Zuckuss, BH

From what I have seen it seems that zuckuss BH does not have Bounty Hunter, but he does have an ability that when his attack hits, that character can't move till the end of the round. Sure his attack is low (+ 8?), but that is just redonkulous on a melee character, even if they evade/deflect, they are in deep crap.
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Oh, it really is powerful. I love it. Of course, we might not have the final, final stats yet.
A 35 point single-attack shooter that is +8 at best (no BH, no cunning/opportunist) is a waste of 35 points, no matter how many neat tricks he has.  Negating movement and intuition are both great, especially with accurate shot...but if he only has +8 attack, it really won't matter, because he'll never hit anything worthwhile.  I really, really hope there's more to this guy than meets the glass of bloomilk. 
A 35 point single-attack shooter that is +8 at best (no BH, no cunning/opportunist) is a waste of 35 points, no matter how many neat tricks he has.  Negating movement and intuition are both great, especially with accurate shot...but if he only has +8 attack, it really won't matter, because he'll never hit anything worthwhile.  I really, really hope there's more to this guy than meets the glass of bloomilk. 



I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.
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I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



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A 35 point single-attack shooter that is +8 at best (no BH, no cunning/opportunist) is a waste of 35 points, no matter how many neat tricks he has.  Negating movement and intuition are both great, especially with accurate shot...but if he only has +8 attack, it really won't matter, because he'll never hit anything worthwhile.  I really, really hope there's more to this guy than meets the glass of bloomilk. 



I'm with ya on this train of thought.  If he has Twin, that's a whole different story.  I could see using him consistently. 



I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



Qui-Gon, Jedi Trainer.



Nice. I forgot his CE isn't just for Melee
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It says qui-gonns CE effects only those with a printed damage of 10. Zuckuss has 20.
I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



Whorm is always good, but a couple other options off the top of my head:
-- Darth Malak, DLOTS is always a nice attack booster
-- Darth Vader, COTS is a boost albeit could be a costly one with a miss.  Fortunately, Zuckuss could reroll the miss effectively giving him three rolls to hit (second two at +12)
-- Thrawn giving him Opportunist although that would waste his ability to stop someone in his tracks if he has already gone.

I'm sure there are others.  I think he is more of a flavor piece with lots of gimmicks for someone who really wants to play him.  You really aren't going to build a squad specifically around a piece like this, but he could be a lot of fun to try.  I am hoping the BH ability shows up in final draft to make his cost seem more in line with the others.

It says qui-gonns CE effects only those with a printed damage of 10. Zuckuss has 20.




Qui-gonns CE effects those with a printed attack of 10 or less not damage
It says qui-gonns CE effects only those with a printed damage of 10. Zuckuss has 20.




Qui-gonns CE effects those with a printed attack of 10 or less not damage



...I never learnt to read...


I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



Qui-Gon, Jedi Trainer.



Another option is Jabba, Crime Lord, which would also boost his low damage output. Since he has Accurate, I guess you pick the targets he is likely to hit.
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cool ways to beat Grand Master Luke: A. Boba BH desintigration B. Atton Rand + him doing 260 damage in a turn= 1 turned Luke C. Vong Spit poison Vampires+Zombies=Vombies! Boba BH's Big D's 1)Grand master Luke 2)Boba BH 3)Vader Unleashed 4)Vader's apprentice redeemed 5)General Grievous Droid Army Commander 6)mando scout


I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



Qui-Gon, Jedi Trainer.



Another option is Jabba, Crime Lord, which would also boost his low damage output. Since he has Accurate, I guess you pick the targets he is likely to hit.



You don't use Jabba CL very often, do you?  If you did, you would realize Jabba's CE applies to non-unique fringe followers.  Zuckuss won't be benefiting from that CE. 

Like I said before, he needs either Twin or Double for that cost.  Special abilities and FPs will only take you so far.
A worthy improvement for my main Gand, Zuckuss.  Can't wait to see the sculpt!
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Like I said before, he needs either Twin or Double for that cost.  Special abilities and FPs will only take you so far.



I would agree. At 35 points, I'd expect him to be able to hold his own, not to force me to pay 20+ points more for a CE just to make him remotely useful. Even then, he's not so good.

