Arcane Power 2 Wishlist

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I'd like to see melee builds for the Sorcerer and Warlock.

The sorcerer build should allow Channelling through any light blade, and the powers should be ranged powers (mostly targeting reflex), but have channeling damage expressions ("Special: if you channel this power through a dagger or light blade, it does 2[W]+Cha damage instead").  Secondary stat should be Dex or Int.  Kickers should be more mobility-oriented.

The Warlock build should be focused on the Con pacts, and just sprinkle the occassional Weapon attack at various levels, like Eldritch Strike ... with appropriate Infernal/Star/Vestige kickers.  The kickers should tend toward meatshield/defender-lite control effects.  (Marks, mark-like free damage if you attack someone else, slows, immobilize, prones, etc)

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Since Martial Power 2 introduced paragon paths for martial characters multiclassing to other power sources (e.g. Avernian Knight, Arcane Trickster, Arcane Battlemaster), that opens the door for something I've been dying to see for quite some time.

Namely, a paragon path specifically for Bards who multiclass into Druid. Fili would be a good name for it. I'm thinking, for starters, ability for Bards to use implements with which they're proficient with Druid powers and Charisma in place of Wisdom to attack and damage with them. And then a lot of other cool, Celtic-inspired stuff attached. That'll bring back the flavor of the 1st Ed. Bard.



Fili is just one of the Irish names for the Scholarly caste in the old Celtic caste system.  I think that Ovate would probably be a better name, denoting prophet, and being tightly associated with Bards and Druids within the Scholarly Caste, and having nominal forms throughout the Celtic World (Fáith in Ireland, Ofydd in Wales, Vates in Gaul, etc).

But I think your idea is -awesome-.



I'm partial to recycling the ol' Fochlucan Lyrist title, myself. Smile

Danny

I second the Fochlucan Lyricist paragon path; we need a bard/druid combination.
I would also like to see more creation type rituals, all the way up to mythals, as it would give something for PC's to strive toward (as in "Why no, you take all the gold, this old scroll which explains how to safeguard Silverymoon is all I need")


For that matter, it would nice to go back through all the 2.0 to 3.5 spells and find what rituals we could create, up to an including Wish. The game does not NEED a wish ritual, but players just really like the idea of a genie showing up and offering to give them their heart's desire (complications then ensue).


I would also like to see a more elaborate set of rules for how spells can interact with single-use terrain. That was an idea introduced in the DMG2, although WoC has not done much with it since. Letting PC's bounce a spell off a mirror, using magic missile to cause a rope to break or chandelier to fall just has so much more interesting than giving PC's a whole new set of abilities.
I had almost forgotten about Fochluchan Lyrist. That's got to be the PPath.  Our silly names pale in comparison to HISTORY.

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Don't forget others....

Totemist Warden/Monk hybrid who can summon the spirits of magical beasts as natural attacks...

Dragon Shaman/sorc who summons the spirits of wyrms....

Daggerspell Mage for Sorce/Rogues with the blade channelling feat....

Unseen Seer Arcane/Rogues for those sneaky spellcasters....

Dirgesingers for when the Shadow Source arrives....

Soulborn and Incarnate divine/monk classes that weave the energy of incarnum....

Dracolexi Cleric or Invoker/Sorcerers who speak the power words of the dragon tongue....

Truenamer Wizard/Invokers....


Many possibilities...

Daggerspell Mage for Sorce/Rogues with the blade channelling feat....


Oh god, this please. =D

I am still waiting for the Dragon Pact Warlock, one who makes a deal with an ancient dragon for their power while becoming their pawn/slave/ally.

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Dirgesingers for when the Shadow Source arrives....

Yes, yes, yes!


Daggerspell Mage for Sorce/Rogues with the blade channelling feat....


Oh god, this please. =D

I second!

Danny

I am still waiting for the Dragon Pact Warlock, one who makes a deal with an ancient dragon for their power while becoming their pawn/slave/ally.




