past year versus previous sets is solely based on horrible decisions from wizards.  You can make up all the number you want of Baneslayer would be just as rare if mythics didn't exist and I call BS.  Standard rares rarely went over 20-30 bucks before mythics.  Now we have rares hitting 80 dollars.  Congratulations Wizards.  You have sufficiently priced out people from playing what was supposed to be the main tournament format for constructed.
I like fun, but competitive decks. So I might not play what is optimal but they have normally been tested to have a 2/3 winrate.

Agreed - Standard is dead to me, I have been utterly priced out of the game - and I'm not a 'budget' player; I've shelled out for dual lands and Cryptic Commands and the like, the staples of the format in the past. But the current staples cost three times as much as they did two years ago, and guess what, my income hasn't increased three times over in that same period.

It's a good time to be playing standard, Mike tells us - only if money is literally no object to you. Mike, did you notice that EVERY decklist you featured today (except the 1st one, which has 2) featured 3 copies of Jace the Mind Sculptor? And have you noticed that Jace the Mind Sculptor costs over $70 per copy? Or that 4 of them played Gideon, who costs almost as much?

Have you also noticed that there are NO 'budget' alternatives for those cards? That's the real problem - in the past you had the painlands if you couldn't afford the 'better' dual lands. They did the same thing but did 1 damage to you. Or you had the taplands which came into play tapped. Is there a card that does the same job as Jace but can't be used the turn it comes into play? Or does 1 damage to you when you use it? Nope. (Ok, there was no budget Cryptic Command).

When Mythics were introduced, a lot of apologists said that regular 'chase' rares would be cheaper. Perhaps the fetches are a dollar or two cheaper than they would have been, but that saving has been utterly wiped out by the incredible cost of Jace, Vengevine and friends. Furthermore, Wiazrds has also been cunning in another way - maybe dual lands are a little cheaper, but M10, Zendikar and Worldwake all had brand new sets of rare dual/fetch lands, that's 3 sets in a row!! So dual lands are individually cheaper, but they're printing them in more sets, so ultimately there's no saving there either! (Fair play to Wizards, M11 is reprinting the M10 duals, that's something).

[Edit: and before someone points out that you can build a competitive Red deck for not very much, while I concede that is true it surely can't be right that anyone who can't afford an $800 deck (see post below) is forced to play one specific deck? As Mike's article points out, for those that can afford the chase cards Standard is indeed a varied and rich format - but if you don't have a very high disposable income you can only fling burn spells and attack with efficient Red creatures and like it. That's it.]

"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------
Just to give us a frame of reference I hopped over to the website of a well known secondary market retailer from Virginia and priced up Brian Kibler's deck. If we assume that you have all the commons you need the deck comes out at $865.29 (less shipping).
"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------

I wasn't aware that it had gotten that bad. Jesus christ.

For the sake of balance I looked up the other decks too (I should also point out that all these calculations are based on the cheapest prices at the aforementioned website, i.e. less than mint quality. If you want mint condition the costs would be slightly higher).

Let's assume the other Next Level Bant lists cost the same as Kibler's (they are pretty similar), so around $860.00

The Turbo Land deck is the budget option here, at just $436.86 (yes, that's "budget" if you want to play anything containing Blue these days).

Tasaki Ryo's Mythic Conscription comes to $664.81.

Patrick Dickmann's Mythic Conscription adds up to $844.90.

"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------
Jund wasn't that expensive when it was fully sleeved up, was it?  The land-base was rough, but I think the rest of the deck was passable.

Sure, that's still saying that the deck was probably $300, but compared to the $700 or so for the other decks it was more budget friendly.
PS:  I've been saying that Oracle of Mul Daya was an amazing card advantage machine since it was spoiled.  I'm in love with that thing and I'm glad to see it really get featured.  For green, its as close to Sylvan Library as we'll ever get, I think.
Jund wasn't that expensive when it was fully sleeved up, was it?  The land-base was rough, but I think the rest of the deck was passable.

Sure, that's still saying that the deck was probably $300, but compared to the $700 or so for the other decks it was more budget friendly.



Well, let's take a Jund deck at random shall we, one that's done well recently? How about Bradley Carpenter's from the Top 8 of GP Washington a few weeks ago.....

