1/21/2010 FtL: "Get InVigorated"

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This thread is for discussion of this week's From the Lab, which goes live Thursday morning on magicthegathering.com.

Love this card, it made me double-take.

It doesn't seem AMAZING OMGEEE but it seems like it has a good place in my decks with mostly zendikar refuge lands. *shrug*
Thanks a lot, Wizards of the Coast, for making shocklands even more overpowered. Yeah, yeah, I know this card doesn't do anything on its own and any deck that wants lots of Ravnica duals probably wants better things to cast with them. That doesn't matter to the kind of player who is going to want to get "maximum value" from their copies of those overpriced abominations and annoy the hell out of me by prattling about how much awesomer they are than everything else that's ever been printed.
This card is shouting for Stasis.
One-mana card that breaks the symmetry of Root Maze/Orb of Dreams - lock!
(Currently I run 4 Frozen AEther's)

-Fantasos-
Uh... Combo with Time Vault?
Isn't "comes into play tapped" supposed to be used to BALANCE card power?  I actually really love the idea of this card, especially in multiples, but SERIOUSLY.  I see this ending up one of three ways:

1.  It turns out to be a nifty card, but mostly just Johnny goodness.
2.  It flashes a sad panda face as the eternal formats whack it on the nose and make it sit in the the restricted/banned corner, but standard doesn't have the cards to abuse it overly.
3.  The banned list returns to standard, and everyone goes GRRRRRR as their new decks go POOF.

Somehow though, I have a feeling that regardless of the outcome, people are going to be happy to see tri-lands rotate out in the autumn, because this suckers got potential to make absurd manabases feasible. 

Also anyone who hasn't read the "Stock mana" theory being kicked around recently should check out Floreses podcast on top8magic.  That system of evaluation says this card is DISGUSTING if left alone (not even bringing up multiples), because it gives you +1 mana for every CIPT land you play.
A man's actions are not the sum of his psychological parts...but his decks are.
Oh man want.

Also, I'm not all that worried about power since it's card disadvantage when working only with CIPT (sorry, ETBT) lands.
Has anybody else thought of using the Amulet of Vigor along with the Naya plane? Think of it, you can play any number of lands each turn, so you play one of the Ravnica bounce lands, such as Gruul Turf, it comes into play untapped, you tap it for one mana of two different colors before having it bounce itself back to your hand, rinse and repeat. The result: Infinite mana of not one, but TWO different colors!

Or even better yet, use that same combo with Fastbond and Life Gift. (Fastbond lets you play any number of lands each turn but you loose one life for every land after the first. Life Gift gives you one life everytime you play a land. Result: You end up gaining one life AND an infinite suply of two colors of mana.) Then you just use a Banefire to hit your oponent for infinite, unblockable, uncounterable, unpreventable damage! And the best part? Since Fastbond costs one you can do this entire combo on your second turn! (Turn one: Play a forest, tap it, play Amulet of Vigor. Turn two: Tap the forest to play Fastbond, drop a Gruul Turf, tap it then bounce it, repeat, play Life Gift, then play Gruul Turf and bounce it to your your hearts content, and follow it all up with the afore mentioned Banefire!) Granted you will loose one life overall, but if you have all the right cards in your hand, this is a game ender!

Gentlemen, I believe we have a broken combo on our hands!

Or even better yet, use that same combo with Fastbond and Life Gift. (Fastbond lets you play any number of lands each turn but you loose one life for every land after the first. Life Gift gives you one life everytime you play a land. Result: You end up gaining one life AND an infinite suply of two colors of mana. Then you jusdt use a Banefire to hit your oponent for infinite, unblockable, uncounterable, unpreventable damage!)

Gentlemen, I believe we have a broken combo on our hands!


Nice combo!  The god draw of, say, Simian Spirit Guide, Amulet of Vigor, Gruul Turf, Fastbond and Banefire is a five-card first-turn win.  No need for Life Gift here, since your Banefire will be set to 20 with you at 10, though it would be a good card to have in there for later.  Neat to see such a combo figured out so soon.

Isn't "comes into play tapped" supposed to be used to BALANCE card power?  I actually really love the idea of this card, especially in multiples, but SERIOUSLY.  I see this ending up one of three ways:

1.  It turns out to be a nifty card, but mostly just Johnny goodness.
2.  It flashes a sad panda face as the eternal formats whack it on the nose and make it sit in the the restricted/banned corner, but standard doesn't have the cards to abuse it overly.
3.  The banned list returns to standard, and everyone goes GRRRRRR as their new decks go POOF.

