Response to the Wotc Announcement!!!

Ok guys Wizos is killing the game.  We knew that was coming.

So here is how you can help your community and keep this thing going.  SWMGamers has looking into doing what the Decipher community did with the players committee.

So moving forward here is the plan we have made on Gamers and hope others will join and help.

Gamers is getting people to work together as a committee.

We have some folks lined up and lord knows they may need some help.

We are going to have people looking at designing virtual sets going forward.  Gamers will post these downloadble stats and give folks an idea of corresponding mini that would work.  If some customizers want to give instructions on how to make a cool custom of the character then awesome.

We will work hard going forward.

I have spoken to some of our maps guys and they will produce maps for the community going forward also.

Moses and I will continue to insure that Floor Rules and OP issues are handled to keep the game going.  Even if that means forming our own sanctioning body for the game (we assume this will be coming soon).  We will be looking into making a downloadable event reporting software. 

I ask the community to be patient and be helpful now more than ever.  If you have something to add dont sit around and think about offer the help.  If you can write and event reporting program because you have that skill.  Then step up and help us now the community needs it.

I fully expect these boards to recieve less and less attention because while the game was alive they kind of let us know where we stand.  So if you have not been to gamers get over there and help us.

As it stand now SWMGamers and Miniature Market will be running all the events at Gencon this year.  There will be no drop off in prize support or in number of events.

There will be Regionals this year also.  Gamers is already coordinating that and we have expanded the venues.  So please everyone keep your chins up.
team revan Collection: 801/801 SWM DCI Content Manager sith holonews network

Dean, It is awesome that you (and our community) are willing to step up and take on this challenge.  Not sure how long WOTC will still support us via DCI or if they will let us fade away (anybody know how long they supported DDM for DCI play).  Hopefully WOTC will help us make a smooth transition from one governing body (them) to another (ours) and our community will stay strong.

I will do anything I can to help.

Jason

I'd like to help out if I can, but Im confused about how the New Minis will be. I know it's still early, about 2 hours after the announcement, but I am confused. Will the new figures be figures that will have guides how to make out of your own plastic, or will we have rewriting of card texts like the SWCCGPC did? I'd like to remind that SWCCG wasn't legally able to make new cards right away; it was a few years before they could do anything but retext and recost. I'm sure more of what you said will clear of in time; even though I thought the end was probably MotF, I had hoped otherwise and though that the announcement would be after the set was released, so this is kind of a shock, even though it shouldn't be.

EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.
Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -
The cheapest part of any game is the ruleset.    With all the hundreds of star wars minatures already out there all you need to do is make new cards and post updated rule sets.


I just wish they made the AAT droid tank
EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.



There are plans to do both of these things, actually. I've already begun working on restatting, and have been at it since before Christmas.
I urge everyone who is interested in helping out travel to SWMGamers (plus, who knows how long WotC will keep this board around, lol)
Death to Star Wars Miniatures, Long live Star Wars Miniatures

That is too bad....We kinda saw it coming but still sad for gamers both RPGer's and Mini's Players.
I, for one, will continue to play and teach the game to my children and any friends that are interested. The game will not change for me. It is good to see that the community is rallying and trying to keep the game moving in verious ways. Keep up the great work!!!

Death to Star Wars Miniatures, Long live Star Wars Miniatures
Minis Mayham podcast www.d20radio.com Denver Star Wars Miniatures http://community.wizards.com/denverstarwarsminiatures
EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.



There are plans to do both of these things, actually. I've already begun working on restatting, and have been at it since before Christmas.



One of the thing that I hope doesn't happen, and the main reason I stopped playing with SWCCGPC's V-cards, is that the sets didn't just make the redone stuff playable or more fun; They made the redone stuff dominate, and completely destroyed the point of the draw phase in the process. The whole thing was about pulling out whatever you wanted from your deck, so much that there was hardly a point in shuffling (in a card game).
Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -

Personally, while I'm obviously sad to see the end of production for this game which has brought me so much enjoyment over the years, I'm still optimistic, because, as Dean said, the game will go on.  I've been keeping up with the various threads dealing with this over at Gamers, and what I read there is very encouraging.  Not only will SWM continue, but in some ways it will be better than ever!  So if you were planning or hoping to go to Gencon for SWM this year, then I strongly encourage you to still come!  It's going to be a BLAST! 