Total cost: $561.94 - What some people are forgetting is that the recent tech for Jund has really ramped the price - Sarkhan the Mad and Consuming Vapors really add on the $$$

However - I am nothing if not fair; in that same Top 8, Owen Turtenwald had a list totalling only $278.54, so I will concede that depending on your build, Jund MAY still be a budget option. There are a few important caveats to this though - 1) Jund is being edged out of the metagame, just look at GP Sendai - it made up a huge proportion of the field, a massive proportion, way more than double it's nearest competitor, but only had (I think) 2 slots in the Top 8, amongst a sea of W/U/G. 2) It will die a death soon - Pulse, Leech, Bloodbraid, Terminate, Thrinax, to name but 5 are going bye-bye in 4 months. 3) As mentioned before, the latest tech for this deck, Sarkhan etc, is really pushing the price up.
"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------
Jund wasn't that expensive when it was fully sleeved up, was it?  The land-base was rough, but I think the rest of the deck was passable.

Sure, that's still saying that the deck was probably $300, but compared to the $700 or so for the other decks it was more budget friendly.



$300 is not bad.  I think most decks were around $300 back when ravnica was around.  Im picking ravnica simply because it was the last set packed with chase rares namely the ravnica duals.  Those duals were at the time according the fanbois who run this math...nearly identical in rarity like 1/18 to the current mythics 1/20.  Yet there prices where $20 at my local store yet mythics hit $80. 

I don't mind paying $300 for a deck.  Especially one that had the staying power of Jund.  The negative to all this comes when your basically priced into a deck.  If you dont have $800 play jund or else.  If you can't scrounge up $300?  Welcome to the world of RDW.  Thats basically it to be competitive. Thanks to Wizards The overhyped pricing of Mythcs and the Mythic idea in general have priced most people into those decks.  Being forced into a deck should not be happening.
I like fun, but competitive decks. So I might not play what is optimal but they have normally been tested to have a 2/3 winrate.
I wish the prices would max out at 30 dollars per a single T2-legal card as it was in the past, but still I don't like that so many people are quoting the price for an entire deck. I know 800 bucks is a sick amount, but if someone plays any limited or opens some product (in the US the booster boxes are so cheap, too!), he surely owns at least something. The true cost of a deck for an active Magic player is not 800, albeit it can still be about 500, which I admit is still pretty much.

If on the other hand you don't spend money for anything else than a Standard deck by buying the singles, $800 is not that bad for a two year time period. I know people won't play the exact 75 for two years, but they can trade/sell the cards they won't need any longer, as it seems the value of chase mythics won't drop at least for as long as they are standard legal. If you want to own everything and never sell or trade cards away, well that is called collecting and it will cost money. Most rants I hear are from people who just want to play any deck they think has the best chance to win the tournament, and I think it is doable without using a single-shot 800 dollars.

Loaning a few cards shouldn't be a problem either, especially since not everyone of your friends can attend the same tournaments so they'll likely loan you some of their cards.
Padish, you make some valid points, but I must make some responses:

1) Playing Limited definitely helps, this is true, but it is absolutely no guarantee - I play Limited every week, sometimes multiple times per week, and I do fairly well, but I own no Jaces, no Gideons, a single Vengevine, no Elspeths, a single Sarkhan, etc etc. In fact, this brings to light another problem with Jace, and to some extent Vengevine and Gideon - Jace was from a small set, and because of the strange structure of Zendikar block was opened in Limited formats fo a very short period of time. Gideon and Vengevine are in a big set, but are in the last set of the block. These things contribute hugely to the shortage of supply, and thus the high price.

2) "In the US, the booster boxes are cheap too!" Fair enough, but y'know, a lot of us don't live in the States? I have played competitive Magic in the UK and in Australia and can confirm that prices are relatively higher in those countries than the US. Take Misty Rainforest as an example - maybe $10 or $11 dollars in the US? In the UK it's around the equivalent of $15 US, somewhere around 40-50% higher. A ROE booster box around $90 in the States? A box in Australia costs the equivalent of around $120 American.

3) "If you want to own everything and never sell or trade cards away, well that is called collecting and it will cost money" - Have you ever tried trading for a Jace? It's practically a running joke here - first time someone walked into the store and asked "hey, anyone got a Jace for trade?" everyone in there literally burst out laughing. Because they are so scarce and valuable it is very hard to trade for them - if you do you generally end up having to accept a very lopsided trade, so it ends up costing even more, effectively.
"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------

Yeah, I live in Europe myself. When I buy a box, I pay 120 euros (144 dollars at the moment, converted with google). I was just assuming most people here are US residents.


