Lord of the Pits: Ranger/Pit Fighter/Demigod

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I'd say you could afford to lose the farbond sword, but I know you like having a ranged attack with this build.

Thought about using one Subtle and one Battlecrazed weapon instead ?
Subtle is probably nice for sustained damage, and if you use Subtle in your off-hand, you will lose very little from your nova, as you have CA right away (3d6 - 6 = 4.5 per off-hand attack).

Money:
We buy a Ring of Free Time instead of a second Battlecrazed Bastardsword +6.
Now we need 2125k GP for the Subtle Bastardsword +6: 400k (left over) + 1300k (Farbond Spellblade +6 -> +5) + 425k (Drop Ring of Invisibility) = 2125k
There you go. ;)

It's actually -6 damage per attack with the off hand because I have Gaunlets of Destruction for brutal 1. The reason I wouldn't consider it is that CA as an isolationist Ranger is hard to come by barring burning up a power for it which makes it very situational outside a nova, and I do lose some hefty damage even within the nova (-48 damage dips me under Solo killer territory, plus I don't get CA until at least one attack lands, so it's actually -54).

Also, downgrading your Basic Ranged is a no-no: it's bad enough to be in a situation where you have to resort to Ranged combat. Making it worse by lowering your enhancement is just not an option.
OK, missed the Gauntlets.

And CA is IME still viable enough, from straight CA granters to prones, dazes and more. And your Battlecrazed weapon doesn't grant you anything, while Subtle works at least sometimes, and while not giving you back your Primeshot at least recovers some of the Called Shot damage should you need to resort to flanking.

And to be honest, if you have to resort to RBAs with a Farbond Spellblade, those Resist 5 all are IMO going to help you much more than a +1 hit / dmg, not speaking of the general use for the Ring of Free time.

Considering that you can make your first attack with Battlecrazed, that'd leave you at -48.
Although I thought you actually could use that minor action to easily make up for that damage. No extra attack and no buff, no item to activate ? Well, at least you could get adjacent yourself, without relying on allies or standing dangerously close for one round.

Personally I don't consider any damage numbers without accounting for hit/miss (or crit, on the good side) to be worth too much, so I wouldn't worry about a bit up and down there. As it is, you have to rely on allies anyway to get in constant hits alone, not even speaking of getting adjacent, etc. Then relying on allies to provide a +6 dmg buff for one round, or maybe doing at least 50 damage themselves sounds fair enough to me.
Especially if you consider the constant value a Ring of Free time has. But of course YMMV. ;)
I think you are going to want to reconsider the Boots of Eagerness.  If you were not aware, they got nerfed on 2/8 and no longer give you an extra minor action:

Boots of Eagerness

Your feet feel peppy in these handsome brocade boots.


Level: 9
Price: 4,200 gp
Item Slot: Feet


Power (Encounter): Minor Action. Use this power during your turn to take a move action.
Update (2/8/2010)
In the power, replace “Free Action” with “Minor Action.” In addition, delete “additional” from the power’s text. The item is intended to grant a move action, not a minor action. Some attack powers require only minor actions to use. This revision limits characters from using this item to acquire extra minor actions that can be used to make numerous attacks during a turn.
@langeweile: The problem with that hypothesis is that you assume I have another minor action attack left (I don't). Otherwise, a variant for that use would have been considered and added.

Also, I disagree with the point that Subtle is of greater general utility: I can induce the Bloodied state with my +1 Blood Fury Long Knife on an encounter basis, making the extra dice come into play. Not only that, but the regeneration afforded by Longtooth Shifting allows me to hover at or around Bloodied with a lesser risk than other characters, thus handing me a free +3d6 on every attack. This is the reason I have discarded other weapon enchantments such as Tyrant's Weapon (who actually offers +6d6 damage per hit, but only on nova turn) with Headsman's Chop, among other combos: Battlecrazed is the easiest to use round in and round out.

Remember that you don't operate in vacuum when building a nova; your allies want to see this hit as well. Additionally, this works as great complement to attack buffs that don't give +damage and are easy to hand out (Battle Captain's Inspiring Word, for example). You want as much overkill damage as you can anyway, though, because dice are soemwhat swingy.

@Necros99: I am aware of this change, but I still favor the power because it still provides action advantage on an encounter basis, though I'll probably look around and see if I can find a replacement that won't bust the bank.
First off, Thank you for your great guides.

I have two questions that might have been answered (sorry for not reading through 13 pages of comments for something as trivial as these).  At level 2, what happens to the Javelin that was purchased during character creation?  And at level 6 your long description says you are picking up Weapon Expertise when up top you are picking up Weapon Focus (weapon expertise is picked up later, at level 8 iirc).  Like I said, very trivial.
@Necros99: I am aware of this change, but I still favor the power because it still provides action advantage on an encounter basis, though I'll probably look around and see if I can find a replacement that won't bust the bank.



Three replacements I was considering are:  Dragonborn Greaves (L12), Battlestrider Greaves (L12), or Boots of Dancing (L7).
First off, Thank you for your great guides.

I have two questions that might have been answered (sorry for not reading through 13 pages of comments for something as trivial as these).  At level 2, what happens to the Javelin that was purchased during character creation?  And at level 6 your long description says you are picking up Weapon Expertise when up top you are picking up Weapon Focus (weapon expertise is picked up later, at level 8 iirc).  Like I said, very trivial.