For example:
Zuckuss (35) + Whorm (20) vs Vader Scourge (55)

I know who I'm betting on.
I doubt that the BH +4 ability will change many minds. But needless, he is still a great mini that brings many things to the table. Intuition is perhaps one of the strongest abilities in the game. Essentially a mobile attacker with speed 12. And people are really underestimating Snare Rifle. Melee gets if he attacks them, no Strafe or Gallop for that round, and Mobile Attackers can be stopped from retreating. And yeah, his stats didn't necessarily get boosted like the others, but damn, he still has a 20 Def. And he works well with a lot of good figs.
It says qui-gonns CE effects only those with a printed damage of 10. Zuckuss has 20.




Qui-gonns CE effects those with a printed attack of 10 or less not damage


Yes, Its if the printed attack is 10 or less . He does look sweet though
Well, it looks like he has BH+4 after all. He's a little pricey for having low damage output, but I could see myself fitting him into a squad that already has Qui-Gon JT, preferably in 200. Between Intuition and Anticipation, a crucial +16 Accurate Snare Shot could turn a game around if the enemy is relying on beatsticks or certain movement breakers. Throw in Yularen for Opportunist as well, though that nerfs his main selling point by shooting someone who has already moved. 20 Defense certainly isn't too bad, so he has decent survivability. In the right squad, with his combination of abilities, he could be an extremely handy shooter.
Like I said before, he needs either Twin or Double for that cost.  Special abilities and FPs will only take you so far.



I would agree. At 35 points, I'd expect him to be able to hold his own, not to force me to pay 20+ points more for a CE just to make him remotely useful. Even then, he's not so good.

For example:
Zuckuss (35) + Whorm (20) vs Vader Scourge (55)

I know who I'm betting on.



Yeah, because it is going to be real easy for him to get within 6 of Zuckuss. He SHUTS down a bunch of the non-swap Melee strategies. He is not the big threat. He is the perfect support, however, in that he can toss a huge wrench in the opponents strategies.

I doubt that the BH +4 ability will change many minds. But needless, he is still a great mini that brings many things to the table. Intuition is perhaps one of the strongest abilities in the game. Essentially a mobile attacker with speed 12. And people are really underestimating Snare Rifle. Melee gets if he attacks them, no Strafe or Gallop for that round, and Mobile Attackers can be stopped from retreating. And yeah, his stats didn't necessarily get boosted like the others, but damn, he still has a 20 Def. And he works well with a lot of good figs.



Oh, I like Intuition just fine.  Very underrated ability.  But do we need another reason to not use Melee pieces?  Really now, Snare Rifle seems like a slap in the face to the Melee side of the game.  Sure, the Mobile attackers can't retreat, but they can still pump out attacks from across the board. 

If I'm paying 35 points for a mini, I expect more than 20 total damage. 


I was gonna use him with Whorm and Durge JH, but other than Jolee I haven't though of too great a way to boost attack.



Qui-Gon, Jedi Trainer.



Another option is Jabba, Crime Lord, which would also boost his low damage output. Since he has Accurate, I guess you pick the targets he is likely to hit.



Or paired with Thrawn mittrawn and JCL, then he always will have a 12.  not much better after all Rex is still a lousy shot, and he shoots a lot.
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The good news is a certain site updated the database and it appears he does have BH +4 which helps quite a bit.  Still not a power piece to build around, but a nice mid-priced throw in.  Accurate is still one of the best SA out there.  Intuition, if played right, can maximize damage output and minimize sitting in the open.  Force Sense is always nice to have since it does not replace attacks.  Not facing Stealth, that's OK, more FPs for rerolls or extra movement.

EDIT:  looks like some of you are faster typers than I am. lol  I guess it justs helps support your ideas.


Oh, I like Intuition just fine.  Very underrated ability.  But do we need another reason to not use Melee pieces?  Really now, Snare Rifle seems like a slap in the face to the Melee side of the game.  Sure, the Mobile attackers can't retreat, but they can still pump out attacks from across the board. 

If I'm paying 35 points for a mini, I expect more than 20 total damage. 



It almost seems like he was designed specifically around the snare rifle ability. Like they sacrificed his damage output for the chance to trap a big hitter out in the open and enable massed attacks from the entire squad to take him out in one round. Then it was like they thought 'oh crap, that is totally badass so we need to give him a crap attack in order to make it harder to do.


Oh, I like Intuition just fine.  Very underrated ability.  But do we need another reason to not use Melee pieces?  Really now, Snare Rifle seems like a slap in the face to the Melee side of the game.  Sure, the Mobile attackers can't retreat, but they can still pump out attacks from across the board. 