Somehow though, I have a feeling that regardless of the outcome, people are going to be happy to see tri-lands rotate out in the autumn, because this suckers got potential to make absurd manabases feasible. 

Also anyone who hasn't read the "Stock mana" theory being kicked around recently should check out Floreses podcast on top8magic.  That system of evaluation says this card is DISGUSTING if left alone (not even bringing up multiples), because it gives you +1 mana for every CIPT land you play.



I don't see that happening. While it looks nifty I'm inclined to think that players have better things to put in their decks than a card that let's them roll tri-lands/every-other-land-I-don't-memorize into play set to go. It's a fragile thing to focus on.

I am Blue/Black
I am Blue/Black
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.
I'm both selfish and rational. I'm scheming, secretive and manipulative; I use knowledge as a tool for personal gain, and in turn obtaining more knowledge. At best, I am mysterious and stealthy; at worst, I am distrustful and opportunistic.
(Amulet of Vigor) I like these funky cheap utility artifacts. I wan't the only person back in the olden days to start a typical game with a sprinkling of little artifacts, like Soul Net, Library of Leng, and Fountain of Youth.


Every man and his owl has thought of this ability, but it hasn't yet been printed.

This is an interesting and relevant ability, and I agree with the execution here. It's the simplest version, and it works well as an artifact.
Amulet of Vigor is certainly a powerful card, but I don't quite understand the part about two of them being able to untap a permanent twice. After all, the card says "whenever"; so the permanent enters the battlefield tapped, and is untapped then. If I tap it, I should no more be able to untap it later in the turn, from the effect of the second amulet, then I would be able to untap it during some later turn; this isn't when it entered the battlefield, it's later.

Coming up with weird ideas to make everyone happy since 2008!

 

I have now started a blog as an appropriate place to put my crazy ideas.

Amulet of Vigor is certainly a powerful card, but I don't quite understand the part about two of them being able to untap a permanent twice. After all, the card says "whenever"; so the permanent enters the battlefield tapped, and is untapped then. If I tap it, I should no more be able to untap it later in the turn, from the effect of the second amulet, then I would be able to untap it during some later turn; this isn't when it entered the battlefield, it's later.



Read up on Triggered Abilities.
From what I can tell, this is one of those fun wacky stack tricks, but I think it happens something like this:

1) When a land comes into play tapped... the two copies of the ability go on the stack, one on top of the other.
2) The 'top' copy of the ability resolves, untapping the land...  The second copy's ability is still on the stack.
3) In response, you tap the land again... the land's ability is now on the top of the stack so it resolves first.
4) Finally, the second copy's ability resolves, untapping the land again.

So basically, the abilities go on the stack when the land comes into play and triggers the ability, but that's not necessarily when they resolve.


I don't see that happening. While it looks nifty I'm inclined to think that players have better things to put in their decks than a card that let's them roll tri-lands/every-other-land-I-don't-memorize into play set to go. It's a fragile thing to focus on.




I agree that standard can't really utilize this card, since only maanfixing is really currently affected, but I still beleive legacy (maybe even extended?) will actually be able to build win conditions around this card.  And it's not as if their are no decks that run tri-lands though, and even some control builds that use refuge duals.  They get a benefit of this guy if he comes down early, and multiples late can accelerate for a turn, or allow you to leave mana open to respond to their turn.

And don't forget this card when the set comes out...or the next 4 sets.  It has niche pet card that enabled a combo build out of no where written all over it.
A man's actions are not the sum of his psychological parts...but his decks are.
My inner Johnny screams at me to get 4 of this card at the release.

It's likely a broken combo will involve this card in the future.
Since Voltaic Key is unrestricted in Vintage, I don't see Amulet of Vigor making a big dent in the format. Amulet gives you one extra turn, but the Key gives you infinite.

Oh, but it's sure going in my Patron of the Moon EDH deck that I've been working on. What timing, Wizards!
Realm Razer finally has a friend to play with. 

I envision some Johnny designer trying to break Realm Razer making this card just because. 
Since Voltaic Key is unrestricted in Vintage, I don't see Amulet of Vigor making a big dent in the format. Amulet gives you one extra turn, but the Key gives you infinite.

Oh, but it's sure going in my Patron of the Moon EDH deck that I've been working on. What timing, Wizards!



This is what I was going to say, but was beaten to it.