Agreed.  Dragon Pact, Genie Pact, and Marut Pact seem to be the strongest concepts for future Warlock Pacts.

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I am still waiting for the Dragon Pact Warlock, one who makes a deal with an ancient dragon for their power while becoming their pawn/slave/ally.




Agreed.  Dragon Pact, Genie Pact, and Marut Pact seem to be the strongest concepts for future Warlock Pacts.



Couldn't you just fold Dragon and Genie together with Elementals to get an Elemental pact? And for the Marut Pact, It would probably be better to fold that into an Astral pact for Immortal creatures.

Also, I don't know much about Dark Sun, but isn't the Sorcerer-King Pact (which is essentially a Dragon Pact) already confirmed?

I'm mostly suggesting the more broad pacts because no Warlock Pact so far has been "you get power from this particular creature". It always gives you a wide range of possible patrons (espcially Vestiges), instead of just, "You get power from Maruts... yes... Maruts, and only Maruts..."

Anyway, in looking back, I noticed that Swordmages have got almost nothing in the way of support beyond Arcane Power and couple dragon articles, so I'm hoping that AP2 has a lot of awesome new powers, and at least one at-will that can be used as a melee basic attack.

I could also get behind the Weapon/Impliment Swordmage. Perhaps some new class feature such as:

Ambidextrous Spellsword


When you are wielding two implements that you can use, at least one of which is a Light Blade or a Heavy Blade, you gain the benefit of your Swordmage Warding even though you do not have a hand free. In addition, you gain Dual Implement Spellcaster as a bonus feat, even if you do not meet the prerequisites.
The first part of your feat seems fine, but adding free Dual Implement Spellcaster on top?  >.> Don't quit your day job.
Couldn't you just fold Dragon and Genie together with Elementals to get an Elemental pact? And for the Marut Pact, It would probably be better to fold that into an Astral pact for Immortal creatures. Also, I don't know much about Dark Sun, but isn't the Sorcerer-King Pact (which is essentially a Dragon Pact) already confirmed?--Chameleon-X


Yeah, you could combine the two into an Elemental Pact and get a decent result, then just walk in reflavor and your done no harm no foul on my part, I'd prefer a straight dragon pact to this but I'll admit I'm not above refluff when needed.

As for the Sorcerer-King Pact, you make an excellent point that this may in fact be the dragon pact, but remember alot of what makes a Sorcerer King is being skilled in both Psionics and Magic so this flavor might still be involved which is a unique touch to Dark Sun.  Again that's where the reflavoring comes is, and we do need to see it to understand it.  For all we know they could forgo the psionic aspect of the Sorcerer-King mythos for this pact and it could be the ideal dragon pact. 

Just have to wait and see for Dark Sun.
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RE: Dragon Pact, I was always kind of hoping for an infernal pact PP that binds you to some Rogue Abishai, former exacrchs of Tiamat.

How about a bunch of Warlock powers with Dragon fluff that have riders for Infernal and Vestiage pacts? Maybe the Green Dragon power has fey, and the Purple Dragon power has Dark too!

And maybe pet based Warlock? Beyond your average familiar, an imp, sprite, floating eyes of the vestige, or shadow that makes attacks alongside you? Stepping on the Beastmaster's toes? Perhaps . . . but I can see people enjoying the concept.

Plus, even if summoners have gotten a lukewarm reception, for the love of fluff can we have some Dragon summoning powers? Wyrmspirit Binder PP? Lesser Dragon Orbs as implements?
Couldn't you just fold Dragon and Genie together with Elementals to get an Elemental pact? And for the Marut Pact, It would probably be better to fold that into an Astral pact for Immortal creatures. Also, I don't know much about Dark Sun, but isn't the Sorcerer-King Pact (which is essentially a Dragon Pact) already confirmed?--Chameleon-X


Yeah, you could combine the two into an Elemental Pact and get a decent result, then just walk in reflavor and your done no harm no foul on my part, I'd prefer a straight dragon pact to this but I'll admit I'm not above refluff when needed.