I'd like to help out if I can, but Im confused about how the New Minis will be. I know it's still early, about 2 hours after the announcement, but I am confused. Will the new figures be figures that will have guides how to make out of your own plastic, or will we have rewriting of card texts like the SWCCGPC did? I'd like to remind that SWCCG wasn't legally able to make new cards right away; it was a few years before they could do anything but retext and recost. I'm sure more of what you said will clear of in time; even though I thought the end was probably MotF, I had hoped otherwise and though that the announcement would be after the set was released, so this is kind of a shock, even though it shouldn't be.

EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.


There are a number of ways this could work:
1.  Re-cost them...RS Luke, Jedi Knight could now cost 20pts, rather than 27, for example. Keep his stats the same.
2.  Re-stat them (slight changes in stats, or in SAs/FPs/CEs), in order to bring them up to par with the current minis.  Basically, for example, give Twin Attack to CS Saesee Tiin, and he'll be a solid mini.  Keep his cost the same.
3.  Re-design them from the ground up, with new stats, abilities, and costs.

As Dean stated, Gamers has already for a while now had some work going in preparation for this event which we all sensed was on the horizon.  When it comes to re-designing/re-stating/re-costing the figs, there are a number of people at Gamers who will do an excellent job. 
Personally, while I'm obviously sad to see the end of production for this game which has brought me so much enjoyment over the years, I'm still optimistic, because, as Dean said, the game will go on.  I've been keeping up with the various threads dealing with this over at Gamers, and what I read there is very encouraging.  Not only will SWM continue, but in some ways it will be better than ever!  So if you were planning or hoping to go to Gencon for SWM this year, then I strongly encourage you to still come!  It's going to be a BLAST!

I'd like to help out if I can, but Im confused about how the New Minis will be. I know it's still early, about 2 hours after the announcement, but I am confused. Will the new figures be figures that will have guides how to make out of your own plastic, or will we have rewriting of card texts like the SWCCGPC did? I'd like to remind that SWCCG wasn't legally able to make new cards right away; it was a few years before they could do anything but retext and recost. I'm sure more of what you said will clear of in time; even though I thought the end was probably MotF, I had hoped otherwise and though that the announcement would be after the set was released, so this is kind of a shock, even though it shouldn't be.

EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.


There are a number of ways this could work:
1.  Re-cost them...RS Luke, Jedi Knight could now cost 20pts, rather than 27, for example. Keep his stats the same.
2.  Re-stat them (slight changes in stats, or in SAs/FPs/CEs), in order to bring them up to par with the current minis.  Basically, for example, give Twin Attack to CS Saesee Tiin, and he'll be a solid mini.  Keep his cost the same.
3.  Re-design them from the ground up, with new stats, abilities, and costs.

As Dean stated, Gamers has already for a while now had some work going in preparation for this event which we all sensed was on the horizon.  When it comes to re-designing/re-stating/re-costing the figs, there are a number of people at Gamers who will do an excellent job. 



I think I'd lean towards re-statting them.  Obviously that could differ from mini to mini.  However, there have been so many great abilities/fps introduced into this game, I'd like to see older minis have a few of them.  One that comes to mind is giving Yoda of Dagobah Levitate.  Heck, some of these new FPs would work great on a Luke (Dark Temptation anyone?) or such.
I agree with you (there are some great updates that should happen, and Levitate for Yoda of D is one of them), but I'm not sure it would need to happen for every mini that we address.  I'd think that the people doing the work would have to decide how to approach each mini.  "Should the Twilek Scoundrel stay at 7pts and receive some stat or SA upgrades/updates, or should we completely redesign this thing so that it perhaps now costs 13pts instead?"  That kind of discussion would have to happen quite often, I think.  In most cases, my thought would be that simpler is better, but I'm not one of the people doing the work, so I'll leave it to them.