Nobody mentioned Orb of Dreams?

Or even better yet, use that same combo with Fastbond and Life Gift. (Fastbond lets you play any number of lands each turn but you loose one life for every land after the first. Life Gift gives you one life everytime you play a land. Result: You end up gaining one life AND an infinite suply of two colors of mana. Then you jusdt use a Banefire to hit your oponent for infinite, unblockable, uncounterable, unpreventable damage!)

Gentlemen, I believe we have a broken combo on our hands!


Nice combo!  The god draw of, say, Simian Spirit Guide, Amulet of Vigor, Gruul Turf, Fastbond and Banefire is a five-card first-turn win.  No need for Life Gift here, since your Banefire will be set to 20 with you at 10, though it would be a good card to have in there for later.  Neat to see such a combo figured out so soon.




Nice call on that Simian Spirit Guide! I knew there was a way to work this combo turn one, but I wanted to do it without making it like a 7 card combo or some other such unbelievably impossible thing. Thanks! Now if you'll excuse me, I have a deck to build. :P
Amulet of Vigor is certainly a powerful card, but I don't quite understand the part about two of them being able to untap a permanent twice. After all, the card says "whenever"; so the permanent enters the battlefield tapped, and is untapped then. If I tap it, I should no more be able to untap it later in the turn, from the effect of the second amulet, then I would be able to untap it during some later turn; this isn't when it entered the battlefield, it's later.



IIRC both the Vigor abilities would be put on the stack, one would resolve and you would then be able to respond to the other one so you can effectively use the ability twice.
I'm torn on this one. As much as I dislike the overused "enters the battlefield tapped" clause on dual lands and such, this particular implemention of a workaround seems, quite plainly, nuts.
Proud member of C.A.R.D. - Campaign Against Rare Duals "...but the time has come when lands just need to be better. Creatures have gotten stronger, spells have always been insane, and lands just sat in this awkward place of necessity." Jacob Van Lunen on the refuge duals, 16 Sep 2009. "While it made thematic sense to separate enemy and allied color fixing in the past, we have come around to the definite conclusion that it is just plain incorrect from a game-play perspective. This is one of these situations where game play should just trump flavor." - Sam Stoddard on ending the separation of allied/enemy dual lands. 05 July 2013
late or even mid game this is going to be a dead card really, and it can't be out turn 1 without some serious help. i don't think it's going to unbalance anything.
Nobody mentioned Orb of Dreams?



Yes, somebody did (before me)

This card is shouting for Stasis.
One-mana card that breaks the symmetry of Root Maze/Orb of Dreams - lock!
(Currently I run 4 Frozen AEther's)

