|
4 months ago ::
Feb 15, 2013 - 2:56PM
#21
|
Date Joined:
May 21, 2009
|
This section really sold it for me. Brin's background story marks the first time ever I have been interested in Cormyr.
I'm so glad to hear this!
Yeah that was what I found weird about his reaction. He managed to survive torture, solitary confinement and a conjugal booby trap; all while keeping his wits enough to think about both his long term survival while his short term survival was in jeopardy. He seemed to handle the situation completely differently.
I think he forgets sometimes that Farideh's not as under his sway as she was at the start.
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 3:01PM
#22
|
Date Joined:
Feb 19, 2006
|
First off:
1. I completely bought the Book's explanation. I love when you just trust something as the reader and get completely duped. It teaches you a lesson.
2. I was also too on guard to fall for ghost Tam by that point.
I was happy the library didn't let them leave. I had a feeling that wasn't going to happen, and now that Rhand has showed up, they're really pinned inside.
As we get a better look at Dahl, I hate to say it, he continues to rub everyone the wrong way. He just reminds me of one of those people who is almost unlikeable until you get used to his slant of personality. He is one of the more interesting characters (to me) and I think he's eclipsed Brin by far in my mind. He's definitely playing on another level. I'm interested to see how he works out moving forward. I'd also love to see someone play a PC who's primary functionality was rituals!
Glad to see Lorcan back. He's still the same old Lorcan! He's so predictable - like the way he immediately got jealous of Dahl and started taunting him. He obviously doesn't deserve Fari, but I still think their budding relationship is a perfect example of how teenage girls often make horrible decisions picking their first (usually older) boyfriend. I can think of 4 or 5 examples of this from high school off the top of my head. Again, I think the number one strength of the Brimstone Angels series is how well written and believeable both Fari and Havi come accross. This would be a great series to introduce younger female readers to the Realms. Maybe I'll go up to my local B&N later and take the Brimstone Angels copies and throw them over in the enormous teen romance/fantasy section. Move aside Twilight and Hunger Games, here comes the devils!
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 4:50PM
#23
|
Date Joined:
Aug 11, 2012
|
"This would be a great series to introduce younger female readers to the Realms. Maybe I'll go up to my local B&N later and take the Brimstone Angels copies and throw them over in the enormous teen romance/fantasy section. Move aside Twilight and Hunger Games, here comes the devils!"
XD !!! DOO EET!
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 16, 2013 - 8:10PM
#24
|
|
|
For what it’s worth, I also believed the Book’s explanation of Tieflings. I think it took me a little longer than others to realize that the Book is mostly evil. I (incorrectly) thought it was basically helpful but just had its own agenda.
There’s nothing here worth dying for.
I simply *love* the repetition of this line. It keeps coming up over and over in different places – dreams and reality. It gives the reader this tremendously dark and sinister view of the Library. It’s this repeated warning that seems to be growing in strength and frequency as the group spends more time in the library. It’s almost like a good horror novel that keeps giving warnings of impending doom. This library is actually a really scary place if you asked me (or the dead Shadar-Kai.)
I can only guess how crazy things are going to get when Rhand busts through that door.
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 17, 2013 - 3:01PM
#25
|
Date Joined:
May 21, 2009
|
As we get a better look at Dahl, I hate to say it, he continues to rub everyone the wrong way. He just reminds me of one of those people who is almost unlikeable until you get used to his slant of personality. He is one of the more interesting characters (to me) and I think he's eclipsed Brin by far in my mind. He's definitely playing on another level. I'm interested to see how he works out moving forward. I'd also love to see someone play a PC who's primary functionality was rituals!
Seconded! (Obviously?) I think it would be a fun twist.
Maybe I'll go up to my local B&N later and take the Brimstone Angels copies and throw them over in the enormous teen romance/fantasy section. Move aside Twilight and Hunger Games, here comes the devils!
I am fully behind this.
And I've said it before, but I'm really pleased to see how wide an audience the Brimstone Angels books appeal to. This is an excellent tool for convincing fantasy-curious friends (especially women) that the Realms is more than dudes with swords. 
That said: I liked Lorcan's line to Dahl about his sword, personally. 
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 17, 2013 - 3:04PM
#26
|
Date Joined:
May 21, 2009
|
There’s nothing here worth dying for.
I simply *love* the repetition of this line. It keeps coming up over and over in different places – dreams and reality. It gives the reader this tremendously dark and sinister view of the Library. It’s this repeated warning that seems to be growing in strength and frequency as the group spends more time in the library. It’s almost like a good horror novel that keeps giving warnings of impending doom. This library is actually a really scary place if you asked me (or the dead Shadar-Kai.)
I can only guess how crazy things are going to get when Rhand busts through that door.