At L2 and above, you are assumed to have all the mundane gear (like nonmagical weapons) you need, as per the DMG. So I have plenty of Javelins, it's just they needn't be mentioned. And thanks for the catch.

@Necros99: Thanks; I'll look into those.
JUst one question for you. That is an awful lot of cash to buy items with. Where did you come up with that figure from?

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71235715 wrote:
JUst one question for you. That is an awful lot of cash to buy items with. Where did you come up with that figure from?

Standard DMG rules for creating a character that isn't level 1. You get 3 free items, level+1, level, level-1, and enough cash to buy another level-1 item. Not sure who it was, but someone worked out the math for what a level 31 item would cost, and he took that as the gold value since there are no level 31 items. The total is something like ~14.2 million gold IIRC, and any "mundane" gear is free.
The figure I use were compiled by awaken_D_M_golem (though that thread is nearly 2 years old and lost to the back of the CharOp board), and he had 2 different ways of dealing with the "there's no L31 item" dilemma:

1. Use the standard gp progression to determine the worth of a L31 item and add the gp value.
2. Rule that you get 2 L30 items instead.

I went with assumption #2, since there was no real consensus as to which one would be correct (and I don't believe either is wrong to this day). Alcestis was dead on in the explanation, I just couldn't resist pulling the "back when I was a n00b..." reference.
And then you sold the granted items off, using the spare cash to buy multiple lower levels items? Just making sure I'm clear on how it was handled.

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71235715 wrote:
Pretty much what I did was compile the combined gp value of the items plus the gold you get and then use it as a lump sum to buy items with.
Okay. Thanks for the information.

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71235715 wrote:
Shall this build fall back on the Kensei, or shall it be declared obsolete?
Kinda sad to see this build die. My condolences LDB.
Favorite character I've ever played.  

So long, dear friend. 
Hellooooo Ruthless Punisher and Disciple of Divine Wrath!

Condolences, LDB. This build has always been the Canterbury Cathedral of this board.
I'll just leave this here...

Wizards seem determined to suck the fun out character building more with each errata  
That was a sucker-punch WOTC!
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.



Until July.
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.



Until July.


I don't think that'll get nerfed.  But we'll have the crash cart on stand-by.
Honestly, I'd consider Warpriest first, Ruthless Punisher and Avenger MC cheese second, and only third Kensei.

LDB taught me the value of the "mini nova" ages ago, and the more I get into the game the more valuable his advice has been. Pit Fighter is the single greatest PP of all time because it cranks both nova and static damage. Warpriest keeps the nova boost and has a ton of useful other effects. Ruthless Avenging adds the static modifier (much of the time) and offers a bit less sexy nova mechanic (OoE for 2 turns). Last in my eyes is Kensei and its flat, modest static modifier.

But YMMV. I do agree that Kensei is unlikely to get nerfed, unless every other striker build starts switching to it. 
Also also want to remind LDB that with follow up blow being once per round, the nova damage for this build was severly crippled.  The builds goal of having a solo killing nova turn is pretty much gone.  The build's still decent, but..yeah.
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.

Pit Fighter wasn't the only loss.  Follow-up Blow got the nerf bat, too.
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.

Pit Fighter wasn't the only loss.  Follow-up Blow got the nerf bat, too.

Yeah thanks I already posted that.

Honestly, I'd consider Warpriest first, Ruthless Punisher and Avenger MC cheese second, and only third Kensei. 
 



What is the deal with Ruthless Punisher + Avenger MC?  Does this somehow grant a way to get past the RP's humanoid limitations?

It seems to me that Kensei + Frost Cheese is a great way to go for melee characters.

I'm still trying to come up with a good replacement for my archer ranger|rogue who used Pit Fighter.  I can probably get away with going Darkstrider instead, but may need to switch my Hybrid Talent around.
Not a huge deal people.  He'll just change from Pit Fighter to Kensai.

Pit Fighter wasn't the only loss.  Follow-up Blow got the nerf bat, too.

Yeah thanks I already posted that.



I see that now.  Your post wasn't there yet when I started my reply.
*sheds tear*

Goodbye, my firstborn. I will miss you. The Str/Wis Ranger will live on, but you will no longer be part of it.

Expect a new thread with some other Str/Wis Ranger tricks, probably of a different outlook (Ranger/Pathfinder is still intact, after all). But this one has reached its end.
It was a fun ride while it lasted.


What is the deal with Ruthless Punisher + Avenger MC?  Does this somehow grant a way to get past the RP's humanoid limitations?



No. It's just that RP (with its limitations) does give a nice static modifier and, very importantly, it's actually a Ranger PP. Which leaves your MC slot free for something way more abusive than Battle Awareness (a nice feat in its own right). Oath of Enmity for two turns is absolutely tailor-made for an LDBesque approach to the melee ranger (emphasizing starting each encounter with a nova of some proportion). Which is pretty much the only right approach.

It seems to me that Kensei + Frost Cheese is a great way to go for melee characters.

I'm still trying to come up with a good replacement for my archer ranger|rogue who used Pit Fighter.  I can probably get away with going Darkstrider instead, but may need to switch my Hybrid Talent around.



Frost Cheese works for any PP, just about. The skill power Find Weakness is a real good nova boost of more recent vintage you may want to look at.

As for an archer Ranger|Rogue, that's a tough one. Getting your striker bonuses each round is a real challenge, I suspect.