As for the Sorcerer-King Pact, you make an excellent point that this may in fact be the dragon pact, but remember alot of what makes a Sorcerer King is being skilled in both Psionics and Magic so this flavor might still be involved which is a unique touch to Dark Sun.  Again that's where the reflavoring comes is, and we do need to see it to understand it.  For all we know they could forgo the psionic aspect of the Sorcerer-King mythos for this pact and it could be the ideal dragon pact. 

Just have to wait and see for Dark Sun.



Sorcerer-King Pact will probably be flavor-neutral enough that it (like the Dark Pact from FR) can be adapted to non-Dark Sun campaigns. They might even include footnotes in the player's guide on how to adapt the mechanics to other settings.

Multiclass-oriented paragon paths seem to be a good idea, such as an Arcane Archer (Bard/Ranger) or the aforementioned Bard/Druid combination. Perhaps even a "psychic enchanter" type of class combining Psion and Wizard, with the ability to use power points to give a boost to arcane spells.



I want a new Sorcerer MC Feat that is worth picking up for a Bard. Mostly one with the 'you gain training in one skill from the Sorcerer's class skill list' line.

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The first part of your feat seems fine, but adding free Dual Implement Spellcaster on top?  >.> Don't quit your day job.



Okay, so ignore the second part.

In any case, I'd just like to see more close blasts and DEFINITELY more area burst powers for Swordmages. We have like, what, two so far? Granted, the second one is awesome to the Nth degree, but a paragon-level option to replace Incendiary Sword would be greatly appreciated.
The first part of your feat seems fine, but adding free Dual Implement Spellcaster on top?  >.> Don't quit your day job.


Okay, so ignore the second part.

In any case, I'd just like to see more close blasts and DEFINITELY more area burst powers for Swordmages. We have like, what, two so far? Granted, the second one is awesome to the Nth degree, but a paragon-level option to replace Incendiary Sword would be greatly appreciated.



Erm, guys? There is another problem here. Dual-wielding Swordmages have no other class feature to give up in exchange for Warding on dual-wield.

And don't forget that +3 warding is balanced because it replaces a shield. If you get an off-hand weapon and +3 warding, it's immediately broken because of weapons with the defensive property.

A dual-wielding swordmage only needs attack powers that use the off-hand, everything else is fine as-is. With the dual implement spellcaster feat, it's pretty effective to wield an off-hand weapon already anyway.
Hm... Dual Implement Swordmage who can use a Wand in their off-hand to complement their sword and can qualify for the Two Weapon feat chain even when wielding a Wand? You loose out on defenses a tad (not TOO much with Two Weapon Defense) but gain more properties.

We need more Close Blast power for Bard...and Bards that gain SOMETHING from weilding an enchanted instrument as implement. As is those things are fairly useless. You're always better off going Melee + Shield or Wand + Shield for defenses, or combine two types of attacks (Blades that act as implement and melee weapon or melee weapon with thrown property, etc) for versatility. Instrument need to be used two handed and limit you to implement powers.
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Musical instruments are actually quite cost-effective in Heroic and early Paragon. They double as implements and as focuses for your Bard rituals, many of which are quite good.

I would like to see more love for instruments in upper Paragon and Epic, though. After Lv. 15 or so I find myself just keeping that ol' Cli Lyre around for rituals and moving on to a wand for my implement proper. Of course, having Bard rituals higher than Lv. 10 as an incentive to stay with instruments would help that.
oh yeah ritual focus... forgot about picking up a wonderous one for my paragon bard.

I got that bard ritual that lets you shave off 2 hours of an extanded rest (Song of Restfulness)...and I'm a Drow...meaning I only need to Trance for 2 hours :p

With my Darkvision no one is sneaking up on us during the night.
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I love the familiars, so more options to build upon the familiars would be great, new feats and new familiar choices.  Maybe something to have a second familiar(not sure if it'd be useful but they are fun rpwise).