If I'm paying 35 points for a mini, I expect more than 20 total damage. 



It almost seems like he was designed specifically around the snare rifle ability. Like they sacrificed his damage output for the chance to trap a big hitter out in the open and enable massed attacks from the entire squad to take him out in one round. Then it was like they thought 'oh crap, that is totally badass so we need to give him a crap attack in order to make it harder to do.



You may be right.  Could be another example of Rob (or Peter) overestimating the value of one SA. 
A guess a new question would be if his cost is about right for what he has over the first Zuckuss. Assuming the certain sites' stats are now correct, from the old Zuckuss, he loses nothing, gains +40 (double) HP, + 5 defense (this is a big deal for me), Force 2, Anticipation, and Force Sense, and of course, Snare Rifle. Is that worth 13 pts? I think so, in a lot of cases.

Also, I like how many of the bounty hunters have their wepaon from their decipher card as an SA now.
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A guess a new question would be if his cost is about right for what he has over the first Zuckuss. Assuming the certain sites' stats are now correct, from the old Zuckuss, he loses nothing, gains +40 (double) HP, + 5 defense (this is a big deal for me), Force 2, Anticipation, and Force Sense, and of course, Snare Rifle. Is that worth 13 pts? I think so, in a lot of cases.

Also, I like how many of the bounty hunters have their wepaon from their decipher card as an SA now.



There is a problem with that comparison.  The original Zuckuss was not a good buy for his 22 cost.  So it's kind of a flawed comparison.  On the surface, you get far more for 13 points (than the original).  Yet you really need to compare pieces of similar costs.  Ideally the 32-38 range.  I think that will give you a better approximation.

I also like the nod to the Decipher card game.
We reviewed Zuckuss on the SHNN (near the end of the show).
Yeah, I am super happy with the matching weapons. Just need a new Dengar with Blaster Carbine and Iggy with Neural Inhibitor.

Intuition has always been an expensive ability (and rightly so).

Quick comparison to a fig 2 more points:

Zuckuss has +10 HP, +4 Def (!), +1 Atk, and +10 Base damage.
And then it is Zuckuss's Snare Rifle, Accurate, BH, and Force Powers vs Double, Twin, Deadeye. I think we can all agree that Zuckuss is still a better buy than Carth.

And really, Zuckuss has half the damage output than another "great and awesome" piece that is little less than double his cost.

Sure, he might very well not fit your playstyle, that is perfectly fine. I know I will be using him a lot, as that Snare Rifle can be deadly against a lot of squads. Seriously, just watch as you play a game and think (what if I wasn't able to move that round???). The amount of things he synergizes with will be sure that plenty of squads will make him very playable.
We reviewed Zuckuss on the SHNN (near the end of the show).



Oh, I will have to give a listen then for sure :D.  I enjoyed the last one.  Never realized how fun it is to listen to you and Dnemiller banter back and forth.  Lou is fun to listen to as well.

EDIT: I think this Zuckuss has Carth beat.  But I think that has more to do with his Snare Rifle (combined with Accurate) and his Force Powers.  The base 10 damage isn't where Carth suffers.  It's that low Defense of his that is the kicker.  His low Defense was probably designed with the OR Captain in mind.  The low attack probably doesn't help either.  I still think he should have had the Soldier SA.  That way he could have at least benefited from the Squad Assault portion of the CE.
Quick comparison to a fig 2 more points:

Zuckuss has +10 HP, +4 Def (!), +1 Atk, and +10 Base damage.
And then it is Zuckuss's Snare Rifle, Accurate, BH, and Force Powers vs Double, Twin, Deadeye. I think we can all agree that Zuckuss is still a better buy than Carth.


You actually hurt your argument by trying to show that Zuckuss is good for his cost by comparing him to Carth, since Carth is known as pretty much one of the worst minis in the game.

However, gaining BH +4 makes a significant difference.  At first I was quite surprised (from a flavor point of view) that he didn't have BH +4, so I'm glad that it's fixed.  But from a gameplay perspective, having a 12 attack vs uniques (and accurate) is solid. 

