Dragon 384 - Class Acts: Warlord

12 posts / 0 new
Last post
DnDi_Large.png      Dragon 384
Class Acts: Warlord

by Robert J. Schwalb

No one knows the battlefield better than the warlord. The warlord powers presented in this article speak to the warlord’s dynamic approach to combat, reflecting an awareness about his or her allies’ capabilities, their strengths, and their weaknesses.


Look friend, we ain’t got no fancy spells and there ain’t no gods lookin’ out fer the likes of you and me. We got these weapons, but we got something more too. We got each other. You get my back and I swear on my father’s beard I’ll get yours.


Talk about this article here.

384_ca_warlord.jpg


********


To start off the discussion, I'd like to point out that, since this article was originally set for later this month, it ties into Martial Power 2.  There are Melee and Ranged attacks here.

However, Warlords have no history of using Dexterity.  Even the Skirmishing Warlord, with plenty of ranged weapon powers, is based off of Strength, not Dexterity.  So that seems a bit odd.

Maybe that'll be errata'd out?  Or maybe future Warlord builds will key off of Dexterity?

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

IMAGE(http://images.onesite.com/community.wizards.com/user/marandahir/thumb/9ac5d970f3a59330212c73baffe4c556.png?v=90000)

A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

I like the granting of 2[w]and 3[w] melee or ranged strength or dex attacks.
I like the warlord melee or ranged attacks. 


the warlord strength or dex based attacks are. . . odd 
Currently, the only way anybody would take advantage of the Dex-keyed attacks would be Hunter Rangers MCing into Skirmishing Warlords, wanting to key their MC melee and ranged powers off of Dex rather than Str.

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

IMAGE(http://images.onesite.com/community.wizards.com/user/marandahir/thumb/9ac5d970f3a59330212c73baffe4c556.png?v=90000)

A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

Whats also odd are the level 1 and 9 daily powers which make on ally do 3W or 2 allies do 2W, the way its phrased its hard to tell if they are making the attack, or if you are.
There is a typo in the power "Destructive Strike".  The heading shows it as a level 1 power, but the stat block says it's a 9th level power.  I suspect based on it's position in the document it is supposed to be a level 1 power.

-Robert
Yeah, the Dex option is weird.  When we last saw the MP2 excerpts, the ranged Warlord was using Str for his ranged attacks.  I wonder if they changed it to Dex, or if it was originally Dex and this article never got updated when they changed it to Str.

As it stands, I agree it's kind of odd.  The only way someone would use them is, as Mar said, if they were a Dex-based class MCing into Warlord to grab one or two powers.  I don't like the idea that they would start purposefully designing powers in one class that are only there for multiclassers from a different class.  It dilutes the whole point of having classes.  If someone at WotC really wants to make an elven bow ranger that also has a few leaderish powers, they could just add the leaderish powers to the Ranger.  Most Rangers would still take high damage strikery powers, but I think it's fine to include one or two options that stray from the role.  Powers designed specifically for bow rangers and rogues don't need to be put under Warlord just because they're leadery.  That would be like making some high damage Sorcerer powers that key off Int instead of Cha, just so that Wizards who want to focus on damage can take them.  It would be better to just make them Wizard powers.
Yeah, the Dex option is weird.  When we last saw the MP2 excerpts, the ranged Warlord was using Str for his ranged attacks.  I wonder if they changed it to Dex, or if it was originally Dex and this article never got updated when they changed it to Str.

As it stands, I agree it's kind of odd.  The only way someone would use them is, as Mar said, if they were a Dex-based class MCing into Warlord to grab one or two powers.  I don't like the idea that they would start purposefully designing powers in one class that are only there for multiclassers from a different class.  It dilutes the whole point of having classes.  If someone at WotC really wants to make an elven bow ranger that also has a few leaderish powers, they could just add the leaderish powers to the Ranger.  Most Rangers would still take high damage strikery powers, but I think it's fine to include one or two options that stray from the role.  Powers designed specifically for bow rangers and rogues don't need to be put under Warlord just because they're leadery.  That would be like making some high damage Sorcerer powers that key off Int instead of Cha, just so that Wizards who want to focus on damage can take them.  It would be better to just make them Wizard powers.



Nope.  I have MP2, and the Ranged weapon attacks for Warlords are based off of Strength, with either Wisdom or Intelligence riders.

That's why this is so strange.

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

IMAGE(http://images.onesite.com/community.wizards.com/user/marandahir/thumb/9ac5d970f3a59330212c73baffe4c556.png?v=90000)

A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

I'm not sure if I'm seeing the same article that is being discussed. The three powers I see which have Strength or Dexterity-based attacks are powers which grant attacks to allies. That way, they can use Strength or Dexterity for their attacks. It's safe to guess that the intention is to have Strength for melee attacks and Dexterity for ranged attacks, but as written, rogues can use those powers to make melee attacks with Dexterity and Strength-based characters like fighters or wardens could use those powers to make ranged attacks with Strength. 
It appears the article was ninja-eratta'd.

Still, those powers that grant attacks are very unfriendly to the melee  classes that don't use strength or dex, such as the Avenger, Battlemind, Chaladin and Ardent.

It would have been perhaps better to instead grant a ranged or melee basic attack, except done additional dice of damage, such as the PP from the White Lotus article. That way thoe classes can atleast take advantage of the attack due to Weapon Training atleast.
They just changed it a few hours ago.  Originally all the powers let the Warlord use Str or Dex.
It appears the article was ninja-eratta'd.

Still, those powers that grant attacks are very unfriendly to the melee  classes that don't use strength or dex, such as the Avenger, Battlemind, Chaladin and Ardent.

It would have been perhaps better to instead grant a ranged or melee basic attack, except done additional dice of damage, such as the PP from the White Lotus article. That way those classes can at least take advantage of the attack due to Weapon Training at least.


The challenge is keeping the power descriptions concise. It's easier to say "Strength or Dexterity" than "the targets make a basic attack that does 2[W] extra damage". As an immediate problem, that breaks when you've got a wizard with Magic Missile or a sorcerer with Acid Orb, so now you need to change it to "a weapon basic attack". It interacts with powers, items, and feats that boost basic attacks, so the power actually becomes more powerful than it already is, rather than just becoming more versatile.


If you don't have a character in your party who can easily take advantage of the granted attacks, then you don't take the power. I think that allowing Strength or Dexterity for the attacks (melee or ranged) is a good compromise. Warlords work best with other martial classes in that regard.

Just replace "the target makes the following attack" with "The target shifts 2  squares and makes a basic attack. On a hit, if it is a weapon attack its does 2[w] extra damage, or if it is an implement attack it deals 2d8 extra damage" just like the white lotus article. This gets rid the whole extra power tacked on to the bottom of the 'main' power.

Note that the Warlord's Hail of Steel encounter power at level 17 simply has "and every ally within 5 squares of you makes a basic attack against the target." on its hit line, which is friendly to all classes (as long as they have a descent basic attack). Warlord powers that grant attacks do favour strength, but a party can easily adapt to him with weapon training. Strength and Dex is a silly comprimise that doesn't follow other warlord powers of similar theme.