I just want a PILE of new spells for wizards and sorcerers.  Comb through the old Spell Compendium and rob ideas from that.  Experiment with the flavor of spells, as too many of them feel generic.  Half of Arcane Power's wizard powers felt a bit like "an illusion chills your foe's heart and inflicts X (save ends)."

Also, I would like to see a power-swap feat for wizards, sorcerers, and bards (it hurts the warlock flavor to include them) that is NOT a multi-class feat, but just lets you steal one spell from one of the other classes and use your highest ability modifier for it.  This may sound 3.5ish, but I always thought an important aspect of the arcane classes' flavor was that sorcerers could do many of the same things as wizards, but in a different way, setting up a rivalry between those schools of magic.

This "commonality" of the arcane power source exists to some extent, such as sorcerers being able to apply damage bonuses to all arcane powers, and all classes being able to swap implements for a feat.  I'd like to see this theme made more significant, kind of like arcane's "schtick" is that there are a certain number of spells out there and different means of "accessing" them.

This theme's ultimate expression might be an epic destiny that any arcane character could enter that is similar to the Eternal Seeker, but only for spells and allows even more cross-class ransacking of spells, without necessarily multiclassing.
Oh, and I"d like them to finally wow me with rituals.  I have to remind myself to read those in most books...
I just want a PILE of new spells for wizards and sorcerers.  Comb through the old Spell Compendium and rob ideas from that.  Experiment with the flavor of spells, as too many of them feel generic.  Half of Arcane Power's wizard powers felt a bit like "an illusion chills your foe's heart and inflicts X (save ends)."

Also, I would like to see a power-swap feat for wizards, sorcerers, and bards (it hurts the warlock flavor to include them) that is NOT a multi-class feat, but just lets you steal one spell from one of the other classes and use your highest ability modifier for it.  This may sound 3.5ish, but I always thought an important aspect of the arcane classes' flavor was that sorcerers could do many of the same things as wizards, but in a different way, setting up a rivalry between those schools of magic.

This "commonality" of the arcane power source exists to some extent, such as sorcerers being able to apply damage bonuses to all arcane powers, and all classes being able to swap implements for a feat.  I'd like to see this theme made more significant, kind of like arcane's "schtick" is that there are a certain number of spells out there and different means of "accessing" them.

This theme's ultimate expression might be an epic destiny that any arcane character could enter that is similar to the Eternal Seeker, but only for spells and allows even more cross-class ransacking of spells, without necessarily multiclassing.



I agree with this whole-heartedly.
...what about a little system of common arcane magic? something like the Skill Utility Powers: all arcane classes can choose from them

then a list of flat options available for them? shared options intra power source

all with attack stat "INT or CHA" and pretty simple effects with minors in controlling or damaging or buffs

so to have the possibility to give some minor buff effect to the wizard to recreate the old trasmutation school flavour, a warlock with some minor area blast, a sorcerer with some controlling effect

so to have minor options for building his own secondary combat-role
an as fluff having more the arcane as a common pool of energy, differeent only in term of "way to get access to it"

...what about a little system of common arcane magic? something like the Skill Utility Powers: all arcane classes can choose from them

then a list of flat options available for them? shared options intra power source

all with attack stat "INT or CHA" and pretty simple effects with minors in controlling or damaging or buffs

so to have the possibility to give some minor buff effect to the wizard to recreate the old trasmutation school flavour, a warlock with some minor area blast, a sorcerer with some controlling effect

so to have minor options for building his own secondary combat-role
an as fluff having more the arcane as a common pool of energy, differeent only in term of "way to get access to it"




Why not just create "Arcane ONLY" rituals? 

I personally think that rituals should be divided into types, some should be universal, and Martial Practices shoudl be folded into rituals.  But that would take an edition change, so…

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Hrm, I want a good rule set for how arcane classes can craft items and rituals, or even create their own spells.
Why not just create "Arcane ONLY" rituals? 