When people play limited, they at least get a decent amount of rares (mostly lands at the moment) they will need in their constructed decks, and that helps somewhat. And of course the lucky mythic opening will happen every now and then. I guess I should have said that the 800 dollars needed for a deck will be paid during a long time period. No one should need to waste that much at a single time, as they likely have something themselves and can also borrow a few cards.


What comes to trading for Jaces, many online retailers have buy lists with decent buy prices, and they often include all sorts of older casual stuff and whatnot. While you can't get a Jace from other people, I've found these retailers quite useful. (I know I don't get the full value, but what the heck was I doing with those Doubling Seasons anyway?)

Yup, I think we agree about things generally Padish, and I absolutely take your point about people rarely having to pay for a deck all at once, but I do still think you are overestimating the Limited aspect - I've known people who have busted multiple boxes and opened neither a single Gideon nor a single Vengevine, so if they can open 72+ boosters, how long must it take a drafter to get a set of either?

As for your comment on online retailers, I will have to take this at face value - I have never tried this approach so cannot comment - if it works as well as you imply then that's fantastic. My only concern is that the trades will be even more lopsided than "real life" trades - if you trade $80 worth of cards for a $50 card, you are far worse off than if you had just bought it for $50.

When it comes to the Jaces, Gideons, Elspeths and Vengevines of this world, it is totally and utterly a seller's market - prices are unlike anything we have seen before (Tarmogoyf was but a single card remember, not like the multiple $50+ cards of today), so I can't help but feel that any trading completely screws the peron "trading up". This means that although the Limited player will be opening "a decent amount of rares", a lot of the value of the cards he opens will be lost to entropy when he trades up for the chase mythics.
"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------
I agree with the sentiment. Its a shame because it probably would be a great time to be playing standard, if it weren't for the unprecedented cost.

The UK secondary markets are a little pricier than the US, and at one of the most popular second hand sites the prices for the "big five" (Jace, Gideon, Elspeth, Baneslayer and Vengevine) are respectively £57.50, £45, £35, £40 and £30. That's about $80, $65, $50, $60 and $45.

The apologists are very quick to point out that other prices have fallen, and I agree that at the bottom end you find cards for £1 which might otherwise have been, say, £2. But that isn't the point. Trying to get hold of the top-end cards is just a painful, expensive and unrewarding process. And this is from someone who has happily been trading for, paying for and playing cards since The Dark. As someone posted here, asking for a Jace for trade is just a running joke. The scarcity is such that you'd have to be impossibly lucky or spend all your time playing limited to hve your "fifth" Jace for your trade folder.

Standard isn't completely out of my reach - but it has sufficiently costed out enough options for me to have lost the desire to claim what portion of it that I am able. If the accessability of standard has any long-term role to play in the future of Magic, then this is surely an own-goal.
Unfortunately when you start talking prices you have to add in the caveat: The reason these decks are so expensive is because people are WILLING to pay that price for those cards. 
The reason these decks are so expensive is because people are WILLING to pay that price for those cards. 

Which comes from the perception of Mythic Rare being somehow significantly more rare than regular-rares were a few years ago.
Mythic rarity is a bullet-point on a Marketing powerpoint file somewhere, and serves little other purpose.

Jund wasn't that expensive when it was fully sleeved up, was it?  The land-base was rough, but I think the rest of the deck was passable.

Sure, that's still saying that the deck was probably $300, but compared to the $700 or so for the other decks it was more budget friendly.



Well, let's take a Jund deck at random shall we, one that's done well recently? How about Bradley Carpenter's from the Top 8 of GP Washington a few weeks ago.....

Total cost: $561.94 - What some people are forgetting is that the recent tech for Jund has really ramped the price - Sarkhan the Mad and Consuming Vapors really add on the $$$

However - I am nothing if not fair; in that same Top 8, Owen Turtenwald had a list totalling only $278.54, so I will concede that depending on your build, Jund MAY still be a budget option. There are a few important caveats to this though - 1) Jund is being edged out of the metagame, just look at GP Sendai - it made up a huge proportion of the field, a massive proportion, way more than double it's nearest competitor, but only had (I think) 2 slots in the Top 8, amongst a sea of W/U/G. 2) It will die a death soon - Pulse, Leech, Bloodbraid, Terminate, Thrinax, to name but 5 are going bye-bye in 4 months. 3) As mentioned before, the latest tech for this deck, Sarkhan etc, is really pushing the price up.