Repetition is one of my favorite literary tools when used right (which I hope this is!). If you hit the right notes, it pulls up all the previous iterations every time you repeat the phrase or event, and then adds in this new one. It's a great way to build an atmosphere or tension between characters in particular.
I remembered that the story I didnt' tell before is now okay to share. But I'll stick it on the next round.
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 17, 2013 - 4:47PM
#27
|
Date Joined:
Mar 15, 2010
|
One great thing about this book is how well it reads the second time around - there are subtle asides dotted all over the place that lie in wait and pop up when you return for a second reading. I can't really say any more for fear of spoiling it (I don't have the deftness of touch that Erin has) so I won't By this stage, the Library has worked its way under everyone's skin, and as the reader, I found myself being spooked by the place too. Some stories - especially films - telegraph their twists far too clumsily, or force their characters to behave in ways that just don't quite ring true; however the atmosphere here is balanced beautifully, and the tension rises in parallel with the character's dawning realisation that Something Bad has been playing tricks with them. And yes, the ending of chapter 13 was brilliant! I'm sure I've said it before, but I love the conversations between Havilar and Farideh - they have a freshness and an honesty to them that contrasts nicely with all the double-dealings and careful discussion that the other characters tend to have. There's something really engaging about them - their situations might change, but I hope they never lose that spark. I don't think I was fully taken in by Ghost Tam in chapter 14, but I was uncertain enough to feel unsettled for a moment - what if it *had* been Tam? I particularly liked the line "Something popped like a drum skin breaking", too. And Farideh's little 'oh' as she realises she was tricked by Ghost Havilar into reading The Book. It was great to see Lorcan again - and even more so watching him realise that he's not free just yet. The conflicting tiefling lore was fascinating, too, and it fitted in nicely rather than feeling like a lump of exposition (on the back of this, I'm really rather looking forward to finding out what happens in The Sundering...) Lorcan's on fine form as he starts needling Dahl - he comes out with some perfect lines Dahl has been pretty dislikeable for the majority of the book, but here, after the charged scene with Lorcan, we finally see just what's been eating away at him for so long, and I started to feel just a little bit sorry for him. A great ending to the chapter, too.
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 6:14AM
#28
|
|
|
(*growls in annoyance that something so paltry as work has kept him from Book Club for close to 2 weeks*)
I have only just caught up to this Chapter, so please forgive me if I you get the feeling that am sharing my impressions from chapters 10-12 as well as writing what is likely to be an essay...
My word, didn't things get dark all of a sudden! Adolican Rhand pretty much embodied the darkness up to this point, for me anyway, as he makes my skin crawl. However in chapers 13-16 we see what seems to be a stroll into a library rapidly devolve into surreal visions, shadows, traps and corpses. It may be a symptom of my recent playing experience, but I am afraid I haven't trusted the Book since Havi picked it up and started sneezing in Chapter 10. And I really haven't trusted it since it lied about the spell. I haven't trusted the library (and its ghosts) since we saw Havi without her Glaive.
I should add, as background, that the group I am part of has recently been playing through the 4E version of the Tomb of Horrors. Which is, while lacking the meat-grinderish tendencies of the original, more than enough to make a person jumpy and distrustful of any dungeon-esqe area. So when character started popping up with one-track conversations after making contact with the tome (and sneezing on the "dust") I distrusted that immediately. (the same goes for the Fari-alike)
So now onto the meat of Chapters 13-16! I really enjoyed these chapters, for all of their darkness Erin has managed to retain a sense of tenacity, optimism and perhaps even whimsy, without devaluing the pervasive atmosphere of peril. This is a good thing. I have missed the lighter side to things in the more recent material (much of 4E) and so to see it here is a great boost for me.