I personally think that rituals should be divided into types, some should be universal, and Martial Practices shoudl be folded into rituals.  But that would take an edition change, so…


Well, they could actually do that already.  Martial Practices were unique not only for being divided, but because they changed the component cost to a healing surge system.  Likewise, individual power sources could have a distinct brand of ritualism that varies in how it is carried out.

Arcane Evocations could be exotic and esoteric, full of strange requirements, complex configurations, or particular circumstances.
Divine Sacraments could be extremely costly, demanding sacrifice, but allow the burden to be shared amongst multiple individuals, so that a chorus is more powerful than a longer and a priest is aided by his congregation.
Primal Rites could vary depending on location or time; a single ability might work differently if used in a desert or a forest, and the passage of time and season might impact the outcome.
Psionic Traditions might require self-empowerment like Martial sources, as both are linked to the power of the self, but be tied into power points and other sources to indicate mental fatigue rather than physical.

This would help both thematically and mechanically, allowing each source to have their own "cool things", powers and abilities tied directly to their source and cemented firmly in their tenets, while also allowing rituals to be the "quick and dirty" magic-at-a-cost method of getting things done, more expensive but more open.
Why not just create "Arcane ONLY" rituals? 

I personally think that rituals should be divided into types, some should be universal, and Martial Practices shoudl be folded into rituals.  But that would take an edition change, so…


Well, they could actually do that already.  Martial Practices were unique not only for being divided, but because they changed the component cost to a healing surge system.  Likewise, individual power sources could have a distinct brand of ritualism that varies in how it is carried out.

Arcane Evocations could be exotic and esoteric, full of strange requirements, complex configurations, or particular circumstances.
Divine Sacraments could be extremely costly, demanding sacrifice, but allow the burden to be shared amongst multiple individuals, so that a chorus is more powerful than a longer and a priest is aided by his congregation.
Primal Rites could vary depending on location or time; a single ability might work differently if used in a desert or a forest, and the passage of time and season might impact the outcome.
Psionic Traditions might require self-empowerment like Martial sources, as both are linked to the power of the self, but be tied into power points and other sources to indicate mental fatigue rather than physical.

This would help both thematically and mechanically, allowing each source to have their own "cool things", powers and abilities tied directly to their source and cemented firmly in their tenets, while also allowing rituals to be the "quick and dirty" magic-at-a-cost method of getting things done, more expensive but more open.



I like your ideas, but don't use evocations for Arcane.  Not only is the term inappropriate for Arcane characters (no matter how used it was by certain blaster Wizards), it has been reappropriated for the type of powers uses by Primal Characters.

Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.

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Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.



And the bad-boy Sorcerer. And a few warlocks.

So, yeah, the Wizard is pretty scientific.

I still like Formulae, though. And the idea is awesome.
Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.



And the bad-boy Sorcerer. And a few warlocks.

So, yeah, the Wizard is pretty scientific.

I still like Formulae, though. And the idea is awesome.



Sorcerers are arguably alchemists in the traditional sense – they experiment with powers to discover the truth, rather than using logic. 

Warlocks are pretty scholarly.  And the formulae to make pacts with various entities would work.

Also, remember, this is rituals, not powers.  So without taking a feat, only Wizards, Bards, and Artificers get it.

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Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.


There most definitely is a science to music, even if one has passion and inspiration.

And Swordmages, I see it as a science with a number of schools focused on exact movements and fighting techniques.
Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.

And the bad-boy Sorcerer. And a few warlocks.

So, yeah, the Wizard is pretty scientific.

I still like Formulae, though. And the idea is awesome.

Try "Craftings" for Rituals of the Arcane Arts.
Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.

And the bad-boy Sorcerer. And a few warlocks.

So, yeah, the Wizard is pretty scientific.

I still like Formulae, though. And the idea is awesome.

