5/06/2010 FtL: "W Cubed"

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This thread is for discussion of this week's From the Lab, which goes live Thursday morning on magicthegathering.com.
Doesn't using Mirrorweave, targetting a creature-fied Gideon Jura, turn all creatures into 6/6's with Planeswalker - Gideon as types and so they all go poof?
In the second paragraph he says to Mirroweave them into Quicksilver Elementals and then copy Gideon's abilities, this doesn't actually give them the creature type it just copies the creatures abilities. Also, I call into question where he says that if you target a non-legendary Gideon in soldier form all creatures will become (un-animated) Gideon Jura's. Wouldn't they all be copies of the Animated Gideon? As for them gaining the creature type Planeswalker - Gideon, when he is animated it says his creature type is a Human Soldier... nothing legendary there... at EOT they won't revert back to Planeswalker cards because Mirrorweave falls off at the same time as the activation of Gideon does... I think I am confused.... Undecided
In the second paragraph he says to Mirroweave them into Quicksilver Elementals and then copy Gideon's abilities, this doesn't actually give them the creature type it just copies the creatures abilities. Also, I call into question where he says that if you target a non-legendary Gideon in soldier form all creatures will become (un-animated) Gideon Jura's. Wouldn't they all be copies of the Animated Gideon? As for them gaining the creature type Planeswalker - Gideon, when he is animated it says his creature type is a Human Soldier... nothing legendary there... at EOT they won't revert back to Planeswalker cards because Mirrorweave falls off at the same time as the activation of Gideon does... I think I am confused....



There's some rather confusing layering going on here, but it works the way that Noel says. Firstly, a copy effect only references a card's printed text; it doesn't care about temporary effects like Gideon's third ability. So Mirrorweave turns all other creatures into normal, unanimated Gideon Juras. Secondly, Planeswalker is not a creature type, but a full-fledged card type, like Creature. (So an animated Gideon would have the type line "Creature - Human Soldier, Planeswalker - Gideon.") There is a special rule, similar to the legend rule, that says when multiple planeswalkers with the same planeswalker type are in play, they are all sent to the graveyard as a state-based effect. Since Mirrorweave gives every creature "Planeswalker - Gideon," all creatures (including the original Gideon) go to the graveyard.
"An even deadlier board sweeper than All is Dust"?  How about "no".  All is Dust gets enchantments, this doesn't.  This does get non-Esper artifact creatures and Eldrazi, unlike Dust, but on the average every enchantment in the game's history (plus Esper artifacts like Scourglass and Time Sieve) totals more potency, methinks, than every colorless creature.  Moat alone will render every Eldrazi other than Emrakul and the vast majority of artifact creatures useless, so I'd much rather have Dust.  Not that the combo isn't cute, I'm just cutting the hyperbole.

Secondly, Planeswalker is not a creature type, but a full-fledged card type, like Creature. (So an animated Gideon would have the type line "Creature - Human Soldier, Planeswalker - Gideon.")



Actually the way they write typelines now, he would be "Planeswalker Creature - Gideon Human Soldier" or something to that effect, but your version is better and I kinda wish they'd start printing cards that way.  (EG Obsidian Battle-Axe would be "Artifact - Equipment, Tribal - Warrior.")  It looks cooler the way it is, but there is potential confusion that I think isn't worth it.
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Noel didn't mention it in his article but the first thing I noticed in his last decklist was the two copies of Mistmeadow Witch, blinking a animated Gideon to get his loyalty back to 6 seems like a nice backup to have. Also both a tap and untap ability for the Elemental to copy… there is a lot of stuff you can do with that decklist, so: good job, Noel!

I really want to make a Sarkhan the Mad deck that uses a ton of guys like Ravenous Rats and Rotting Rats and such.  Little guys with useful CiP triggers (EtB triggers?).

Sure, they start off annoying, generating incremental card advantage.  Sure, they may be too small for the late game.  But, who cares?  They are secrently Dragons in Disguise!  heh...
They changed the planeswalker loyalty counters rule?  Thats no fun.  So now I can't Kraj copy an animated planeswalker and then add loyalty whenever I want?  Booooo.
But the best thing to do with Mirrorweave is to make a team of 6/6 creatures that don't take damage. First, build up a bunch of creatures (with some help from Kinsbaile BorderguardPatrol Signaler, and Cloudgoat Ranger). Next, Mirrorweave everything into Quicksilver Elementals. Then activate Gideon's 0 ability, and have your Quicksilver Elementals copy his abilities for  each. They can each use his third ability once for free, and presto! You have an army of undamageable 6/6 creatures for a turn. Your opponents' creatures, meanwhile, will be stuck as ordinary Quicksilver Elementals—they can't use Gideon's abilities, because it's still your turn.


Wouldn't it be more efficient to just do it this way?
>Solderfy Gideon for 0
>Pay to give Quicksilver Elemental all of Gideon's abilities
>Cast Mirrorweave to make every creature a 3/4 with Gideon's abilities
>Activate Gideon's ultimate on all of your guys to make them 6/6s that can't receive damage

That way you don't have to pay absurd amounts of blue mana and your opponents still can't do the same because--even though they all have Gideon's abilities--it's not their turn.
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But the best thing to do with Mirrorweave is to make a team of 6/6 creatures that don't take damage. First, build up a bunch of creatures (with some help from Kinsbaile BorderguardPatrol Signaler, and Cloudgoat Ranger). Next, Mirrorweave everything into Quicksilver Elementals. Then activate Gideon's 0 ability, and have your Quicksilver Elementals copy his abilities for  each. They can each use his third ability once for free, and presto! You have an army of undamageable 6/6 creatures for a turn. Your opponents' creatures, meanwhile, will be stuck as ordinary Quicksilver Elementals—they can't use Gideon's abilities, because it's still your turn.


Wouldn't it be more efficient to just do it this way?
>Solderfy Gideon for 0
>Pay to give Quicksilver Elemental all of Gideon's abilities
>Cast Mirrorweave to make every creature a 3/4 with Gideon's abilities
>Activate Gideon's ultimate on all of your guys to make them 6/6s that can't receive damage

That way you don't have to pay absurd amounts of blue mana and your opponents still can't do the same because--even though they all have Gideon's abilities--it's not their turn.



The problem is that copy effects only copy the actual printed information on the card, so the Mirrorweave wouldn't give the creatures Gideon's abilities, because those abilities aren't actually printed on Quicksilver Elemental.

Mistmeadow Witch + Gideon isn't as cool as I originally thought it would be, because the only way to continually keep it going is for Gideon to only use his 6/6 ability (since he comes back in at end of turn, instead of immediately). Something like Momentary Blink, though, would let you attack with Gideon, Blink him, and then use a different ability in the same turn. Even better, comboing him with a recurrable bounce-a-permanent effect like Vedalken Mastermind would let you use his +2 ability and, after your opponent attacks Gideon, bounce him back to your hand to create a recurring fog.
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