I think I'd lean towards re-statting them.  Obviously that could differ from mini to mini.  However, there have been so many great abilities/fps introduced into this game, I'd like to see older minis have a few of them.  One that comes to mind is giving Yoda of Dagobah Levitate.  Heck, some of these new FPs would work great on a Luke (Dark Temptation anyone?) or such.



Heck yeah on the DT for Luke. As soon as I saw the ability I went back into the custom set stats I was working on a nd gave it to the Luke I had in there. He and Anakin are arguably the best fit for that ability flavor-wise.
Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -
I agree with you (there are some great updates that should happen, and Levitate for Yoda of D is one of them), but I'm not sure it would need to happen for every mini that we address.  I'd think that the people doing the work would have to decide how to approach each mini.  "Should the Twilek Scoundrel stay at 7pts and receive some stat or SA upgrades/updates, or should we completely redesign this thing so that it perhaps now costs 13pts instead?"  That kind of discussion would have to happen quite often, I think.  In most cases, my thought would be that simpler is better, but I'm not one of the people doing the work, so I'll leave it to them.



However, I'd like to see a little more community involvement than the SWCCGPC had. There's a lot of ways to do that, but I wonder how it would work if the leading member of the SWMPC decided what 10 minis or whatever would be redone in the next set, and then just open it up to all sorts of ideas from everyone, then the leaders taking what they like from that. it sound like dean is heading this all up with help from a lot of other big names, which I am grateful for. Not everyone will be happy with it, but like I said, I'd like to see it where the average player might see his or her idea on a re-do, rather than the SWCCPC that occasionally had a consultant outside of the elite circle.
Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -
I agree with you (there are some great updates that should happen, and Levitate for Yoda of D is one of them), but I'm not sure it would need to happen for every mini that we address.  I'd think that the people doing the work would have to decide how to approach each mini.  "Should the Twilek Scoundrel stay at 7pts and receive some stat or SA upgrades/updates, or should we completely redesign this thing so that it perhaps now costs 13pts instead?"  That kind of discussion would have to happen quite often, I think.  In most cases, my thought would be that simpler is better, but I'm not one of the people doing the work, so I'll leave it to them.



Yeah, that's why I think it would have to be on a mini by mini basis.  I'm certainly not going to worry as much over a Twilek Scoundrel as I would Luke of Dagobah (I'd love to give him a lightside equivalent of Emperor's Hand.  He should be able to spend his FPs and Yoda's on the same turn.)

I think I'd lean towards re-statting them.  Obviously that could differ from mini to mini.  However, there have been so many great abilities/fps introduced into this game, I'd like to see older minis have a few of them.  One that comes to mind is giving Yoda of Dagobah Levitate.  Heck, some of these new FPs would work great on a Luke (Dark Temptation anyone?) or such.



Heck yeah on the DT for Luke. As soon as I saw the ability I went back into the custom set stats I was working on a nd gave it to the Luke I had in there. He and Anakin are arguably the best fit for that ability flavor-wise.



SAs like Dark Temptation should not be limited to one mini.  The flavor of that FP fits well with Luke and Anakin.  You could even give Dispassionate Killer to a Vader or Malak.

This is a lot like a year ago.  Topps shutdown WizKids.  People jumped out of the game and EBay was flooded with figures.  Other groups tried to show the community support for the game to either entice an existing company to buy the product line or create a company to buy it to continue the game.


Yes, it took a year, but HeroClix is back – a new set came out in November (and sold better than prior sets) with a new booster set and starter pack due in April and May, respectively.  Many familiar faces are part of the new NECA/WizKids and have revived the game and are growing it.  NECA bought the HeroClix brandname and mechanics from Topps/WizKids and then had to get character licensing deals with Marvel and DC Comics.  Can there be a similar path here?  Will WotC sell the game mechanics to another company who would have to work with LucasFilm?