Jund is not getting edged out of the field.  It will go away when Alara rotates, but until then it will still the Standard's dominant deck.

I wish we could have one topdecks discussion without one guy bitching about prices in every thread.  Seriously, go complain in the 2 million other threads out there.  I had sympathetic ears at one point, but I'm tired of people spouting off the same old ****  in every thread.  Here's a hint: No one cares about your opinion.  Yes, we know decks are expensive, you don't have to point this out at EVERY opportunity. 

I wish we could have one topdecks discussion without one guy bitching about prices in every thread.  Seriously, go complain in the 2 million other threads out there.  I had sympathetic ears at one point, but I'm tired of people spouting off the same old ****  in every thread.



Let me quote you:


No one cares about your opinion.


Which comes from the perception of Mythic Rare being somehow significantly more rare than regular-rares were a few years ago.



That's because they really are, by the math.  The rare sheet contains 2:1 regular rare to mythic.  That means in perfect distribution, your chance of busting a specific mythic out of a single store bought pack is 1 in 121 for a large set.  That rate hasn't been seen since Ice Age era. 

Small set?  1 in 88.  The same rate as pulling a Reflecting Pool out of a pack of Shadowmoor.  Your small set mythic equals a big set rare in recent printings.

Combined with the fact that the rares are twice as common (thus causing a sharp decline in rare values) fewer boxes are getting opened due to the insanely fast EV drop.  This causes the rift we see today : spiked high mythic prices, depressed rare values. 

M10's short print and Baneslayer's high value caused the perfect key to open the gate for $40+ mythics.  Once vendors found out people were willing to pay that much, coupled with the unwillingness to miss the next 'big mythic', every chase mythic got there afterward.  Now we're staring at a very scary Standard next year.

IMO, mythics shouldn't have passed the $30 mark.  This is coming from someone with 3 Jace2's.  *I* don't like that they're $60+.  I can't trade them off or trade for them without feeling ripped off.

Which comes from the perception of Mythic Rare being somehow significantly more rare than regular-rares were a few years ago.



That's because they really are, by the math. 


www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.a...
The important discovery for us was that we could add in a new level of rarity without having to print cards at a higher rarity than we already print. The best way to explain this is to just show the old and new system side by side. The rarity of the set on the left is equal to the new rarity listed on the right.










Old SystemNew System
Tenth Edition RareMythic Rare, Large Set
Shadowmoor RareMythic Rare, Small Set
Future Sight RareRare, Large Set
Planar Chaos RareRare, Small Set


 (Ok, there was no budget Cryptic Command).



Yes there was. It was by far weaker, and you didn't have all the options, but it was still "Counter and Draw" (no bounce or tap your opponent out though).
Dream Fracture

Orzhova Witness

Restarting Quotes Block
58086748 wrote:
58335208 wrote:
Disregard women acquire chase rares.
There are a lot of dudes for whom this is not optional.
97820278 wrote:
144532521 wrote:
How;s a 2 drop 1/2, Flying broken? What am I missing?
You're missing it because *turns Storm Crows sideways* all your base are belong to Chuck Norris and every other overused meme ever.
And as a counterpoint to Qmark's argument, I present the current (and rising) $80 price tag on Jace, the Mind Sculpter.

Face reality - Something is seriously wrong, and Mythics are a very big problem.  Saying "It's the same!  Really!" does not change reality, and here in reality, Jace is $80.  If it's not scarcity, it's something else, and it actually doesn't matter what the precise cause is - It's a PROBLEM.  It's a problem that can't be corrected from the outside, changes need to be made on the inside.

Wizards is losing players to the Mythic problem.  I know this, because I've watched people quit because of it.

R&D has chosen to ignore the problem.  That's fine, that's their choice.  It's a bad choice, and the game suffers for it, but it is their choice.

Which comes from the perception of Mythic Rare being somehow significantly more rare than regular-rares were a few years ago.



That's because they really are, by the math. 


www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.a...
The important discovery for us was that we could add in a new level of rarity without having to print cards at a higher rarity than we already print. The best way to explain this is to just show the old and new system side by side. The rarity of the set on the left is equal to the new rarity listed on the right.










Old SystemNew System
Tenth Edition RareMythic Rare, Large Set
Shadowmoor RareMythic Rare, Small Set
Future Sight RareRare, Large Set
Planar Chaos RareRare, Small Set




Care to elaborate on exactly waht this is telling me?