-Fantasos-



OMG click HERE! OMG! How to autocard and use decklist format
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57817638 wrote:
I like storm crow because I really like crows in real life, as an animal, and the card isn't terribly stupid, but packs a good deal of nostalgia and also a chunck of the game's history. So it's perhaps one of the cards I have most affection to, but not because "lol storm crow is bad hurr hurr durr".
Listen to my SoundCloud while you read my signature. The Island, Come And See, The Landlord's Daughter, You'll Not Feel The Drowning - The Decemberists by vimschy IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/rkvR.gif)IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/L3es.gif) IMAGE(http://dragcave.net/image/m71H.gif)
Quotes
56747598 wrote:
57295478 wrote:
Although I do assume you deliberately refer to them (DCI) as The Grand Imperial Convocation of Evil just for the purposes of making them sound like an ancient and terrible conspiracy.
Now, now. 1994 doesn't quite qualify as "ancient".
56734518 wrote:
Oh, it's a brilliant plan. You see, Bolas was travelling through shadowmoor, causing trouble, when he saw a Wickerbough Elder with its stylin' dead scarecrow hat. Now, Bolas being Bolas took the awesome hat and he put it on his head, but even with all his titanic powers of magic he couldn't make it fit. He grabbed some more scarecrows, but then a little kithkin girl asked if he was trying to build a toupee. "BY ALL THE POWERS IN THE MULTIVERSE!" he roared, "I WILL HAVE A HAT WORTHY OF MY GLORY." and so he went through his Dark Lore of Doom (tm) looking for something he could make into a hat that would look as stylish on him as a scarecrow does on a treefolk. He thought about the Phyrexians, but they were covered in goopy oil that would make his nonexistant hair greasy. He Tried out angels for a while but they didn't sit quite right. Then, he looked under "e" (because in the Elder Draconic alphabet, "e" for Eldrazi is right next to "h" for Hat) in his Dark Lore of Doom and saw depictions of the Eldrazi, and all their forms. "THIS SHALL BE MY HAT!" he declared, poking a picture of Emrakul, "AND WITH IT I WILL USHER IN A NEW AGE OF DARKNESS -- ER, I MEAN A NEW AGE OF FASHION!" And so Nicol Bolas masterminded the release of the Eldrazi.
57864098 wrote:
Rhox War Monk just flips pancakes, and if games have told us anything, it's that food = life.
56747598 wrote:
76973988 wrote:
This thread has gotten creepy. XP
Really? Really? The last couple days have been roughly every perverse fetish imaginable, but it only got "creepy" when speculation on Mother of Runes's mob affiliation came up?
76672808 wrote:
57864098 wrote:
57531048 wrote:
Nice mana base. Not really.
Yeah, really. If my deck was going to cost $1000+, I'd at least make it good.
99812049 wrote:
I like to think up what I consider clever names for my decks, only later to be laughed at by my wife. It kills me a little on the inside, but thats what marriage is about.
56816728 wrote:
56854588 wrote:
Of course, the best use [of tolaria west] is transmuting for the real Tolaria. ;)
Absolutely. I used to loose to my buddy's Banding deck for ages, it was then that I found out about Tolaria, and I was finally able win my first game.
70246459 wrote:
WOAH wait wait wait
56957928 wrote:
You know, being shallow and jusdgmental aside, "I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
"I later found out that Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates with at least two other people"
56957928 wrote:
Jon infiltrated his way into OKCupid dates
56957928 wrote:
OH MY GOD
109874309 wrote:
The only way I'd cast this card is into a bonfire.
82032421 wrote:
The short answer is that there's no rule barring annoying people from posting, but there a rule barring us from harassing them about it.
56747598 wrote:
Browbeat is a card that is an appropriate deck choice when there's no better idea available. "No better idea available" was pretty much the running theme of Odyssey era.
56874518 wrote:
Or perhaps it was a more straightforward comment indicating a wish for you to be bitten (Perhaps repeatedly) by a small yet highly venomous arachnid.
70246459 wrote:
58280208 wrote:
You're an idiot, and I'm in no mood for silliness.
57817638 wrote:
57145078 wrote:
You just... Vektor it.
That's the answer to everything.
70246459 wrote:
58347268 wrote:
I think the problem is that you don't exist.
This would sound great out of context!
56965458 wrote:
Modern is like playing a new tournament every time : you build a deck, you win with it, don't bother keeping it. Just build another, its key pieces will get banned.
57864098 wrote:
57309598 wrote:
I specifically remember posting a thread when I was just a witty bitty noob.
You make it sound like that's still not the case.
58325628 wrote:
Rap is what happens when the c from crap is taken away.
Doug Beyer:
But sometimes it's also challenging. Because sometimes OH MY GOD, WHAT THE HELL IS THIS THING?
141434757 wrote:
Flashforward five thousand years (Click for atmosphere) :
57927608 wrote:
to paraphrase Jeff Goldblum, Vektor finds a way.
58347268 wrote:
when in rome **** AND PILLAGE
143229641 wrote:
I always find it helpful when im angry to dress up in an owl costume and rub pennies all over my body in front of a full body mirror next to the window.
Dymecoar:
Playing Magic without Blue is like sleeping without any sheets or blankets. You can do it...but why?
Omega137:
Me: "I love the moment when a control deck stabilizes. It feels so... right." Omega137: "I like the life drop part until you get there, it's the MtG variant of bungee jumping"
Zigeif777:
Just do it like Yu-Gi-Oh or monkeys: throw all the crap you got at them and hope it works or else the by-standers (or opponents) just get dirty and pissed.
57471038 wrote:
58258708 wrote:
It's true that Alpha and Beta didn't contain any cards like Tarmogoyf, Darksteel Colossus, or Platinum Angel. It just contained weak, insignificant cards like Black Lotus, Mox Sapphire, and Time Walk.
Normally it's difficult to pick up on your jokes/sarcasm. But this one's pretty much out there. Good progress. You have moved up to Humanoid. You'll be Human in no time.
91893448 wrote:
94618431 wrote:
I didn't know Samurai were known to be able to cut down whole armies...
They can when they're using lightsabers!
57129358 wrote:
97980259 wrote:
My wife brought home a baby black squirrel they found on a horse track and cared for it for a few days. We named it Grixis, but it died.
Unearth it!
70246459 wrote:
[/spoiler] And I'm on Magic Arcana. How about you? Oh, by the way, I'm also on From the Lab now. Twice, actually. And now with my own submited decklist!