Fari's work on the ritual: I love this, pure and simple. In most of the actual D&D games I play, I am the party controller (I like the strategy inherent in the role). And so being a Ritual Caster is almost always an option... and one I take! I have been dissatisfied with the mechanics of rituals (takes 10 minutes, you either have them or your don’t etc) but that can be houseruled... what really stood out to me about this process was the capacity to work on it. Obviously Fari has a skilled tutor, the Book, but the ability research and create new magics is something I have always enjoyed and would like to see more of. As luck would have it, after reading this chapter, the party in the game that I am now running picked up a fragment of a ritual. On the strength of that fragment, and Erin’s narrative, I will now give the party a chance to work towards completing it again. Thanks Erin! The interplay between the characters remains good, Mira and Maspero, Mira and Tam, Brin and Havi (the award for the daftest place to start a new relationship goes to...) and Fari and everyone. I also enjoyed the way that the Library is dragging challenging experiences out of people and using them to herd the group members away from certain places. Brin’s scene was especially powerful. The Ghosts, the traps, the visions and now the Netherese are all making for a very fraught situation! And speaking of fraught situations, the reappearance of Lorcan definitely gave the already charged atmosphere an extra kick. Now on to the subject of Dahl. Oh dear heavens, whatever shall we do with this boy? And I do mean boy. The last time I encountered that level of immaturity and that lack of control was with my younger sisters. When they were five years old. He seems to lack any sort of control, a reflection of his spiritual suffering, I am sure. I just wonder how long it will be until he stops lashing out at everyone. Still, at least his being adept with rituals may help to keep the rest safe from the Netherese for a few minutes! Now, to talk about the Tieflings, their history and their Lore. Having already decided that I don’t trust the Book as far as I could throw it (after setting it on fire), I have to say that the Book’s version of the origin story for the Tieflings made about as much sense to me as Liquorice Limosine. Lorcan’s version, while unpalatable has much more of a sense of veracity to it. Especially since it was nigh-on shocked out of him. I do like the idea of leaving the option open for Demon born, as well as Devil born Tieflings, but that really struck me as an aspect of WotC’s stated intention to never stop any character being able to play any class or race. Still, it is dashed fine storytelling. The only thing that I would ask, thus far, Erin is whether Dahl’s discovery of the royal line of Cormyr was an intentional act by The Library/The Book? I should imagine it will drive a wedge between certain members of the party, when it comes to light. On that basis it seems a little too... convenient for a casual discovery. Especially since the Book/Library has had relatively little contact with the outside world (apart from the larger events that the Book specifies) and so the only way it could really have gotten that information in the first place is to drag it out of someone’s head (a likely possibility, to my mind). Dahl’s thoughts, at the end of the chapter, seem to echo this line of thinking. On to chapter 17!
My approach to the NPCs of previous editions. Spoiler:
Show
I always saw the High Level NPCs as shepherds of the Realms not its defenders. Making sure that not too many sheep were lost as they milled around (as they are wont to do) and bringing on the young'uns into the job. In that way a shepherd never has time to go and hunt down all of the wolves but is pretty dashed effective at keeping them away from the sheep when they rear their heads. "It was a puzzle why things were always dragged kicking and screaming. No one ever seemed to want to, for example, lead them gently by the hand." - Terry Pratchett
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:04PM
#29
|
Date Joined:
May 21, 2009
|
I'm sure I've said it before, but I love the conversations between Havilar and Farideh - they have a freshness and an honesty to them that contrasts nicely with all the double-dealings and careful discussion that the other characters tend to have. There's something really engaging about them - their situations might change, but I hope they never lose that spark.
Thank you for putting this that way! This is one of things where I have to admit, I've been just writing without thinking about technique. But you make an excellent point, and I think it should prove enlightening in the future.
|
|
|
|
3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:25PM
#30
|
Date Joined:
May 21, 2009
|
So now onto the meat of Chapters 13-16! I really enjoyed these chapters, for all of their darkness Erin has managed to retain a sense of tenacity, optimism and perhaps even whimsy, without devaluing the pervasive atmosphere of peril. This is a good thing. I have missed the lighter side to things in the more recent material (much of 4E) and so to see it here is a great boost for me.
This too! Aside from the lovely compliment, I appreciate seeing this in so many words. That tone shift seems to be an element a lot of people have some trouble with, and I'll be honest, I like a darker story (or at least one with a lot of threats and tensions to contend with). So when we talk about the Sundering returning to the roots of the Realms, this is one of those things I wonder about.
Fari's work on the ritual: I love this, pure and simple. In most of the actual D&D games I play, I am the party controller (I like the strategy inherent in the role). And so being a Ritual Caster is almost always an option... and one I take! I have been dissatisfied with the mechanics of rituals (takes 10 minutes, you either have them or your don’t etc) but that can be houseruled... what really stood out to me about this process was the capacity to work on it. Obviously Fari has a skilled tutor, the Book, but the ability research and create new magics is something I have always enjoyed and would like to see more of. As luck would have it, after reading this chapter, the party in the game that I am now running picked up a fragment of a ritual. On the strength of that fragment, and Erin’s narrative, I will now give the party a chance to work towards completing it again. Thanks Erin!
Hooray! You're very welcome!
The only thing that I would ask, thus far, Erin is whether Dahl’s discovery of the royal line of Cormyr was an intentional act by The Library/The Book? I should imagine it will drive a wedge between certain members of the party, when it comes to light. On that basis it seems a little too... convenient for a casual discovery. Especially since the Book/Library has had relatively little contact with the outside world (apart from the larger events that the Book specifies) and so the only way it could really have gotten that information in the first place is to drag it out of someone’s head (a likely possibility, to my mind). Dahl’s thoughts, at the end of the chapter, seem to echo this line of thinking.
This answer will have to wait for more information!
|
|
|