Try "Craftings" for Rituals of the Arcane Arts.



How about just "Crafts?"

Martial Practices
Arcane Crafts
Divine Sacraments
Primal Rites
Psionic Traditions
Shadow Mysteries

Yay! We can bring back Mysteries this way, since the powers are called Hexes.

Before posting, why not ask yourself, What Would Wrecan Say?

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A great man once said "If WotC put out boxes full of free money there'd still be people complaining about how it's folded." – Boraxe

Arcane… Formulae, perhaps?  Most Arcane classes are scientifice, with the exception of the artsy Bard and the athletic Swordmage.

And the bad-boy Sorcerer. And a few warlocks.

So, yeah, the Wizard is pretty scientific.

I still like Formulae, though. And the idea is awesome.

Try "Craftings" for Rituals of the Arcane Arts.



How about just "Crafts?"

Martial Practices
Arcane Crafts
Divine Sacraments
Primal Rites
Psionic Traditions
Shadow Mysteries

Yay! We can bring back Mysteries this way, since the powers are called Hexes.



+1

until now the common Ritual are a big enough shared resource,
so I approve separated ritual for other power sources: Martial Pratices are a good example

this could give a right arcane feeling, and also with a "Arcanist Crafter" feat that gives some bonuses and Ritual in the "arcane only" compart

as for Ritual, generic ones also, could be interesting a special summon Ritual which allows you to summon a monster, maybe choosing type or maybe just some keywords, and have it as your ally
the thing is: the DM must then use the rules for PNGs -> subtract from the XP reward of encounter the XP weight of that monster
that is: it's just an instrument for something you already do by roleplaying (somehow get an ally, and that ally giving benefit cost his XP reward), but consenting some minor benefits, like in healing compart (all monsters has 1 healing sourge and no way to use it free, so a summoned one could have 2 healing sourges usable trough the leader of course) and in choosing compart (summon elemental ally even if you are in a small human village who has nothing to do with elementals: it coulb be funnier also just setting with the ritual, and related Arcane skill check, the level of the monster and some or just one keywords of it, so you can't even say what are really summoning -> fun to role it, even if the Natural keyword should be not awayable for fluff reason "have we summned a human guard? lame...")

and, as previously said, I approve the idea of Arcane Scholls as a way to modify at-will attacks (and something more) like Divine Domains and Martial Styles do
the only doubt is that, because all warlock share Eldrich Ray and have a second build-obligatory at-will, all the "Arcane Schools bonuses" must influence only Eldrich Ray, for Warlocks
I still think there should be Rituals that are generic, though, for all power sources.

The advantage of generic rituals is that they can be used across sources.  So Tenser's Floating Disc, for example, fits both Wizards and Psions. 

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Taking the thread now back to the original post topic, I would love to see Arcane Power 2 be put on the books.  So far as I can tell, Arcane Power 2 isn't even scheduled until 2011 or later.  What's odd is that this "Essential" line is dominating the last quarter of the year.

Personally, I think the "essential" line should have been released at the beginning of the edition, and not almost 2 years into it.  Have the intrepid minds of the developers already run out of ideas?  Stay tuned for the exciting conclusion of 4th edition...
How about a return of the abjurer, A set of wizard powers that control by interupting attacks and shuting down auras and zones.

Feats for warlocks to represent different patrons There are at least 9 major devils as many stars and countless fey lords. Even dark pact has more then one gimick.
The sea looks at the stabillity of the mountian and sighs. The mountian watches the freedom of the sea and cries.
...Feats for warlocks to represent different patrons There are at least 9 major devils as many stars and countless fey lords. Even dark pact has more then one gimick.

Or at least expand on the background, hooks, and inspirations, for both Pacts and Spell Sources.
Some pact concepts might be interesting in the same vein as the weapon style feats, or maybe use magic academies/mentors/what have you for that.

What I'm hoping for is a few more paragon paths for the artificer since there really only seems to be the battlesmith engineer right now.