We should continue our support of the game.  We still have figures, stat cards, maps, etc to enjoy the game.  Do so.  We do have another set coming this Spring.  Buy it.


Maybe we can show enough financial and moral support to have another company try their hand at SWM.  Maybe we can create a new company to take on that challenge.  Either way, it will be a long road.  Acquisitions don’t happen overnight; especially when there is 3rd party licensing involved.


I'm open to being part of a new company to make a run at it.  You?  In what regard -- moral support, minor financial support for feasability and start-up, business advisor (legal, contacts in mfg for plastic figure production, sales rep, etc), or investor?

Well can i suggest 1 thing Dean, if you go ahead and do down loadable new custom cards with NEW RULES, can you please make sure that all the members on your designing team are not all DCI players.

If most are that's OK but please not all. Remember that playing at home using the rule YOU WIN BY DEFEATING ALL YOUR ENEMY is not the same sort of game that is played in DCI. Remember that not all of this community are DCI players and if you really want all of the community to be behind you on this, you might find it sits with members better  if all ( both DCI and non-DCI) player are been represented and being considered.

I live in the UK so that might  make it difficult for members like me to get involved because of time zones and things, but i am more than happy to do anything, if you feel i could be of help. I would very much like to be involved if i can help.
i love the idea of virtual sets and as a customizer i am always willing to help and to give oppinions if anyone wants it. One thing i would like to see for a first virtual set is from bloomilk. Shinja is doing a custom set contest and it would be interesting if the winner of the contests creation was the first set out. Just a little food for thought to keep the game going with new sets while others are configured.

Personally, while I'm obviously sad to see the end of production for this game which has brought me so much enjoyment over the years, I'm still optimistic, because, as Dean said, the game will go on.  I've been keeping up with the various threads dealing with this over at Gamers, and what I read there is very encouraging.  Not only will SWM continue, but in some ways it will be better than ever!  So if you were planning or hoping to go to Gencon for SWM this year, then I strongly encourage you to still come!  It's going to be a BLAST! 


I'd like to help out if I can, but Im confused about how the New Minis will be. I know it's still early, about 2 hours after the announcement, but I am confused. Will the new figures be figures that will have guides how to make out of your own plastic, or will we have rewriting of card texts like the SWCCGPC did? I'd like to remind that SWCCG wasn't legally able to make new cards right away; it was a few years before they could do anything but retext and recost. I'm sure more of what you said will clear of in time; even though I thought the end was probably MotF, I had hoped otherwise and though that the announcement would be after the set was released, so this is kind of a shock, even though it shouldn't be.

EDIT: NVM, I see what it is. A new luke's card for example, that you can use with Luke, Rebel's mini. One thing that I think could work as well, that might be simpler in some ways, is just restatting that luke, completely, and still be able to use the original if you want (specify before game start of course) That way, any legal issues with using names may be avoided.


There are a number of ways this could work:
1.  Re-cost them...RS Luke, Jedi Knight could now cost 20pts, rather than 27, for example. Keep his stats the same.
2.  Re-stat them (slight changes in stats, or in SAs/FPs/CEs), in order to bring them up to par with the current minis.  Basically, for example, give Twin Attack to CS Saesee Tiin, and he'll be a solid mini.  Keep his cost the same.
3.  Re-design them from the ground up, with new stats, abilities, and costs.

As Dean stated, Gamers has already for a while now had some work going in preparation for this event which we all sensed was on the horizon.  When it comes to re-designing/re-stating/re-costing the figs, there are a number of people at Gamers who will do an excellent job. 