Orzhova Witness

Restarting Quotes Block
58086748 wrote:
58335208 wrote:
Disregard women acquire chase rares.
There are a lot of dudes for whom this is not optional.
97820278 wrote:
144532521 wrote:
How;s a 2 drop 1/2, Flying broken? What am I missing?
You're missing it because *turns Storm Crows sideways* all your base are belong to Chuck Norris and every other overused meme ever.
He's trying to argue that Jace is precisely as rare as (say) Mythic Mystic Gate.  i.e., the number of Jaces in N packs of Worldwake is the same as the number of Mystic Gates in N packs of Shadowmoor.  As we all know, shortly after Mystic Gate hit $80, its price began to drop back down, so we can expect the same thing of Jace's price.

Wait, no, that's not what happened.

The reality is, yes, there are the same number of Jaces in N packs of Worldwake as there were Mystic Gates in N packs of Shadowmoor.  The inequality comes from other places:

1. Shadowmoor draft was SH-SH-SH.  Worldwake draft was Z-Z-W.  So the number of Jaces on the market from drafts is one third the number of Mystic Gates on the market from drafts.

2. The mean value of a Shadowmoor pack was not great, but it wasn't super low.  With Worldwake and RoE, it's significantly lower.  Additionally, the median value is well below the mean value, meaning if you don't open a Mythic, the return for opening a pack is absolutely awful.  Since opening packs of Worldwake and RoE is basically a miserable experience if you're hoping for value, no one is opening them.  Fewer Jaces on the market as a result.

3. Shadowmoor draft eventually turned into SH-SH-EV draft.  Worldwake draft, on the other hand, turned into RoE-RoE-RoE drafts.  Fewer Jaces on the market as a result.

These factors all share a few common elements:

1. They are predictable.  R&D both could have and should have known these things were likely.

2. They are preventable.  R&D could easily have made changes to their plans to avoid aggravating the problem.

3. They are repeatable.  R&D can and should learn from these events.  But, since no one in R&D has commented about learning from these mistakes, and taking steps to avoid them in the future, we must assume they have not done these things.

Jace's secondary market value is high, and will likely continue to rise.  General predictions put the ceiling around $100.  I think the ceiling is actually significantly higher than that, since the only point at which the price must stop rising is where it becomes profitable to crack boxes for Jaces.  Approximately four Mythics per box, ten Mythics in the set, that's...  *back of napkin math* Two and a half boxes per Jace?  So that's around $200 before it becomes profitable to increase supply just by ordering and cracking boxes.  That's the ceiling.

I'd love to hear someone in R&D say the magic words - "We screwed it up.  Sorry."
Care to elaborate on exactly waht this is telling me?

By "the math", a M10 mythic is allegedly as "rare" as a 10E rare.  Of course, that's "MaRo Math" from the time period they were trying to 'sell' us on the Mythic idea, so make of it what you will.

Wizards is losing players to the Mythic problem.  I know this, because I've watched people quit because of it.

Of course it is.  It's simple and direct market manipulation, and it's backfiring spectacularly, almost exactly as a handful of forum cynics predicted.
R&D has chosen to ignore the problem.  That's fine, that's their choice.  It's a bad choice, and the game suffers for it, but it is their choice.

Magic has had a longstanding theme of R&D being completely infallible, at least for two years.  Then, and only then, does R&D open acknowledge its mistakes.
The only notable exceptions are Academy, Skullclamp, and that rough transition from MD5 to Kamigawa when nobody was significantly buying any new cards up until the Affinity core was castrated.

@Faisdjas - Nobody cares about my opinion? I'm certain nobody cares about it more than they care about anyone else's, but people here are responding to and debating the points I made (including yourself when you mentioned Jund's metagame position), so y'know.... If you personally are bored of this debate, that's fair enough- just ignore it!! Why the need to try to stop other people talking about it? You're not interested, ignore it!

Furthermore, you seem to want to dismiss the issue of expensive decks, but doesn't the fact that, in your own words, there are "2 million other threads" about this suggest that just maybe it is a serious and ongoing issue to a lot of people? The fact is that however much Wizards wants it to, the issue of mythics/expense in general is not going away - as long as there are multiple type 2 staple cards going for unprecedented prices and the issue is not being actively addressed by Wizards (anyone seen an article by an R&D member that specifically tackles the $80 price tag or ubiquity of Jace 2.0?), then why shouldn't people continue to express their concerns over it?