Amulet of Vigor + Orb of Dreams + Winter Orb sounds like a fun griefer deck for casual... They even curve out nicely at cc's 1, 2, and 3.  Though the ordering could be better, i suppose.


It doesn't seem like it will break any new formats; it's a solid effect but it's prolly not abusable enough to be broken.  It does open up a bevy of viable combo-decks, though, so I think it'll be interesting.

Amulet of Vigor is certainly a powerful card, but I don't quite understand the part about two of them being able to untap a permanent twice. After all, the card says "whenever"; so the permanent enters the battlefield tapped, and is untapped then. If I tap it, I should no more be able to untap it later in the turn, from the effect of the second amulet, then I would be able to untap it during some later turn; this isn't when it entered the battlefield, it's later.



I think it's the use of multiples that does that.

I am Blue/Black
I am Blue/Black
Take The Magic Dual Colour Test - Beta today!
Created with Rum and Monkey's Personality Test Generator.
I'm both selfish and rational. I'm scheming, secretive and manipulative; I use knowledge as a tool for personal gain, and in turn obtaining more knowledge. At best, I am mysterious and stealthy; at worst, I am distrustful and opportunistic.
Thanks a lot, Wizards of the Coast, for making shocklands even more overpowered. Yeah, yeah, I know this card doesn't do anything on its own and any deck that wants lots of Ravnica duals probably wants better things to cast with them. That doesn't matter to the kind of player who is going to want to get "maximum value" from their copies of those overpriced abominations and annoy the hell out of me by prattling about how much awesomer they are than everything else that's ever been printed.

Try to have that guy who annoys you play against people who use original dual lands Tongue out. There goes his prattling about how his Ravnica duals are awesomer than everything else ever printed (and worse gets your annoyance of overpriced mana fixing lands, I guess... Wink).

But seriously, using that artifact to avoid paying 2 life for a dual land coming into play untapped really isn't worth it. You shoudn't get annoyed and instead laugh at the guy's face real hard. As for yourself, be the smart guy and use it with lands that really make it good, like the other, common dual land cycle of Ravnica.

Magic The Gathering DCI Lvl 1 Judge Don't hesitate to post rules question in the Rules Q&A forum for me and other competent advisors to answer : http://community.wizards.com/go/forum/view/75842/134778/Rules_Q38A
This card is so awesome and long overdue, but it's worth the wait. The fact that it says "Permanent" is just... well, awesome. So many cards can be broken with this... I don't know how esle to say it. XD
As for yourself, be the smart guy and use it with lands that really make it good, like the other, common dual land cycle of Ravnica.

Win
The
Thread

One Amulet makes them interesting, two makes them crazy, and a third amulet turns each of those lands into two Black Lotuses at once.

Holy crap!  Two days ago I was driving home and thinking if Wizards could makea  card like this and then I thought "Nah... Time Vault for one..."
HOLY CRAP!
I'm going to guess that all the Time Vaults in the world just tripled in price... at least.
Holy crap!  Two days ago I was driving home and thinking if Wizards could makea  card like this and then I thought "Nah... Time Vault for one..."
HOLY CRAP!
I'm going to guess that all the Time Vaults in the world just tripled in price... at least.



yeah, uh...sorry to be the one to tell you this, but there was already a time vault combo and it's a lot better than the one with this card. sorry, man.

Since Voltaic Key is unrestricted in Vintage, I don't see Amulet of Vigor making a big dent in the format. Amulet gives you one extra turn, but the Key gives you infinite.


If i'm not mistaken... 2 amulets +1 Ruin ghost + 1 Tideforce Elemental in play... If your opponent is tapped out and you play a Sejiri Refuge, it's infinite life for you... !! Surprised OMG!! Funny in casual, but not competitive enough... Wink
That is exactly the same idea I was thinking. Does the tapping for mana count as an ability?

I built the deck with

4 amulet of vigor
4 ruin ghost
4 tideforce
4 step lynx
2 emeria angel
3 kraken hatchling
4 fabricate
2 adventuring gear
2 path
4 negate
4 hedron crab

and all the lands are come into play tapped except for 2 islands

celestial colonade
sejiri refuge
sjiri steppe
halimar depths
glacial fortress
4 triland
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