I am in favour of option 1 as the simplest and most viable way to finally  balance the set so every piece is a viable choice when choosing units for play.  All you need to do is put a sticker over the old price and voila done.  When I found out Rob didn't even do the costing (the most important stat for a piece) this Magic designer Mon did I was dismayed.  I've been calling for old pieces to be recosted since Universe.  But stat recosting back then would have been pointless/redundant because of Power Creep.  Now that the game is finally complete, recosting can be done to balance play and correct all of the overcosting/undercosting.  I have always thought that any piece is worth putting in a squad if it's price for the right price.

Option 2 is very ambitous but I think it will be difficult to get everyone to agree.

Option 3 is an even more abitious version of option 2 but might be easier for people to either take or leave.  Very similar to TLT set that was put together a few years ago.

I also have another idea that was outlined in the Ultimate Mission books where players can customize stats/abilities according to a stat  price list.  Want more Defence? pay a bit more.  Want an SA added?, pay a bit more.  Want less Attack for a combine fire piece?, pay a bit less.
Revamp for the sake of revamp? That always works out well.
I am in favour of option 1 as the simplest and most viable way to finally  balance the set so every piece is a viable choice when choosing units for play.  All you need to do is put a sticker over the old price and voila done.  When I found out Rob didn't even do the costing (the most important stat for a piece) this Magic designer Mon did I was dismayed.  I've been calling for old pieces to be recosted since Universe.  But stat recosting back then would have been pointless/redundant because of Power Creep.  Now that the game is finally complete, recosting can be done to balance play and correct all of the overcosting/undercosting.  I have always thought that any piece is worth putting in a squad if it's price for the right price.



I really like this idea. Like, I don't even play competitively, but I would appreciate this so much. Last week, I accidentally crushed my son's CS Jango squad, all because I was using newer pieces. An across-the-board recosting would really help everyone, even those of us who only play at home. Smile

72ccb3a99f297b7624ecac31e26f7921.png?v=33480
Star Wars: Tapestry
 - a play-by-post campaign for everyone... good OR evil!

I am in favour of option 1 as the simplest and most viable way to finally  balance the set so every piece is a viable choice when choosing units for play.  All you need to do is put a sticker over the old price and voila done.  When I found out Rob didn't even do the costing (the most important stat for a piece) this Magic designer Mon did I was dismayed.  I've been calling for old pieces to be recosted since Universe.  But stat recosting back then would have been pointless/redundant because of Power Creep.  Now that the game is finally complete, recosting can be done to balance play and correct all of the overcosting/undercosting.  I have always thought that any piece is worth putting in a squad if it's price for the right price.



I really like this idea. Like, I don't even play competitively, but I would appreciate this so much. Last week, I accidentally crushed my son's CS Jango squad, all because I was using newer pieces. An across-the-board recosting would really help everyone, even those of us who only play at home.



I agree, this would certanily make up for a number of the early sets many short comings, and allow a vast array of preexisting pieces to find use, with slight adjsutments to point costs. A bigo ne that comes to mind is the RS Boba Fett,  when RS and CS were all that was avalable he was worth half you squad, but now, he's not worth the quarter cost of a 200 point army.
Best gaming community in the world. My collection is proof. 2009 SWM RAC member 795 Club member Over 75 Good trades, Zero Negatives You can check out my squads at Bloomilk, or share in more conversations at SWMGAMERS "There is always a choice..."
I agree that re-costing is the way to go. It'd be easier to agree on and easier to remember the changes.

Anything else people wanted to do with the game could be done through new custom figures or limiting/adding rules to particular skirmish.


There are a number of ways this could work:
1.  Re-cost them...RS Luke, Jedi Knight could now cost 20pts, rather than 27, for example. Keep his stats the same.
2.  Re-stat them (slight changes in stats, or in SAs/FPs/CEs), in order to bring them up to par with the current minis.  Basically, for example, give Twin Attack to CS Saesee Tiin, and he'll be a solid mini.  Keep his cost the same.
3.  Re-design them from the ground up, with new stats, abilities, and costs.

As Dean stated, Gamers has already for a while now had some work going in preparation for this event which we all sensed was on the horizon.  When it comes to re-designing/re-stating/re-costing the figs, there are a number of people at Gamers who will do an excellent job. 