And you're right: Snare Rifle is a very useful ability, especially since it allows no save.  What held me back before was the pathetic +8 (which will never hit reliably, thus nerfing Snare Rifle)...but +12 will actually hit somewhat reliably (and with Qui Gon JT it's great).  Snare Rifle, together with Anticipation and Intuition, makes it clear that this Zuckuss is designed as a first-strike piece for those crucial game-deciding rounds.  When you build with him and play him for that purpose, I think he could be worth his points.  He's just designed differently than most pieces: he's not there for damage-output, the way that SO many others are nowadays...he's there to hinder your opponent as much as possible.
Like I said before, he needs either Twin or Double for that cost.  Special abilities and FPs will only take you so far.



I would agree. At 35 points, I'd expect him to be able to hold his own, not to force me to pay 20+ points more for a CE just to make him remotely useful. Even then, he's not so good.

For example:
Zuckuss (35) + Whorm (20) vs Vader Scourge (55)

I know who I'm betting on.



Yeah, because it is going to be real easy for him to get within 6 of Zuckuss. He SHUTS down a bunch of the non-swap Melee strategies. He is not the big threat. He is the perfect support, however, in that he can toss a huge wrench in the opponents strategies.




I'm just saying that 35 points seems awfully steep for a support piece, especially one that is going to need some serious support of its own just to be able to do its job.
Quick comparison to a fig 2 more points:

Zuckuss has +10 HP, +4 Def (!), +1 Atk, and +10 Base damage.
And then it is Zuckuss's Snare Rifle, Accurate, BH, and Force Powers vs Double, Twin, Deadeye. I think we can all agree that Zuckuss is still a better buy than Carth.


You actually hurt your argument by trying to show that Zuckuss is good for his cost by comparing him to Carth, since Carth is known as pretty much one of the worst minis in the game.

However, gaining BH +4 makes a significant difference.  At first I was quite surprised (from a flavor point of view) that he didn't have BH +4, so I'm glad that it's fixed.  But from a gameplay perspective, having a 12 attack vs uniques (and accurate) is solid. 

And you're right: Snare Rifle is a very useful ability, especially since it allows no save.  What held me back before was the pathetic +8 (which will never hit reliably, thus nerfing Snare Rifle)...but +12 will actually hit somewhat reliably (and with Qui Gon JT it's great).  Snare Rifle, together with Anticipation and Intuition, makes it clear that this Zuckuss is designed as a first-strike piece for those crucial game-deciding rounds.  When you build with him and play him for that purpose, I think he could be worth his points.  He's just designed differently than most pieces: he's not there for damage-output, the way that SO many others are nowadays...he's there to hinder your opponent as much as possible.



He is certainly a piece that strays away from the big damage dealing ways we are used to.  I'll be happy if he proves me wrong and is an effective piece. 

On a related note, I found it funny that people were mentioning IE Thrawn and Yularen.  Those two commanders don't gel with his Snare Rifle.  If you are benefiting from Opportunist, Snare Rifle is irrelevant. 
what about padme giving him a +4 attack znd z free attack? also 2 chances at a snare rifle could be great. and gree could give squad assault.

i think the fact that zuckass has a force point will make him a greal candidate for a force spirit buddy.
Zuckuss may very well be the best piece in this set.  
Zuckuss may very well be the best piece in this set.  


I agree with Mike.
Zuckuss may very well be the best piece in this set.  



Right away my goal was to pin a beatstick out in the open then tear him apart. Snare rifle could be as scary to an opponent as Disintegration in some situations. 100 HP Jedi Bodyguard for 2 factions with Ferus for only 27 points might be better, but now that I've seen all the ways Zuckuss can be boosted (and that he has BH +4), It will be a close call for me.
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Qui-Gon seems to be the most effective way to boost his attack. Thrawn doesn't help (Opportunist and Snare Rifle are two opposite abilities). Jabba from RS gives him 2 attack, not a whole lot, but it helps.
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Zuckuss may very well be the best piece in this set.  


I agree with Mike.



Third. Smile
Which is not necessarily a compliment of Zuckuss, though.
As someone who relies heavily on Reserves, in both Imperial (Ozzel) and Fringe (Lobot CLO), Zuckuss' Anticipation was enough to make me want him more than any other piece in a long time.

The Snare Gun is nice icing on the cake though and Jolee Bindo can at least bump up Zuckuss' Attack and Defence by two each.  

Accurate Shot and Force Sense make him even more desirable. With Emperor on Throne giving Zuckuss an endless supply of the force, Zuckuss will be a key component of all my future squads!
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Theres a combo that could be alot of fun to play around with Zuckuss and Emp on POtty, great idea Stormtrooper