As far as Jund goes, funnily enough it's a good example of what we're talking about - it's still the most dominant in terms of numbers, but that is because it's still the cheapest 'good' deck to build. Look at the GP Sendai results - Jund was massively, overwhelmingly the most played deck, but had only 2 slots in the top 8, which was otherwise awash with W/U/G (the expensive decks). Next Level Bant made up 1% of the field, but had as many top 8 slots as Jund, go figure.

"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------
The worst part is the Jace is poised to do nothing but go up in price. Due to the fact that the only thing thats really keeping Jund, the only 'budget' deck, around is that cascade is really stupid good(funny that it used to be called OP and now its sort of a saving grace for a lot of players). When the cycle happens losing bloodbraid, blightning, mealstrom pulse etc as good means of dealing with plainswalkers means we are left with basically bolt and vengevine(also $40+) atm. So with less ways to deal with them they gain even more power and price goes up even more. If the trend continues the way its going i can see it alienating a lot of players. This is the same problem that people had with legacy and the reserved list. Except in this case the 'reserved list' contains the played mythics and plainswalkers. Maybe they will print a solution in the first set of the next block. Heres hoping.
Care to elaborate on exactly waht this is telling me?


By "the math", a M10 mythic is allegedly as "rare" as a 10E rare.  Of course, that's "MaRo Math" from the time period they were trying to 'sell' us on the Mythic idea, so make of it what you will.


Oh, that's why Cho-Manno, Revolutionary was $30! I get it now.
In all actuality, it is one fourth the price of a Godsire. Go figure.

Orzhova Witness

Restarting Quotes Block
58086748 wrote:
58335208 wrote:
Disregard women acquire chase rares.
There are a lot of dudes for whom this is not optional.
97820278 wrote:
144532521 wrote:
How;s a 2 drop 1/2, Flying broken? What am I missing?
You're missing it because *turns Storm Crows sideways* all your base are belong to Chuck Norris and every other overused meme ever.
Oh, that's why Cho-Manno, Revolutionary was $30! I get it now.
In all actuality, it is one fourth the price of a Godsire. Go figure.

And Farmstead is just as rare as Underground Sea!

It is amazing to me that none of the whining and complaining take any of the BoaB decks out for a spin.  Seriously, there is some very innovative decks in that thread.  Try the Pyromancers ascension deck out. 

Of course they'll need to be modified.  Game one though?  CRUSH!  No need for anthing but 3 time warps, 4 lightning bolts and 4 pyromancers ascension.  Not exactly high costs. What's that about a $30 for a functional deck that literally is awesome in game one.

Most of the complaints on this thread really boil down to one fact:
Current sets have cards in them that are good in older formats. 

Wow!  Know how many people play only EXTERNAL formats?  LOTS & LOTS.  They buy the cards they need or want to add to their decks. 
Know how many player only play EDH?  LOTS & LOTS.  They too only buy cards they need or want for a deck. 

Consequently, Constructed is now competing for the same pool of cards that ALL formats want.

Blam! High prices.
Time Warp isn't really an option. Especially on Magic Online it's getting very expensive. You can't make a good budget deck with mythic rares; as soon as the deck is recognized as 'good', prices will soar and it's no longer budget. Got to stick with rares.
Jund is not getting edged out of the field.  It will go away when Alara rotates, but until then it will still the Standard's dominant deck.


(sic)

Out of curiosity I just hopped over to the deck database at Starcity Games and searched for all decks that made top 8 in Standard tournaments since the release of Worldwake (and therefore Jace TMS). When I say Jund is being edged out of the metagame, I mean in terms of actual succesful, rather than total numbers.

Number of Jund decks that made Top 8? 195
Number of decks that made Top 8 and contained Jace? 360

Number of Jund decks that came first? 20
Number of decks that came first that contained Jace the Mind Sculptor? 57

Now, I know what you will say, Jund is only one deck whereas Jace is in several decks - well that's exactly my point. That's the problem with Jace, that it is utterly ubiquitous is multiple winning strategies. However, if you want to get more specific, Jund has had 20 1st places since Worldwake, Mythic Conscription, which did not even come about until Rise, has managed 22 in the same period.
"Personally, I believe $50 is the roof that someone will pay for a Standard card, Mythic or otherwise." - Ben Bleiweiss, StarCity Games ----------------------------------------------------------