Although the first option here would by far be the easiest way out, i really like the second one better. Giving Saesee Tiin twin attack is an easy fix for a figure that is never used. And this way, all the newer abilities and force powers could also be adopted by older minis. Also, characters that were powerful 'back then' but became obsolete with the release of newer ones could rise again with a boost in stats.

I agree, this would certanily make up for a number of the early sets many short comings, and allow a vast array of preexisting pieces to find use, with slight adjsutments to point costs. A bigo ne that comes to mind is the RS Boba Fett,  when RS and CS were all that was avalable he was worth half you squad, but now, he's not worth the quarter cost of a 200 point army.



Agreed, many of the pieces were fine after the first couple sets in comparison to others in the first couple sets.  Quick and (relatively) easy to adjust the costs to allow the lesser Clone Strike Jedi into more play.  They might not have all the power abilities, but you could bring in two-three for every modern Jedi.

I think a "suggested" quick fix list would be nice (option 2) for some pieces that could benefit from abilities introduced after the piece was made or ones that make more sense. (Yoda of Dagobah with Levitate, Luke, JM with Force Renewal, Maul on Speeder with Flight, etc.).  It would not have to be formally adopted, but a different option.  We now have three DCI options/levels for map choice, why not levels for minis, too.  Standard play is all pieces as printed, one level for re-costed pieces, and most restricted level with re-costed and modified stats.

Yeah, I am a fan of re-costing figs.  We've got ~ 900 pieces to work with.  Many with interesting abilities that are currently too expensive to actually play.

SWM @ Atlanta, GA: http://www.atlantaswg.com/ SWM @ Charlotte, NC: http://www.queencitygamers.com/

There are a number of ways this could work:
1.  Re-cost them...RS Luke, Jedi Knight could now cost 20pts, rather than 27, for example. Keep his stats the same.
2.  Re-stat them (slight changes in stats, or in SAs/FPs/CEs), in order to bring them up to par with the current minis.  Basically, for example, give Twin Attack to CS Saesee Tiin, and he'll be a solid mini.  Keep his cost the same.
3.  Re-design them from the ground up, with new stats, abilities, and costs.

As Dean stated, Gamers has already for a while now had some work going in preparation for this event which we all sensed was on the horizon.  When it comes to re-designing/re-stating/re-costing the figs, there are a number of people at Gamers who will do an excellent job. 



Although the first option here would by far be the easiest way out, i really like the second one better. Giving Saesee Tiin twin attack is an easy fix for a figure that is never used. And this way, all the newer abilities and force powers could also be adopted by older minis. Also, characters that were powerful 'back then' but became obsolete with the release of newer ones could rise again with a boost in stats.



I'm sure most would agree that the best option is create a new card for an outdated mini that can be used as an alternate for the current one. That way, the old one can still be used if someone wants. To just wipe away what has been already done isn't really necessary.

Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -
My only problem with having two completely different cards, is trying to keep track of 900+ base cards and abilities, then however many more "redone" abilities.  Changing just the cost, makes it easier to remember what all the pieces are supposed to do, but allows flexibility in the builds.  Any minor tweaks for stats or abilities could be kept to a minimum (I still think some cards could use a reboot with newer abilities, but as few as possible).  Cost changes don't eliminate the previous design, just the availability. 

Either way it is months down the road at the earliest - we still get to enjoy one more set and then see how the whole picture comes together.

This could improve things from a source material accurate sort of way ;

imagine someone like Moff Veed actually having a comic accurate use like allowing Krayt and his Sith into the empire just like in the series.
My only problem with having two completely different cards, is trying to keep track of 900+ base cards and abilities, then however many more "redone" abilities.  Changing just the cost, makes it easier to remember what all the pieces are supposed to do, but allows flexibility in the builds.  Any minor tweaks for stats or abilities could be kept to a minimum (I still think some cards could use a reboot with newer abilities, but as few as possible).  Cost changes don't eliminate the previous design, just the availability. 

Either way it is months down the road at the earliest - we still get to enjoy one more set and then see how the whole picture comes together.




I addressed this on Gamers, for the most part. But to add to what I said over there, it would be no different if WotC were to release a set of all Clone Strike characters with new minis. You don't have to keep up with "900+ abilities" to distinguish between a new card and an old card. All that is required is for the person using the mini to tell his or her opponent which card is being used for the stats. And then the opponent can look at that card at any time.

My only problem with having two completely different cards, is trying to keep track of 900+ base cards and abilities, then however many more "redone" abilities.  Changing just the cost, makes it easier to remember what all the pieces are supposed to do, but allows flexibility in the builds.  Any minor tweaks for stats or abilities could be kept to a minimum (I still think some cards could use a reboot with newer abilities, but as few as possible).  Cost changes don't eliminate the previous design, just the availability. 

Either way it is months down the road at the earliest - we still get to enjoy one more set and then see how the whole picture comes together.




I addressed this on Gamers, for the most part. But to add to what I said over there, it would be no different if WotC were to release a set of all Clone Strike characters with new minis. You don't have to keep up with "900+ abilities" to distinguish between a new card and an old card. All that is required is for the person using the mini to tell his or her opponent which card is being used for the stats. And then the opponent can look at that card at any time.




Adding my bit onto Boris' points:

Another reason why an alternate is better than an alteration (I think I found some terms I like) is that the options keep expanding. Let's say just for example they make a new alternate card for the Jabba the Hutt (RS) that has a CE (or Special ability) that allows Savage allies to ignore Enemies' Diplomat (among other abilities). There may reason where you would still want to use the old Jabba (you really need reinforcements 30 for some reason), and if he is given an alternate card rather than a replacement card the options are there.

Each set we get new pieces whose function we have to learn. I don't see why that should change just because Wizards is stopping. In fact, we have the potential to be a lot more innovative. If someone has a problem with remembering what a new character is supposed to do, then I reccomend they stop collecting and playing pieces after Rebel Storm. Each set we have to learn new abilities. What's the problem now? In all likelihood, the new cards will likely look significantly different from the way they are now, which will help avoid confusion. The situation won't be too much different (and in a lot of circumstances easier) than remembering "Which of the 12 vaders is that one you have there?"

Also, just recosting a piece is too boring IMO. 

Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -

If alternate cards are the way to go it would be interesting to optimize alternate cards based on pt level.  So you could have 100, 150, 200 and mass combat versions of Agen Kolar, Vader etc...


If alternate cards are the way to go it would be interesting to optimize alternate cards based on pt level.  So you could have 100, 150, 200 and mass combat versions of Agen Kolar, Vader etc...




I really wish I could get across what's been talked about on Gamers.
Do you want to help advance the game when Wizards pulls the plug? Go Here: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75862/22337613/Minis_YOU_want_to_see:_The_first_step - - -
I'm certainly not against new cards to bring some old pieces into new light, just wanted to address a concern.  It appears, it has been addressed, so that's cool.  I fully understand the points being made and don't have a problem myself, more just playing devil's advocate.

I guess it's not the updated cards that bother me, but new/different abilities with the same mini represented on the board.  When I see a particular enemy piece on the board, I know what stats to expect.  It would just take some getting used to the idea that it would be different and I'd have to ask which stats were being used for that game and check cards before each match.  I've seen it come up with proxy pieces in friendly games.  Not a big deal, just something I'm glad is being considered early.
I've sized it up a bit and am pretty convinced that -with the exception of about 6-8 pieces- if you took all the pieces from the first four sets (6pts or greater) and reduced the cost by 10% (rounded off) nearly all of the old pieces seem to settle into nearly the right point cost compared to the newer 'power crept' pieces. 
   For example, check out how the old Luke, Vader and Anakin would now be costed properly against the newer Lukes, Vaders and Anakin pieces.